School without grades

[Wheat]

So the school my dad is a teacher at here in Calgary got chosen for a pilot project where students do not get a real mark. They cannot put a number on there stuff. So, for an essay, they can say it was good, but no numerical value. I personally believe this is bullshit because you'll never actually know exactly how good your stuff was. What do you guys think?
http://www.theglobeandmail.com/news...es-coming-to-calgary-mistake/article12524077/

 

[LynxNation]

I went to a college where we didn't have grades or tests, and honestly it was really hard. you received credit based on how much the teacher thought you paid attention and the quality of your work. You had the total chance of 16 credits a quarter and they could give you 12, or 7, or 0. Knew a lot of kids who consistently had to retake classes and took years to graduate. It's definitely alternative but I think it makes you put more focus on actually being in class, not spacing off or skipping.

 

[saskskier]

My brothers finance is teaching in that school in Calgary (I think) and she absolutely hates it. She has no room to properly evaluate her students work properly.

Kids going through that system are in for a rude awakening once they hit college/university and their work is... well... graded.

 

[Wheat]

My brothers finance is teaching in that school in Calgary (I think) and she absolutely hates it. She has no room to properly evaluate her students work properly.

Kids going through that system are in for a rude awakening once they hit college/university and their work is... well... graded.

woodman jr high?

 

[VT_FLO]

Enjoy that liberal bullshit education and trophies for everyone. "Oh by the way, that hard working fight till you win attitude dude/chick in the next town over just got the university slot you wanted because they have more drive and initiative drilled into them every day than the smiley face, frowny face education you get."

 

[saskskier]

woodman jr high?

I don't know for sure, but sounds right and I know she is having to work through the grading pilot project.

 

[Wheat]

I don't know for sure, but sounds right and I know she is having to work through the grading pilot project.

Either way its some serious bullshit thats probably gonna set kids up for failure.

 

[caucasian_chad]

Enjoy that liberal bullshit education and trophies for everyone. "Oh by the way, that hard working fight till you win attitude dude/chick in the next town over just got the university slot you wanted because they have more drive and initiative drilled into them every day than the smiley face, frowny face education you get."

Yup. I feel like this system you would end up with a lot of kids doing passable work, but very few doing exceptional work because there's no clear reward. How would you even know for sure if you were doing exceptional work? If you weren't doing passable work, how would you figure out which classmates are the ones doing exceptional work that can help you out?

 

[Utard]

I'm pretty sure Reed does this. It's also widely regarded as the hardest college in the states.

 

[Laurent.]

I like grades, being a notorious slacker they motivate me to actually study and be the top performer so I can consider everyone with a lesser grade then me as losers.

 

[GayWolf420]

Why? You can still learn and get good grades. Its not always about having the most A's in the class. Just seems to me they're doing it so that "no one feels left out" and no feewings r hurt when grades are handed out.

why cant we all just accept the fact some kids are just better than others? Enough of this "we're all the same bullshit".

 

[miroz]

I like grades, being a notorious slacker they motivate me to actually study and be the top performer so I can consider everyone with a lesser grade then me as losers.

Ha! This. I like when professors can tell where in the score distribution yours falls relative to other students. It either affirms you're the shit or motivates you to do better.

Also, numerical grading simplifies the conversation between a teacher and their class. The teacher says "Blah blah blah learn this" and the students say "here is my exam demonstrating my comprehension." Numerical grades allow the teachers to evaluate not only the individuals but also the class as a whole, which is a reflection on their teaching.

How can teachers have that interaction with students if there are no grades? "There were 8 smiles, 6 pizza slices, and 2 porcupines. Overall well done class!" This isn't a rhetorical question, I'm actually interested.

 

[DirtYStylE]

The concept is on point, but its going to be tough to execute. The standardization of the schools systems has taken away the need to learn about some really important stuff. Instead everyone focuses on getting that A and everything else gets disregarded for the most part.

A feedback system that will provide actual feedback is desperately needed for learning purposes. % are weak

 

[caucasian_chad]

The concept is on point, but its going to be tough to execute. The standardization of the schools systems has taken away the need to learn about some really important stuff. Instead everyone focuses on getting that A and everything else gets disregarded for the most part.

A feedback system that will provide actual feedback is desperately needed for learning purposes. % are weak

Most teachers don't just hand stuff back with a score and no comments. The ones that do suck.

 

[Scaredwhiteboy]

I'm pretty sure Reed does this. It's also widely regarded as the hardest college in the states.

Maybe by your Down's Syndrome father considers it hard, but most people would laugh at a degree from Reed.

 

[Utard]

Maybe by your Down's Syndrome father considers it hard, but most people would laugh at a degree from Reed.

Well I don't go there so I'm just relying on the testimony of others along the fact that Reedies pretty much have their pick from whatever institution they want for grad school.

 

[NotGhood]

The government's perception of how the school system functions and how it needs to be changed is so far off it defies comprehension

 

[lgward]

i think it's only good if the person is mentally challenged. my good friend went to a school that didn't give out number grades, and the environment was far too laid back for him to actually learn anything that would help him in the real world. sure, you can teach kids all you want about math and english, but if you don't force them to learn about how to cope with stress and disappointment, you're wasting your time. number grades make it easier to track progress and teach kids to suck it up and work harder.

 

[Dobber]

That's like Skiing without Skis

 

[dmski]

I went to a college where we didn't have grades or tests, and honestly it was really hard. you received credit based on how much the teacher thought you paid attention and the quality of your work. You had the total chance of 16 credits a quarter and they could give you 12, or 7, or 0. Knew a lot of kids who consistently had to retake classes and took years to graduate. It's definitely alternative but I think it makes you put more focus on actually being in class, not spacing off or skipping.

Sounds like a popularity contest. Teachers could be very biased in that place

 

[corona]

further pussification of society.

and wtf is with all this happening in Alberta?? I would have thought the whole no grades and no fail policies would be in some hippy commune like Victoria, not in staunch Conservative territory.

 

[LynxNation]

Sounds like a popularity contest. Teachers could be very biased in that place

Yeah I think there is potential for that, though I never experienced it personally or heard anything from friends. At the end of the quarter you had to write a personal evaluation along with the teachers that go into your transcripts when you graduate. That sounds super hippy dippy and it is, but I think it also gives a second perspective to what the teacher has to say about you as well.

I really liked the education I got there. I know a lot of people that dropped out because they didn't/ couldn't handle it. I think it's to each their own.

 

[Peter.]

I'm pretty sure Reed does this. It's also widely regarded as the hardest college in the states.

weird, because i have never heard of this school in my life.

 

[saskskier]

i think it's only good if the person is mentally challenged. my good friend went to a school that didn't give out number grades, and the environment was far too laid back for him to actually learn anything that would help him in the real world. sure, you can teach kids all you want about math and english, but if you don't force them to learn about how to cope with stress and disappointment, you're wasting your time. number grades make it easier to track progress and teach kids to suck it up and work harder.

Perhaps it's good in some of those circumstances, but I'm in a case conference with a kid who has some cognitive delays. The school is saying they are performing at a certain level (I think 'developing' was the grade they were giving), however the parent is saying they are way further behind than the school is saying.

Because the school only has four performance levels, there is no way to accurately determine how a child is performing.

 

[Lucas]

weird, because i have never heard of this school in my life.

But he knows people who say that so it must be true.

 

[DrZoidberg]

This would work for a select group of people who want to improve and want to prove to themselves they can learn and do things. Everybody else wouldn't give a shit.

 

[hamman]

I think it would work for some kids, but I think others could have even more problems than under the current system. (I'm thinking some kids need more structure) Kids should be taught more applicable information whatever way kids taught and tested. I also think teaching out of a book in most circumstances dumbs down the lesson, and doesn't leave much room open for discussion and or interpretation from multiple perspective because of the way lessons and timelines usually need to be met.

 

[miroz]

But he knows people who say that so it must be true.

It's the real deal. Actually pretty impressive.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Reed_College

"Reed has produced the second-highest number of Rhodes scholars for any liberal arts college—31—as well as over fifty Fulbright Scholars, over sixty Watson Fellows, and two MacArthur ("Genius") Award winners.[5][62] A very high proportion of Reed graduates go on to earn PhDs, particularly in the sciences, history, political science, and philosophy. Reed is third in percentage of its graduates who go on to earn PhDs in all disciplines, after only Caltech and Harvey Mudd.[6] In 1961, Scientific American declared that second only to Caltech, "This small college in Oregon has been far and away more productive of future scientists than any other institution in the U.S.""

And about the grading there:

"Although letter grades are given to students, grades are de-emphasized at Reed. According to the school, "A conventional letter grade for each course is recorded for every student, but the registrar's office does not distribute grades to students, provided that work continues at satisfactory (C or higher) levels. Unsatisfactory grades are reported directly to the student and the student's adviser. Papers and exams are generally returned to students with lengthy comments but without grades affixed."[15] There is no dean’s list or honor roll per se, but students who maintain a GPA of 3.5 or above for an entire academic year receive academic commendations, which are noted on their transcripts, at the end of the spring semester.[15] Many Reedies graduate without knowing either their cumulative GPA or their grades in individual classes. Reed also claims to have experienced very little grade inflation over the years, noting, for example, that only ten students graduated with a perfect 4.0 GPA in the period from 1983 to 2012.[16] (Transcripts are accompanied by a card explaining Reed's relatively tough grading system, so as to not penalize students applying to graduate schools.)[17] And though Reed does not award Latin honors to graduates, Reed does confer several awards for academic achievement at the time of commencement, including naming students to Phi Beta Kappa.[18]"

 

[lgward]

Perhaps it's good in some of those circumstances, but I'm in a case conference with a kid who has some cognitive delays. The school is saying they are performing at a certain level (I think 'developing' was the grade they were giving), however the parent is saying they are way further behind than the school is saying.

Because the school only has four performance levels, there is no way to accurately determine how a child is performing.

Very valid point. Ultimately, I think it depends on the kid. If he or she or whoever is not doing well in a certain environment, then that environment should be changed. Mix and match for each kid, you know? However, I feel like this system might be abused by a perfectly capable kid who's just too lazy to deal with a strict guidelines; and parents who aren't aware. Number grades aren't a bad thing for everyone.

It really just depends on the unique circumstances for every kid, and it's up to the parents/schools to put them into a place where they feel the kid is benefiting the most.

 

[Utard]

weird, because i have never heard of this school in my life.

That's probably because it's tiny. It's where Steve Jobs went to school
https://www.unigo.com/articles/top_10_colleges_that_will_kick_your_butt

 

[Lucas]

It's the real deal. Actually pretty impressive.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Reed_College

"Reed has produced the second-highest number of Rhodes scholars for any liberal arts college—31—as well as over fifty Fulbright Scholars, over sixty Watson Fellows, and two MacArthur ("Genius") Award winners.[5][62] A very high proportion of Reed graduates go on to earn PhDs, particularly in the sciences, history, political science, and philosophy. Reed is third in percentage of its graduates who go on to earn PhDs in all disciplines, after only Caltech and Harvey Mudd.[6] In 1961, Scientific American declared that second only to Caltech, "This small college in Oregon has been far and away more productive of future scientists than any other institution in the U.S.""

And about the grading there:

"Although letter grades are given to students, grades are de-emphasized at Reed. According to the school, "A conventional letter grade for each course is recorded for every student, but the registrar's office does not distribute grades to students, provided that work continues at satisfactory (C or higher) levels. Unsatisfactory grades are reported directly to the student and the student's adviser. Papers and exams are generally returned to students with lengthy comments but without grades affixed."[15] There is no dean’s list or honor roll per se, but students who maintain a GPA of 3.5 or above for an entire academic year receive academic commendations, which are noted on their transcripts, at the end of the spring semester.[15] Many Reedies graduate without knowing either their cumulative GPA or their grades in individual classes. Reed also claims to have experienced very little grade inflation over the years, noting, for example, that only ten students graduated with a perfect 4.0 GPA in the period from 1983 to 2012.[16] (Transcripts are accompanied by a card explaining Reed's relatively tough grading system, so as to not penalize students applying to graduate schools.)[17] And though Reed does not award Latin honors to graduates, Reed does confer several awards for academic achievement at the time of commencement, including naming students to Phi Beta Kappa.[18]"

Yeah... Sorry for being a dick.

Sounds pretty cool but I think the reason that they can do the whole no grades thing is because you are still assigned a grade, it's just not shown to the student unless it's below a C. Also the school has a reputation so the lack of grades on a transcript doesn't actually matter.