Vegetarianism

John.

John.

Active member
Just curious about people's views. Simple question, I think there are many moral arguments for eating vegetarian, does anyone have any valid arguments against vegetarianism? What do you think about vegetarianism?

 
There's nothing wrong with eating meat, but some of the practices of the meat industry are pretty atrocious. I personally don't care if other people are vegetarians, as long as they don't push their views on me, like "YOU'RE MURDERING INNOCENT ANIMALS!"

I don't understand vegans, because honestly, what's wrong with drinking the milk from a cow or the egg from a chicken? It doesn't harm the cow to harvest its milk, and milk has many healthy properties, as do eggs.
 
originally started as a result of cultural and religious beliefs, later evolved into no longer being an option for certain cultures due to adaptation of the diet, now taken over by weirdos who simply don't want to eat meat because they are delusional.

more meat for me, i follow maddox's diet.

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preferably exotic or endangered animals (whenever possible).
 
Understand that some people have damn good reasons, for example they are either very allergic or completely intolerant to certain foods, like dairy products.
 
a very ignorant response would bevegetables=salad=womenmeat=filling steaks=MAN FOOD
i just eat meat because it's filling and tastes good, i feel like you can't get as full if you eat only vegetables
 
I'm fine with it as long as they are fine with me eating meat.

I just hate people that try to get you to join PETA or shit like that. When in reality, the meat industry isn't going to stop killing animals because some people joined some group. Its like trying to shut down a tobacco company or something, you just can't do it (I don't smoke cigs by the way).
 
Becoming a Vegetarian strictly for the purpose of promoting animal ethics is completely ignorant and unacceptable in my eyes. As a former employee in many fine health food, or alternative grocery stores, I cannot stress this enough.

It is the 'MORAL' equivalent of being against war, and instead of voting for an anti-war candidate, simply not voting at all.

If you truly believe in ethics and animal rights in the food industry, you buy ORGANIC meat, not stopping eating it altogether. Organic promotes strictly regulated rules on farmers. Some of them include:

-Specific amount of organic grazing area per cow. I believe it's 2 acres per cow.

-No antibiotics or drugs or hormones WHATSOEVER.

-Must have organic feed AND a natural, untampered source of food. No sprays of any kind. Also, at least 1 natural water source.

So if you truly want to act on your 'Ethics' you would buy organic to save the animals.

Other than that, Vegetarians are fine. Its a way to live, just as long as they're not dumb fucking blondes about their shit.
 
Most people in america eat way more meat than is healthy. I'm not actually vegetarian, but I only eat meat once or twice a week. It's the healthiest way to go in my opinion.
 
2 acres per cow?!?!?!?

thats ridiculus, and it will lead to the demise of cows as a food source.

the only way to "save the cows" is to eat more beef because as long as there is popular demand, we will protect cows
 
did you mean veggies and potatoes?

i believe the direct translation of the native american word for vegetarian is "bad hunter"
 
I could really use a medium rare steak right about now. thick and juicy and tasty. There is no veggy shit that can substitute that, so that alone is a reason that meat wins.

granted that is a terrible argument (well, not even an argument) but I don't care.
 
The answer is literally in your mouth. There is an easy way to determine what a species is meant to eat, and that is by what type of teeth it has. This is how we can easily tell if an animal is a carnivore, omnivore, or herbivore. Since humans have both molars and canines it is an absolute truth that humans are made to be omnivores.

Also another fact is, during early periods of man we HAD to eat meat to survive. Humans as a species would have never survived any amount of time if we weren't made to eat both plants and animals. How do you think humans even survived the ice age, where much of the plant life was killed. It was impossible to maintain or gain any weight to survive such harsh environments without the consumption of fatty meats. Fatty acids are a big example of that. The human body breaks down without essential fatty acids that are mostly found in different meats. Yes there are some plants that have fatty acids (flax seed being an example), but how available do you think they were during our beginning stages. Why do you think supplements is such a big market? It isn't mainly because of gym fanatics.

In conclusion, if vegetarians were the first humans on this planet, we wouldn't be here. They would have starved themselves and killed off our species in no time flat. This is to the ones that say humans weren't meant to eat meat blah blah blah. If they are one of these totally ignorant vegetarians that refuses to look at the evidence. If it's just by choice, but you aren't that ignorant I have no problem with it.
 
Or he's just one of the most badass meat eaters that actually would let an animal sit with him at a meal next to his current meat and potatoes to show them what's coming.
 
you can get just as much protein from not eating meat... meat taste good. More than 90% of meat in the U.S. is full of unnatural hormones and steroids though.

Meat companies are about nothing but profit. Why slaughter a cow that weighs 2,000 lbs. when u can get them to eat or inject hormones and steroids into them and make them weight 2,200 lbs and make more $ per cow? think about it. One of the many reasons americans are fat. Not so much that we eat too much, its also because what we eat, is crap in disguise.
 
Meat industry is definitly wrong, as in WRONG! But if hunting and killing shit gets your rocks off, then go for it, to me it seems retarded but each to their own. Life feeds off life, I acknowledge that, but I have a hard enough time killing vegies to eat, so I definitly can't justify eating animal carcass. I'm vege yes.
 
Is this a serious post?

So I can't be both against eating meat and for animal rights? Whether I buy organic meat or don't eat meat at all, I'm still not supporting the non-organic mass producers of meat. Further, what is and isn't organic gets murkier and murkier every year, there are a shitload of supposed "organic" certification companies and they have very very different standards. (The USDA isn't exactly the most reputable outfit in my eyes as well.)

You're post reeks of self justification and ignorance. If you can't understand why you're wrong, spend five minutes thinking about the meaning of supply and demand. Eat meat if you want, but don't tell me that I am against animal rights because I follow a vegetarian diet.
 
And plants are so much better? Ground contamination/chemicals/insecticides/water sources etc. People need to realize that NOTHING is contaminant free in the world we live in now. Organic isn't as organic as people think it is. See there are some rules in place to be qualified as organic, and they fall WAY short of being actual organic. It's only as organic as it has to be to put that little organic sticker on it, but it isn't really organic. Grow your own organic at home? K did you check what's in your backyard soil? Where'd you get the top soil in pots? Where are you getting the water that you water them with?

In actuality plants nowadays are more unnatural than the meats. Do you know that almost every vegetable we grow in this age is genetically altered? The plants that you think are clean are not even supposed to exist in the form they are. You know that canola oil that everyone thinks is so healthy, well ya see it was genetically altered by Canadian scientists. It's source is the very same mustard plant (which is poisonous) that made the poison known as mustard gas, and very small traces of that poison is in every container. How about that soy that vegetarians love? Research it and you'll find it was hugely altered and original soy was poisonous.
 
i totally support vegetarians..but i dont care if people eat meat..i dont eat much beef but pretty much every other normal meat.

and yah..its not like u are hurting a cow if u drinnk their milk..i dont get vegans...i would die with out dairy products.
 
1) milk and dairy are far more energy consumptive than vegan foods.

2) Many vegans still object to the treatment of animals in the dairy industry (plenty of sketchy practices even without killing the animals. Bovine growth hormone for example can cause udders to get swollen and infected, passing pus into your milk)

3) What about the male cows and older milk cows? They don't just get turned loose into a field to play. Most dairy cows' calves are turned into veal

4) There are many health benefits to a vegan diet, cultures in southeast Asia that eat almost no animal products have the lowest rates of heart disease in the world.

Just a few of the reasons that a vegan diet is totally legit.
 
I don't understand the rationale of vegetarians that don't eat meat because of moral reasons.

Humans evolved so that pretty much our sole advantage is our intelligence. If we have the technology to keep cows and efficiently slaughter them so that we can get as much food as possible then we should. Its like saying that its immoral for a lion to eat a gazelle because it has claws and teeth. Its not our fault that cows haven't evolved adequate defense mechanisms.
 
You clearly have no understanding of Biomass levels and Bioaccumulation. The feed animals are getting are just as polluted if not more than vegetables for human consumption, thus since the trophic levels are ten to one for primary consumers such as chickens and far far higher for Cattle, you are getting ten or more times as much contamination per calorie in meat, not to mention the steroids. Nice try though. Also, I'm very aware of the issues with soy, another reason to push for less regulated hemp production in this country, one of the healthiest food sources out there, both for humans and the planet.
 
By that rationale genocide is totally fine because the victims haven't evolved enough to protect themselves. In fact, if we have the technology to nuke people, we probably should right? I mean, we evolved largely through violence, many of the earliest humans have been found with spear points in their ribs or other evidence of violence.

Now before anyone freaks out, I am not at all comparing the meat industry to the holocaust, just pointing out the flaws in your argument.
 
Umm, I hiked 2500 miles from Mexico to Canada on the Pacific Crest trail this summer, seven months after my second ACL replacement in a year. I think I'm kinda healthy and I've been a vegetarian for more than four years.
 
but it isn't natural to immorally kill animals, and mass produce their meat full of chemicals and preservatives.

Or perhaps it is natural, just as natural as downtown L.A.
 
I agree. I was just stateing the meat side of things. "certified organic" is certified by who? probably just another company that's part of the USDA or FDA. True organic was before people started polluting. So if you want to get real technical then, yeah, there's virtually no such thing as 100% ORGANIC.
 
because we don't eat humans?

If we slaughtered cows mercilessly without eating them then I would have a problem with that
 
I didn't talk about levels per consumption did I? What I said is true. Yes you can get heavier dosages based on what you eat, but my point still stands that the plant life that we grow today is more unnatural in its current state than a cow is. We have changed the genes of every plant that is made for consumption. A cow is still more genetically natural than that corn you are eating. It's also still too early to say if there is going to be any effects of this gene splicing/altering. When we actually take plants that are poisonous and alter them to be consumed, you can't tell me that meat is so bad while ignoring what you're eating being disguised as being totally healthy. Which practically every vegetarian does.

See vegetarians refuse to face these little facts and shove contamination of meats down our collective throats, all the while eating plants that are mutations and for sure have contaminations themselves. I admit fully that meats are contaminated as all get out, but I also know that everything we touch/eat/breathe is.

All in all, we are all fucked.
 
You're making some big assumptions here and ignoring some basic truths. By the very act of domesticating animals you are then rendering them genetically unnatural. Not every plant that we eat is GMO as well, there is huge a difference between cross-breeding and grafting of plants which has gone on for centuries and more serious GMO stuff. If you want to talk about GMO's I'm all for that. It's ridiculous that right now there is no requirement to label ingredients as such. However, they are not in "everything we eat." I believe it was switzerland that recently actually banned all GMO food pending further research. It is not too late.
 
unnatural pesticides alter plants. and when pesticides are sprayed and some pests don't die, they develop an immunity, therefore a new pesticide is made, and sprayed on the plants again. Seeds from plants today came from the past, obviously. Air pollution can affect plants too.
 
OH. MY. GOD.

You are the definition of fucking stupid, do you know that? Not only are you arguing a seperate topic, but you are calling me ignorant and self-righteous as well!!!??

No, things don't get murkier when it comes to orgnics, its a VERY strictly regulated practice YOU DUMB TWAT. If you had any idea what you were talking about, you would know that, and furthermore, there are literally fucking books on the topic. Go read one, stop being retarded. Second, no, you can't be against the mass-producers of cheap quality meat if you are vegetarian. You are what we call neutral. Not against, and not for like an undecisive bitch.

And please, no more attacks on my personal character if you obviously don't know shit about your topic or fail to provide any credibilty on the subject

/DONE/
 
See my post about bioaccumulation. If you are concerned about the chemicals in pesticides, you are eating at least ten times more chemicals in meat than if you ate only vegetables. The cows don't just magically make the pesticides in their feed disappear.
 
Supply and demand. If I don't buy mass produced meat, there is less of a market for it, the value drops and less is produced. How is that wrong?

Further, I am pretty skeptical of any group that is as affected by lobbying as the USDA.
 
You want a moral argument against vegetarianism? Consider the implications of cutting down a forest so you can grow your field of wheat. Agriculture in general is in violation of 'the laws of life'; These laws being the laws that are obeyed by every other animal on the face of the planet.

it goes:

You may compete to the full extent of your capabilities, but you may not

hunt down competitors or destroy their food or deny them access to food.

you may compete but you may not wage war
 
I am a vegetarian but not because of like "saving animals" or saying how wrong it is to eat meat... i bet someone i could for a month and i just kinda never really ate it after that. but i could care less if people do eat meat
 
Good point, because cows are totally running wild in the forest. Cheap production of beef is one of the primary causes for slash and burn practices in the rainforest. About brazil

"Cattle in the country’s Amazon jungle region, which numbered 73.7 million head

in 2006, occupied 74 percent of the total deforested area."
 
There is no end to this thread, no one will ever convince than eating meat or not is the right answer.

So....

FUCK YOU VEGETARIANS, STOP TRYING TO CHANGE OUR MIND, WE LIKE MEAT, AND WILL NEVER STOP EATING IT BECAUSE YOU THINK IT IS BAD!!!!!!

FUCK YOU MEAT EATERS, STOP SHOVING MEAT IN OUR FUCKING FACE, WE ARE VEGANS, WE WILL CONTINUE EATING OUR OWN BIOLOGIC FOOD AS WELL AS OUR DELICIOUS FRUITS!!!!

Now, stop the hating please.
 
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