THE ELECTION!

^and you can't forget that in a nearby town, they are bannin street basketball. In my town you can already be arrested for skateboarding and they are having a meeting tonight about the banning of them.

Dave from the *NORTH EAST*
 
^oh yeah and in that same nearby town, rollerblading and skateboarding are already illegal.....just wait guys....

EUROPE KICKS ASS
 
I walk with a swagger

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'Dude, check out this nasty gouge.'

'Your mom has a nasty gouge.'

'221 is fucking hilarious'

~221
 
I think this topic has pretty much been beaten to death. It has gone nowhere (like most forum debates). It’s worthless for both sides to try and explain anything because people of another persuasion are too stubborn to listen or care (I’m not excluded from this). I sill have many questions yet to be explained by anybody. And others probably feel the same way about me. It probably should end here. Whatever, I had a good time debating.

BTW -=koLLac=-, Yes, I have heard of a metaphor. How is “I didn't even have the energy to finish reading your stupid post.� a metaphor? Do you know what a metaphor is?

met·a·phor: (Brought to you by dictionary.com)

1. A figure of speech in which a word or phrase that ordinarily designates one thing is used to designate another, thus making an implicit comparison, as in “a sea of troubles� or “All the world's a stage� (Shakespeare).

2. One thing conceived as representing another; a symbol: “Hollywood has always been an irresistible, prefabricated metaphor for the crass, the materialistic, the shallow, and the craven� (Neal Gabler).

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I can tie my shoes. My parents are very proud.
 
You cant say shit about the economy. Bush has revived it from a nightmare that he was left with from bush. Everyone always complains that the economy crashed right when bush came to office, but did you ever think that Clintons economical plan was still in effect until october of the following year. Bush's plan actually brought it back to life. And then 9/11 happened and we had to recover from that. That had nothing to do with bush, but yet again, he has brought it up from the ashes , so to speak, and just yesterday Greenspan told the american public that 'the economy is gaining traction and is steadily progressing'. Dont say that the economy sucks because you dont have a clue.

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Worrying is like a rocking chair. It gives you something to do, but in the end, it doesnt get you anywhere. Write that down.
 
it's not bush's fault at all that the economy went down, but the problem is that it's still bad and not what it was supposed to be at this point. the improvements are far worse than what was expected.

____________________

Chappelle's Show Cult...BITCHES
 
What is it supposed to be at this point then?

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Worrying is like a rocking chair. It gives you something to do, but in the end, it doesnt get you anywhere. Write that down.
 
alright, it wasn't a metaphor bah, but I really didn't read it the firt time. but coming back again and again I managed to read it, but I don't agree with everything. Your arguments seem structured (more so than mine haha, but I don't have time) but they just don't consider the 'un-American' point of view. I don't just travel...I live in the places I go to, and therefore I can very well understand why they do not like you.

I have awesome friends here and the nature around Placid is beatiful too, if it wasn't for that...the rules and regulations would've driven me back to europe a long time ago.

this country still has potential 9not as much as eastern europe) but it's hard to change with conservatives running the country making bad decisions (attacking Iraq without the UN wasn't cool)

I believe that havign Bush as a President only harms this country and the people living here. He's stupid, I'm not saying that to insult him...it's a fact. His IQ is somewhere around 80 which is very low average. It's sad.

I'd give him 100 with practice but that is still average, and not enough for the president of a superpower

EUROPE KICKS ASS
 
If you feel so confident that conservative presidents will screw up the country, what would you do if you were president to be so much better than them?

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Worrying is like a rocking chair. It gives you something to do, but in the end, it doesnt get you anywhere. Write that down.
 
I would never ever in my life no matter how stoned, stupid, after a concussion or whatever else...want to be the President of the United States.

That doens't mean I have no right to criticize haha

EUROPE KICKS ASS
 
^You are sophomoric.

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I can tie my shoes. My parents are very proud.
 
I was referring more to your lacking of judgement, but maturity seems to also be a factor. As for supporting of killing people, do you want to start this debate up again?

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I can tie my shoes. My parents are very proud.
 
Bush has the IQ of a hamster. Kerry is wiser. Vote for Kerry. Don't fuck it up!

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My knee is like my skiing... Really bad.
 
Youre right. Kerry is VERY wise. I cant believe that I was so stupid to think statements like 'well I voted for it before I voted against it' were stupid, or that admitting to burning villages and using weapons against civilians that werent even cleared to be used (this was all in an interview by the way) was a good idea. You have changed my mind. Kerry is DEFINETLY the smart one in this race.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Worrying is like a rocking chair. It gives you something to do, but in the end, it doesnt get you anywhere. Write that down.
 
sophomoric means immature but anyway...

lacking of judgement about what? I can't judge things, becasue I do not support Bush or Republicans or conservative politics or the way the US acts on the global political scene? ehmm...ok

bottom line...never vote for someone stupider than yourself...that rules Bush automatically out

EUROPE KICKS ASS
 
A lot of people are voting for bush because Kerry is such a fucking moron. It's the whole 'lesser of two evils' concept. Bush might not be the best, but kerry would be much worse

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Thats nucking futs!
 
kollac- you just continue to make yourself look dumber. Friendly suggestion: just stop.

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Worrying is like a rocking chair. It gives you something to do, but in the end, it doesnt get you anywhere. Write that down.
 
Back to our good old friend dictionary.com

soph·o·mor·ic

1. Of or characteristic of a sophomore.

2. Exhibiting great immaturity and lack of judgment: sophomoric behavior.

I say lack of judgement because I believe your opinions are misguided and sometimes flat out wrong. Your ultimate intentions are noble, but I think your methods for achieving things are illogical.

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I can tie my shoes. My parents are very proud.
 
Highlight the AND part.

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Worrying is like a rocking chair. It gives you something to do, but in the end, it doesnt get you anywhere. Write that down.
 
^^^^^dude what about really smart people? should they just not vote? ha! I got ya! I think people should vote for people who are dumber than them always because it makes me feel superior! which is why everyone should vote for bush. It will give me a big confidence boost to be able to say 'I am smarter than a 2 term president!'

Jesus saves!

Gretzky gets the rebound. he feeds the puck to LeClair. he shoots! he scores! the crowd goes wild
 
i just watched kerry on that late night politic show (u know the one that makes fun of politics) and he seemed alot smarter than bush.

Member Since 2003-01-15

Member Number 13501

dont get it twisted
 
'I am going to vote for the person who is best for America, and not for Europe'

How about voting for the candidate who is least likely to destroy the world? That seems like it would be good for the U.S. AND Europe. And parts of Africa and South America too, for that matter.

-----------------

See my website, Common Sense: www.ThoseDamnLiberals.org

I'm an atheist/moralist.

My parents were hippies. Both my grandfathers were Mennonite conscientious objectors in WWII. It's complicated.
 
Lets look at this objectively. Who is more likely to 'destroy the world'? George Bush or Terrorism? My vote is terrorism. Those who think that bush is bombing the entire world need to get a clue and not be so short sighted.

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Worrying is like a rocking chair. It gives you something to do, but in the end, it doesnt get you anywhere. Write that down.
 
who is the least likely person to solve the problem of terrorism? Bush (kerry's not much better either....in general...the US won't solve it no matter how many atomic bombs you have)

EUROPE KICKS ASS
 
and by the way...utahpowderski... can you show me what post made me look dumb, becasue saying that without backing it up by some arguments amkes someone look dumb...not me though.

All I'm trying to show is that Bush is not a good president, and that the way the US solves international problems is not the right one...

EUROPE KICKS ASS
 
oh Quinny...tehre is definitely no flat out wrong fact in my posts

go to dubyaspeak. com and enjoy the stupidity of your president and then post some enlightened commetns as to how he knows what he has to do

EUROPE KICKS ASS
 
you know man? sometime your gonna realize that more and more of our imports are coming from outside the country. until then you will just keep misunderestimating me. You really dont see that we have a firm commitment to Nato. We are a part of Nato. We have a firm commitment to Europe. We are a part of europe. You know what I mean

Jesus saves!

Gretzky gets the rebound. he feeds the puck to LeClair. he shoots! he scores! the crowd goes wild
 
You really dont think that bush is taking action against terrorism, kolloc? Please do explain.

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Worrying is like a rocking chair. It gives you something to do, but in the end, it doesnt get you anywhere. Write that down.
 
fact is that Bush is taking action in the wrong way. You don't go in and bomb a country without international consent.

secondly, Bush initiates terrorism with his actions. It's true he had to ract to 911 somehow, but 911 was a result of some mistakes of your former presidents (fucking with muslims years ago...I don't think they forgot) I have to emphasize the fact that they are not jealous or anything. they value things different frm what we (the westerners) call freedom

EUROPE KICKS ASS
 
“can you show me what post made me look dumb, because saying that without backing it up by some arguments makes someone look dumb�

You say shit all the time without ever baking it up. All you have been saying in this entire thread is Bush sucks, he is pure evil, his supporters are under his control, and the US is completely fucked. I have pointed out faults in every single one of your posts. All you do is repeat yourself. You never answer any questions I bring up out of your statements. If you are trying to show that Bush is a terrible president, than you are doing an exceptionally poor job. Its hard to convince people when your arguments are thin and you don’t think you words through.

BTW, don’t use someone else’s website to try and argue for you. Make statements of your own. Stuff on that website is taken out of context anyway. You can make anybody “look stupid� if you cut and paste their own words. I could make you look moronic by taking you own words and arraigning them to my needs. Even though you make a big enough idiot of yourself already.

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I can tie my shoes. My parents are very proud.
 
hhahahaha cut out of context....no matter how you put it in context, the words Bush makes up never make sense :)

and how you point out all the wrong things I say...you just take my comment and then say it's wrong...great job! I can do the same thing with yours.

how can you deny that it is the fault of UNITED STATES that the people in mid east hate you? Why don't they hate French? Or Brits? Why are they so happy when they get to kill an American?

EUROPE KICKS ASS
 
were the lone superpower in the world and a major supporter of israel, thats why

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HIGH NORTH SESSION 4

The Hot Sauce Champion of the World
 
They do hate the french and the brits to retard!

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Worrying is like a rocking chair. It gives you something to do, but in the end, it doesnt get you anywhere. Write that down.
 
Your persistence and ignorance are starting to get on my nerves.

WARNING, lots of words ahead.

“hhahahaha cut out of context....no matter how you put it in context, the words Bush makes up never make sense :)�

YAWN...once again you don’t say why, you just say it...

“and how you point out all the wrong things I say...you just take my comment and then say it's wrong...great job! I can do the same thing with yours.�

I can at least say why it’s wrong. I don’t get that much out of you.

“how can you deny that it is the fault of UNITED STATES that the people in mid east hate you? Why don't they hate French? Or Brits? Why are they so happy when they get to kill an American?�

You are fucking hopeless. I guess I’ll have to explain things in more depth to get it through your thick skull.

The Middle Eastern people that truly do hate us actually hate all of the western world. The only reason America stands out for them is because we are the most wealthy and powerful nation is history. I already fucking told you. Extremist groups and leaders are the reason for this hatred. These grous all hate the US for one reason or another.

Changing the focus of domestic problems. This is the major reason, period. The Middle East has a comparably low standard of advancement and living compared to the western world. With the economic climate of the Middle East, it is difficult to improve these problems. Many leaders simply don’t have the money to fix many of the problems. Instead of putting effort into improving situations, the cheaper and easier way is to blame the problems of something else. Why would the leader do this you might ask? So they can keep their money and power. And why would leaders ever admit their wrong or that they can’t deliver? The people won’t rebel against you if you can unite them against a common enemy. People will support you more if you are a “hero� rather than average Joe, or a sly rat. This common enemy they use is the United States. Many leaders tell their people that their lives can’t improve because the US wont let it happen. Now the ball gets rolling. Since the US is so different they came blame us for many things, wealth, technology, religion, and oppression. We are used as a scapegoat for many of their own problems. It’s much easier to blame someone else for problems rather than take responsibility. No question about it.

Supporting Israel is currently a very convenient excuse for Arab leaders. This has a relation to three things; homelands, economy, and religion. Our nation supports the Hebrews who now live in “their� region. Many are sore about this because it was their own home, now they have to share it both in economic and land terms. This creates the tension between the Arabs and the Jews. Religion is also a factor. Don’t use that crap that the Palestinians were there first, because historically the Jewish people came into that region before the Muslims. This is very little of the US’s fault. European nations are at bigger fault for starting this. But why is the US blamed now? Because we now support the Israelis. If it weren’t for us backing them up, the Muslims would slaughter every one of them. It’s something that has caused a lot of tension for the region. I can go far deeper into this, but that is another issue entirely.

Aggressive Culture and Religion. Many leaders use religion as a pivotal excuse for conflict. The commoners do not know any better so the truly believe that religion is the true reason. Occasionally religion is the true motive but that is a rare exception. You said so yourself that they pray many times a day. Many Muslims are fanatic about their religion. Religion is such a big thing the Middle East because it is one of the few enduring things that people can attach to. If you can establish the common ground or religion, their in your back pocket. You can now weald religion as a weapon. Historically the Muslims are known for not taking a linking to people of different beliefs. The last time they actually accepted other religions was in ancient Arabia. We don’t need to use Christians as an example, look at the Jews and ancient Armenians. Throughout history they have been kicked around by the Muslim nations. Don’t use the argument that Jewish people were also oppressed by Europe. Most oppression anywhere was purely political rather than religious. Muslims have also fought with the Christians, do I even need to go here? The Moors invaded the Spanish region in the middle ages, and don’t even mention the crusades. They have also fought with the Hindus and other Easterners throughout history. They also make a habit of fighting amongst each other. But this is of course is not so much of a religious conflict. The Middle East is the most war torn region in history. Religion can both be a true reason and a scapegoat. Religion is by far the most compatible “tool� for leaders to use. Leaders can use religion to keep their people in line.

Leaders can have great influence over the people, if they use the proper methods. The above reasons can create an almost universal resentment for the US, but some people take it to the next level. Anti-American terrorism is given born. They attack, and we respond. The leaders use our response to violence as fuel to their fire. But that doesn’t necessarily matter. They will attack no matter what. Even if we do nothing and they give up on us they may move to a different target, Europe perhaps? That is why the US must respond. We have an obligation to try and stop this. It is for the greater good of the world. It may seem like and impossible fight as you said so yourself. But it is better to have tried and failed then to not try at all. And even if the US fails, we have made a difference. Who knows, we may find a way to completely stop terrorism. We are ultimately trying to make the world a less violent place by taking a stand against it. You may ask why we respond with and army them? Fight fire with fire. How else can you do it? Diplomacy doesn’t always work. Saddam Hussein is a great example. We also go into the Middle East because we have additional interests in the region. What kind are you might ask? Economic. If you wish I can address this to, but I don’t want to bore you. The US is both working for the good of ourselves and others. People think we are being selfish. We are to some extent. That is because a nation needs to take care of itself. But if you or anybody else has any foresight, you would see what we are really doing.

I think it is a safe assumption that you let emotion play are large role in your decision making. You let your feeling get in the way of deduction and common sense. That is not always a bad thing, but it can be and issues in more complex issues. Just letting you know. Also, I think you, at some point in your life, should study political science. I think you would benefit geatly.

That is my speil. If you want, I can go even deeper and cover more grey area if you have some unanswered questions.

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I can tie my shoes. My parents are very proud.
 
Also, something I forgot to address earlier. You questioned my experiences from around the world?

I have been to every continent in the world except Antarctica. I have been to the Middle East. I have been to southeast Asia. I have been to Africa. I have been to Australia. I have been to Europe so many times it doesn’t even matter. I lived in England for a year. That not good enough for you? I’d say I have had as much experience with different people as you. But I guess I could be wrong.

And if you have been to a third world country and if you did indeed manege to notice that huge gap between the third world and the US. From what I have seen, people regardless of location or culture are eager to learn or try new things. Especially if it can help them.

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I can tie my shoes. My parents are very proud.
 
Oh yeah, One more thing. I love that bit in your profile.

“I hate inconsiderate, subjectively thinking, hypocritical, narrow minded people�

I could have a field day with this and how it relates to you, but I’m going to let it be for now.

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I can tie my shoes. My parents are very proud.
 
^if Im not mistaken that sig is a joke

Jesus saves!

Gretzky gets the rebound. he feeds the puck to LeClair. he shoots! he scores! the crowd goes wild
 
Well, I certainly hope is.

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I can tie my shoes. My parents are very proud.
 
Have you heard anything about the threats that France gets every single day from middle eastern countries because of their law that prohibits their head scarfs for women? How can you tell me that they dont hate them if you had? If you havent it just shows that you are an uninformes moron trying to sound all smart when in reality you dont know the facts at all. Plus, they also put the Brits in the same category with the americans because of our close alliance and relationship with eachother. You dont have a fucking clue. I wish people like you werent allowed to vote. America would be better off.

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Worrying is like a rocking chair. It gives you something to do, but in the end, it doesnt get you anywhere. Write that down.
 
I could be mistaken but, I don’t think he is a US citizen, thus he cannot vote.

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I can tie my shoes. My parents are very proud.
 
Yeah those French are really tolerant aren’t they?

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I can tie my shoes. My parents are very proud.
 
Forget Europe. Think about it. Europe wants good relations with us because we are the USA. The big kid on the block. US policy is world policy. That is the fact of the matter, good or bad, whether you like it or not.

 
That isn’t the best mentality. I only disagree with a Europe (aka France and co.) because I don’t believe that they have a lone term intrust in mind for international policy. I am for eventually having the entire world be an equally contributing community. I want a world where nations can help each other when in need. I want a world where people can cast aside differences and face global problems. The United States is trying to set an example that countries need to be proactive in the world. If your nation is threatened, you should take a stand for the good of all. Doing nothing often does more harm than good in the long run. Countries like France are in a self preserving mentality. They could care less if, for example, India and Pakistan went to war. The only reason they would get involved is because of their own intrust, not the intrust of the people in the warring countries. I’m not saying that the US doesn’t do this, but at least we also work or a broader solution.

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I can tie my shoes. My parents are very proud.
 
taht law by the French was a retarded decision and here these are soem of Bush's words if you want examples...

'We need to know whether or not people are learning. And if they are, there will be hallelujahs all over the place.'

-- University of New Hampshire, Jan. 8, 2002

'Senator Kerry opposed Medicare reform and health savings accounts. After supporting my education reforms, he now wants to tilute them.' (I'm sure you know what 'tilute' means)

'Americans are serving and sacrificing to keep this country safe and to bring freedom to others. After the attacks of September the 11th, 2001, this nation resolved to fight terrorists where they dwell. We resolved to arm the terrorist enemy.'

'Rick Sanchez has done a fabulous job. He's been there for a -- a long time. His service has been exemplorary.'

there are more of course...

I agree that some might be accidental, but there are a lil' too many accidents happening then.

I also see why you support Republicans (and I partially do too, when it comes to taxes)

but why do you have to support Bush?

ANd ...again...I do not think that they would attack the US, had it not been for the interventions throughout history. Maybe they'd attack Europe, but you know what? I would not care, becasue Europe would look for support first and then attack...not the other way.

I wouldn't have the balls to start a war...you can still see the damage from the 2nd world war ineurope and it's just wrong. I don't believe in God and all this Jesus magic stuff, but I agree with Jesus when it comes to violence. I wouldn't fight fire with fire. but that's just me and I accept your decision to disagree with me.

still, please don't vote for Bush...if you don't want Kerry then pick the Libertarian dude, but Bush is so damn stupid.

EUROPE KICKS ASS
 
KoLLac:

I can and I will vote for Bush. He is not as stupid as many people write him off to be. Running the most powerful country in the world has to be one of the most difficult tasks. Every decision you make is complex and effects millions of people and the decisions can test your very moral and ethical fabric. So before you call Bush an idiot, keep that in mind. I believe Bush has more to offer than Jon Kerry. That is another issue in it self. I understand that you do not believe in violence and I fully respect that. Just keep this in mind, people are selfish, they will commonly use any methods they can to get what they want. That is the human condition. To try and end something terrible you sometimes need to bare down and fight. It may not be the easiest solution, but it is the right one. WWII could not have been won it the allies took a pacifist approach.

If you did read my long post above, than I sincerely hope you learned something. And I hope you also take the advise I gave to you.

Nickskier:

That contributes very little to this thread. That article proves nothing, that is politicks as usual.

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I can tie my shoes. My parents are very proud.
 
Oh most definitely.

I, surprisingly :) did manage to read through your whole post and , surprisingly once again, sis agree with most of what you said.

I must add that the United States is not the sole superpower, especially not economically.

I kind of think that what we try to say is not really the opposite, we both want the other side to consider our own position.

The fact that the Americans can really only choose between 2 candidates is sad, but I guess there isno way to change that anyway.

EUROPE KICKS ASS
 
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