Town Hall Debate
- Thread starter pmills
- Start date
This is way off topic but I just had a revelation: A new Mantra.
Do you like skiing and want to see it vibrant and growing recreational activity? Then don't vote for obama.
I bet he will hurt those with discretionary money to spend at resorts. Skier visits will go way down if his proposed tax rates are enacted. Just my speculation and opinion.
Do you like skiing and want to see it vibrant and growing recreational activity? Then don't vote for obama.
I bet he will hurt those with discretionary money to spend at resorts. Skier visits will go way down if his proposed tax rates are enacted. Just my speculation and opinion.
lying? no not necessarily in a premeditated fashion, I just think he is trying to please the majority with representations that he will never see to fruition.
Yeah, way off.
I'm pretty sure if they can afford to stay in a $300- $1200 a night room they will still be able to stay in that room. They may downgrade from an Escalade to a Denali, but I'm sure they will be ok.
Everyone else, well if they get tax breaks.... hmmm maybe instead of working at the resort for their season pass and eating Banquet dinners the entire season, they will be able to afford Lean Cuisine.
I'm pretty sure if they can afford to stay in a $300- $1200 a night room they will still be able to stay in that room. They may downgrade from an Escalade to a Denali, but I'm sure they will be ok.
Everyone else, well if they get tax breaks.... hmmm maybe instead of working at the resort for their season pass and eating Banquet dinners the entire season, they will be able to afford Lean Cuisine.
hahahahaha guess what... wrong........ family vacations are the first thing cut back when things get tight. and you really think that lower income families who have an extra 100 per month are going to spend it on 2 $50 dollar lift tickets?
D=big government, big taxes - R = smaller government, less taxes. Historically thats what it has been.
You're both right. This election will not affect how many people go skiing no matter who wins. To say otherwise is to say stupid, nonsensical bullshit in an attempt to influence people via their pastimes, using emotional attachment to an activity to trump common sense. As John Symms would say, don't lobby my hobby.
ax_murderer
Active member
he cut taxes.
clinton claimed he wouldnt raise any and then did..
clinton claimed he wouldnt raise any and then did..
You speak of skiing as if its a common sport.
Average income families dont go on family vacations to ski resorts... they go to places like wisconsin. My family never once went on a family ski vacation, yet everyone skis.
Skiing is a weird sport. Youre pretty much either really wealthy, an employee, or it is what is making you poor. And if it is what is making you poor, then yeah, the $100 is going to make you happy.
A family that is getting their taxes raised isn't going to be hurting in the vacation area. If they are hurting, then they have spending problems.
If my friends parents who make $80,000 a year can afford to go on a family ski trip every year, own their house, a boat, and 3 cars, then I'm pretty sure people over that income can as well.
Average income families dont go on family vacations to ski resorts... they go to places like wisconsin. My family never once went on a family ski vacation, yet everyone skis.
Skiing is a weird sport. Youre pretty much either really wealthy, an employee, or it is what is making you poor. And if it is what is making you poor, then yeah, the $100 is going to make you happy.
A family that is getting their taxes raised isn't going to be hurting in the vacation area. If they are hurting, then they have spending problems.
If my friends parents who make $80,000 a year can afford to go on a family ski trip every year, own their house, a boat, and 3 cars, then I'm pretty sure people over that income can as well.
really? ..... ask ski resort management who they are voting for... and why. nonsensical bullshit JD? How many parents do you talk to about expenses? This is a skiing website and I frankly worry about my taxes going up and how much I can budget towards travel. Think there are other people like me? I think most skier visits are funded by people exactly like me..
ax_murderer
Active member
I don't know when that came up but of course this election won't make that much of an effect.
But "trump common sense"? It''s just what you believe agianst ours.
But "trump common sense"? It''s just what you believe agianst ours.
I think you're attempting to spin your interpretation of the Candidates' relative policies in an appeal to the emotions of people on a skiing website in a manner that's really pretty flimsy and transparent, and wish you'd stop, because it's pretty embarassing. If people want to believe that voting for one or the other will hurt skiing because of taxes, global warming, whatever, then they're dumb enough to believe just about anything. You're being a hack and it's diminishing my ability to take you seriously in general.
Sno.
Active member
I think you missed the point entirely.
I didn't mention anything about your debt being a burden for others to bear. I said, if you get sick, and need tens of thousands of dollars worth of medical care, and you can't pay for that, you will become a financial burden on society, and so it might be worth it, to buy yourself healthcare at 100.00/month with your tax return money, than to donate it.
I didn't mention anything about your debt being a burden for others to bear. I said, if you get sick, and need tens of thousands of dollars worth of medical care, and you can't pay for that, you will become a financial burden on society, and so it might be worth it, to buy yourself healthcare at 100.00/month with your tax return money, than to donate it.
Campeador
Active member
They're both crooks in the end, its simply a cycle between democrat and republican. After watching this debate, McCain is weak sauce. McCain is not the kind of future I want for the Republican party. I never thought I'd say this but it may be better if Obama wins this one. I still won't vote for him, but I won't be devastated either if he wins. Just have to tough it out. Hopefully the failures of the Obama administration will help us root out all these fake Republicans in congress, put new people who actually believe in the true values of the Republican party, and not those who follow George Bush's spendcrazy version of the party.
I don't make any where near 250k..
It's my opinion that Obama will raise taxes across the board and that things will get far worse under him economy wise. The democratically controlled congress will see to that.. IMO!
If things get worse economically, then people will cut back on things like recreation which includes skiing.
So JD.. which candidate do you think will be better for skiers and why?
It's my opinion that Obama will raise taxes across the board and that things will get far worse under him economy wise. The democratically controlled congress will see to that.. IMO!
If things get worse economically, then people will cut back on things like recreation which includes skiing.
So JD.. which candidate do you think will be better for skiers and why?
PhaedeD
Active member
ya i was watching cnn or something yesterday, no it wasnt fox.. but they said that in reality the tax increase is going to effect 20% of the population not the like 2% or 3% they are claiming.
if you want change and want to bring washington in a new direction, why chose someone who has been in washington for 33 years to be your vp? I mean washington has been going down hill for a while now and im not saying i have been paying great attention or reading about every senator and what not but i mean joe biden hasent done that much to try and change washington I think if he had i would have heard his name a lot more over the passed 15 years.
if you want change and want to bring washington in a new direction, why chose someone who has been in washington for 33 years to be your vp? I mean washington has been going down hill for a while now and im not saying i have been paying great attention or reading about every senator and what not but i mean joe biden hasent done that much to try and change washington I think if he had i would have heard his name a lot more over the passed 15 years.
pmills
Active member
I'm not sure if you can't connect the dots, or you just don't want to, but lets just think about this for a while.
You want to bring in change BUT you also have to answer the critique of not having a lot of experience, how do you do this?
well one way you can handle it if you're not that experienced, you surround your self with people who are experienced. If you want to bring about change, you do so responsibly by having someone who you can have a dialogue with, you have someone who you can throw ideas against and challenge you so you create the best possible solutions.
lets have an example, With the need for reduced spending the candidates are going to be looking for places to cut money, programs that don't work. One place i think Obama is ready to find some major cash is in the war on drugs. It is not effective at all, I hope you agree. Well, Obama want's to reform this, so he throws out some ideas, he says alright lets try a, b and c. He looks to Biden and says what do you think? Biden if you didn't know was one of the guys who helped create the war on drugs in the first place. When revamping something it is my oppinion that it'd be better to have someone who made it first, and have them re-work it, than to have someone else start from scratch. So now you have Biden reporting in to Obama saying alright, well here was our orriginal goals, here's what do we need to change, what doesn't work, and here is what we want to keep. In the end you have a more comprehensive, ready to work plan that has been the result of a well rounded ticket.
I'll just ask you one question about what you think McCain will or won't do... When there is some sort of solution needed, and McCain want's to share the load, do you really think he's going to turn to Sarah Palin and say Alright cuda, what are we going to do about russia?
I mean my answer is not in a million years, Sarah doesn't bring anything to the table for John. John is suppose to encompass the change, and the voice of reason. If McCain has a question, my guess is he'll ring up Lieberman and see what he'd say. Perhaps you really think McCain and Palin will just be a dream team of experiance and change, but if you really think about it, if Palin says "whoa boy, check this before you do anything" McCain isn't going to hesitate.
I think the biggest turn off for both of them is they feel like it's a good thing not to hesitate. Can't think about it, just do it. Not a good slogan for a government.
You want to bring in change BUT you also have to answer the critique of not having a lot of experience, how do you do this?
well one way you can handle it if you're not that experienced, you surround your self with people who are experienced. If you want to bring about change, you do so responsibly by having someone who you can have a dialogue with, you have someone who you can throw ideas against and challenge you so you create the best possible solutions.
lets have an example, With the need for reduced spending the candidates are going to be looking for places to cut money, programs that don't work. One place i think Obama is ready to find some major cash is in the war on drugs. It is not effective at all, I hope you agree. Well, Obama want's to reform this, so he throws out some ideas, he says alright lets try a, b and c. He looks to Biden and says what do you think? Biden if you didn't know was one of the guys who helped create the war on drugs in the first place. When revamping something it is my oppinion that it'd be better to have someone who made it first, and have them re-work it, than to have someone else start from scratch. So now you have Biden reporting in to Obama saying alright, well here was our orriginal goals, here's what do we need to change, what doesn't work, and here is what we want to keep. In the end you have a more comprehensive, ready to work plan that has been the result of a well rounded ticket.
I'll just ask you one question about what you think McCain will or won't do... When there is some sort of solution needed, and McCain want's to share the load, do you really think he's going to turn to Sarah Palin and say Alright cuda, what are we going to do about russia?
I mean my answer is not in a million years, Sarah doesn't bring anything to the table for John. John is suppose to encompass the change, and the voice of reason. If McCain has a question, my guess is he'll ring up Lieberman and see what he'd say. Perhaps you really think McCain and Palin will just be a dream team of experiance and change, but if you really think about it, if Palin says "whoa boy, check this before you do anything" McCain isn't going to hesitate.
I think the biggest turn off for both of them is they feel like it's a good thing not to hesitate. Can't think about it, just do it. Not a good slogan for a government.
PhaedeD
Active member
i see what your saying but i dont think McCain is going to take the same approach as bush and just do things without thinking about it. Our country did that for to long and i think he knows that. we need to sit down and think about our decision before we make them. Obama doesnt make any decision he just thinks about it and thinks about how it will effect what people think about him AKA a people pleaser.
almostaskier
Active member
Even though they'll actually go down for 95% of people, and your income bracket especially.
Your opinion is unfounded.
Your opinion is unfounded.
skiminnesota
Active member
do you have a crystal ball?
you dont know what he is going to do you know what he claims to do, and so far his legislative history (as short as it is) says the EXACT opposite...
you dont know what he is going to do you know what he claims to do, and so far his legislative history (as short as it is) says the EXACT opposite...
Ben.
Active member
then quite frankly your an idiot.
your logic can go entirely in the other direction as well. whats to say that mccain is ACTUALLY going to cut taxes? not to mention even if he does cut taxes, you wont get the majority of the benefit, those cuts are only really good for again, the people making more than 250k
your logic can go entirely in the other direction as well. whats to say that mccain is ACTUALLY going to cut taxes? not to mention even if he does cut taxes, you wont get the majority of the benefit, those cuts are only really good for again, the people making more than 250k
skiminnesota
Active member
yeah, because the top 25% of our country is the part paying the burden for the other 75%.
seems fair right? people who dont pay taxes dont need a tax cut right?
if you want to doll out money fine, but dont hide behind the "tax cut" BS, call it what it is, its a "free money" check from the government...
The top-earning 25 percent of taxpayers (AGI over $64,702) earned 68.2
percent of the nation's income, but they paid more than four out of
every five dollars collected by the federal income tax (86.3 percent).
The top 1 percent of taxpayers (AGI over $388,806) earned approximately
22.1 percent of the nation's income (as defined by AGI), yet paid 39.9
percent of all federal income taxes. That means the top 1 percent of
tax returns paid about the same amount of federal individual income
taxes as the bottom 95 percent of tax returns
wow, the numbers dont lie..
http://www.taxfoundation.org/research/show/250.html
again, if you want to give money to people who need it, fine thats YOUR opinion, but dont hide behind the manipulative words of "tax cuts"
seems fair right? people who dont pay taxes dont need a tax cut right?
if you want to doll out money fine, but dont hide behind the "tax cut" BS, call it what it is, its a "free money" check from the government...
The top-earning 25 percent of taxpayers (AGI over $64,702) earned 68.2
percent of the nation's income, but they paid more than four out of
every five dollars collected by the federal income tax (86.3 percent).
The top 1 percent of taxpayers (AGI over $388,806) earned approximately
22.1 percent of the nation's income (as defined by AGI), yet paid 39.9
percent of all federal income taxes. That means the top 1 percent of
tax returns paid about the same amount of federal individual income
taxes as the bottom 95 percent of tax returns
wow, the numbers dont lie..
http://www.taxfoundation.org/research/show/250.html
again, if you want to give money to people who need it, fine thats YOUR opinion, but dont hide behind the manipulative words of "tax cuts"
ax_murderer
Active member
Funny you should mention thinking before speaking....
"In that same interview, asked about an Obama campaign commercial that mocked Sen. John McCain's lack of computer skills, Biden called the ad "terrible." A few hours later, after McCain's campaign highlighted the remark in several news releases, Obama aides put out a statement under Biden's name in which the senator from Delaware said he had not personally seen the commercial and did not have any concerns once he watched it.The next day, confronted with a interview in which Biden had said he opposed the bailout of the insurance company American International Group, a move that Obama supported, the Democratic nominee said that "I think Joe should have waited" before commenting.And Obama aides spent much of the week defending the candidate's backing of the construction of "clean coal" plants, after a video surfaced on the Internet that showed Biden at a campaign event saying he opposed clean coal. The coal industry is a major employer in Ohio and Pennsylvania, two key swing states where Biden is doing much of his campaigning, and Obama has pledged support for coal plants that emit less carbon dioxide than traditional plants."
But I'm sure for democratic candidates, its good thing to speak without thinking, it shows that the VP and President might not agree and will be working towards the best solutions doesn't it?
"In that same interview, asked about an Obama campaign commercial that mocked Sen. John McCain's lack of computer skills, Biden called the ad "terrible." A few hours later, after McCain's campaign highlighted the remark in several news releases, Obama aides put out a statement under Biden's name in which the senator from Delaware said he had not personally seen the commercial and did not have any concerns once he watched it.The next day, confronted with a interview in which Biden had said he opposed the bailout of the insurance company American International Group, a move that Obama supported, the Democratic nominee said that "I think Joe should have waited" before commenting.And Obama aides spent much of the week defending the candidate's backing of the construction of "clean coal" plants, after a video surfaced on the Internet that showed Biden at a campaign event saying he opposed clean coal. The coal industry is a major employer in Ohio and Pennsylvania, two key swing states where Biden is doing much of his campaigning, and Obama has pledged support for coal plants that emit less carbon dioxide than traditional plants."
But I'm sure for democratic candidates, its good thing to speak without thinking, it shows that the VP and President might not agree and will be working towards the best solutions doesn't it?
ax_murderer
Active member
haha your fucking retarded. you think its appropriate to ask someone's income you don't know on a public forum? its extremely rude question.
even more, this is about skiing and taxes? not only does papa rightly need to worry about his taxes increasing, bill clinton also said he would only cut taxes, ski resorts make enough money that their taxes would increase a whole bunch, that is going to affect the ski industry big time.
even more, this is about skiing and taxes? not only does papa rightly need to worry about his taxes increasing, bill clinton also said he would only cut taxes, ski resorts make enough money that their taxes would increase a whole bunch, that is going to affect the ski industry big time.
none of these tax proposal are a done deal.. its just proposals that each candidate tries to sell us on. I believe McCain will do more to cut spending than Obama will. There is no way any of us can predict who is the better choice however, we can guess at it based on what and how they speak.
I don't personally like smooth talkers because that is the one thing what they are best at. Talk. McCains passion about issues makes me believe that he will be the more likely candidate to get things done. Obama will just talk about what we need and try to get others to do it for him. I believe McCain will actually roll up his sleeves and get stuff done.
I don't personally like smooth talkers because that is the one thing what they are best at. Talk. McCains passion about issues makes me believe that he will be the more likely candidate to get things done. Obama will just talk about what we need and try to get others to do it for him. I believe McCain will actually roll up his sleeves and get stuff done.
Twinjibber77
Active member
"not now cheif, I'm in tha fucking zone"