Vail Resorts Struggling?

[TOAST.]

That slide deck was nice. Everyone complains about day pass prices but they literally spell it out if it wasn't obvious enough yet. They're increasing day pass prices to push everyone towards the subscription model because it is more profitable and reliable for all skier types, even you locals. They are buying no name places in Ohio and PA to add to their subscriber model. I'm surprised NC hasn't been targeted yet, especially given that Charlotte and Raleigh are two of the fastest growing regions in the US and within a few hours of two separate mountains. They are very open about their aggressive expansion and acquisition plans. They're coming for Europe too lol so you fuckers bragging about cheap tickets....for now.

We should also expect more independent ski areas to struggle as skiers move to IKON/Epic passes and stop going to places not on those passes. Those independents will have to raise their prices to stay afloat and that will push even more skiers away and towards passes. This is only the beginning of the consolidation...

Therefore this whole debate going on above me about they have little thresholds to close down underperforming places is questionable. Yes that's common in big corporations to trim the fat but for vr, it's part of their business plan. Those places couldn't have had great profit margins when they bought them anyway. If they close them, well, they lose many of those subscribers and hinder ability to add new subscribers in those areas. That's unlikely to happen. If they start seeing regional drops in subscribers though, that may be a possibility of closing some locations in those underperforming regions.

The only stupid things are:

-Mobile pass idea...cool until your phone runs out of juice.

-Same wage across all resorts. This should be location specific and differentiate more for certain roles. The income to survive in Vail, CO is much different than Bellefontaine, OH...lol mad river.

-Their self proclaimed focus on attracting and retaining top talent. Lmao. This will be their downfall and probably their biggest risk in the next 20 years.

-Their confidence that new resorts will not be built and aren't a threat.

And don't be mad at Vail. Be mad at the people they paid to design this very lucrative master plan.

I think a big thing that is going to hurt vail is the barrier to entry. A lot of the small resorts in the population hubs that they purchased were good at getting new people on skis and introducing people to skiing. That no longer seems like it's the case. They have successfully sold the subscription model to people that already skiied, but I do not see it being sustainable long term as populations get older and the economy declines.

 

[skierman]

I think a big thing that is going to hurt vail is the barrier to entry. A lot of the small resorts in the population hubs that they purchased were good at getting new people on skis and introducing people to skiing. That no longer seems like it's the case. They have successfully sold the subscription model to people that already skiied, but I do not see it being sustainable long term as populations get older and the economy declines.

Nah man, catering to people who travel to multiple different resorts a season and/or families that stay over a week at mega resorts to justify the cost is an incredibly smart and sustainable business model which is impervious to downturns in the economy. As we all know, wealthy gapers will never abandon skiing in order to save some money when times are tough.

 

[WoFIowz]

I think a big thing that is going to hurt vail is the barrier to entry. A lot of the small resorts in the population hubs that they purchased were good at getting new people on skis and introducing people to skiing. That no longer seems like it's the case. They have successfully sold the subscription model to people that already skiied, but I do not see it being sustainable long term as populations get older and the economy declines.

Maybe but they're doing a hell of a job attracting new customers who end up spending more. They're definitely targeting the higher travel class of consumers.

 

[michael_bc]

I doubt whether the Vail model will take foot in Europe. Most of the lift companies are majority-owned by the local governments which are unlikely to relinquish control (Andermatt is a famous exception).

Meanwhile, European resorts have found an alternative to Vail's subscription model: dynamic pricing. It works like plane tickets and forces people to buy their lift tickets well ahead of time. This removes the uncertainty of weather and snow conditions on ticket sales. This model has been wildly successful and Europeans are now learning to ski on days without sun (!). It rewards early bookers and loyal customers, even if they only ski 1 week a year. Maybe some of the non-Epic/Ikon resorts could try this model to stay afloat.

**This post was edited on Feb 29th 2024 at 8:16:33am

 

[eheath]

View attachment 1088390

Maybe but they're doing a hell of a job attracting new customers who end up spending more. They're definitely targeting the higher travel class of consumers.

They took advantage of COVID big time, cheapest pass they ever sold was when everyone was trying out skiing again/for the first time. That number is going to plummet.

 

[theabortionator]

I doubt whether the Vail model will take foot in Europe. Most of the lift companies are majority-owned by the local governments which are unlikely to relinquish control (Andermatt is a famous exception).

Meanwhile, European resorts have found an alternative to Vail's subscription model: dynamic pricing. It works like plane tickets and forces people to buy their lift tickets well ahead of time. This removes the uncertainty of weather and snow conditions on ticket sales. This model has been wildly successful and Europeans are now learning to ski on days without sun (!). It rewards early bookers and loyal customers, even if they only ski 1 week a year. Maybe some of the non-Epic/Ikon resorts could try this model to stay afloat.

**This post was edited on Feb 29th 2024 at 8:16:33am

Ine of the mtns in Arizona does this. Prolly others.

I get it but its kind of shit imo. If its used just for the holidays, like you really wanna go thay bad? Fuck it. But in general? Idk fuck having to pre buy and plan everything out. That's no way to live