What gives a ski pop?

Snowcase

Snowcase

Active member
Just wondering what some factors are in giving a ski pop. Lots of people say flex but it doesn't make sense to me. With a stiffer ski and more camber it would want to revert to the same position faster which would give it pop wouldn't it?
 
yea, you want a lil flex so it has more bend to pop back into shape from, but a ski thats responsive to its flex and pushes you up as you push off from flexing is what the pop is. The camber is also important, you've pretty much got it. Also internal parts like the carbon ollie band and other shit i dont get give it that responsivenss
 
if its stiffer it will have more pop, but thats only if you can actually flexit. so its kind of a few factors. where the ski flexxes, how much you way, how tall you are and stuff.
 
Camber is way important... and the material. a responsive core, than retains it's shape, doesn't loose camber. some woods are just snappier than other. and it also has a lot of how the person uses it.
 
hes right....there is also the factor of the ollie band...which is a strip of ....(i dont know what) that is placed in the ski.

check out the line factory tour in wski106. its all there.
 
ollieband is carbon fiber. but i dont get line, theres a better way to do it tham 4 stringers tip to tail. do X's

X on the tail, and on the tip X

and one big one that runs the length of the ski. that makes a much stiffer ski torsionally, and makes it retain camber/pop better. this is how snowboards with carbon are made.
 
that was to snowcase...

and actually now that i think about it...it really depends where your popping from..if your popping off your tails then i guess your tails would need more flex. if your nollie-ing=more flex on nose.
 
id say it would be best to have it get flexxier as it gets closer to the tips and tails. that way its a smoother flex and uses more of the ski to pop rather than just one part.
 
true, torsionally stiff doesnt by itself make a ski better. it is something you want, however. there are a lot of companies that do use stringers in snowboarding, but the more progrssive ones use a crossed design. it creates a matrix of carbon, makes the ski pop more, and makes it retain pop/camber well.
 
as far as i knew torsional stiffness was like twisting motion, which would have nothing to do with pop, but it would held stability.
 
FUCKING BAMBOO!!!!!! ROCK ON NINTHWARD!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
 
near the bindings, because that is where the most force is applied. line has butter zones, and armada also has an individual flexpoint in the t-hall.
 
Take a course in Mechanics of materials..

It has to do with the rebound of a material. Thats all, skis perform differently, based on how well the absorb different types of energy (ie, flex v. torsional rigidness), what the modulus of elastisity is, etc.
 
its all about how stiff the core your using is, such as sugar maple = stiffest core their is, most pop their is

also the more camber you have, the more of a trampoleine affect you have when you pop up on your skis
 
yeah i would have thought so, but i think there would be different camber in each ski

im more than likely wrong though
 
The full answer:

The resiliance (ability to return stored internal energy as kinetic energy and return to its original shape (the ability for the wood to follow hooke's law under a leaf deformation)) is the only thing which affects the "pop" of a ski.

Sidewall type does not matter.

Stiffness of a ski does not matter in the slightest bit. The stiffness affects riding characteritics, but not the pop. If you need to know what ski is stiffer than another one, look up the young's modulus of the wood used in the core and the composites used in its construction.

Adding composites / fiberglass etc does not increase the pop of a ski, it maximizes the y modulus of the ski (makes it more rigid)

You can look up the resiliance of a lot of common wood types if you want to know what kind of characteristics the ski will have when it comes to pop.
 
camber really has nothing to do with it. camber just keeps the entire ski in contact with the snow as much as possible. if the ski had a huge amount of camber, it would help, but you would have to use it like a trampoline and jump up and down a few times before you achieved maximum pop, and thats if you could manage to ski with only the tips and tails touching.
 
i dunno wat gives a ski pop but if u want a ski wiht pop get k2 fujatives i was riding my friends this weekkend they were so fun
 
from my point of view and being familiar with hockey this also comes into play with the sticks.. there are specified flexes on every stick and you find one that fits you. so when you apply the right force to it it bends and when you give, the stick "snaps" back giving you a harder shot. related to skiing, when you apply the right ammount of force the ski bends and when you give with your weight it gives a responsive feel, therefore "pop."
 
yyyes, it is mostly the camber, and then the materials used , not the stiffness, certain woods will be more "popier" than others, specially if they have glues in them. Things liek metal skis could be really stiff but have little pop, because of the atomic properties. This is why wood is sucha fantastic substance. Wood also holds its cmaber longer , suppling a longer lifetime of pop.
 
really your whole speech on hookes law is showing that a more resiliant ski that returned the quickest is going to pop more.

Thing like a bow, the stiff the bow, the more pound of pressure you get the farther and faster it launches your arrow. But you have to be strong enough to pull it back.
 
I think a lot a factors go into it...a stiffer ski would have more pop but I imagine HOW you ski on that particular ski, and your weight, height, ability, etc make a significant difference.
 
it doesn't quite work like that.

We research this kind of thing here as its our job to build skis. What i do required a degree in physics, but this matter is elementary.

A weak person using a stiff ski wont be able to deflect the ski very far, but because it is stiffer, this small deflection stores a large amount of energy.

The same person using a softer ski will bend the ski much further. The ski stores less energy for a given amount of deflection, but it deflects further. The same amount of energy is stored.

This is super basic hooke's law. If i have a stiff spring and a flimsy spring, and i apply the same force to both of them (lets say im making a slingshot or something), both springs will shoot just as far. both springs will return the same amount of force when released. The only difference is that the stiffer one will have extended less than the small one under the identical force.

when you put energy into a ski to pop, 100% of that energy goes into the ski, regardless of how stiff it is. How much useful energy the ski gives back when you jump dpends on its resilliance / dampening / whatever you want to call it. The ski doesnt return as much force as you applied on it, because some of the energy changes form (is damped).

Basically, what im getting at is that energy isnt created out of nowhere. A stiffer ski doesnt magically generate more energy when you pop. stiffness 100% does not determine the pop of a ski, the dempening properties of the core do.

Using your bow analogy, a stiff bow and a non-stiff bow are both capable of shooting an arrow with the identical velocity / distance with the EXACT same amount of effort from the user. if Johnny is strong enough to apply 100lbs of force, then, regardless of which bow he uses, the bow will shoot the arrow the same distance. the only difference is that the less stiff bow will bend a LOT further as he loads it. Ps: the reason bows are stiff is because if they were soft, they would bend too far to be practically usable. this is an ergonomics / usability thing. This is the same for skis. A stiff ski provides different ergonomics than a soft one, but no difference in pop. different lamination processes, composites, and sometimes the type of wood, are the major determining factors for that.

haha, anyway, if youve read the far through my mini book, hopefully it made some sense!
 
ur kidding right??? all that means is that pop is how much 'rebound'(if u will), a ski gives when ollied on...how much it pushes back for extra air
 
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