Town Hall Debate

Thinking before speaking, and thinking before acting should be treated with two separate critiques, One is much worse than the other, as you've pointed out, you can go back on your word, you can easily fix something you've misspoken about. BUT you can't go back on your actions as redily.

now i'm not condoning the fact that the Dems say one thing and then say the opposite, as you've pointed out, but you've got to realize that The Republican's hands aren't clean either. What did McCain say about Iraq? That it'd be super easy, and they'd treat us like liborators, we'd be heros. Well then he said he never said that. But i'm not going to go back and forth over this, you know it, and i know it, people aren't 100% consistant

BUT please recognize that making a decision like being the VP when you explicitly said you didn't know what the VP actually does literally months earlier, requires a thought process, and if you forgo that process, or if you embrace that way of 'not' thinking, then you're doomed.

 
i love how a lot of the arguments in this thread are premised on the "i don't want to pay my hard earned money so everyone has healthcare" line of thought...you don't want to pay for something that doesn't directly benefit you even if it is for the betterment of society as a whole.

if you want to bitch about paying for something that doesn't benefit you, you should bitch about social security. none of us will ever see any of it and yet we all pay for it on every paycheck.
 
...... so basically its random choice? not to mention if were gonna base it on how they speak i think obama might even have a slight edge on mccain. your logic doesnt really make sense
 
I guess that if you assume that what people say they are going to do is not what they will actually try to do, you can say just about anything you want and get away witht he fact that's a "possibility".

It is my humble opinion that even though papasteeze thinks he's a proactive skier, he'll actually do more to help snowboarders take over the snowparks than what he says.

I have no basis for this statement other than I think he's a liar, and I don't like his age. Therefore papasteeze is a crook.
 
i disagree with whoever said he was alot more specific, i would say if he is at all its a miniscule ammount, but i certainly wouldnt say mccain was any less vague, they both are.
 
change. we need some change. if we could just get some change up in here, everything would be fine.
 
Character character character..... There are combined characteristics of Obama that bother me. I can't put my finger on it and I certainly don't expect anyone that doesn't know me to trust my intuition, certainly not on here.

I wish I could be more verbose in describing the things that make my forehead furrow. I am just raising some points that some can relate to who have had dealings with very smart people.

I wish I could pull up the CNN special where Obama was talking about himself during his college years.
 
haha except two of the lines were "accept responsibility of our own lives" (abortion? free universal health care?)
and, "Follow our goals without them being at the expense of yours".... hmmm again then get your hands out of healthcare
 
let me ask you this, if health care is a "right" then why the fuck are my parents paying for it?!?!?!

why would i pay for one of my rights? hmmmm interesting to think about..........

 
hahaha those were creepy, but by no means obamas fault. the first was obviously some sort of army academy, and those things brainwash the shit out of kids in them.

the second, crazy parents.

both remind me a lot of jesus camp, when the kids in that camp were praising their great president george bush. creepy as fuck? hell yeah. but neither is really the candidates fault
 
Okay.. I have mentioned this before and I have no idea if this has anything to do with Obama becoming and effective leader but, I think he is so smart that he has achieved his "mission in life" by establishing his "place in this world". (those are his quotes from that CNN interview)

When I factor in the way he has risen to where he is, I think he has been on this mission since his days in Harvaard. He practiced organizing people in Chicago and has taken those learned skills all the way.

What surprises me about him is more what he doesn't say. I want to know how he really feels about our population segments who are abusing the system to get what free hand outs they can.

I want to know why he doesn't think that everyone can rise to anything they want, using himself as an example. Or maybe he does, he just doesn't dare say it.

 
Yeah, I've watched all the debates. Thanks.

And Barack Obama does not leave the "Change" phrase to advertisements and banners, he says it all the time. Perhaps I can find a "change" edit for you.

all that goes through my head when I hear Obama speak is "how? how? how? how?"..so many ideas without any plans for execution.*

*drew, i'll elaborate later, don't have time for a long post right now

 
stop posting these videos this has nothing to do with politics. this is simply someone brainwashing these young kids.
 
You pay for all your rights in the form of taxes... the benefits conferred on you by society come with the cost of chipping in to support the national infrastructure. You pay for your right to education, to life (in terms of not being stabbed for your jacket, ie law enforcement), to security against foreign incursions (defense)... lots of things. That seems like a really weird point to be making.
 
JD i could be wrong but in canada doesnt the government pay for health care? now i know from living in bellingham, wa for 4 years that when i was at the doctors or in hospital that a large amount of people were from canada. i asked a few people why, not the canadians but nurses and doctors they said because its very hard to get a doctors appointment right away in some areas and also a lot of times the doctors dont get paid for months. I could be wrong but i think this is what i remember hearing.
 
I think he realizes, like most of us do, that his story, while inspiring, isnt the norm but an exception. The majority of poor people arent nearly as lucky.
 
i got my bear arms for free.

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sorry for my vagueness...

here is the way i see it, when you start throwing around the term a "right" people will automatically jump to something they are entitled to, now if you are entitled to something, why would you pay for it?

dont go "well you still pay for it with taxes" yeah SOME people would be paying for it, but not everyone.

wouldnt it be easier to get it for free from the government? thats what the masses would do.

now if the government started giving away healthcare, there will be shortages, because when something is free people will hoard it..... now if we have shortages from a government run healthcare industry... what is the next logical step? rationing, what is the effect of rationing? people dieing in ambulances like over in the UK? the point is i dont want the government telling people who can, and can not, go get medical attention....

i know there is a moral argument to be made for everyone having healthcare, and i honestly can see that side, but try and follow my logic....
 
just like with the freedom to bear arms you get a free gun right?

i think you can stretch your legs of reason and figure out a justification for "why do people deserve health care regardless and how you justify it in a system where not everyone can pay for the expenses"

i think you might want to try along the lines of keeping people healthy is beneficial to all in the community, therefore those who are able to pay for the expense do. How you make it exactly fair, why don't 'try' to figure it out and tell me.
 
It's so true. John McCain's health care plan is the right way to go that way you can shop outside just your state which makes companies competing against each other nation wide that way you will get the best price possible.

 
That's pretty inaccurate. There are cases where there's a long wait for surgeries or scans, and there are flaws with the system due to the administrative inefficiency and bureaucracy and the way it's set up, but that's going to happen with any system. Meanwhile people can see doctors fairly quickly. For a local clinic, you just walk in and put your name down; sometimes it takes 10 minutes, sometimes 2 hours, but you just go home (the closest clinic to me is a 2 minute drive) and come back when they phone you if it's long. That's for minor stuff. The last time I went to a hospital was the ER after a car accident; it wasn't anything terribly serious (concussion) but I was triaged within 10 minutes of walking through the door, on a friday night at 2:30 am. Ended up having to stay overnight and get 2 scans which happened the following morning. So in my experience it works okay. There are certainly no doctors going without pay... I don't know WHERE that one came from. They make on average less money here, still a whole lot of money, but not as much as in the US.
 
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that's some pretty radical shit (talkin bout the movie). I very highly doubt that if that

actually did happen it would turn out that bad. Personally I'd say

Barack would have a better chance of fucking us over that bad then

Palin or McCain would good God.

That's amazing special effects and such though.
 
here i'll help guide your finger... he's black.

Whether people want to admit it or not, the race card is going to play a huge role in this election. I know democrats that have told me they "have a hard time voting for a black guy". Now I would like to take my time to contract my original statement in this post, because I have no idea what you are like in person, or even if I did know you in person I'd never know how you felt about the issue. You could be anything from completely racially unbiased to closet racist.

For some reason I never could understand why conservatives seemed to be closed minded. Or maybe it's the other way around, and closed minded people tend to be conservative. Race really should not be an issue. But then again that is a Eutopic statement. We live in a imperfect world.
 
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