Does it matter if God exists?

I didn't really know wtf you were trying to do with that post.

Its not too hard to predict that people would be hostile to whats written in the bible. However, im pretty sure atheists have been discriminated against for the last few thousand years... and still are in the US and other very religious countries.
 
See, this is what I love. You completely ignore the point of my argument and circle back around to "that's so illogical."

Let's focus on that for a second.

If I am walking down the street and find a Rolex on the ground next to a couple of nails and a piece of quartz, by your reasoning, my response should be "hot damn. A million years ago that nail and that quartz got together and now a Rolex evolved!"

The human body is nothing more than a complex and intricate machine. When any LOGICAL human being sees a machine which WE have created, we say "Wow. Somebody really smart must have built that."

Rolex, Ferrari, iPhone, Droid, all the same.

Now, for no other reason except that the machines are biological, you all suddenly decide that they must have assembled themselves.

There is absolutely no logic in what you say. It really is as simple as your fallen, rebellious spirit refusing to accept that God created you and that you are accountable to Him, as his creation, for the way in which you behave. You don't like that, so you choose to pretend that He isn't there.
 
Of course you don't. You've been a member since May 2010 and you're probably 15. The logical progression of thought that comes with age and maturity evades you at this point in life.
 
I know for a fact, that as a skiier he owns objects, this is something he has chosen to ignore, take this for example.
Matthew 6:19
  • Do not lay up for yourselves treasures on earth, where moth and rust destroy and where thieves break in and steal; but lay up for yourselves treasures in heaven, where neither moth nor rust destroys and where thieves do not break in and steal. For where your treasure is, there your heart will be also.
Luke 14:33
  • Any of you who does not give up everything he has cannot be my disciple.
Matthew 6:24
  • No one can serve two masters; for either he will hate the one and love the other, or else he will be loyal to the one and despise the other. You cannot serve God and Money.
Matthew 19:21-24
  • Jesus answered, "If you want to be perfect, go, sell your possessions and give to the poor, and you will have treasure in heaven. Then come, follow me." When the young man heard this, he went away sad, because he had great wealth. Then Jesus said to his disciples, "I tell you the truth, it is hard for a rich man to enter the kingdom of heaven. Again I tell you, it is easier for a camel to go through the eye of a needle than for a rich man to enter the kingdom of God."
Matthew 19:28-29
  • Jesus said to them, "I tell you the truth, at the renewal of all things, when the Son of Man sits on his glorious throne, you who have followed me will also sit on twelve thrones, judging the twelve tribes of Israel. And everyone who has left houses or brothers or sisters or father or mother or children or fields for my sake will receive a hundred times as much and will inherit eternal life.
Luke 9:23-25
  • Then he said to them all: "If anyone would come after me, he must deny himself and take up his cross daily and follow me. For whoever wants to save his life will lose it, but whoever loses his life for me will save it. What good is it for a man to gain the whole world, and yet lose or forfeit his very self?
Matt 13: 22
  • The one who received the seed that fell among the thorns is the man who hears the word, but the worries of this life and the deceitfulness of wealth choke it, making it unfruitful.
Hebrews 13:5
  • Keep your lives free from the love of money and be content with what you have, because God has said, "Never will I leave you; never will I forsake you."
Phil 2:3
  • Do nothing out of selfish ambition or vain conceit, but in humility consider others better than yourselves.
Acts 2:44-45
  • All the believers were together and had everything in common. Selling their possessions and goods, they gave to anyone as he had need.
Don't pick and choose parts of the bible, live by it all or shut the fuck up. Chances are you're going to have to kill your wife, because Deuteronomy states she should be stoned at her father's door if she's not a virgin when she marries you.
 
My rebuttal of his argument is implied.

Christians had an explanation for rainbows long before science did.

God created light and the refractive index long before the first rainbow was recorded.

It is also believed by many people (myself included) that before the great flood, that rainbows were never seen because the earth was watered not by rain, but by water welling up from within the earth.

At the time of the flood, God chose to alter this pattern as a sign of judgment for wickedness and in order to display evidence of His new covenant with water now suspended in the air in sufficient quantities to cause refraction.
 
PLEASE don't tell me you're serious?

A rolex does not sexually reproduce.

You must be trolling if you're going to bring evolution back into this argument. All you need to do is google evolution, read the wikipedia page on it, and then shut the fuck up... because you clearly have some major problem with comprehending a reasonably simple concept that any 9th grader can understand.
 
In Mark 11:24 Jesus says ""Whatever you ask for in prayer, believe that you have received it, and it will be yours"

Does this mean I can have anything I ask for?
 
I have already proven the flaw in this logic a couple posts ago. The fact that you chose to ignore it then accused me of ignoring the point of your argument is laughable.
 
As usual, you throw the Bible at me without bothering to understand it.

"Do not lay up for yourselves treasures on earth."

How does that imply

"Do not have nice things or enjoy the earth and all its pursuits?"

I don't have 50 pairs of skis and clothes and excesses which I could never use. I have what I need, and that allows me to be generous and take my friends skiing with me and to enjoy God's earth.

Oh, and for your information, my future wife is a Virgin. So am I.
 
Quoting technofarm from Aug 15 2010 2:51:41:
And about the Bible, its the oldest book we have on human record so why wouldn't you believe it
First I'd like to start with your first statement. The Epic of Gilgamesh is the first book humankind has known. It is commonly referred to as the first epic, poem, and storytelling experience that exists beyond the realm of religious myth. It was written in Mesopotamia, around the year 3000bc. It's a fantastic book, I suggest you look it up. Much of the Bible's stories about Noah are actually founded in parts of this book's mythos.

Second, I'd like to ask you a question. Under what criteria do you believe that "something had to put" the Universe in a correct order by a cosmic being? Is that not more farfetched than any of the other theories? Is it simply that you cannot fathom a world in which there is no creator, or because that creator is not like you, or acts in ways you can understand?
Let's look at several theories:
1)Manifold/brane: Two massive manifolds of extradimensional material collide in null space outside of our universe, creating a massive explosion of matter and substance, giving our universe the momentum to expand.
2)Bubble: Our universe is a small bud off a larger universe, which contains a small packet of material from a much larger, abundant universe.
3)God: An supra-dimensional being created the universe specifically for us, gave us dominion over this universe, and it's 10^16 galaxies and [10^16(10^9)]^2 worlds.

Notice lack of big bang? Well that's because Big Bang Theory is no longer considered valid in the eyes of the most recent scientific evidence that strongly suggests manifold, as these explosions would validate several dimensional models proposed to explain the shape of the universe. The idea of God is still valid, but the Christian God is an impossibility within the constraints of reality. You'll just have to accept the fact that the Christian God is an amalgamation of several different belief structures, myths, and was a tool to reflect and enforce the moral constraints of the era it was written. There IS, however, the possibility for a being capable of matter manipulation - a "supreme" being. So, if you worship that God, fine. But do not come here and tell us that the Christian God is a feasible, even plausible explanation for our reality.
 
LOL. So Wikipedia is a valid academic source?

I understand complex electromagnetics. That is what my thesis topic for my MS in Electrical Engineering is on actually. I'm pretty sure all of the intricacies of your precious evolutionary theory don't escape me.
 
Romans 5

20The law was added so that the trespass might increase. But where sin increased, grace increased all the more, 21so

that, just as sin reigned in death, so also grace might reign through

righteousness to bring eternal life through Jesus Christ our Lord.

Ever seen that one before? The law of the Bible wasn't given in the expectation that we would be able to obey it. It was given to make us aware of how much we need God's grace.

I can guarantee you I know the Bible a lot better than you do. You might as well find another line of argument than the standard "Let me take some quotes out of context and try to make you change what you live your life around in 10 sentences or less."
 
Implying that, because you are an Electrical Engineer, you are in expert in an entirely different field of study is ludicrous and a serious detriment to your intellectual reputation. Why don't you quit being so cocky you fucking asshat.
 
Genesis chapter 17, verse 12:
  • And he that is eight days old shall be circumcised among you, every man child in your generations, he that is born in the house, or bought with money of any stranger, which is not of thy seed. He that is born in thy house, and he that is bought with thy money, must needs be circumcised
Exodus chapter 12 verse 43:
  • The Lord said to Moses and Aaron, "These are the regulations for the Passover: No foreigner is to eat of it. Any slave you have bought may eat of it after you have circumcised him, but a temporary resident and a hired worker may not eat of it.
Exodus Chapter 21, verse 1:
  • Now these are the ordinances which you shall set before them. When you buy a Hebrew slave, he shall serve six years, and in the seventh he shall go out free, for nothing. If he comes in single, he shall go out single; if he comes in married, then his wife shall go out with him. If his master gives him a wife and she bears him sons or daughters, the wife and her children shall be her master's and he shall go out alone. But if the slave plainly says, 'I love my master, my wife, and my children; I will not go out free,' then his master shall bring him to God, and he shall bring him to the door or the doorpost; and his master shall bore his ear through with an awl; and he shall serve him for life.

Exodus Chapter 21, verse 20:
  • If a man beats his male or female slave with a rod and the slave dies as a direct result, he must be punished, but he is not to be punished if the slave gets up after a day or two, since the slave is his property.
God sounds like a fucking scumbag to me.
 
Once again you have failed to address the main point of his argument. Instead you choose to illuminate a minor flaw in his post that doesn't even invalidate his main argument.
 
Well let's see. First we have circumcision.

God commanded that His people have their foreskins removed as a sign of their being His. These days, it is practiced mostly for housekeeping and cleanliness purposes. Were you?

Next, passover feast

A Jewish holiday meal which people who are outsiders and don't understand are not to partake in.

Next, Slavery

When debts where beyond the capability of the debtor to pay, it was common practice to sell themselves into slavery. At the end of 7 years, regardless of the size of the debt, they were set free with their family. If at the end of the servitude, the person chose not to be set free, they would be marked, much as we pierce ears today, and there ya go.

If you murder someone, you should be punished. If they don't do what they are supposed to, they can be beaten. Ever gotten in a fight with somebody who owed you something? And before you bring excessive brutality into it

Ephesians 6:9

And masters, treat your slaves in the same way. Do not threaten

them, since you know that he who is both their Master and yours is in

heaven, and there is no favoritism with him.

Just because it isn't addressed here as wrong does not mean the Bible condones beating anyone. In fact, it is forbidden here. If threatening is wrong, then certainly beating is as well.

None of this is at all complicated to understand or interpret? I'm not the least bit concerned by it.
 
Here in Ephesians 6:9 we have a DIRECT contradiction to Exodus Chapter 21, verse 20, that is also another way we can prove that the Bible is complete, and utter, BULLSHIT.

Another thing my religiously blinded friend,
  • He planned the days of your life in advance, choosing the exact time of your birth and death. The Bible says, "You saw me before I was born and scheduled each day of my life before I began to breathe. Every day was recorded in your book!
Pastor Rick Warren

So if God has a plan for everyone, he had a plan for Hitler? He wanted him to kill all the jews? What was his reasoning behind this? To test our faith? I can think of better ways.

 
How is there a contradiction here?

Nowhere in Exodus 21 does it say it is OK to beat a slave. In fact, it prescribes punishment for those who beat someone to death.

Ephesians 6 says NOT to do so.

There is no contradiction there. And let it also be noted that the original quoter chose the translation of the verse which best fits his agenda.

Romans 11

36For from him and through him and to him are all things.

To him be the glory forever! Amen.

Yep. God had a plan in the holocaust. Why are you complaining about that? You weren't there. You know nothing of what happened. I can show you countless stories of Jews who endured it and glorified God for it, and would spit in your face for using it as an argument against Him.

The very fact that you still have air to breathe and were not destroyed at your first conscious sin is something called providential love.

God provides for you in spite of your sin.

You are engaged in the classic blunder of self righteousness. Ascribing to God the attributes you think He should have, as opposed to believing in the ones which He does.

Anyone who is imperfect (which is everyone) deserves nothing better than death. To live life at all is a blessing.

The issue is that you believe that you are inherently good, and therefore deserve something.

Self righteousness.
 
Romans 6:23

23For the wages of sin is death, but the gift of God is eternal life in[a] Christ Jesus our Lord.

Nope. Just quoting Romans 6:23.

I will be praying for you.

 
Is your napkin the most printed and translated piece of literature ever to exist on the face of the earth?

I thought not...
 
You need to take some notes on Zacman's trolling. Notice how he chooses to argue for a point that is clearly wrong and slowly increases the ridiculousness of his arguments until eventually he can say that everybody in the world deserves to die and nobody even bats an eye. To be honest, he is one the best trolls I've ever seen.
 
BUT IF THE SLAVES RISES AFTER A DAY OR TWO

MEANING THERE IS NO PUNISHMENT IF YOU BEAT YOUR SLAVE, JUST IF YOU KILL THEM!

DERP DEERP DERPPPP. Sometimes I wonder how I as an atheist can better understand the Bible than you.

I never said I was inherently good, I will be the first to admit I am a sarcastic, arrogant asshole. I am a dick, and I really..am not ashamed.

You need to realize, that the BIBLE IS WRONG.

If God is all knowing and the Bible is perfect, then why is it so damn sexist? Sure Eve ate the forbidden fruit, but come on that was a while ago.

1 Corinthians chapter 14:As in all the congregations of the saints, women should remain silent in the churches. They are not allowed to speak, but must be in submission, as the Law says. If they want to inquire about something, they should ask their own husbands at home; for it is disgraceful for a woman to speak in the church.

1 Corinthians 11 :But I want you to understand that the head of every man is Christ, the head of a woman is her husband, and the head of Christ is God. Any man who prays or prophesies with his head covered dishonors his head, but any woman who prays or prophesies with her head unveiled dishonors her head--it is the same as if her head were shaven. For if a woman will not veil herself, then she should cut off her hair; but if it is disgraceful for a woman to be shorn or shaven, let her wear a veil. For a man ought not to cover his head, since he is the image and glory of God; but woman is the glory of man. (For man was not made from woman, but woman from man. Neither was man created for woman, but woman for man.) That is why a woman ought to have a veil on her head, because of the angels.

He seems like a dick
Are any of the elders in the book of revelations women? noAre any of the books in the bible written by women? no
Stop picking and choosing in the bible, it pisses me off. Balls to the wall, or not at all. You can't do that with the Canadian criminal code, so don't do it with anything else.
 
So is this guy gonna answer my post or what? It's quite clear he isn't well-versed in history, nor does he possess even moderate knowledge about his own religion.
 
And another thing, ripped right from my Brother's writings.

To any unbiased observer, the reason for sexism in the Bible is very easy to understand: The Bible was not written by a "all-knowing", "all-loving", "fully-enlightened" "god". It was written by primitive men who were flagrant sexists. Just look at how men in primitive countries like Afghanistan treat women today. Those are the kind of men who wrote the Bible.
yes he wrote part of the article for Imaginary, and yes I am proud.
 
This thread is full of fail. Seriously.

The main discussion for this thread is "does god exist?" NOT discussing the validity of the historical backgrounds of religion and/or the catholic church.

Making religion threads on NS should cause for immediate deletion. seeing as how NS is 90% atheistic teenagers, a topic of this caliber just won't happen
 
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