The super rich hiding up to $32 trillion offshore

Sry for late reply, just got done working LIKE A MIDDLE CLASS BADASS. Jk but now that you are splitting the middle class into subsections, my argument is invalid, but everyone I know who is 'middle middle class' is doing fine.. Maybe you are confusing 'ghetto' with 'truly middle class'. Then yes, good point, but through what I see every day, its only the people who feel entitled to free everything that push this kind stuff.
 
Except for the fact that it isn't legal, as is clearly pointed out in the article. There's a reason people aren't legally allowed to put their money in offshore bank accounts in the Caymans, it's called tax evasion. As in deliberately storing your money in another nation so you don't have to pay your part to live in your own country.

Yeah paying taxes sucks, but it's a necessity, so those copping out to Lichtenstein or wherever else are deserving of those who are mad them.
 
^true. Sorry, didn't even hardly skim the article so I assumed they were being tricky, but in a legal way.
 
they sure pitch in a shit ton more than you or i do, somebody making 1,000,000 and paying 350,000 just in income tax in one year is contributing way more than I would over my entire life, does that not sound "fair"? is that not good enough for you? if anything i think we owe them, they are picking up our slack, what the fuck do i have to complain about? i dont feel like they owe me for working their ass off to make money.
 
And just what ass-backwards racist, ignorant, hole in the ground did you grow up in?

Ever wonder what the rest of the work thinks of people like you? Take two seconds to ponder that thought and maybe self-reflect a little.
 
Nothing is stopping you from making a million a year. But when you do, you'll have to pay crazy taxes. Don't want to pay taxes? Don't make money. Your choice. Live like shit living on food stamps and such, or make money and pay for other peoples food stamps. Easy choice for me.
 
I believe that comment was mocking the others above who didnt believe the aljazeera story to be true because of its funny name.
 
I can believe it. The world's rich are getting richer, wouldn't surprise me if the figure was correct.
 
Brilliant question is brilliant.

Income tax was found to be unconstitutional in America numerous times. Not saying there shouldn't be taxes but if you actually sit back and look at the concept of gvt. and taxes it can get really interesting. The only reason a gvt. exists and can spend money is because they tax it's ppl, and if the ppl didn't pay they're taxes the gvt would instantly cease to exist.
 
For all of the people saying "wtf that's retartded it's like twice the

GDP!?!? impossibru!", you should look into how GDP is actually

calculated and then realize how fucking stupid you are.

Actually, if you factor in the present value of the difference between the nation's total

revenues and its total obligations (I'm talking all social security programs, Medicare, and Medicaid, etc) US national debt is $211 trillion.

And that's an optimistic figure, coming from Laurence J. Kotlikoff, chief ec

 
when like 50% of your income goes away, thats stopping you from making a million a year. but really, its just extremely backwards to me. the rich contribute way more, so punish them by making them contribute more than they already are? sure its not gonna discourage me from trying to make good money, but it just fits perfectly into our societies shitty outlook on success, this "shame on you rich guy, you dont need that much money or that nice house, you owe me because your selfish" Its annoying as fuck, its like we think its totally cool for the poor to mooch off the government and the man because they are entitled to it, fuck that.
 
They have all that money specifically for that reason... No one ever made money giving their wealth away. Sure people do, and that is great, but the vast majority just want it for themselves.
 
Yeah because life is REALLY hard for those hedge fund managers and CEOs who only get to keep 40% of the millions in interest and the tens of millions of dollars in wages every year. Its a good thing they have those yearly bonuses or else they'd really be in financial troubles!

http://abcnews.go.com/Business/top-ceo-bonuses-2010-heinz-oracle-cisco-nike/story?id=12404900#.UBAfErTeDFI

Funny, I think I've heard the same argument before when I was once passing by a house for the clinically retarded...
 
Yet this "news article" includes the phrase "super rich", claims they're "hiding" money, and uses the words "tax evasion" multiple times in reference to the use of low tax jurisdictions and tax treaties, all of which is specifically built into the tax code and into those treaties.

Hey look, my country's tax system says I pay half as much tax for a capital gain as for interest income - I guess it must be immoral for me to make my money in real estate speculation instead of lending, huh?
 
Just for clarification the highest marginal tax bracket in the US is 35%. That means that on the last dollar of TAXABLE income, a rich individual (>$388,350 for single filing status) is able to keep 65 cents of that dollar, the government takes 35 cents, not 70.

However, most of the rich people you probably have in mind make most of their money from capital gains (ie. investments). Long-Term (>1 year) capital gains are taxed at a preferential rate of 15%.

So no, the government does not keep anywhere near 70 cents per dollar.

Also, if a person falls in the 35% tax bracket, they do not pay 35% on every dollar they earn. They pay 35% on every dollar they earn above $388,350. So whoever said a person who makes $1 million pays $350,000 in taxes, no they don't. The calculation for how much tax a person with $1 million dollars of ORDINARY income would pay is:

$1,000,000 - Gross Income

($5,950) - Standard Deduction (varies for filing status and if you are able to itemize, this is single)

($3,800) - Personal Exemption (varies for amount of dependents, this is one (yourself))

___________

$990,250 - Taxable Income

Total Tax:

$870 - 10% Tax Bracket

$3,998 - 15% Tax Bracket

$12,575 - 25% Tax Bracket

$26,040 - 28% Tax Bracket

$69,201 - 33% Tax Bracket

$210,665 - 35% Tax Bracket

= $323,349 Total Tax

= 32% Effective Tax Rate with a 35% Marginal Tax Rate

HOWEVER, if all of the $1 million dollars was from long-term capital gains they would pay $148,536, or an effective tax rate of 14.9%.

/end tax lesson

*This is an overly simplified example for illustrative purposes. $323,349 is the MOST tax a person with $1 million dollars of income would end up paying. Most people with this kind of income are itemizing deductions to reduce their taxable income below $990,250.

** This is all based on 2012 tax law. Rates are scheduled to go up in 2013 if there is not further legislation.
 
never said life was REALLY hard for them, thats not the point. doesnt matter if their life is a living hell or the easiest shit in the world, thats 100% their business, its their money. ya know there are kids in Africa that dont own clothes and eat like a couple grains of rice a day, why should you be able to have a tv? your life is so damn easy with your clothes and apartment and shoes, and non shit infested water, you dont NEED two pairs of socks. life must be really hard for you and your thousands of dollars in income. why dont you give that to someone who needs it? greedy asshole.

you can keep going with this but where do you draw the line? there is no fucking line. you may see a sports car and a pool as unnecessary, well diseased starving africans might see a fucking umbrella for a home unnecessary, and you own a fucking cell phone!?

people earn more than others, work harder than others, have more than others, are luckier than others, thats life, doesnt matter how you got what you have, nobody owes anyone anything.

why the fuck should they pay a higher percentage, when the fact that they make millions, means they are paying more in taxes per year than you will over your entire lifetime? you work your ass off your entire life to make millions, lets say you make 1,000,000 a year. joe makes 20,000. if you pay the SAME percentage, joe is putting in 2% as much as you are. yet he thinks you owe him more. how the fuck is that anything but the opposite of fair?

the idea that the people picking up the slack and pulling along the poor are the ones that should be pitching in a higher percentage is fucking ridiculous, the people not taking money from the government, the 1% that pay 40% (or whatever it is) of income taxes, need to pitch in more and "pay their fair share"???

 
So your argument is the following... those who are more fortunate than us, who are in their position because of either being privileged (a minority of millionaires/billionaires) or hard work tied in with being lucky (all the other millionaires/billionaires), shouldn't pay a larger percentage that they can easily afford and still live an unchanged quality of life because there's naked kids in Africa?

I didn't know they allowed special-needs children to use the internet...
 
pretty much, but i still dont think you get my point. it does not matter if they can easily afford it. shit i make like 15,000-20,000 a year, and could easily give away half if i didnt waste my money on things i dont need. all i need is food and a form of shelter right? but no, i want a certain level of comfort that isnt exactly necessary. thats exactly what the super rich are doing. they might want to spend 30 million on a new vacation home, which they cant easily afford, you may want to spend 20 grand on a new car, i might want to spend 10 on rent for a nice apartment, the the poor man in mexico might want to spend 10 bucks on a shitty bike. doesnt fucking matter what your definition of necessity is and what you think is easily affordable. its that you feel that you are entitled to someone elses money, for doing absolutely fucking nothing for it. and you arent. your money is your own business.

Why do you think rich people owe you? what have you done to deserve it? your not willing to work your ass off building a company for 20 years? do they owe you because you have different values?

do you not think the rich pay a fair share? the guy making millions may be paying hundreds of thousands, maybe millions in taxes. and you or i pay probably a couple grand? what do we have to bitch about? im amazed at how people like you can manage to figure out some fucked way to ignore your huge lack of contribution to society or whatever you want to call taxes, and find a way to think the guy paying millions in taxes isnt paying a fair share. how the hell do you manage to come up with that conclusion?
 
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Hahaha, ignorance is bliss.

There's plenty of billionaires and successful people who worked for their whole lives to get to where they are now that believe that people in their positions of success or wealth have a duty to use their resources for the BETTERMENT OF SOCIETY AS A WHOLE. I bet that's an idea that you've never heard of, huh?

So wait if men who have worked their whole lives believe that wealth, to a certain degree, should be used to help those less fortunate because its common knowledge that not every person in financial trouble is a result of being lazy, uneducated or drug addicts...

but really, keep on generalizing and using poverty in Africa for a topic that has absolutely nothing to do with poverty in Africa. It makes you seem really intelligent.

 
you still dont get it.thats great that some billionaires think they have a duty to use their resources for the betterment of society, its called charity... and plenty of rich people are more than happy to give to charities, whether or not they believe in a flat tax rate.

and yes i have heard of that idea, I seem to be the one willing to pay MORE in taxes for the "BETTERMENT OF SOCIETY AS A WHOLE" rather than just letting the rich take care of it. and if we did have a flat tax rate, I sure as shit would be paying a bit more.

Ive put in plenty of time with local charities, even pitched in some of the little money i have. but hey, because i believe we should all be taxed the same rate i guess im the selfish one who doesn't want a better society.

and what do you think these billionaires would be doing if we had a flat tax rate? do you not think they would be helping to better society? say the flat rate was 25%. someone making 1,000,000 would be paying 250,000 where someone like me making 15,000 would pay 3750. id say the millionaire is helping to better society A LOT more than I am. makes me feel like i gotta pick up the slack, it would take like 70 of me to pitch in as much as one guy making 1,000,000. and you think I should have to pay less?

So using your logic, because i think i should pay more taxes, with a flat tax rate, and everyone should pay the same rate, meaning the rich arent taking care of me and wiping my ass. im the one who doesnt want to better society? how the fuck did you come to that backwards ass conclusion?

you just sound like some lazy entitled fuck who would rather sit back and let everyone else take care of it. sounds like you would rather let others help society while you mooch off the man.

yes a lot of poor people are in shitty situations that are hard to get out of, and im all for having some kind of way to help them back on their feet. but really, im willing to bet the majority of people mooching off welfare and unemployment for long periods of time have no desire to stop if it means working hard. they can have their flat screens and 10 pairs of shoes and enough food to get fat.

Ive worked with probably 20+ people like this at my last two jobs and i dont think i met one person who actually wanted to get out of their condition. they live off welfare, maybe work a little, then get unemployment, its a cycle for them and they can live off it pretty comfortably. i almost dont blame them.

Its no wonder we have the unemployment we have, and the lowest amount of people looking for jobs in like 40 years. our society has made it so acceptable to mooch, and so damn easy to, and at the same time we are shaming success. rich people arent motivated and hard working anymore, now they are selfish and greedy. no wonder our country is sucking so hard.
 
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I hate how some people feel entitled to rich peoples money. They earned it and they can do whatever the fuck they want with it, including put it in any bank they want. If you can prove its illegally done then fucking arrest them.
 
i dont know if this is related but all the time in the yachting world, rich people register their superyachts (ranging anywhere from a couple million dollars worth all the way up the 100$ million area) in the georgetown/bikini/grand cayman. most of these people are US citizens and by registering in these areas they dont have to pay any tax on the value of their yachts which is astronomical.
 
Exactly, it kinda of annoys me when I see a US owner flying a Cayman flag.

Respect to those who fly US flags on US boats by US owners.

irrelevent opinion is irrelevent
 
the guys found loopholes to keep the money he's earned without breaking laws. id sure as shit do it if there were legal ways to keep more of what i earn, its being a smart businessman. the problem isnt "greedy rich people" only paying millions in taxes, when they should paying millions plus 1. its that its not financially smart to keep money in US banks, its not financially smart to keep jobs in the US, rather than outsource etc.. if americans are so desperate to find loopholes in the system to keep their money, the problem isnt americans wanting more money, thats a great attitude to have, the problem is that our system doesnt work. you can make more money hiding your money offshore and outsourcing jobs, thats where the problem starts, the rich are only finding the best solution to the problem.
 
cant take aljizeria seriously. but yeah we need more taxing and less spending. also if a country taxes too much you get capital flight. also countries are printing so much 32 trillion isnt going to be that much in a decade.

also who cares
 
You're working under a lot of assumptions there bud...

assuming that the rich illegally keep their money offshore because the taxes are too high. Although it could never be that they want to keep all their money, despite the tax rate. Hell why would they move it now if taxes were to drop even 10%? They still get to keep more by leaving those accounts they already have open. What makes you think that they'll somehow have a change of heart?

This is the same false argument that people use to combat outsourcing. No they're not taking American jobs away because they want to maximize profit, they're doing it because they're the victims who get overtaxed! Lower the taxes or else the people with money will leave.

Sorry but since when was it acceptable to be at the mercy of the ones with money? Lower their taxes or extend their tax cuts or else they'll leave with all their money... yeah that sounds like the work of charitable dudes for sure.

How many rich people would still do charity work if it wasn't tax deductible or good PR? I can tell you that its a minority and the ones that do are well known because its that rare.

There are many reasons why the wealthy have all that money and there's a lot of people that know that its not because they were charitable...

But hey you're right, the government shouldn't be the ones deciding how the wealth should be redistributed (which is a completely false statement, nice job on that one), that should be left up to the wealthy because its their money so they must know how/how much to distribute to the needy or to taxes... That makes complete sense.
 
your talking about corporations that are all about profit, and what they are doing by keeping their money offshore and outsourcing is increasing that profit. its growing their business, there is nothing wrong with wanting more profit and growing their business. for a lot of these large corporations they simply couldnt be competitive if they hired locally. the problem STARTS there, its very difficult for a lot of american corporations to be competitive by keeping it within the U.S. I completely agree that it would be better if jobs were not outsourced and money was kept within the U.S. but when a corporation has to sacrifice the one thing it exists to create, which is profit, it makes complete sense that they would outsource.

and realize that most these corporations are publicly owned, they have an obligation to act on the behalf of the shareholder, and by not being competitive, the stock price decreases, is less attractive to investors, etc..

you realize that our corporate tax rate ranks as the highest in the world?

when its not possible to be successful or exceed a certain level of success by keeping completely local, you have a problem. and its not big bad greedy businessmen.

our taxes and operating costs here can actually prevent success, that is the problem, how the hell can you expect a corporation to want to stay here if it potentially means they will not be successful? its a dead end for these guys and tehy are claiming they are "victims who get overtaxed" they are simply avoiding becoming a victim.

by asking that corporations keep money within the US and keep jobs locally, you are asking them to forego their entire purpose, profit. even if these companies stayed local, if it meant a severe drop in their competitiveness its a lose lose.

It just does not make sense for the well being of the corporation or the well being of our economy to keep everything here. that is THE problem, not businessmen wanting their business to be successful.
 
Oh yes, all those struggling corporations and companies that cannot be successful or grow under the tax laws of the U.S.

Which is why the U.S. is home to over 130 of the Global 500 companies, right?
 
Are you kidding me right now?

If you want to be taken seriously and not as a child, maybe you should respond to what I wrote instead of completely ignoring it and asking a question that you don't know the answer to.

And a more intelligent question might be, "how many of those companies NEEDED to outsource jobs and hide money illegally offshore in order to grow to where they are now?"
 
I would like to mention that I agree with the flat tax rate, 45% for everything. All types of income including investments and interest.
 
cap gains tax should be either zero or progressive.

would u gamble in a casino that took 45 percent of your winnings and if u lost, tough shit? fuck no
 
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