New Rules - Making NSG Better

J.D.

Active member
Staff member
Dear NSG,

The mod forum has been undertaking some discussion of late. Basically, we feel like NSG has become a bit of a mess. This is partly our fault. A couple of years ago, there was an executive decision made to loosen the slack on moderation in this forum and let it be a bit more unbridled and unmanaged, and focus on keeping the other forums a bit more organized.

This hasn't really worked very well - or, to be more accurate, NSG has gotten a bit out of hand the last little while. This has started to affect other areas of the site, as the behaviour level in this forum has transferred over into other forums and content like news comments and media. Overall, it's not giving off a good impression to people who might come on here. When a content producer clicks on a thread in NSG and the first reply is "OP's mom is a huge slut" or something equally brilliant, it immediately turns people off the site. When an interview is posted and the first comment is "this guy is a huge chode", it puts a damper on everything afterwards.

With that in mind this thread is intended to give people the chance to give some input on what we can do to make it better. New rules, new policies, new ideas, and so forth. Doug suggested I post a thread so we can have a public discussion with the people who use the forum. I know some people think it's fine and like it this way, but we've decided to change the atmosphere, so hopefully people can just post suggestions as to how make improvements rather than arguing over whether we should.

As you see we added two new moderators this week, Dingosean and BWalmer. This was done more or less entirely in response to a meeting we had about NSG. There were some other good candidates and, who knows, we may add more mods down the road. Incidentally, for the first time I can remember, we really changed the process from focusing solely on people who have been around a long time and are long-standing members and towards people who have been producing good threads and responses lately. We want to encourage that.

The long-standing forum rules are posted below for reference. If you think any of these should be changed somehow, replaced with something that reflects the fact that this isn't 2004 and the internet is a different place, or if you think new rules should be added, share that view below.

In order to ensure that this board is as helpful and enjoyable as possible to as many people as possible, we have established the following rules for this board. Any message may be removed if it:

-Contains any form of discrimination based on race, gender, religion, national origin, physical or mental disability, sexual orientation or age. This includes words, abbreviations and slang which has a negative connotation.

-Contains links to sexually explicit or offensive material

-Contains blatant advertising for a company you work for. If you wish to advertise on Newschoolers.com, you must do so properly. Please contact dbishop@sportnet.com

-Contains unwarranted and direct hate towards other members of the site

-Have materials that wish to slander or hurt Newschoolers.com or their associates

-Contains spam, which only intention is too further one’s post count

-Contains information about deal-a-day websites. It is not your responsibility to pass on a good deal, as these threads only clog up the forums.

-Contains any personal information of others which can violate privacy issues

-Contains links to a site promotes the illegal downloads of ski industry material

-Contains items which are trying to be "flipped". If you wish to make a profit, do so somewhere else please

-Is deemed by us to be unsuitable for any reason whatsoever.

If we decide that a post is unacceptable, we will remove the post. Depending on the severity of the post or the past history of the user who made the post, we may drop a ban on your ass.
 
Some initial points.

First, the advertising thing is no longer relevant. We have made a policy change that permits ski industry threads to be posted provided that they're reasonably coherent (not "BUY BUY BUY! SALE ON NOW!" kind of stuff). There's a line between this and spam, though - spam is still not permitted. That said, I'm open to suggestions on what to do with thread #237 about Joey's new screen-printed t-shirt "apparel" company...

Second, it's just not feasible for us anymore to actually moderate gear flipping. This is a holdover of about 15 years ago, when the industry was very small and hooking people up with cheap gear was just what was done. B/S/T is, at this point, an unregulated marketplace. If someone buys ten pairs of Norwalks for $50 a pop and wants to sell them for $300, we're probably not going to do anything about that. That being said, if you think what someone is doing is bullshit, and taking advantage of deals that should have been available to everyone to make a quick buck, feel free to call them out on it. Community justice is still a thing.

Nobody actually posts links to Steepandcheap or Gearscan or whatever anymore, so I don't think we need the thing about the deal-a-day websites at this stage. Spam is still spam, though, if people are posting a bunch of these.

Here is the first new rule that's being added: no more lame, BS replies to the OP in a misguided attempt to be funny. We're really sick of opening a thread, and seeing the first two pages being littered with crap like "this thread gave me aids", "I hope you die in a car crash OP", "I fucked OP's mom", "This thread is now about spiderman", "I ain't readin that shit" gifs, "revolver ocelot", one-line joke responses to the topic or instant thread de-railings.

That shit isn't funny, and it's stale, been done a thousand times. Worse, it kills threads before they even start. We're going to start deleting that stuff, and making notes of who does it. If you've done it multiple times, it will result in banning, because it's really just making unnecessary work.

Just FYI, by the way, that applies to this thread... If you're about to ironically reply to this post with "your post gave me aids" or something, I really suggest not doing that. Thanks.
 
I think this is all a good idea, but I bet it's going to revert going back to how it was because someone will callout Bishop on how skiing is supposed to be fun, and free, and not serious. Then we'll end up backtracking to the shit hole that NSG currently is.

Personally, I'd just like to see more threads like Byron's (sorry, nothing personal) cleaned up where they're obviously a fake dumb story or poll, just for the attention, but they're allowed to go on for 3 pages and clutter the feed. Dragon dildo threads just aren't funny anymore.
 
One point I think we should also make is that this is a community effort, not just changes to the rules, moderation, and procedures. If you see someone posting shit, call them out on it. If someone is doing stuff they shouldn't be, you should PM a mod (with a link) and they can take care of it. If you want to see better discussion, better posts, and less crap, it's as easy as contributing solid material yourself and not tolerating pointless bullshit. This community is a brilliant, powerful place, and together it's pretty crazy what we can do when we all come together. Remember we all share a common interest and passion, lets not forget that in the depths of NSG. Help us, and we'll help you :)

**This post was edited on Sep 4th 2014 at 1:42:23pm
 
13118561:SKI.ING said:
I think this is all a good idea, but I bet it's going to revert going back to how it was because someone will callout Bishop on how skiing is supposed to be fun, and free, and not serious. Then we'll end up backtracking to the shit hole that NSG currently is.

Personally, I'd just like to see more threads like Byron's (sorry, nothing personal) cleaned up where they're obviously a fake dumb story or poll, just for the attention, but they're allowed to go on for 3 pages and clutter the feed. Dragon dildo threads just aren't funny anymore.

I agree with you on the troll threads, but there's a difference of opinion on that because let's face it, sometimes they're funny. That's part of the point of this thread though - identifying things we need to deal with to improve NSG, and then figuring out how to deal with them. So we can have a discussion about that. Do people generally think that threads like that should just be deleted?

As far as Doug goes, this was all his idea and given that he got us together for a teleconference to address the issue I'd say he's pretty serious about it. Skiing isn't supposed to be serious but it is supposed to be a community, not a cesspool of dumb crap.

13118566:Walter.1337 said:
One point I think we should also make is that this is a community effort, not just changes to the rules, moderation, and procedures. If you see someone posting shit, call them out on it. If someone is doing stuff they shouldn't be, you should PM a mod (with a link) and they can take care of it.

This point is important. Often we see posts of "Well so and so did this and it wasn't deleted and they weren't banned". I've seen that argument for like eight years now. Why are you complaining in a thread? PM someone who can deal with it. Here is how that PM should look:

"Hey, Member X posted (explain what was posted) in this thread: (link). It's on page 2 about halfway down."

That's all, we just need to know what the issue is and where to find it.

**This post was edited on Sep 4th 2014 at 1:47:41pm
 
I'm super glad this has been addressed, and look forward to seeing how this plays out. NSG totally needed to be cleaned up.
 
13118561:SKI.ING said:
I think this is all a good idea, but I bet it's going to revert going back to how it was because someone will callout Bishop on how skiing is supposed to be fun, and free, and not serious. Then we'll end up backtracking to the shit hole that NSG currently is.

Personally, I'd just like to see more threads like Byron's (sorry, nothing personal) cleaned up where they're obviously a fake dumb story or poll, just for the attention, but they're allowed to go on for 3 pages and clutter the feed. Dragon dildo threads just aren't funny anymore.

This isn't about making it less 'free'

This is about cutting down on the mindless clutter and making this place a much more intelligent, interesting place to visit. We can still have fun and screw around. Let's just have more tact behind it rather than posting the same lame crap every single time.

When "First!" becomes "I banged OP's mom", it's going in the wrong direction in our eyes.
 
13118591:DingoSean said:
This isn't about making it less 'free'

This is about cutting down on the mindless clutter and making this place a much more intelligent, interesting place to visit. We can still have fun and screw around. Let's just have more tact behind it rather than posting the same lame crap every single time.

When "First!" becomes "I banged OP's mom", it's going in the wrong direction in our eyes.

Its a slippery slope when only a select few get to make decisions about what is/isnt funny or appropriate.

Why not let the community moderate itself? Put a button that if a post recieves more than 50 down votes, it gets deleted. if a member gets 3 deleted posts in a day he/she(lets be real, he) gets banned for a day etc.

It comes down to whose interest do you want to serve with this website. Is it an open forum that represents the Newschool demographic and culture, or is it a website that portrays newschool skiing culture the way NS.com wants it to be seen?
 
I am definitely a fan of this direction. Hopefully we can see some significant progress in NSG becoming more mature. Not that we can't have a good time, but I like that steps are being taken to move away from the current cesspool it's become.
 
that all sounds fine, assuming the moderation doesnt go overboard. stupid jokes and answers are part of NSG and forums in general. if i ask a question here, it's not because i somehow think the answer will be more educational than googling it.. you feel me?

also, why not just make it mandatory to label NSFW links as such? i don't think we need mommy and daddy outlawing links to stuff within reason
 
13118608:californiagrown said:
Its a slippery slope when only a select few get to make decisions about what is/isnt funny or appropriate.

Why not let the community moderate itself? Put a button that if a post recieves more than 50 down votes, it gets deleted. if a member gets 3 deleted posts in a day he/she(lets be real, he) gets banned for a day etc.

It comes down to whose interest do you want to serve with this website. Is it an open forum that represents the Newschool demographic and culture, or is it a website that portrays newschool skiing culture the way NS.com wants it to be seen?

That's precisely why this thread was posted. We aren't trying to be dictators here. We're opening this for discussion with everyone so we can make it how you want it. The only new rule we've really decided to impose is to cut down the dumb stuff that NSG is known for that makes people feel like they can't contribute anything interesting or start a fun discussion without it being followed up by "tl;dr OP's mom's a whore"

There's a reason why "Newschoolers is just full of 12 year olds" has become a stigma - and part of it is because places like NSG have become infected by 18-20 somethings acting like 12 year olds. I don't think anyone besides the trolls really want it to be like that.
 
topic:J.D. said:
-Contains any form of discrimination based on race, gender, religion, national origin, physical or mental disability, sexual orientation or age. This includes words, abbreviations and slang which has a negative connotation.

Id honestly been wondering if you guys had changed/given up on this policy I feel like I see f-----t multiple times a day and the n word every other day. also just weird shit like a guy with a hitler icon has a thread that makes it on your front page a couple days ago
 
13118627:hey-dude-its-me said:
Id honestly been wondering if you guys had changed/given up on this policy I feel like I see f-----t multiple times a day and the n word every other day. also just weird shit like a guy with a hitler icon has a thread that makes it on your front page a couple days ago

Anyone who posts those types of things is immediately issued a banhammer. Sometimes we'll miss it for a little bit, but if you catch it before we do, just let us know, whether that be by PMing a mod who's idling, or posting in the Transparent moderation thread in Site Discussion which we all follow.
 
13118608:californiagrown said:
Its a slippery slope when only a select few get to make decisions about what is/isnt funny or appropriate.

Why not let the community moderate itself? Put a button that if a post recieves more than 50 down votes, it gets deleted. if a member gets 3 deleted posts in a day he/she(lets be real, he) gets banned for a day etc.

We've been looking at that as an option down the road, we just don't have the framework in place to make that happen right now. Hence the effort to give the community a voice on which direction this should go. Like the others have mentioned, when members let us know what they like/dislike, we get a better idea of what people want. When its lets up to us and then everyone just sits back and complains, it's not productive

Help us help you make NS what you want it to be
 
13118640:MacMahoooon said:
Help us help you make NS what you want it to be

It want to create, for the first time in all history, a garden of pure ideology, where each poster may bloom, secure from the pests purveying contradictory truths. A unification of thoughts.
 
Thanks for addressing this issue guys. I have completely stopped coming into and posting in NSG in the last year because of the serious lack of any response and the overwhelming amount of shitty, "I banged ops mom" jokes.

Hopefully this will go over well and NSG can be an alright place to hang out again.
 
13118608:californiagrown said:
Its a slippery slope when only a select few get to make decisions about what is/isnt funny or appropriate.

Why not let the community moderate itself? Put a button that if a post recieves more than 50 down votes, it gets deleted. if a member gets 3 deleted posts in a day he/she(lets be real, he) gets banned for a day etc.

It comes down to whose interest do you want to serve with this website. Is it an open forum that represents the Newschool demographic and culture, or is it a website that portrays newschool skiing culture the way NS.com wants it to be seen?

because people will downvote opinions/facts/ideas that they don't like....which will lead to users like/upvote whoring

just because something is disagreeable/stupid doesn't mean it's not legit content

anyway....good job guys keep up the good work
 
Works for me. Honestly it's a balance though. A bunch of kids see stupid things posted and then post even more stupid shit in everything. You could post a good thread about the OG's of the sport or something like that and some noob will come in and ruin it.

I just wanna use this site for what it is at this point. I'm kind of over the whole stick it to the man bullshit. Many I got old.

good luck
 
13118706:SFB said:
this is it, this is how nsg dies. it was fun while it lasted.

Oh please, NSG has gone through plenty of these phases, it's a cycle. It's still here and will continue to be here. Now you can either sack up and be a halfway decent member and still have plenty of fun, or contribute to the problem we're trying to address and face a banhammer. Your choice :)

13118746:.Hugo. said:

e9w93d.jpg
 
13118530:J.D. said:
Some initial points.

First, the advertising thing is no longer relevant. We have made a policy change that permits ski industry threads to be posted provided that they're reasonably coherent (not "BUY BUY BUY! SALE ON NOW!" kind of stuff). There's a line between this and spam, though - spam is still not permitted. That said, I'm open to suggestions on what to do with thread #237 about Joey's new screen-printed t-shirt "apparel" company...

Second, it's just not feasible for us anymore to actually moderate gear flipping. This is a holdover of about 15 years ago, when the industry was very small and hooking people up with cheap gear was just what was done. B/S/T is, at this point, an unregulated marketplace. If someone buys ten pairs of Norwalks for $50 a pop and wants to sell them for $300, we're probably not going to do anything about that. That being said, if you think what someone is doing is bullshit, and taking advantage of deals that should have been available to everyone to make a quick buck, feel free to call them out on it. Community justice is still a thing.

Nobody actually posts links to Steepandcheap or Gearscan or whatever anymore, so I don't think we need the thing about the deal-a-day websites at this stage. Spam is still spam, though, if people are posting a bunch of these.

Here is the first new rule that's being added: no more lame, BS replies to the OP in a misguided attempt to be funny. We're really sick of opening a thread, and seeing the first two pages being littered with crap like "this thread gave me aids", "I hope you die in a car crash OP", "I fucked OP's mom", "This thread is now about spiderman", "I ain't readin that shit" gifs, "revolver ocelot", one-line joke responses to the topic or instant thread de-railings.

That shit isn't funny, and it's stale, been done a thousand times. Worse, it kills threads before they even start. We're going to start deleting that stuff, and making notes of who does it. If you've done it multiple times, it will result in banning, because it's really just making unnecessary work.

Just FYI, by the way, that applies to this thread... If you're about to ironically reply to this post with "your post gave me aids" or something, I really suggest not doing that. Thanks.

oh my smug mod rage at the end of this post. Spiderman threads can be hilarious. You guys need to lighten up. Thanks
 
13118764:El_Barto. said:
oh my smug mod rage at the end of this post. Spiderman threads can be hilarious. You guys need to lighten up. Thanks

Yeah, the spider man thing is hilarious the first time. The second time it's worth a chuckle. After that it's stale and annoying. And a significant number of threads in this forum get ruined by being de-railed within the first ten posts. Whether or not a thread is destroyed is not something that should be determined by a small group of unimaginative trolls.
 
13118764:El_Barto. said:
oh my smug mod rage at the end of this post. Spiderman threads can be hilarious. You guys need to lighten up. Thanks

couldn't agree more. didn't see much of a problem with this until I noticed a mod trying to tell other people what is and what is not funny......what a joke, who are these nerds who are so easily offended by words lol???

if forrest gump came to nsg and made a 'stupid' post would you really remove it or ban him?

I totally understand how you want first impressions to be good, but if forrest noticed that comments are being removed due to "stupidity" then he might be reluctant to begin posting.....

anyway good for you guys, hopefully this opinion isn't removed for not aligning exactly with yours.
 
13118839:.Hugo. said:
What are you trying to say? Im not changing it

I think he's trying to visually show you what sort of things upset/offend him. we should wait to verify from him personally though.
 
13118839:.Hugo. said:
What are you trying to say? Im not changing it

I'm guessing he's trying to show that you are exactly the type of person making the comments targeted by that rule change and so it's not surprising you're opposed to it.
 
13118839:.Hugo. said:
What are you trying to say? Im not changing it

Oh I'm not saying you should change it, I'm just putting your "RIP NSG" comment into perspective. You seem to get your rocks off to "OP's mom jokes" so these changes must seem like a big deal to you.
 
I'm stoked to see how this goes, rules don't change anything, people thinking about what they post and why they are posting it is what will save NSG.
 
13118876:J.D. said:
I'm guessing he's trying to show that you are exactly the type of person making the comments targeted by that rule change and so it's not surprising you're opposed to it.

13118881:Walter.1337 said:
Oh I'm not saying you should change it, I'm just putting your "RIP NSG" comment into perspective. You seem to get your rocks off to "OP's mom jokes" so these changes must seem like a big deal to you.

Do I wish NSG would stay the same way? Yes. But im not gonna sit here and complain or let it upset me, its just an internet forum... I dont know why you guys think I would be so upset about this, there are a ton of members that make those kinds of posts waaay more than I do. At least about half of my posts are actually serious ones, and I dont go in and ruin good serious threads or make a ton of shitty "troll?" threads like a lot of members like to do.
 
13118640:MacMahoooon said:
We've been looking at that as an option down the road, we just don't have the framework in place to make that happen right now. Hence the effort to give the community a voice on which direction this should go. Like the others have mentioned, when members let us know what they like/dislike, we get a better idea of what people want. When its lets up to us and then everyone just sits back and complains, it's not productive

Help us help you make NS what you want it to be

dont lie to yourself. If you cared about what the users of NSG liked you wouldnt touch a thing. FRY probably has more upvotes in NSG than any other user in the last three months and he is exactly the member youre trying to change.

What better way to see whats popular and what isnt than upvotes? Oh right, mod e-muscle flex, thats the way to do it.
 
lol @ the 5 or so butthurt members who are just trolls. Go ruin a site thats already shit like reddit or 4chan.
 
13119018:El_Barto. said:
dont lie to yourself. If you cared about what the users of NSG liked you wouldnt touch a thing. FRY probably has more upvotes in NSG than any other user in the last three months and he is exactly the member youre trying to change.

What better way to see whats popular and what isnt than upvotes? Oh right, mod e-muscle flex, thats the way to do it.

The only problem with this is that posts that aren't bad, but just share an unpopular opinion, often get down-voted. So down votes aren't a good way to go about determining what should be deleted. This brings us back to the point that a separate "Vote for deletion" button should be implemented.
 
13119035:pussyfooter said:
lol @ the 5 or so butthurt members who are just trolls. Go ruin a site thats already shit like reddit or 4chan.

What's the point of NSG without trolls? Look at all the threads that on the front page of NSG right now. We'd be a bunch of squares if there wasn't some sort of humor in any of them.
 
13119035:pussyfooter said:
lol @ the 5 or so butthurt members who are just trolls. Go ruin a site thats already shit like reddit or 4chan.

Coming from Dr.Butthurt.

These changes wont impact how i post. I rarely say OP mom jokes as i dont find em funny anymore. I dont post memes and most all my stupid shit is OC.

Keep on telling us what is funny

NSG description

"All things non-ski related. Talk about partying, girls, guys, the weather, whatever turns your crank!"

Just admit you dont want us to decide what is and isnt popular. You guys clearly think you know what we want. Just own your opinion rather than hide behind false reasoning.
 
13119018:El_Barto. said:
dont lie to yourself. If you cared about what the users of NSG liked you wouldnt touch a thing. FRY probably has more upvotes in NSG than any other user in the last three months and he is exactly the member youre trying to change.

What better way to see whats popular and what isnt than upvotes? Oh right, mod e-muscle flex, thats the way to do it.

Oooooo burn
 
I was all for creating a more mature version of NSG outside of DF but I feel that just getting more strict in NSG is a bad idea
 
13119047:Miomo said:
What's the point of NSG without trolls? Look at all the threads that on the front page of NSG right now. We'd be a bunch of squares if there wasn't some sort of humor in any of them.

Seeing as you joined in 2012 I wouldn't expect you to know what NSG is without trolls.

Back in the golden days (2002-2006) there was actually intelligent discussion and good jokes/trolls. Don't get me wrong, I love a good troll (ie boone skis today) but most of the current day trolling on NS is childish and provokes nothing but "what the fuck was that stupid shit i just read".

You kids have no idea what it means to be a good troll, you just make dumb jokes and its fucking over.
 
Please keep this conversation on topic, we created this thread to hear back from the members.

Thanks
 
I think that the immature responses are sometimes hilarious and I love that whenever I post a thread I know someone is going to say some dumb shit and I'll laugh... In other words I like it the way it is please don't change it :'(
 
13119129:Walter.1337 said:
Whoever asked me to check the first page of threads, you asked for it:
https://www.newschoolers.com/forum/thread/788792/Worst-Day-Of-Your-Life

About 2/3 of the way down a perfectly good (and very serious) thread, this happens:

24eq9mc.jpg


This right here is the problem.

Look at how many upvotes those posts have. I like reading funny stuff on ns. It's a good stress reliever lol and it gives me a reason to sign in everyday!
 
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