Revision Messed Up

13825996:whoa-dere said:
according to his linkedin, bill works as a consultant for a hospital network in florida haha
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Not the same person. Maybe related though? They both lived in Michigan at one point.

Edit, after some more information was given to me, I was incorrect in my above statement. I think his father/relative (with the same name) also was in the medical field in Florida, thats who I saw (since the person I saw was born in the 40s).

**This post was edited on Jul 13th 2017 at 12:26:18pm
 
Skis.com released a statement yesterday about how they got the skis as part of a third party liquidation:

"On July 11th Skis.com became aware of allegations against Revision Skis. While Skis.com has purchased and possesses Revision Ski inventory, we at no point dealt with or were associated with Revision Skis, in any way. All current inventory was acquired through a 3rd party liquidation service and Skis.com was unaware of any allegations against Revision Skis at the time of purchase."
http://blog.skis.com/skis-com-official-statement-re-revision-skis/
 
13826097:dkirse said:
"On July 11th Skis.com became aware of allegations against Revision Skis. While Skis.com has purchased and possesses Revision Ski inventory, we at no point dealt with or were associated with Revision Skis, in any way. All current inventory was acquired through a 3rd party liquidation service and Skis.com was unaware of any allegations against Revision Skis at the time of purchase."
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Well they are either lying or totally incompetent and out of touch considering anyone mildly involved in the industry has been watching this unfold for the better part of a year now. Not sure which is worse.

But seriously they have to be lying.
 
13826111:tyrol said:
Well they are either lying or totally incompetent and out of touch considering anyone mildly involved in the industry has been watching this unfold for the better part of a year now. Not sure which is worse.

But seriously they have to be lying.
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I don't know, I'd venture to guess that a vast majority of skiers have still never heard of Revision.
 
13826112:Sklar said:
I don't know, I'd venture to guess that a vast majority of skiers have still never heard of Revision.
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There are two things I initially thought of:

It doesnt matter if half the people at skis.com know who revision was, the person in the acquisition department may know nothing about skiing. Just some person with an MBA (this is a thought, not saying its a fact).

To argue my above point, why the hell would you buy 30k in skis without research the company first. Thats a big chunk of money to blindly buy. They are extremely stupid if they bought skis without researching how durable they are, how buyable they are, how popular they are, etc.

I could glue a bunch of Popsicle sticks together, call them skis and offer 300 pairs to skis.com. Think they would just see 300 pairs of skis and buy them?

**This post was edited on Jul 13th 2017 at 3:25:49pm
 
13826113:kingsskier said:
There are two things I initially thought of:

It doesnt matter if half the people at skis.com know who revision was, the person in the acquisition department may know nothing about skiing. Just some person with an MBA (this is a thought, not saying its a fact).

To argue my above point, why the hell would you buy 30k in skis without research the company first. Thats a big chunk of money to blindly buy. They are extremely stupid if they bought skis without researching how durable they are, how buyable they are, how popular they are, etc.

I could glue a bunch of Popsicle sticks together, call them skis and offer 300 pairs to skis.com. Think they would just see 300 pairs of skis and buy them?

**This post was edited on Jul 13th 2017 at 3:25:49pm
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idk what exactly happened but it's not impossible theyre being truthful. revision is (was) a tiny company and this thread is one of the few places on the internet where you'd even learn about this whole ordeal. much more likely to google the company and find decent reviews etc
 
13826116:SofaKingSick said:
idk what exactly happened but it's not impossible theyre being truthful. revision is (was) a tiny company and this thread is one of the few places on the internet where you'd even learn about this whole ordeal. much more likely to google the company and find decent reviews etc
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No one really knows for sure and likely wont know. But, if I had an employee buying $30k+ in overhead based off quick googling and not picking up a phone to see why the skis are being sold by the 3rd party source cheap (maybe they just didnt want to know) or without calling the actual ski manufacturer to see whats up, Id fire them immediately. But thats just me.
 
If skis.com didn't buy the bulk of revisionskis some other company definitely would've. It's not like a company in this industry would buy skis for approx 30k and just give them away to the poor fellows who got scammed. Why is this even a discussion?
 
13826112:Sklar said:
I don't know, I'd venture to guess that a vast majority of skiers have still never heard of Revision.
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Oh without question. The vast majority of skiers have never heard of Armada believe it or not. 2/3 of skiers ski less than 10 days a year and a large portion of them couldn't name any company other than Rossignol and K2.
 
13826118:swegature said:
If skis.com didn't buy the bulk of revisionskis some other company definitely would've. It's not like a company in this industry would buy skis for approx 30k and just give them away to the poor fellows who got scammed. Why is this even a discussion?
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It's a discussion because of these facts:

-Skis.com has worked with Bill Wanrooy before. They bought skis from him when he was operating as the sales manager for Epic Planks. They are a Michigan company.

-Skis.com just released a statement saying they had no idea going on.

It's a discussion because of these assumptions

-Skis.com employs people who work in the ski industry and do the bare minimum amount of research on the brands they sell when they tie up tens of thousands of dollars in inventory- which anyway you slice it is a ton of money for old model skis.

It's a discussion because of these possibilities:

-Their statement is total bullshit. They got some discount from a 3rd party and figured "OK LADIDA MUST BE A GREAT DEAL NO NEED TO LOOK INTO THIS" when any google search would have turned up the fiasco. GTFO

-They simply couldn't be this stupid. Really. They can't.

- It's not just possible, but probable that this 3rd party company was owned by Bill. Who is this unnammed 3rd party that they are unwilling to identify, Bill Wanrooy Leisure Co. LLC?

But most fucking importantly it's a discussion because a bunch of people on this website paid for those god damned skis one time already and the story skis.com is pushing smells like BS.
 
13826134:tyrol said:
It's a discussion because of these possibilities:

-Their statement is total bullshit. They got some discount from a 3rd party and figured "OK LADIDA MUST BE A GREAT DEAL NO NEED TO LOOK INTO THIS" when any google search would have turned up the fiasco. GTFO

-They simply couldn't be this stupid. Really. They can't.

- It's not just possible, but probable that this 3rd party company was owned by Bill. Who is this unnammed 3rd party that they are unwilling to identify, Bill Wanrooy Leisure Co. LLC?
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- Bill was abducted by aliens who sold his skis to skis.com for gas money to get home
 
13826131:tyrol said:
Oh without question. The vast majority of skiers have never heard of Armada believe it or not. 2/3 of skiers ski less than 10 days a year and a large portion of them couldn't name any company other than Rossignol and K2.
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Normally I wouldn't give a fuck about statements like this however, if you call bs on something don't spread bs yourself. I would love to have the study of those numbers because "a large portion of them couldn't name any company other than rossignol and k2" sounds like it's made up. Prove me wrong and I'll gladly apologize for my ignorance.

13826134:tyrol said:
It's a discussion because of these facts:

-Skis.com has worked with Bill Wanrooy before. They bought skis from him when he was operating as the sales manager for Epic Planks. They are a Michigan company.

-Skis.com just released a statement saying they had no idea going on.

It's a discussion because of these assumptions

-Skis.com employs people who work in the ski industry and do the bare minimum amount of research on the brands they sell when they tie up tens of thousands of dollars in inventory- which anyway you slice it is a ton of money for old model skis.

It's a discussion because of these possibilities:

-Their statement is total bullshit. They got some discount from a 3rd party and figured "OK LADIDA MUST BE A GREAT DEAL NO NEED TO LOOK INTO THIS" when any google search would have turned up the fiasco. GTFO

-They simply couldn't be this stupid. Really. They can't.

- It's not just possible, but probable that this 3rd party company was owned by Bill. Who is this unnammed 3rd party that they are unwilling to identify, Bill Wanrooy Leisure Co. LLC?

But most fucking importantly it's a discussion because a bunch of people on this website paid for those god damned skis one time already and the story skis.com is pushing smells like BS.
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It's Revisions fault and they fucked their customers. I don't blame skis.com for taking this greasy opportunity because I know that I wouldve done the same thing.

Assume that you're a retail manager. A bankrupt company wants to sell a bulk of product that matches your customer field for a ridiculously low price. You do know that the company screwed their customers over. The choice you have then is, don't take the offer and see a competitive company take the offer and basically get free cash? Just because you think it's morally wrong and they don't care? Or seize the opportunity and take the deal. Getting easy money knowing its actually the company's fault and the original product is never going to reach their customers.

A few years later the same guy comes to you with a similar offer, easy cash or give it away to your rivals?
 
13826156:swegature said:
I'll gladly apologize for my ignorance.
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No need to apologize for your ignorance, if that info wasn't self evident you obviously don't ski much. The people on rentals I ride the chairlift with regularly in the midwest couldn't name a single ski company, so I was probably being generous.

I suspect this greasy move by skis.com may backfire. What you think is "free money" is also lost goodwill and reputation. Just because you are admittedly greasy doesn't make any difference here.

But mostly I'm not angry about the greasy move. I'm angry about the press release that is clearly a lie.
 
13826111:tyrol said:
Well they are either lying or totally incompetent and out of touch considering anyone mildly involved in the industry has been watching this unfold for the better part of a year now. Not sure which is worse.

But seriously they have to be lying.
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This is completely ridiculous. To think that the people running a ski sale website are aware or Revision Skis or this website is absurd.

Most people have no idea what either of those things are.
 
13826162:tyrol said:
I suspect this greasy move by skis.com may backfire. What you think is "free money" is also lost goodwill and reputation. Just because you are admittedly greasy doesn't make any difference here.

But mostly I'm not angry about the greasy move. I'm angry about the press release that is clearly a lie.
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I don't agree with you . Their actions look like they really made a fucile research and only after somebody told them about the situtation they realised it is a complete crap. If they found this theme on NS, knew about the situation and still decided to do dirty business - why would they delete all revision skis from their website and make a statement just few days after? I haven't seen any shit hitting the fan on any of famous or reputable ski websites, so It obviously wasn't the "ski community pressure". If they were doing greasy moves they would definitely not give a fuck about the whole situation and just continued selling them. IMO those who say it's just business are wrong, cause this was basically selling stolen shit. This would hardly hit the reputation of any shop and I'm happy skis.com realised this that fast.

If you are a carshop, and you are buying bunch of cars from a "wholesaler" and it appears that all of them are stolen it doesn't mean purchase isn't legit, but who is in his right mind would do that knowing what scandal it will be?
 
13826111:tyrol said:
Well they are either lying or totally incompetent and out of touch considering anyone mildly involved in the industry has been watching this unfold for the better part of a year now. Not sure which is worse.

But seriously they have to be lying.
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I've been involved in the ski industry for 36 years as a skier. I've never heard of them before this. But why should a third party buyer, who is buying skis be responsible for the disservice relizion (pun intended) did to their customers? They are in business to make money, As that what business's do. They bought palates of skis and are selling them. Wow. Feel bad for those who bought them pre-order but that's on religion. Not a company looking to make a profit. They don't have orders to fulfill, have anything as far as orders even, and it's not their responsibility to do so. It is simple business and happens daily.
 
Wait, so did Revisions inventory including many peoples preordered skis get sold to skis.com? That'd be fucked if they bought all the skis before they were shipped to many of you.

Haven't been paying much attention to this lately.
 
13826260:N41v131355 said:
why would they delete all revision skis from their website and make a statement just few days after?
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Probably because several butthurt NSers decided the best way to "get even" with Revision was to leave terrible and obscene reviews on all the revision skis hosted for sale on skis.com without any facts about how exactly skis.com ended up with the skis.
 
13826820:Randy_Quench said:
Probably because several butthurt NSers decided the best way to "get even" with Revision was to leave terrible and obscene reviews on all the revision skis hosted for sale on skis.com without any facts about how exactly skis.com ended up with the skis.
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Yeah, and I can't blame NSers. You can see situations like this everywhere. If you are a shop and you are buying a product with questionable reputation - it's your fault that you were not aware of the situation and you haven't researched deep enough. I'm not saying that it's proper to blame skis.com - but what dafuq should you expect from people who got robbed? Imagine you crowdfunded PoGro 6 and product wasn't released nor you got your money back, and this happened to almost everyone who participated. Then it suddenly appears on amazon. What reviews will you see there? Please
 
13826820:Randy_Quench said:
without any facts about how exactly skis.com ended up with the skis.
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It wouldn't take much for skis.com to explain the situation. But honestly what explanation can there be other than they got a sweet deal on stolen skis. They thought they could be slick about it and make a quick buck, some ill gotten gains, but that shit backfired. Now they are stuck holding these unsellable skis. Fuck 'em.

Assuming they are stuck with the skis they could turn this around into a positive PR move, and raffle them off to pre orders. But that's not something a company attempting to sell stolen skis would do.

Maybe they will give you a coupon code for free shipping if you keep defending them.
 
13826890:Static said:
It wouldn't take much for skis.com to explain the situation.
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I guess they did with the press release saying they were ignorant to all of this, but that sounds like a bunch of bullshit to me.

The question remains; What will happen to the skis?
 
13826890:Static said:
It wouldn't take much for skis.com to explain the situation. But honestly what explanation can there be other than they got a sweet deal on stolen skis. They thought they could be slick about it and make a quick buck, some ill gotten gains, but that shit backfired. Now they are stuck holding these unsellable skis. Fuck 'em.

Assuming they are stuck with the skis they could turn this around into a positive PR move, and raffle them off to pre orders. But that's not something a company attempting to sell stolen skis would do.

Maybe they will give you a coupon code for free shipping if you keep defending them.
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Skis.com got these legitimately. They did not steal anything from anyone. REVISION and Bill Wanrooy did! Bill lost ownership of the skis or sold them to the warehouse without fulfilling HIS orders. Skis.com bought them from the third party. It is not skis.com responsibility to fulfill revisions orders. Be mad at revision and bill wanrooy and not skis.com.
 
13826901:kingsskier said:
Skis.com got these legitimately. They did not steal anything from anyone.
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Well they did purchase a shipment of skis that were already bought, paid for and intended to be delivered to other people.

But if the skis are unsellable will skis.com use the purchase as an expense to lower their tax liability? What will then be done with the skis? Do they go into a dumpster? Do skis.com employees get them?
 
13826903:Static said:
Well they did purchase a shipment of skis that were already bought, paid for and intended to be delivered to other people.

But if the skis are unsellable will skis.com use the purchase as an expense to lower their tax liability? What will then be done with the skis? Do they go into a dumpster? Do skis.com employees get them?
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They bought skis from a third party. Again, Revision is at fault 100%. They did not buy sold skis. They bought skis from a third party. Revision never produced skis for their pre-orders. There is a big difference.

The skis are back up on skis.com. They will likely sell. They are cheap skis with a decent design.
 
13826901:kingsskier said:
Skis.com got these legitimately. They did not steal anything from anyone. REVISION and Bill Wanrooy did! Bill lost ownership of the skis or sold them to the warehouse without fulfilling HIS orders. Skis.com bought them from the third party. It is not skis.com responsibility to fulfill revisions orders. Be mad at revision and bill wanrooy and not skis.com.
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Thank you. Unfortunately some people just don't know when to remove the tinfoil hats from their heads.

13826903:Static said:
Well they did purchase a shipment of skis that were already bought, paid for and intended to be delivered to other people.
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You aren't wrong, but there is a lot of information you and I don't know when it comes to how those skis were acquired. You are assuming skis.com is as slimey as Bill and took what was yours like the Grinch stole Christmas. IMO it is highly unlikely they knew what they were getting themselves into. By attacking them for carrying out their normal business practice you are just tainting more of the ski industry without any proof they did anything to intentionally wrong Revision's original customers.

13826890:Static said:
Maybe they will give you a coupon code for free shipping if you keep defending them.
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Lol you're right, in fact- I was the quality control employee at skis.com who didn't look into the purchase hard enough and now I'm just trying to save my ass from getting canned.
 
13826909:kingsskier said:
They did not buy sold skis. They bought skis from a third party. Revision never produced skis for their pre-orders. There is a big difference.
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I think this is very disingenuous.

Who were those skis intended for? Who paid for them?
 
13826911:Static said:
I think this is very disingenuous.

Who were those skis intended for? Who paid for them?
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These WERE NOT owned by revision yet OR he lost ownership of them. It was on REVISION to get their product to THEIR customer. It is not on skis.com to fulfill revisions orders! What do you want to happen to these skis? Trash them? The third party that had them at first as well as skis.com, did NOT have ANY orders from customers. Bill Wanrooy had orders. He needed to produce the skis and didnt. Why would anyone else lose money to make up for REVISIONS mistake? You are being very ignorant to blame anyone but Revision and Bill Wanrooy. It is no one elses fault (unless there are some facts of illegal practices that havent surfaced) but Bill Wanrooy.

**This post was edited on Jul 19th 2017 at 10:20:08am
 
13826914:kingsskier said:
These WERE NOT owned by revision yet OR he lost ownership of them. It was on REVISION to get their product to THEIR customer. It is not on skis.com to fulfill revisions orders! What do you want to happen to these skis? Trash them? The third party that had them at first as well as skis.com, did NOT have ANY orders from customers. Bill Wanrooy had orders. He needed to produce the skis and didnt. Why would anyone else lose money to make up for REVISIONS mistake? You are being very ignorant to blame anyone but Revision and Bill Wanrooy. It is no one elses fault (unless there are some facts of illegal practices that havent surfaced) but Bill Wanrooy.

**This post was edited on Jul 19th 2017 at 10:20:08am
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But I bought those skis from Revision before skis.com did! Those were my skis! Skis.com stole them from me! Skis.com should just ship all of the skis to the rightful owners!

EDIT: //sarcasm

**This post was edited on Jul 19th 2017 at 10:44:10am
 
13826917:Randy_Quench said:
But I bought those skis from Revision before skis.com did! Those were my skis! Skis.com stole them from me! Skis.com should just ship all of the skis to the rightful owners!
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Bill Wanrooy took your money and ran. Bill Wanrooy should have produced the skis and shipped them to you. Bill Wanrooy is the thief.

Like I said, Revision was not in ownership of those, so you did not buy THOSE skis. You bought a promise from Revision. They did not fulfill that promise. Those skis do not have your name on them. They are just another batch of Revision skis. Maybe the ones he gave to them team riders are yours? Do they owe you the skis? Maybe the ones he shipped out to customers at full price are your skis? Should they give you their skis? NO. BILL OWES YOU MONEY OR SKIS! No one else does. Its a shitty situation and I want every preorder to get refunded, but the world is tough and people are shady. Bill screwed you and you are misdirecting your anger.
 
13826918:kingsskier said:
Bill Wanrooy took your money and ran. Bill Wanrooy should have produced the skis and shipped them to you. Bill Wanrooy is the thief.

Like I said, Revision was not in ownership of those, so you did not buy THOSE skis. You bought a promise from Revision. They did not fulfill that promise. Those skis do not have your name on them. They are just another batch of Revision skis. Maybe the ones he gave to them team riders are yours? Do they owe you the skis? Maybe the ones he shipped out to customers at full price are your skis? Should they give you their skis? NO. BILL OWES YOU MONEY OR SKIS! No one else does. Its a shitty situation and I want every preorder to get refunded, but the world is tough and people are shady. Bill screwed you and you are misdirecting your anger.
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I was mocking some of the comments in here lol. I 100% agree with everything you've said, look at my previous comments defending skis.com.
 
This happens with more than just skis, and it's not up to some other company to fulfill orders that a defunct company never did. Besides NS there wasn't a whole lot of substance to this story, a lot of people had no idea this was happening, hell there wasn't a thread in most other forums until just 2-3 weeks ago. Even if skis.com hadn't bought them, there was no way those skis were going out to the people who pre-ordered them. It's crazy to think another company would be able to figure out who actually bought skis from Revision, then pay to ship out hundreds-thousands of skis on their own dime? Sure that would be cool, can you imagine the logistics of making that all happen though?

Hopefully we will get some sort of "closure" be that hearing from Bill/Revision or, preferably, legal action against him and/or Revision. It's a shitty situation.
 
13826919:Randy_Quench said:
I was mocking some of the comments in here lol. I 100% agree with everything you've said, look at my previous comments defending skis.com.
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Lol I was wondering why you completely 180ed. Got it now.
 
Simplest explanation for this whole debacle is that sometime between summer pre-orders and last March, they ran out of money, no longer able to make good on their outstanding obligations: your pre-orders, team contracts, bills to the factories, warranties, etc. That's why all the inventory was liquidated to skis.com. Nothing confusing about that.

What is confusing is why Revision went silent. Surprised this hasn't turned into a lawsuit yet - don't know their numbers, but I'd guess 150K+ of your guy's hard earned money was taken through pre-orders, used as capital for production, and due to a poor business model, they lost all cash on hand before they could even get you your skis by the time they arrived in March.

Just some speculations, nothing stated is definite. This would be a great case study for business school.....
 
"Bill Wanrooy (Founder)

Bill is an avid skier as well as a ski journalist. He also has comprehensive experience in ski design and manufacturing. His professional background also includes pharmaceutical sales and marketing, and electronic medical records software and technology.

He has a Master’s Degree from Indiana University’s Kelley School of Business."
 
13827119:snowpocalypse said:
https://www.fundable.com/revision-skis
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That was interesting to read.

It's so obvious that this company was eventually going to go under. They were basically a façade trying to gain traction through crowd sourcing via the internet and a bunch of broke kids.

The thing is that the business was destined to fail, it was easy to see that since the beginning. The way in which it failed, however, is 100% on Bill and the choices that he deliberately made. It's a shame... shouldn't have gone down like that.
 
13827132:Park_Ranger said:
He has a Master’s Degree from Indiana University’s Kelley School of Business.
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This cracks me up. Went to one of the top 10 business schools and still failed two ski companies. All that deep Indiana skiing must have distracted him from his studies...
 
13827214:Randy_Quench said:
This cracks me up. Went to one of the top 10 business schools and still failed two ski companies. All that deep Indiana skiing must have distracted him from his studies...
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Not trying to defend him, but the ski industry is a pretty tough industry for start ups. I mean, just look at all the other small (and large) companies who have gone out of business, been bought out, etc etc.

At least none of those companies scammed like revision has done.

Also, you'd be surprised how many people don't know revision is out of business. My buddy bought a pair of talismans the first year and told me he wanted to buy another pair, then I told him the news. He was like "oh really". So I wonder if any kids bought skis even after this whole thing was going on and while the site was still up.
 
13821829:-SnowSnoli- said:
What skis did you order and where in Switzerland? If you don't get your money back and you don't have cash for skis next winter I can try hook you up. I got skis from 174-184.
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tru. was also hyped to rep them in switzerland but after i got mine in april (i ordered from blind2) it quickly faded away. im now thinking about how i can erase any revision branding of my skis

edit: wrong quote but whatever

**This post was edited on Jul 21st 2017 at 5:08:51pm
 
13827119:snowpocalypse said:
Well they are still actively searching out funding
https://www.fundable.com/revision-skis

Anyone want to bet if Bill will respond if you offer money?
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revision-skis-wwnvmvbtvo.png


very battala-esque star on those bases...
 
13828070:partyand_BS said:
their website says new ski line up drops august 1. . . . WHOS STOKED!?
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Where does it say that? I mean, their website is back up which is weird in itself...but it doesn't say they have a new line dropping.
 
13828088:dkirse said:
Where does it say that? I mean, their website is back up which is weird in itself...but it doesn't say they have a new line dropping.
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I thought it was weird that its back too. I cant remember if it was ever taken down, I thought it was.

It says August 1st if you go to the "shop" tab and click "read more" on the skis. Are they seriously going to release more skis? If so, this guy needs to be taken to court.
 
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