Serious thoughts on Look P18's

chazz.

chazz.

Active member
Ok, so i have this years anthems mounted with last years Look P18s. These are of the pivot heal, turntable design, with the din that goes up to 18. they are the same as the rossi ones. I keep hearing from everybody that a din of 18 is way to high, and that you dont need that much din for skiing all mountain, and that the safety features are less than most bindings, and are prone to breaking and awkward releases. I keep saying im not gonna put the din up to 18, just to 13 but because they are built for 18 so it wont stress the spring too much and will be a solid binding. im 6'2" and 170 lbs.

i would like to hear from anybody WHO HAS RIDDEN these, the pros and cons to the turntable pivot heel, and good or bad experiences. thanks in advance to people with legit comments....
 
They are THE BEST binding ever made (arguably, with the 916). If they work for your din range they're super awsome. They're next to impossible to break and have a very predictable and reliable release. People say that they're prone to ripping out because of the tight screw pattern, but if you look at how many of your favourite skiers are riding them you'll see that tear-outs are usually the mounter's fault.
 
If you're riding with your DIN at 13 there is absolutely no reason why you can't use p18's. As long as you're comfortable riding somewhere within the DIN range of a binding they work, and I don't see why people can tell you that you shouldn't have them. However, they are right in saying that p18's don't have all the safety features of most bindings--the only one I can think of being an upward toe release. They're a more primitive binding made to keep your skis on, not to release all the time; this is the reason it's an 8-18 DIN. If they work for you, keep using them!
 
Ooh, and there's nothing wrong with riding an 18 din binding at 10 or 11, most people don't have dins at 18, they buy the p18 for the metal bombproof construction.
 
cuz when you get close to the top din range of a binding it stresses the springs and can screw you up
 
At you're height and weight, the p18 would be perfect depending on what you want. It does get to a poitn where the type of skier you are will determine bindings. At your size, if you are a top-notch, strong skier, a p18 will definitely work for you, however, it's not for everyone your size. And as far as the differences between new and old technology, the pivotol heel piece definietly has it's perks and is favored by folk on this site, but I've never had a problem with the PX and neither have the majority of people I know.
 
Its always good to keep a din as low as possible from its max capactiy because it reduces stree on the binding. A din at 13 on a p18 won't break as likely as a din of 13 on a binding with a din of 15.
 
unfortunatly, contary to your beliefs i have heard from a few expierienced technicians that this is not the case. Myths, they told me. They say that the binding is designed for the DIN range, therefore it will perform the same throughout its range. Can anyone confirm this?
 
I rode them for awhile and they were awesome bindings...I was having problems with breaking diferent pieces on my px12s so i put these on a new pair of skis BUT i dont weigh much at all so it was a bit overkill...i moved down to the fks 15 but overall a very solid binding
 
tru dat. spring tension is greater if you have a 13 DIN on a 15 DIN binding, but I would not worry about it breaking. 13 DIN is 13, whether or not it's a 18 DIN, 15 DIN, or 12 DIN.

yea, that's right
 
i had only belived that from personal experiance, i had some solly 912's and had them at 12, the third time i ate shat i threw them away and knew i needed a bigger din binding. thats why i thought that
 
If you already have them, and you are already using them. and you are

riding at 13, then you are FINE. No need to downgrade to a din of 15 (say

fks155) because it is the exact same binding just with a lower din (to

counter the others in the thread). Same toe and heel release. You have them, keep them. They are lovely.

It is true, the p18 does not

have the multi directional toe release of the 12 and 14 din look/rossi

bindings, but, if you're riding at 13, you might need the extra housing that the p18 provides. Although a 14 din binding would suffice (as mentioned, you can ride max din, and youll be fine).

personally, when I'm competing and stuff, I'll have mine set to 14 (occasionally 15), and it is solid as hell. Love the metal, and the small mounting area (although I epoxy them in the help reduce the risk of a rip out).
 
thanks for all the input. of course i am going to keep them i was just wondering if i was gonna be setting myself up for some crazy crashes this year that wouldnt release. sounds like i'll be fine though. and yea i crank em to 15 every once in a while.
 
Before riding my p18's, I'd never really considered how much a binding choice could be noticed in ski feel - certainly in retention, but not in how the ski rides. The contact that the FKS/P design creates between the boot and the ski due to the low profile turntable heel is stunningly noticable. Others that ride them have expressed similar sentiment to me. Moreover, they release only when needed. For me, that was once over the entire season. Sure, I kept my riding clean, but any other binding would have pre-released once or twice when riding powder, cliffs etc.

I will never go back to another binding for powder/big mountain riding. The retention and contact that these bindings have is stellar.

On the topic of low dins on the p18. I will admit, and I do get crap for this periodically, that I run a din of 10. I'm 5'7 150, but an aggressive and confident rider. Sure a fks 155 would do fine, but it was a matter of availability. It seems that they are more available now then when I got the p18's. Either way, riding at 10 has not harmed the binding in any noticeable manner. Personally, I'll buy whatever turntable binding is available when I need it.

 
you will release...im 5'8''-5'9'' and 130...i rode mine at 11 most of the season and i released when necessary
 
With the Rossignol bindings that's not the case. From what I was told by the good people at Rossignol is that a Din of 10, is a din of 10. Doesn't matter if it's on the PX 12s, 14s, or 18's. He said he didn't know about the older bindings, or other brands, but with all their new shit that's how it works.

And I have P18's. I don't come out of them... That's all you need to know. They're probably pretty dangerous, but if you're a good skier, strong, and find yourself in situations where releasing would be bad news then they're great.
 
Two springs of different stiffness can be at the same tension, but the stiffer of the two will have to be compressed less to do so, and the least stiffer will have to be compressed more. A higher din binding has a stiffer spring than a lower din binding. So if you get a higher din binding and run it on the low side, you don't compress the spring as much. If you don't compress the spring as much, it's going to last longer, and I guess not break as easily, but I don't image that the spring would ever be the part to break on these binders.
 
As long as you ride your DIN within the range (which you do) you are fine. The only con to those bindings is its hard to bend the brakes. But if they are already mounted and you have no problems then that's not an issue.

So basically you're all good.
 
you may be correct about the fact that a spring isnt going to break as long as its within in the din of the binding ( a 15 din on a 15 din binding is ok).

however, and this is straight from the salomon designers from france, A DIN OF 12 ON A 15 DIN BINDING IS ACTUALLY LESS THAN A DIN OF 12 ON AN 18 DIN BINDING. The din rating isn't set in stone, it is relative to each binding. If you normally ride a din of 12 on a 15 din binding and you go up to a 18 din binding, the recommended that you drop your din a point.
 
grillman - that is exactly what I was saying. a din of 13 is always a din of 13, whether it's on 18 din bindings, 15 din bindings, or 12 din bindings.

to hemlockjibber- I have no idea about solly binders, I don't ride them, only look/rossi, so that could be true
 
I have been on alot of FKS bindings and they work the best I think when you are using around 70% of the spring...So if you are using a FKS 180 or Look P18 and you have a din of 12 or 13 you should be cool on that binding. Sometimes FKS bindings do not release when others might in twisting situations. For the most part I ride FKS bindings on my freeride/pow skis and a rossi 140 or simmilar binding on a park ski....
 
you can call it a myth, but a few years ago I had p10s on in the spring they weren't holding me in so I cranked them up to 10 (had them at 8 before) and the first time I fell hard enough to release at all the heel ripped out and the base plate thing broke... sooo yea I'll stick with like 2 or so away from max and min.

On that note, if he rides at 13 he shouldn't get 15 din bindings because then if he's havin a day like that where his skis keep popping off he doesn't have much freedom to make them tighter. although fks' can probably handle maxing out better than shitty old p10s, but as I said i'm gonna give myself plenty of room from now on.
 
Room is good.
The statements here about DIN being universal are mostly correct, however the 'feel' the the release will change, for instance, Capuricus posted a link to Hooke's law of elasticity...basically a 13 DIN requires the same amount of force to release from a 15 and an 18 DIN binding, but because of the rate of compression relative to the spring, one will release more suddenly and the other will be slower and smoother.
But as others have said, P18 is a great binding, THE great binding to most people in the know.
Ride them and enjoy.
 
ok, just got back from hell. alright, id like to consider myself somewhat of an expert on these bindings.

now, in thier current incarnation, the heel piece is the best they've ever been. the new style of attachment to the tt baseplate is much stronger and stiffer, and they ski even better. the old ones that just hook in, instead of the burly rivet still ski great, but not as great as the new ones. also, the current toe piece being sold with the 155s-185s is imo pretty shitty, at least for freeriding. yes, it provides a very direct interface, but it has VERY limited release functionality. most other single pivot toe pieces have at least some degree of upward release (so when the toe gets kicked out to the side far enough, itll start to allow upward toe release), but the race toe is strictly side to side. for freeriding, having that upward toe release is crucial for not blowin your knees.

my all time favorite toe piece for these guys is this older racestock design.

d6c2_1.JPG


its mostly metal, the toe wing assembly is one piece, and floats for a 3D release zone. theres a small switch on the binder that allows you to adjust how active the upward release function is. there is also another screwpiece ontop, which puts pressure on the front of your boot. the ONLY downfall to these guys is a 3 screw mounting pattern, but thats not that big of a deal. they ski amazingly.

the other toepiece i would recommend is this guy,

82291767_tp.jpg


the previous generation the the racestocks. they function almost identically to the current pivot toe, but are metal, and much more durable. (BTW, if anyone has some they wanna get red of hit it up). these guys also have significantly less slop than the consumer pivot toe found in the 120 level turntables and the axials.

so yea, if your serious about it, hunt ski swaps and ebay, and build composite binders. they are actually pretty basic to pull apart and repair. ive scored a number of TTs that just needed a few lil parts. take those off shitty shitty old ones, and your good. brand new pair of bindings for next to nothing. my current project is stripping and repainting/rebuilding one of those ^^ racestock toes with the newer style turntable heel.

oh yea, the brakes are not that hard to swap out. i can do it by myself in like 10 minutes. anyone whose complaining, stop.

 
pm gunsnfuckinroses

it's all that tall goon rides and he usually rides with them at 17 i believe. He will praise them, make out with them, beat off to them, and even sleep with them. He won't ride anything with less that 18 dinsssssssssss...just and fyi
 
im the same weight, but im only 5 10, in the middle of last season i was blowing out of my p12s, at 11 then 12 was even worse, probably because i was maxing the spring, so i spent a week or two searching for some p14s, i hate the px heel, but i came up short and got a pair of fks155s, at the end of last season i had the din at about 13, and they were great, sometimes no vertical release in the toe makes me nervious because i am a very inconsistant skier and do land back seat...but besides that i love them, i turned the din down to 10 for the start of this season though, halfly because i was tired of turning them up from where i put them for the summer, and halfy because my legs arent as strong as they were at the end of last season, but in the end i love my fks more than any other binding i have skied
 
any love for the FKS 120s here?

I love mine for park specific, they seem like the safest (upward toe release), and most durable (whos actually broken those toe peices?) bindings Ive ever ridden. I'm 5-9 160 #'s and ride at a max din of 8. I guess blowing my knee out twice made me a little more conservative...
 
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