Whats going on with Orage?

I am so damn glad I never got the chance to buy any of their stuff (besides secondhand 2010 TJ Pro Jacket)... pretty happy with my armada pants/oakley pants

talking bout armada... lot's of people seem to dislike it because so many kids wear it trying to be dollo or some shit, but damn, armada really is a core freeskiing brand, so I guess casabon knows where to go...
 
13605283:Lil_G-nus said:
I am so damn glad I never got the chance to buy any of their stuff (besides secondhand 2010 TJ Pro Jacket)... pretty happy with my armada pants/oakley pants

talking bout armada... lot's of people seem to dislike it because so many kids wear it trying to be dollo or some shit, but damn, armada really is a core freeskiing brand, so I guess casabon knows where to go...
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So much this . Armada is THE core freesking brand . Sure it's huge , but they stay true to the roots . And produce a product especially the outerwear that is bar none the best quality in freesking. The upper end gore Tex shells are tech- stylish and of insane quality.
 
13605283:Lil_G-nus said:
I am so damn glad I never got the chance to buy any of their stuff (besides secondhand 2010 TJ Pro Jacket)... pretty happy with my armada pants/oakley pants

talking bout armada... lot's of people seem to dislike it because so many kids wear it trying to be dollo or some shit, but damn, armada really is a core freeskiing brand, so I guess casabon knows where to go...
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13605294:Pachankz said:
So much this . Armada is THE core freesking brand . Sure it's huge , but they stay true to the roots . And produce a product especially the outerwear that is bar none the best quality in freesking. The upper end gore Tex shells are tech- stylish and of insane quality.
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What makes Armada more of a 'core' freeskiing brand than Orage? Orage has been in the freeskiing market longer than Armada. They've only ever sponsored freeskiers. They still only sponsor freeskiers.

What's different now than a month ago. Or a year ago? Or ten years ago? They don't sponsor they people you want them to?
 
13605301:saskskier said:
What makes Armada more of a 'core' freeskiing brand than Orage? Orage has been in the freeskiing market longer than Armada. They've only ever sponsored freeskiers. They still only sponsor freeskiers.

What's different now than a month ago. Or a year ago? Or ten years ago? They don't sponsor they people you want them to?
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Armada produces an entirely way larger range of products. Their team dwarfs orage, not saying orage wasn't and isn't core , just don't have the reach and pull of armada .
 
13605213:saskskier said:
Do we know there was no notice? Just because you and I didn't hear about it, doesn't mean those on the team didn't know it was coming.
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13605219:eheath said:
No notice to you, why does that matter?
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Andy said in the comments of the article posted "Also worth noting they didn't tell me I was being dropped. I was with them for 5 years and they never said anything. Being shitty in the ski industry needs to be called out."

Eheath you aren't wrong about people paying loads of attention to who people sponsor, and of course they can sponsor whoever they want, but I feel like the way they went about it was douchey.
 
13605411:Z.J.H. said:
Andy said in the comments of the article posted "Also worth noting they didn't tell me I was being dropped. I was with them for 5 years and they never said anything. Being shitty in the ski industry needs to be called out."

Eheath you aren't wrong about people paying loads of attention to who people sponsor, and of course they can sponsor whoever they want, but I feel like the way they went about it was douchey.
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Was Andy told, by Orage, that he was dropped? Or was he not given as much heads up as Andy would have preferred?
 
13605301:saskskier said:
What makes Armada more of a 'core' freeskiing brand than Orage? Orage has been in the freeskiing market longer than Armada. They've only ever sponsored freeskiers. They still only sponsor freeskiers.

What's different now than a month ago. Or a year ago? Or ten years ago? They don't sponsor they people you want them to?
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armada was founded by tanner hall, jp auclair, jf cusson and julien regnier. enough said.
 
Not to mention that they're selling the B-Dog jacket this year, but just dropped him. To be fair, I really don't know the ins and outs of the industry as well as the companies contracts and rider relationships, but from what I see it seems like they could have handled it better.
 
13605418:Z.J.H. said:
Not to mention that they're selling the B-Dog jacket this year, but just dropped him. To be fair, I really don't know the ins and outs of the industry as well as the companies contracts and rider relationships, but from what I see it seems like they could have handled it better.
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how so? B-Dog is still getting royalties form the jacket or atleast got paid off when his contract was terminated.

Why does everyone freak out when skiers get layed off or fired? That shit happens all the time in life.
 
13605418:Z.J.H. said:
Not to mention that they're selling the B-Dog jacket this year, but just dropped him. To be fair, I really don't know the ins and outs of the industry as well as the companies contracts and rider relationships, but from what I see it seems like they could have handled it better.
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You are clueless dude, just stop.
 
13605418:Z.J.H. said:
Not to mention that they're selling the B-Dog jacket this year, but just dropped him. To be fair, I really don't know the ins and outs of the industry as well as the companies contracts and rider relationships, but from what I see it seems like they could have handled it better.
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So if x-athlete has a pro model (ski, jacket, goggle, glove, whatever) that is released at ISPO or SIA in the next month or so and then the athlete moves on or the team changes before the next season, do you expect the company to drop a product that's already gone into production? If it happens after the product in stores, do you expect them to send out a re-call on that pro model?
 
13605448:saskskier said:
So if x-athlete has a pro model (ski, jacket, goggle, glove, whatever) that is released at ISPO or SIA in the next month or so and then the athlete moves on or the team changes before the next season, do you expect the company to drop a product that's already gone into production? If it happens after the product in stores, do you expect them to send out a re-call on that pro model?
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Good point.
 
13601033:I_liketobutter said:
A bit off topic, but seriously, you kids gotta stop saying this. It's not fucking 1980. Plenty of high quality products across multiple industries are made in China. Manufacturing location has little to do with quality anymore. Sur,e some places are higher on average like the US and Germany, but to say something is shit or not "core" b/c it's made in China in 2016 is ridiculous.
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This this isn't very true. Location still has a ton to do with manufacturing quality. Obviously there are.some quality items that come from places like China, but for the most part the quality really is far worse than equivalent products from countries where workers are paid more, there is better quality control, and far more history in manufacturing specific products. Car parts are a great example. Sure you can get your made in China pistons for 1/2 the price as German made, the tolerances may even be just as good, but it's the metallurgy that seems to be a common quality issue. Anything tool related too. Chinese tools are complete shit. You just can't find quality in tools like taps and drill bits like you can in American made. Again, mostly metallurgy related quality issues.
 
13605301:saskskier said:
What makes Armada more of a 'core' freeskiing brand than Orage? Orage has been in the freeskiing market longer than Armada. They've only ever sponsored freeskiers. They still only sponsor freeskiers.

What's different now than a month ago. Or a year ago? Or ten years ago? They don't sponsor they people you want them to?
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not necessarily more core. but certainly more appealing to the freeski market of young people. of people that still have goals (as in learn new shit instead of "just" ripping pow, which is equally fun but doesn't demand that thrive of learning).

and yes, armada might be pretty big and mainstreamish, but damn, do they offer a big line of nice products and they're not owned by anyone and stay true af to freeskiing, have a nice team, and don't seem to be that kinda dick that orage appears to be novadays
 
13605610:Lil_G-nus said:
not necessarily more core. but certainly more appealing to the freeski market of young people. of people that still have goals (as in learn new shit instead of "just" ripping pow, which is equally fun but doesn't demand that thrive of learning).

and yes, armada might be pretty big and mainstreamish, but damn, do they offer a big line of nice products and they're not owned by anyone and stay true af to freeskiing, have a nice team, and don't seem to be that kinda dick that orage appears to be novadays
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you realize that armada drops people just like every other company. Hell they even dropped one of their founders and kept his ski in production even to this day- the JJ.

The newschool market is tiny and the products are cheap. The BC/all mountain market is large, getting larger, and the products are expensive.

Id still like to hear the whole story from Andy. He aired some dirty laundry, but only gave a small slice of the story.
 
13603304:Pachankz said:
How is this girl a pro? Besides the marketable looks , someone please point me to a segment that shows she's got game. No Ingrid Backstrom here .
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13604293:Park_Ranger said:
I can't believe that they dropped Phil Casabon... PHIL FUCKING CASABON... yet Brooke Potter is still listed on their team page. Sad to know that looking good in lifestyle shots is more important to this brand than supporting true talent.
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Pulling my hair out. These are hardworking and talented women, disregarding that because they are also good looking is a fucking joke. If you want to see women progress in this sport, stop making these assumptions.
 
13605776:californiagrown said:
you realize that armada drops people just like every other company. Hell they even dropped one of their founders and kept his ski in production even to this day- the JJ.
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This. So much. ...and they kept his name on it!
 
13606195:el_mn_op said:
If you want to see women progress in this sport, stop making these assumptions.
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The truth of the matter is: unless you have a daughter, wife or friend that is a chick that rips, you dont give two shits if women progress. You just want to see the sport progress, and women are not the ones progressing the sport so no one really cares. In essence, you could also argue that Women pro skiers are also much more core than mens pro skiers for the same reasons haha.
 
13604264:LethalDescent said:
I remember when HH did a similar rebrand 5 or so years ago. They literally dropped their ENTIRE team and decided to market only to "mountain professionals" (read: vail resorts, interwest, aspen mtn etc...). Seems crazy, but they are doing just fine...
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I thought they needed to do that because they were trying to sell the company at that time?
 
13606195:el_mn_op said:
Pulling my hair out. These are hardworking and talented women, disregarding that because they are also good looking is a fucking joke. If you want to see women progress in this sport, stop making these assumptions.
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Get over it , looking good, image , and marketability are a factor in professional snowboarding and skiing, for both males and females .
 
13606219:Ghini said:
I thought they needed to do that because they were trying to sell the company at that time?
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I can only go off of what I heard at the time but as far as I know it was just a marketing shift (things have changed a bit since). I could be wrong though.
 
13606228:LethalDescent said:
I can only go off of what I heard at the time but as far as I know it was just a marketing shift (things have changed a bit since). I could be wrong though.
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Totally unrelated, but please come back.
 
13606195:el_mn_op said:
Pulling my hair out. These are hardworking and talented women, disregarding that because they are also good looking is a fucking joke. If you want to see women progress in this sport, stop making these assumptions.
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I am not hating on women, I am hating on Brooke Potter. There are plenty of rad girls out there progressing the sport. Girls like Emma Dahlstrom and Lisa Zimmerman who are sending jumps, spinning both ways on/off rails, can actually spin out of a switch up on a rail, and overall have pretty good style get a ton of my respect (this is super ill -https://vimeo.com/141454283).

Brooke Potter, on the other hand, doesn't do any of those things. So the fact that she is still on the team and they dropped someone like Phil Casabon is what absolutely blows my mind, and is why I suggested that Orage cares more about a pretty face in their look book than someone who is actually a talented innovator.
 
13606525:Park_Ranger said:
I am not hating on women, I am hating on Brooke Potter. There are plenty of rad girls out there progressing the sport. Girls like Emma Dahlstrom and Lisa Zimmerman who are sending jumps, spinning both ways on/off rails, can actually spin out of a switch up on a rail, and overall have pretty good style get a ton of my respect (this is super ill -https://vimeo.com/141454283).

Brooke Potter, on the other hand, doesn't do any of those things. So the fact that she is still on the team and they dropped someone like Phil Casabon is what absolutely blows my mind, and is why I suggested that Orage cares more about a pretty face in their look book than someone who is actually a talented innovator.
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Haha! Who the fuck are you? You don't know Brooke or have probably never seen her ski in person. Brooke happens to be one of the only female street skiers out there, and actually does tricks out of the park on gnarly features. How would I know? I was just on a street trip with her and she blew my mind. That's is actual progression for the sport, doing something new and innovating. She also happens to be one of the nicest people out there. Get a fucking clue before trying to disrespect someones image.
 
13606564:Queen_Selassie said:
Haha! Who the fuck are you? You don't know Brooke or have probably never seen her ski in person. Brooke happens to be one of the only female street skiers out there, and actually does tricks out of the park on gnarly features. How would I know? I was just on a street trip with her and she blew my mind. That's is actual progression for the sport, doing something new and innovating. She also happens to be one of the nicest people out there. Get a fucking clue before trying to disrespect someones image.
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Brooke does slay and is definitely pushing helping women's skiing but what park_ranger is annoyed about is that Casabon does the same thing and more but gets dropped. Casabon is one of the most recognised free skiers in the world who competed in the x game/dew, and has been skiing professionally far longer than Brooke has.

Casabon is truly innovating the sport (with his own take on skiing, with no one truly skiing like he does). Even though Brooke is still a great skier with a very clean style I wouldn't say she does something 'new' in terms of her skiing. I suppose she encourages more women to ski park but still, Tatum got dropped and she slays as well.
 
I imagine Brooke gets paid SLIGHTLY less than Casabon so when they were looking at who to drop, progression rate probably wasn't at the top of their criteria.

No need to rip apart an am girl because you are angry your dream boy got dropped.
 
Kinda sucks for Bushy, bet he would rather be head to toe in Oakley.

Just a sign of the times, the small market of park skiers is saturated and isn't profitable. People with money are not going to buy an expensive coat that looks silly to them (park rat style) anymore than park skiers are gonna pick up last years saga for a song before dropping $500 on a quality coat.
 
13606612:Rice said:
Brooke does slay and is definitely pushing helping women's skiing but what park_ranger is annoyed about is that Casabon does the same thing and more but gets dropped. Casabon is one of the most recognised free skiers in the world who competed in the x game/dew, and has been skiing professionally far longer than Brooke has.

Casabon is truly innovating the sport (with his own take on skiing, with no one truly skiing like he does). Even though Brooke is still a great skier with a very clean style I wouldn't say she does something 'new' in terms of her skiing. I suppose she encourages more women to ski park but still, Tatum got dropped and she slays as well.
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13606624:hemlockjibber8 said:
I imagine Brooke gets paid SLIGHTLY less than Casabon so when they were looking at who to drop, progression rate probably wasn't at the top of their criteria.

No need to rip apart an am girl because you are angry your dream boy got dropped.
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Considering Brooke was never on their pro team or had a pro model jacket I have no idea where you are getting this idea that they pay her. The only women receiving pay checks in the ski industry ride for redbull, monster or their European government haha. You guys are crazy if you think that is how the industry works. Brooke has nothing to do with B dog getting dropped.
 
How did I just get ripped on so hard? Lol just so everyone knows, company's need smaller athletes too...

No. I don't make a dime of money from Orage or have a contract. I get product. Bdog was the highest paid athlete on the team. Tatum wasn't dropped she received an offer this year from north face which orage refused to match. Yes, it's a huge bummer both of them aren't on orage anymore because I personally think they are the faces of the brand...
 
Obviously I have no idea what happened, but I'd be very surprised if they just dropped Casabon outright. I'm sure they offered him a new and diminished contract and he thinks he can do better elsewhere so refused.

Like a hockey player. Maybe getting payed 5 million, team thinks they're underperforming for the money, offers them a contract extension for 3 million, player thinks he can get 4 elsewhere so is 'dropped' by the team.

This is nothing new to sports.
 
Meanwhile a rookie making 850k (or in Brookes case free gear) isn't dropped since they figure they're either worth the pricetag or have potential.
 
13606697:brookepotter said:
How did I just get ripped on so hard? Lol just so everyone knows, company's need smaller athletes too...

No. I don't make a dime of money from Orage or have a contract. I get product. Bdog was the highest paid athlete on the team. Tatum wasn't dropped she received an offer this year from north face which orage refused to match. Yes, it's a huge bummer both of them aren't on orage anymore because I personally think they are the faces of the brand...
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Honestly, as an adult consumer. When I think of Orage. I don't think of either of those 2 skiers. I think of J.P.
 
13606697:brookepotter said:
How did I just get ripped on so hard? Lol just so everyone knows, company's need smaller athletes too...

No. I don't make a dime of money from Orage or have a contract. I get product. Bdog was the highest paid athlete on the team. Tatum wasn't dropped she received an offer this year from north face which orage refused to match. Yes, it's a huge bummer both of them aren't on orage anymore because I personally think they are the faces of the brand...
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I don't think anyone was ripping on you. You just got brought up because your face is still on the website but bdog isn't and people were mad that he got bounced.

IMO you're a much better value- cheap, good rep as a coach, put out solid edits, and have a look that sells not just to parkrats looking to shed the shackles of white suburbia haha.
 
13606747:Session said:
Honestly, as an adult consumer. When I think of Orage. I don't think of either of those 2 skiers. I think of J.P.
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This.

Even though he had moved to Armada outerwear at the time of his death, in my head, Orage = JP
 
13606747:Session said:
Honestly, as an adult consumer. When I think of Orage. I don't think of either of those 2 skiers. I think of J.P.
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Yup.

And that press release reeked of canned quotes.
 
I think it was the Schiller pant and jacket from Orage that looked like a legitimate rug back in on 07. That shit scared me away from the brand. I wish I could find a picture of that shaggy, dingle berry collecting pant and jacket.
 
Ok orage didnt drop b dog he left same with tatum and a few other skiers so they called it time for change and they wil not be making a bdog jacket still.
 
If you want a B-dog type jacket, just go to your local farm store, or Wal-Mart. There is bound to be something that looks similar
 
13606697:brookepotter said:
How did I just get ripped on so hard? Lol just so everyone knows, company's need smaller athletes too...

No. I don't make a dime of money from Orage or have a contract. I get product. Bdog was the highest paid athlete on the team. Tatum wasn't dropped she received an offer this year from north face which orage refused to match. Yes, it's a huge bummer both of them aren't on orage anymore because I personally think they are the faces of the brand...
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qouted for emphasis on the fact that the kiddies on newschoolers don't have a clue on how the ski industry works, and making comments on issues you don't understand or have any factual information about can be hurtful.
 
I am 100% saying that they put a lot of thier team in the dark releasing most but, I also think they should be called out because of leaving Ganger out in the dark.
 
13631798:jdfreeski2 said:
I am 100% saying that they put a lot of thier team in the dark releasing most but, I also think they should be called out because of leaving Ganger out in the dark.
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This is the way of professional sports. Sometimes you get traded. Sometimes you get released. Sometimes your contract expires. Orage reached a point where the value of their newschool skiing athletes was at an all-time low. They realized that they were dumping money and gear into athletes and they were not selling gear as a result of their efforts. This process is not sustainable and Orage underwent a paradigm shift to maximize the value of the athletes in market segments they excel in.

I'm sorry an athlete you like got dropped. Sometimes, changes are made overnight and it's out of the company's control. To call out a company without fully understanding the scale of the situation, though, is why vendors leave the market. If we as a community are offended by every athlete that gets dropped, and we feel it's necessary to publicly shame that company for a business decision, vendors will continue to look at us as an unfavorable market segment.
 
13632782:BenWhit said:
This is the way of professional sports. Sometimes you get traded. Sometimes you get released. Sometimes your contract expires. Orage reached a point where the value of their newschool skiing athletes was at an all-time low. They realized that they were dumping money and gear into athletes and they were not selling gear as a result of their efforts. This process is not sustainable and Orage underwent a paradigm shift to maximize the value of the athletes in market segments they excel in.

I'm sorry an athlete you like got dropped. Sometimes, changes are made overnight and it's out of the company's control. To call out a company without fully understanding the scale of the situation, though, is why vendors leave the market. If we as a community are offended by every athlete that gets dropped, and we feel it's necessary to publicly shame that company for a business decision, vendors will continue to look at us as an unfavorable market segment.
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So you don't agree with everybody
 
13633002:jdfreeski2 said:
So you don't agree with everybody
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No, I don't. I think 90% of the people in this thread fail to understand that skiing is a business and sponsored riders are investments.
 
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