Religion, a debate.

mikee

mikee

Active member
Hey guys, I was reading the Jesus thread and it really sparked an interestt in me to see what people on this website thought of religion and such. I just took a week off school to take a week-long course in religion and I have come out much more open minded and accepting. Presonally, I think religion is something created and formed by culture and therefore , inherently not true. However, I believe that anything is possible and therefore, god can exist and might. What I dont understand is what leads people (im assuming the majority of you are christians so lets talk bible) to belive what these scriptures say? What makes your religion truer than all others? Of course there could be a higher power, but I feel that religion is just taking this belief in the divine and shaping it for the cultures benefit. I am not saying anything strictly, just saying my opinions and eager to hear yours. Also, please dont fuck this thread up and post bullshit about nothing.

-Mikee LiFsHitZ-

I can't wait for NS radio!
 
good call

Well, I've gone to church ever since I was born practically, and I still would say I'm not really religious. When I think of religous I think Jesus lovers and shit. That's not for me. I don't really believe in a God or a Jesus, and I esp don't enjoy it when I'm being preached to about that kinda 'strict' stuff. I'm episcapal, which is fairly liberal in terms of Christianity. And coming from Vermont, where Civil Unions were first legalized...yea; the two guys who started all that hoopla are members of my church and serve on several boards w/the parents. So to say the least, my church is quite liberal. This is a good thing tho, instead of going on about Jesus, they relate the scripture shtuff to everyday shtuff. It might seem like such a pain in the ass, and in some ways, the whole church thing is kind of a pain in the ass. In most ways, it's pretty renewing though. I'm def more of a good girl, so I geuss that's easy for me to say...I like those type of sermons though, the ones that clearly relate to my life. That way, I can work on stuff and try to be a better person; openminded, accepting, loving, just...healthier in the outlook. It really releives stress etc. And the best part is, I don't really have to take any more of a part in the church except for creeping in and sitting there sunday after sunday. I choose to only because the people kick some jesus-lovin ass and are just normal, nice people, and I grew up with a bunch of them so we all ski and go to camp and school and such together. For 'Sunday School' we used to go to Dunkin Doughnuts and some kids even blazed. Oh yea, another thing...haha--they have insense for special occasions and such. wow that stuff kicks some ass.....

premium quality!!

~marian
 
Canada has 20,000 Jedis: Census

OTTAWA - The vast majority of Canadians identify themselves as Christians, but a surprising number told Census takers they are followers of the Jedi, the holy warriors from the movie Star Wars.

*this was off CBC news. hilarious. Next census, I'm saying I'm a Jedi. The article also said that in Britain, there are more Jedis than Jews!!

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'Dude, check out this nasty gouge.'

'Your mom has a nasty gouge.'

Turn up the cool. Turn down the suck!!!
 
Yeah, using religious texts and ideas in a liberal way like that is good. It progresses society and takes everything into a more down-to-earth perspective that people can realte to. I, myself am a jew, and although I dont regularly go to a synagogue every saturday or pratcice SHabbat. I do respect the culture and heritage, and therfore, I go to a synagogue on special occassions to see whats happening. My congregation is very open-minded and liberal, and so we also try to relate things to our lives, adn not those of some acolytes 2000 years ago. And also, that insense sounds goood.

-Mikee LiFsHitZ-

I can't wait for NS radio!
 
Hahaha! yes! Also, they have a klingon university in Japan, where you can go and learn the language, customs, culture, religion and ritual of the race. Its so funny. People also practice the sith religion from star wars. This, I believe, shows taht religion is not about if its real or not, but what it can do for us as a society.

-Mikee LiFsHitZ-

I can't wait for NS radio!
 
Yea, haha in a Great Britain census, there were more people who said Jedi for religion than Jewish

But yea, Religion is a form of psychological belief. It is something to keep us from thinking about the harsh realities of life and death. There can be no true religion, because all of them are false scripts and rules to push beliefs unto others. Some are created for the sake of being created. For example, i think it is Anglican, it was created by one of the Kings of England, because he wanted a divorce and could not get one under his current religion

2 Inchers Club
 
i'm not theist, but 1 step more broader. I know there is something that controls life, maybe not god, but something else. Maybe fate, i found this out a few days ago, when the most inexplicable coincidence happenned, twice!

'what can we do to stop this war?'

'Leagalize PORN'

'Its allready legal'

'Not the kind i like'

Proud member of the official NS Ogre team, and NS communist party and OTC

***NEWSCHOOL UNDERGROUND***
 
Hmmm, good point PeteK. There could easily be something higher in our lives. A type of divinity, a god even. Buddhism I think is the religion that embraces the fatc that religion is not true, sacred power is.

-Mikee LiFsHitZ-

I can't wait for NS radio!
 
buddhism focus's on the body, and spirit. By that i mean you, as you are now. It is focused on peace in the body and soul. Buddhism is more a practice of human perfection, then a story and falsities about life and death, and history

2 Inchers Club
 
Precisely. If more religions were based on a purification of ourselves and our world as opposed to some realm up above into which we will be born after death, I think it would be more profitable, bot spiritualy and practicaly.

-Mikee LiFsHitZ-

I can't wait for NS radio!
 
I also believe religion is a responsibility, not an excuse. Too many people became too ignorant because they were blinded by the light of the heavens.

'what can we do to stop this war?'

'Leagalize PORN'

'Its allready legal'

'Not the kind i like'

Proud member of the official NS Ogre team, and NS communist party and OTC

***NEWSCHOOL UNDERGROUND***
 
Another good point. I believe I heard a story about some farmers who were having a bad harvest and therfore, trusted god to relieve there suffering and waited it out. this led to their decline and that teaches you that having faith in something as an excuse can be very bad indeed. Thats a point taht should definitly be brought up alot.

-Mikee LiFsHitZ-

I can't wait for NS radio!
 
we should bring back the human sacrifice. but not virgins. fat chicks maybe.

----------------

'Dude, check out this nasty gouge.'

'Your mom has a nasty gouge.'

Turn up the cool. Turn down the suck!!!
 
And we should sacrifice boy bands, and pretty boys!!!

'what can we do to stop this war?'

'Leagalize PORN'

'Its allready legal'

'Not the kind i like'

Proud member of the official NS Ogre team, and NS communist party and OTC

***NEWSCHOOL UNDERGROUND***
 
AND JOHNNY MOSSELY!!

'what can we do to stop this war?'

'Leagalize PORN'

'Its allready legal'

'Not the kind i like'

Proud member of the official NS Ogre team, and NS communist party and OTC

***NEWSCHOOL UNDERGROUND***
 
I believe in god because how would anything have been created without him? I think he just made the universe and gave us free will and he just sits back and watches.

My girlfriend told me to shove my skis up my ass
 
Thats a good point. the idea of infinity baffles me, and it does have an explanation for it. But why would it be your god?

-Mikee LiFsHitZ-

I can't wait for NS radio!
 
i would only believe in gods creation if:

We could not explain the theories of elements on earth, and how our creation can be followed scientifically almost beginning to end,

The only explanation for this is that god is EXTREMELY smart, so scientifically smart infact that he made the whole universe itself, fit together as a cover up

2 Inchers Club
 
But even if some divine power made the univers, it wouldnt be 'god' it would be just that, a divine power.

-Mikee LiFsHitZ-

I can't wait for NS radio!
 
I have been brought up in a pretty strict, Roman Catholic family. We go to church every Sunday, went to Sunday School for years, etc.. I pretty much went along with it until recently. I even got confirmed and everything in 8th grade.

But about one or two years ago I finally started questioning my faith. I started thinking why I hate church so much, yet I go every weekend. After a lot of thought, I realized the problem was I truley don't believe in most the stuff I have been taught to believe. I have stopped going to church regulary (only when my parents force me.) Slowly I started to formulate my own beliefs, to what best suited me. Yes, I still believe in a god. I believe in an afterlife, but still haven't decided what that is (reicarnation, an eutopia, nirvana, etc...). I like the message of peace many religions preach. I am kinda just collecting my beliefs as I find ones that I like and could belief in.

Pretty much everyday I am trying to sort out what I believe and what I don't. I have nothing against organized religion, or atheist. Just that stuff doesn't suit me. I haven't really discuessed this with others and was wondering how many others out there, are creating some sort of hybrid religion that suits thier beliefs and needs. For some reason, being in a church is becoming more and more creepy for me now, more and more it reminds me of a cult, but I guess that is just me. And if that is what you choose to do, good for you.

__________________________

Andrew

***NEWSCHOOL UNDERGROUND***
 
Hmmm, very intersting. It's true that a religion isnt nessecarily what you need. I think what you are doing is the way to go, as it lets you believe and not be a mindless drone at the same time.

-Mikee LiFsHitZ-

I can't wait for NS radio!
 
i believe in personal morals and values, but you don't need a church or a god to tell you that. why be conformed and have some guy tell you what to believe and this is how you should live, i say screw that. Why even look up to a god? what's the point honestly? to go to heaven? i say bs to that, we're here to live so why waste your time not living

Seize the carp
 
Another thing I hate is how some people are constantly, trying to make people change thier beliefs just because they believe thiers are superior. I have a pretty good Muslim friend and there is this girl in our school who is constantly trying to convert him to Christianity. It is actually very rude and even scary. My friend just polietly nods his head and says no thanks you, but she keeps laying it on and saying creepy things like 'I will pray for you and hope that you make the right decision.'

Why can't people be happy with their own beliefs? Why can't others accept the fact, that maybe others people beliefs are just as ligidiment(sp?) as their own. After constantly witnessing this first hand, I now find this extremley offensive.

__________________________

Andrew

***NEWSCHOOL UNDERGROUND***
 
jesus has a beard.

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Official Co-leader of the Communist party of Newschoolers

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Work Pays off later, Laziness pays off now :D

If you cant say Fu** at least 10 times in one sentence, you must not really be upset.

Im Scared

When your going big mountain, off da cliffs, you gotta briing your first aid, your shovel, your water, your food, your helmet, your radio, all your safety gear, cuz diing aint livin man

Doug- FUck, that kid had no style, he wasnt even as high as my left testicle.

 
not nessecarily Blinds, but yeah i know what you mean, ski bum. I feel teh same way as you. It gets sad when it reaches the level that people will go to great means to convert others to another religion.

-Mikee LiFsHitZ-

I can't wait for NS radio!
 
I've been brought up roman catholic and have been attending church practically every week since i was born. i never really questioned anything, but i've thought about the fact of God himself not being the highr power-if that makes any sense. like what mikee said before, adn i've noticed that as well, is that catholics almost sound so conceited and convinced that god is the one true divine power and that other 'higher powers' like buddha and zeus are not true. i've thought, but never believed it, that what if God isn't the higher most divine power? what if buddha really is?

one thing that i definitely have a problem w/ though in the catholic church is reconciliation. in teh roman catholic church, you must confess your sins to a priest or else they will not be forgiven, as opposed to the protestant religion, where if you are truly sorry for ur sins and confess them to God, you will be forgiven. i know of many people who don't agree w/ what the roman catholic church says about confessing your sins only to a priest. many people i know, myself included, feel awkward confessing certain sins to a priest. i believe that if you are truly sorry for ur sins (and God knows how sorry u really are), and you confess them to God, u will be forgiven.

*******************

My imaginary friend thinks you have serious mental problems.

'Life is a stage on which everyone contributes a verse...what will your verse be?' -Robin Williams in 'The Dead Poets Society'

 
i don't understand why people get so worked up about defending religion and there faith, i think from seeing my friends who are all religious is that alot of it is an act to either impress others or to do it for there parents, which is stupid. why waste your time?

Seize the carp
 
religion is like ure best friend. If some1 was to put down ure religion, or put down ure friend, of course you feel an obligation to stick up for him/it.

'what can we do to stop this war?'

'Leagalize PORN'

'Its allready legal'

'Not the kind i like'

Proud member of the official NS Ogre team, and NS communist party and OTC

***NEWSCHOOL UNDERGROUND***
 
I feel religeon is a crutch for the weak, or weak minded. but whatever melts you butter man. just keep it out of my face.

'dude, I'm wicked smart dude.'

Proud Member of the 802

'Stop crying to emo, listen to misfits and kill things.'
 
i, personnally, am not religious, but it there are a few Inexplicable events that cant seem to be explained by pure coincidence. The fact that we are alive, that the first atom on earth evolved to a human being… it gives us a chance to assume our luck. We are JUST the right distance from the sun, with other planets before, deviating the course of many meteorites(happened, many times in the past) and such… but also events that demand ecplaining. The use of certain animals, if everything is meant for a reason? Cows for milk, pigs for bacon, but lice? Intestinal worms? Dunno about that….

'I was thinking about it... is having your period like making a lot of liquid farts?'-friend of mine, not too intelligent
 
also, you cant base religious beliefs on the existence of jesus in older times (which is proven), because there are currently, in a mental hospital of Québec city, 8 patients who claim to be the new messiah of the catholic religion… whatever.

'I was thinking about it... is having your period like making a lot of liquid farts?'-friend of mine, not too intelligent
 
if you claim to be christ, then you are considered the anti-christ.

but yeah, its not only for the weak minded man. I was a diehard atheist turned agnostic, turned spiritualist, i know there is something, i just know it.

'what can we do to stop this war?'

'Leagalize PORN'

'Its allready legal'

'Not the kind i like'

Proud member of the official NS Ogre team, and NS communist party and OTC

***NEWSCHOOL UNDERGROUND***
 
i just don't care, if there is then great, but if not then i havn't wasted my life

Seize the carp
 
this entire post is pretty amusing. MikeE said he started the topic with the idea in mind of having a semi-serious debate about religions. Most everyone here hasn't posted anything substantially thoughtful or evidential, just opinions.

I personally am a Christian. I grew up in a Unitarian Church my whole life. A Unitarian Church is that in which the people of the congregation believe what they want. Some are muslims, buddhists, quakers, all types.

I became a Christian the summer after 9th grade for a couple of reasons. One, God revealed himself in my life in some major ways. Two, the evidence given for Christ; his life and resurrection, were irrefutable.

I am not going to sit here and preach to you guys either, so chill. As a Christian, it is frustrating to me when people preach without substance, and do it in an offensive way. For all of you that have been annoying, even hurt by Christians, sorry.

For those of you who hate Christians, especially when they try to 'convert' you (man I hate that word), let me try to help you understand why they do so:

1) First off, some may be blind, it is true. In some surveys and polls, 80% of Americans would claim to be Christians, but only 10% are active/knowledgable about their faith. So chances are, some people either dont know what they are talking about, or are over zealous while doing it

2) They think it is the right thing to do. The bible, Jesus, etc all command Christians to spread the good word of God. 'We love because He first loved us.' Anyway, you shouldn't be offended because to them, they are trying to help you, even if you don't think so.

As for other religions, I have studied them all in college and written 15 or 20 page papers on some. All religions are going to have 'flaws' in different people's eyes. The thing about Christianity that is so frustrating to people is that it directly affects them.

Buddhism, Hinduism, Islam, they are all created by people who thought they were right. Personally I am %100 confident that what I believe in is right, based on experiences and evidence. But, don't most people who devote their lives to a religion? So, yes, I can't say with certainty that Christianity is true, or any other religion. But, I still have respect for other religions.

Cant remember, but whoever told about her friend always being annoyed by a Christian: that sucks. The Christian is yes, probably taking the wrong angle, but in the end it is because he/she cares.

If anyone has actual questions and not bashing, feel free to ask them and I will do my best to answer them. If you want to make fun of me and be really negative, that's cool too. Peace

 
some things to ponder

-try and imagine the universe, where it ends? whats at the end? does it end? if it doesnt then whats out there?

-you have to go somewhere when you die, all your thoughts and memories have to be sent somewhere and do something. try and imagine yourself dead in a coffin, no light, no thought, no nothing. you cant. why? because its not possible, the gears in your head are always turning, they cant stop its like a never ending cycle and, shit i cant even explain it, just try it yourself. try and imagine all your memories and thoughts gone. its immpossible and very scary.

-dreams. why do things in your dreams seem to reoccur in real life? major dejavu. sometimes complete scenes can be seen in your dreams and then days even weeks later you see it in reality. i think i have found the answer to this one. its you collective unconciouness coming alive in a deep sleep and organizing all you have recorded and seen throughout the day and it makes predictions on whats going to happen based on what has happenned. even though you dont realize it, every sound and sight and touch and smell you recieve throughout the day is collected and stored somewhere in your brain. you go to sleep and it comes out of hiding but is thrown together into a dream of what might happen in the future or just strange shit like we usually get.

-infinity. try and think about a piece of string that goes on forever and ever. ya cant haha. its immpossible. the mind is a finite thing and the universe is inifinte.

yeah it was kinda off topic but all go together with religion and life and stuff.

peace,paul

'handin out flyers is jus fuckin ridiculous...when you give somebody a flyer its like...say man...why dont you go throw this out for me?'

-mitch hedburg
 
some good stuff to think about snonasty...as much as i try to understand infinity, my mind just can't comprehend it...

:::Jeronimo:::

'Hey everybody! Lateralis drinks alcohol and smokes marijuana cigarettes! You're burned now, lateralis.' -Halo

Camp of Champions, Session B
 
ok, i got something. If heaven is a perfect place, then that means anything below it is infinately worse, so relative to heaven we are living in hell. Plus you all have pbly seen the matrix, could ppl accept a perfect world. Could a perfect world be even perceieved?

'what can we do to stop this war?'

'Leagalize PORN'

'Its allready legal'

'Not the kind i like'

Proud member of the official NS Ogre team, and NS communist party and OTC

***NEWSCHOOL UNDERGROUND***
 
perfect in unachievable because whoes to say that something is perfect? there will always be somebody to find a flaw in something that is 'perfect.'

peace,paul

'handin out flyers is jus fuckin ridiculous...when you give somebody a flyer its like...say man...why dont you go throw this out for me?'

-mitch hedburg
 
ok..heaven is the perfect utopia. the reason utopia can't be achieved on earth is b/c there's a lot of conflict and frustration on earth. in heaven, all the souls are i guess u could say of 'equal goodness.' that's why after u die, u go to heaven, hell, or purgatory. although teh souls in purgatory eventually get to heaven. in heaven, there r none of those people that caused any kind of conflict or frustration on earth b/c they either 1)r in hell (depending on how serious what they did was), 2)r in purgatory (waiting to go to heaven), or 3)r in heaven (cuz they made it from purgatory to heaven).

never to my knowledge was it said that anything below heaven was infinitely worse. hell is worse than all the troubles on earth. sure there's bad things taht happen to u an some situations may be considered hellish, but what about all the good things that happen? i don't think good things happen in hell. earth is a test to see how u react to things and what u choose to do w/ ur life and what god gives u. how u live ur life helps determine where u will go after u die.

*******************

My imaginary friend thinks you have serious mental problems.

'Life is a stage on which everyone contributes a verse...what will your verse be?' -Robin Williams in 'The Dead Poets Society'

 
It seems to me that religion must have been created by culture, but why and how? well, people are afraid of dying, and they don't want to die alone. People want to believe that they will one day be reunited with people they have lost. So ultimately religion was created because people are afraid of death.

I was born on planet earth

a rotating ball where man comes first. it's been around, for a long long time

now it's time to watch it die.
 
SnoNasty, the dream thing has always amazed me. I rarely remember my dreams, but then deja vu occurs. Everytime this happens, I instantly remember the dream, even if I didn't remember it when I woke up, after having it, 2 weeks ago. After it happens, I always take a few seconds and think in amazement of what just happened, but I never really tied that religion. Deja Vu. at least for me, is just a sign for how powerful the human mind actually is.

__________________________

Andrew

***NEWSCHOOL UNDERGROUND***
 
i didnt and dont tie that to religon. relgion is horse shit (sorry if i offended anybody but thats just what i think) dreams are just your minds way of processing all the info it recieves throught the day. i actually record my dreams as soon as a wake up cuz thats when i remember them, i have a small notebook next to my bed. i look back and read them and i can remember the entire dream its cool. one time i lost my keys and i was so mad and frustrated i couldnt find em. i went to sleep concentrating on thinking about my keys and only my keys. in a dream i saw my keys being dropped into the garbage pail when they fell out of my hand when i was carrying groceries. i woke up, went to the bottom of the garbage pail and voila i had my keys. it was so awesome. and this tottaly reniforces my point cuz somewhere in my head it was recorded that my keys fell out of my hand while i was near the garbage and then happened to fall in. concentrating on the keys i think helped my brain retrieve the info on where they were much more readily and displayed the info for me to see.

and this is another point, what are the images you can see in your head? like when your wide awake with your eyes open i mean. its not an actuall image that you see... but you can see it. its whacked. you cans see colors and shapes and texture so vividly but its like its not actually there. and you cant concentarte on an image for too long cuz it just like dissapears for w/e reason. try and picture something for ten seconds, it prob fades at like 5. i dont quite understand this, mabye somebody can contribute who has a theory?

peace,paul

'handin out flyers is jus fuckin ridiculous...when you give somebody a flyer its like...say man...why dont you go throw this out for me?'

-mitch hedburg
 
i've been to church once in my life, my friend made me go because i crashed at his house the night before, so i have no say in this.

-------------------

-I don't trust anything that bleeds for 7 days and doesn't die

HIGH NORTH SESSION 2!
 
I am spiritualist, which means i believe there is more to life then what we see.

'what can we do to stop this war?'

'Leagalize PORN'

'Its allready legal'

'Not the kind i like'

Proud member of the official NS Ogre team, and NS communist party and OTC

***NEWSCHOOL UNDERGROUND***
 
I am a Christian. Not because someone told me its right. But because I know it's right.

Some may ask, 'Well, this atheist strongly believes that he is in the right. What makes you any different from him?'

I look at the world, I see evidence. Evidence in the complexity of the smallest atom, to the largest planet. I see detail that could not have happened by accident. The Bible. This book has stood the test of time and is infallible.

This book is a collaboration written by many men of all different times and walk of life. Yet, not one detail contradicts another.

(you can take something out of context though. But its far from being truth)

And if Christianity is a big hoax, so what?

According to other 'religions' I will be fine.

But what if you are wrong?

I am not religous. I believe in a God and that he sent his son Jesus.

Please, look at the stars one night, and tell me it was all by chance that it came to be.

Eat. Sleep. Breathe. Ski.

 
not to go against christianity or anything ghost dragon but as a serious question, not a challenging one, why is it that the things that happened in the bible dont happen anymore, like water turning to wine(the famous miracle example) and blind people seeing again, and dead people coming back to life and all that other stuff?

peace,paul

'handin out flyers is jus fuckin ridiculous...when you give somebody a flyer its like...say man...why dont you go throw this out for me?'

-mitch hedburg
 
because jesus did all that and he isnt here anymore.

proud owner of 'team ramrod', the best NS hockey pool team ever.
 
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