Realtime clip of Helicopter gunning down some foreign criminals

hmmm, my belief is although yes, those iraquis may be known terrorist leaders and may have killed my americans in the past, they didnt get a trial, hearing or any semblence of justice. one of the great things about america is that almost always even if you commit a crime, you will be dragged into court and given a hearing, not just shot on the street. i know their are exceptions to the rule and that their might be circumstances from that video far beyond our knowledge, but this is my opinion

______________________________________

'michael moore called...said he is ready to fuck you again' - SUpilot

'Yeah, most pros are strict Mormons. I read an interview with Tanner where he talked about his experience with a caffinated beverage. He said that it screwed up his style because he was poisoning the temple that is his body. Then some of his wives left him.' - Mistaskier

 
so your saying we need to capture and try everyone that we might kill in a war, that makes a lot of sense, and in response to petek, only 10% of the iraqi population has a problem with the US occupation of iraq, and that is because they are being influence by all of the radical clerics who dont know what is good for them and who hate the US no matter what we do, the reason that 90% of the iraqi population supports the US, is because we got rid of saddam, your speaking like we just invaded iraq to take control of the country, which is far from the truth, what we did in iraq was a good thing, and yes some civilians are killed, like that guy in the tractor, who could have been a civilian, or he might have had weapons in the tractor and he could have been preparing to fire on the US troops, but what all you bleeding heart liberals do is give all of the Iraqus the benefit of the doubt, if you see a group of people meeting in the middle of a field with supply trucks and you see one man try to hide an rpg what do you do, just fly on by or kill the people in the vicinity around the meeting place, maybe that iraqi was in the wrong place at the wrong time, and maybe not, but every war in history civilians have been killed and that cant be avoided, what liberals like you have to do is think about what we have done for iraq, and not focus on the 10% of the population who will hate the US no matter what it does, we rid iraq of a dictator who killed 20,000 people a year, and we are going to kill some civilians, but not as many as saddam would have killed each year anyways, so your saying that it is right for the iraqi fighters to rise up against the US troops because we are occupying their country and trying to stabilize it, and believe me the president and all the troops want to get the fuck out of iraq as soon as they can, but they must do some work or else all of this war will be in vain and iraq will fall back into a dictatorship and nothing will have been accomplished, the iraqis really have no right to attack US troops, and people like you support them for such bullshit reasons that it pisses me off, if you dont think us ridding iraq of saddam was a good thing, then i can understand why you would support uprisals but if you agree that getting rid of saddam was a good thing then how do you support iraqi troops against people of your own country, who joined the military to fight for your freedom, and have no control over what they do, this is what angers me the most, when people like you wish the deaths of good americans and support iraqi insurgents who are always going to hate americans and have no real reason to rise against us other than their inbred hate of us

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HIGH NORTH SESSION 4

The Hot Sauce Champion of the World
 
yeah that was really long and i rambled a lot but hopefully you get the point

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HIGH NORTH SESSION 4

The Hot Sauce Champion of the World
 
i'm way too tired to read all of that, so i'll just nod my head and smile.

the part i did read, i question those polls very much so. hmm...were they done by Poles? Up to no good again i see. So if these polls were done by Poles, they would reach so far up you would need poles to get to them, hah!

sorry, insomnia is gettn the best of me...

Mind can make a heaven from hell, and a hell from heaven
 
i read it in the newsweek about back pain and i forget who the polls were done by, but i could find out if you really wanted me to

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HIGH NORTH SESSION 4

The Hot Sauce Champion of the World
 
yeah read it now and it might make more sense because i just ramble from topic to topic, and i dont feel like cleaning it up because thats too much work

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HIGH NORTH SESSION 4

The Hot Sauce Champion of the World
 
first of all, no i am not saying that we should, i am merely pointing it out, and as i said their might have been circumstances that we have no idea about, but, gunning people down without direct confrontation is not conductive to world peace. the video also shows slacking in the rules of engagement, in somolia for instance, our forces were not aloud to open fire unless they were fired upon

______________________________________

'michael moore called...said he is ready to fuck you again' - SUpilot

'Yeah, most pros are strict Mormons. I read an interview with Tanner where he talked about his experience with a caffinated beverage. He said that it screwed up his style because he was poisoning the temple that is his body. Then some of his wives left him.' - Mistaskier

 
A lot of things. First, just because only 10% of Iraq is registered as opposed to the US occupation does NOT by any means show that 90% of the population is in favour of it (false dilemma, fallacious reasoning). Secondly, that statistic is meaningless. It's outdated (they've been saying the same thing since the statue of Saddam fell), and was calculated with EXTREME bias, as only a small population of iraqis were included in the results.

Next, i just have to ask, 'Might have had weapons in the tractor that he was going to use to kill US troops'? First of all, that's fairly ridiculous; if I was going to hide a weapon that I intended to use against US troops, I wouldn't put it in my tractor (unless it was something that I carried with me regularly, meaning he wouldn't be carrying it for the express purpose of killing US troops). But more importantly, you want to kill everyone who MIGHT have weapons or intent to hurt US soldiers? Hell, I might be up here hatching a devious scheme in my bedroom to blow up congress, but that doesn't give you the right to toss a grenade in my window.

The benefit of the doubt is a sound legal principle. Just because someone lives in a country you're at war with does not mean A) they are evil and in league with the people you're fighting, nor B) that they deserve to die, and that their deaths are acceptable even if they're innocent. '' the wrong place at the wrong time'' Should NOT be in a soldier's vocabulary! You do not kill innocent people, you make SURE you know who you're gunning down beforehand. I'm not talking about this situation in particular, but in general. This kind of 'acceptable civilian losses' attitude is why everyone outside of the US hates the US.

As far as 'falling back into a dictatorship', that isn't a problem for the US government. Sorry for this wake-up call, but the US government loves dictatorships, as long as those dictatorships are useful to them. What they're waiting for is a government that won't be hostile to them, and will be useful to them.

And for God's sake, just because someone is against the killing of innocent people, against an illegal war and against lying to an entire nation to effect the two aforementioned eventualities, does not mean that they ''wish the deaths of good americans'', it just means that they don't accept whatever the Bush administration decides to do as 'the right thing'.

J.D.'s Hall of Fame for Stupid Posts:

''mad trix is a gay name. go with the k2's.'' -Linepunk

''Dude, Americans or Canadians didn't invent english, the British dudes did.'' -Chauncy

''Gay people are fags'' -Atlantaski

''dude i am literat i just cant spell worth shit u got prob with it bitch'' -Bridgerbowlskier

''Gay marriages are gay.'' -SUpilot

'if it werent for women, i wouldnt have to wear condoms' -Hucksterjibber

''This board seems to have gone downhill since i joined'' -ADjunkie
 
as a second thought that i forgot to add to my last post, that poll number goes every which goddam way, im sick of hearing ONLY 10 PERCENT hate us, then ONLY 10 PERCENT LOVE US or HALF OF THEM HATE US AND HALF OF THEM LOVE US... those statistics are bullshi0, i hear a different number depending on wether i pick up the new york times or the washington post... its that bad

______________________________________

'michael moore called...said he is ready to fuck you again' - SUpilot

'Yeah, most pros are strict Mormons. I read an interview with Tanner where he talked about his experience with a caffinated beverage. He said that it screwed up his style because he was poisoning the temple that is his body. Then some of his wives left him.' - Mistaskier

 
its not like they just flew around and shot at a random tractor plowing a field, the tractor was very close to a meeting which involved a man with an RPG and a supply truck that was most likely full of weapons, and because he was so close and not really doing anything, like plowing a field which is what tractors usually do, instead he was sitting there with some involvement in this meeting, i doubt it is a coincidence that he was just there, but that is a possibility and then he was in the wrong place at the wrong time, but from the soldiers perspective he was part of the meeting, and they did the thing that they were probably told to do, not permit the meeting to occur, also i realize petek probably doesnt want the average american soldier to die, but when he openly supports iraqi uprisings that is basically what he is doing, and with friends and family in the military i dont appreciate a fellow american supporting the people that are trying to kill my friends and family

--------------------

HIGH NORTH SESSION 4

The Hot Sauce Champion of the World
 
well we all know how credible the new york times is, but ill go check to see who the statistic came from that was in the newsweek article

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HIGH NORTH SESSION 4

The Hot Sauce Champion of the World
 
He doesnt support american soldiers deaths in any way, hes just not supporting what he views as sensless killings. But you have to understand that with the political lines everyone walks these days, most positions people take can mean entirely different things to the different people that view them.

______________________________________

'michael moore called...said he is ready to fuck you again' - SUpilot

'Yeah, most pros are strict Mormons. I read an interview with Tanner where he talked about his experience with a caffinated beverage. He said that it screwed up his style because he was poisoning the temple that is his body. Then some of his wives left him.' - Mistaskier

 
well im saying that he may not mean to support their deaths but in my mind and many other peoples minds who have relatives in the army he is supporting their deaths and that gets me pissed and im sure others in my predicament pissed

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HIGH NORTH SESSION 4

The Hot Sauce Champion of the World
 
Just to get this part outta the way, I have no arguments with, how or really why those guys in that vid were killed, its war.

I do have a problem with why the US is in Iraq in the first place. Right now CNN and the american gov. will have you beleive its to combat terrorism and they're paying back the terrorists that took out the WTC, but i thought thats what afganistan was for. It was al quida and Osama, not sadams 'regime' that were flying the planes, and im pretty sure sadam is not friends with osama. BUT i distintcly remember at the start of the Iraq thing, that the US went in because Iraq was in possesion of weapons of mass destruction which was prohibited accounding to some type of treaty they signed, which when they realized there wasnt any, the gov. quickly said it was because of terrorist, now i also heard Cnn sayin that the reason was the US was saving the iraqi citizens from oppression.

So (and even though most of this info is from CNN prob the least realiable source anywhere) why is the US there again, i think if your an american strictly limited to CNN and in full support of the slaughter i mean war you get to pick from a list of reasons why they're there.

Aswell i donno how you americans can so blindly follow george bush, for one reason the guy is a fucking idiot ever less to the guy (my fav momement was way back in the day one he tried to blame china for a US spy plane and a mig colliding in CHINESE airspace) he's screwed your economy sooo bad, your unemployment % is way up your countries in waaaay more debt. and nobody really knows if he was legitimatly elected because of all the recounts.

 
I also have a prob with people that sob everytime the US takes casualties. Like it has been said its war get over it (not that i wanna see them there gonna happen). And dont get pissed about the suicide bombings, its not cowardly at all the bomber always dies, plus its statisical war in its very essence 1 iraqi for say even 2 troop and 2 wounded 1 guy just took out 4 thats what there goin for.

sorry bout the longness of my comments just had alot to be said, if anyone wants to watch a good movie that relates to the subject check out bowlig for columbine by mike moore

 
thanks man, but im tired as shit right now, and im goin to bed so you can hold it down for a while

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HIGH NORTH SESSION 4

The Hot Sauce Champion of the World
 
no dammit don't go to sleep, arguing with someone late at night is a distinguishing charactaristic of ns

______________________________________

'michael moore called...said he is ready to fuck you again' - SUpilot

'Yeah, most pros are strict Mormons. I read an interview with Tanner where he talked about his experience with a caffinated beverage. He said that it screwed up his style because he was poisoning the temple that is his body. Then some of his wives left him.' - Mistaskier

 
yeah but before i go to bed i have to write a paper and i cannot be distracted, so the longer i stay up to argue the more fucked i am tommorow, and im already pretty fucked

--------------------

HIGH NORTH SESSION 4

The Hot Sauce Champion of the World
 
hah, i have to too, i have to write a 5 page reflective essay on teh odysey, which of course i still havnt started

______________________________________

'michael moore called...said he is ready to fuck you again' - SUpilot

'Yeah, most pros are strict Mormons. I read an interview with Tanner where he talked about his experience with a caffinated beverage. He said that it screwed up his style because he was poisoning the temple that is his body. Then some of his wives left him.' - Mistaskier

 
yeah mine is on the eisenhower presidency during the cold war, and i seem to be sitting on NS instead of writing my paper, surprising eh

--------------------

HIGH NORTH SESSION 4

The Hot Sauce Champion of the World
 
Ahahahahahahhaha 'smoke em'', fuck hose terrorist turban-heads. That first guy got W.A.S.T.E.D

___________________________

''Shake it like a polaroid picture''

 
well said, 'smoke em', god bless the united states of america

What's next for you?

Have sex with hot chicks.

-Tanner Hall Interview
 
all of you should just shut the fuck up for 1 minute and think about this. You are now sitting on your computer bitching about american soliders (rocker_girl) and how bad they are and blah blah. But all of you seem to forget that you are here and speaking your mind because of the men and women would died in war. It is not a matter of right and wrong, but a mater of protecting what is ours and survival. Also, we are over there because they killed 3,000 of our inocent civilians. think about that. So your bitching about how barrbic we are and how bad america, i personally think you are hypocritical because again you are using ur right to speak freely, this right is protected by those men and women how have the balls to step up and fight. And you say we are so bad, do we strap bombs to little kids and have them run at the tanks and force americans to shoot them. Remember, we don't know shit about what is really going on. You are just seeing on small section of war, unless you have been in war, i suggest you stop talking and think long and hard.

cody

cody

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HIGH NORTH SESSION 2

Skiing is never a sport, but a lifestlye.
 
^A few things.

First of all, how this war in particular protects freedom of speech is beyond me. Secondly, How you can say 'You have freedom to express your opinion because of them, now STOP FUCKING EXPRESSING IT' makes even less sense. But most importantly, even if they were defending freedoms, that doesn't automatically make everything they do right by ANY standard (Deontologically, they'd be wrong for inhibiting the basic right of innocent people to live, and from a utilitarian standpoint, The lives of the innocent are more important than certain peripheral freedoms that may be inhibited by leaving those people alive). You cannpt just assume that soldiers are doing the right thing simply because they're on 'your side'. Saying 'They're fighting for us, shut up and support them' doesn't make any sense at all, and people who think that way need a wake up call.

J.D.'s Hall of Fame for Stupid Posts:

''mad trix is a gay name. go with the k2's.'' -Linepunk

''Dude, Americans or Canadians didn't invent english, the British dudes did.'' -Chauncy

''Gay people are fags'' -Atlantaski

''dude i am literat i just cant spell worth shit u got prob with it bitch'' -Bridgerbowlskier

''Gay marriages are gay.'' -SUpilot

'if it werent for women, i wouldnt have to wear condoms' -Hucksterjibber

''This board seems to have gone downhill since i joined'' -ADjunkie
 
Hey, I'm back, with a little input. Maybe to round this discussion off, cause alot of what both sides are arguing on is complete heresay... The video itself shows some guys out in a field, some of you say they must be terrorists, and some of you say farmers. First off, a helicopter is not dispatched to an area without some sort of pre flight brief as to what they might encounter during the flight. The fact that this video was taken during the war itself last spring makes any argument over these peoples legal rights just squabbling. Now, since that might be cleared up, there are two distinct differences between peacetime law, and the laws of war, mostly governing engagement with an armed enemy. If you want a lesson on that it won't be here, but I'm going to tell you all how it works. In one of my earlier responses I stated the fact that there were prior mortar attacks that were coming from the area that these Iraqis were in. With that intelligence a threat was identified. A mission was dispatched in order to meet and identify the threat. Since this was during combat operations, on both sides, the right to trial by a jury of your peers, well, that doesn't happen. It's a war and ther are seperate laws governing our actions. The trucks... Thos types of trucks were commonplace during the war for transporting troops and weapons, you see the Iraqi army was not anywhere near what the US and British armies were as to the uniformity of the equipment they used. Saying that the army itself was very unorganized, but it still was an army. These facts are quite obvious when you look back at all the desertions and surrenders that took place during the war. We, i.e. American soldiers, Marines, Seamen, don't have a bloodlust, and we don't go around blindly killing everything that moves, or even looks suspicious. That's why so many of us have been killed on gate security and other types of guard posts. Somalia was different, we were there as part of a UN sanctioned peace keeping force, it was not a war. Currently the US and other countries are occupying Iraq as a peacekeeping for in order to rebuild and stabilize the country. Nowadays when you hear of an Iraqi civilian being killed it usually isn't from a member of our military. As illustrated by a mortar attack that happened last week, the Insurgents mortard an Iraqi neoghborhood, killing Iraqis. The insurgents couldn't give a fuck about the Iraqi's, cause they themselves are not Iraqi's at all. Stated earlier, these people are recruited by these clerics, for their own personal means of taking some sort of control over their region of the country. Before Iraq was even a country it was a scattered quilt of tribal kingdoms if you will... Ala Middle age England, Europe for that matter. Constantly at war, and what your seeing today is the resurgency of that train of thought in these radical muslim clerics. I can truthfully state that the majority of the Iraqi civilian populous does NOT want this, because it only brings more death and chaos to the region. Arguing over polls done by some periodical is pointless. The people attacking the infrastructure that we've protected, and the troops themselves are a small percentage of the country's populous as opposed to the ones that want a peaceful country where they can finally lead a safe, secure, and happy life. If you want my opinion, 9/11 wasn't the biggest reason we attacked Iraq, that's why we're still in Afghanistan and the surrounding countries. We invaded Iraq with the expressed reason to oust Hussein, and no one can say that wasn't a good thing for the people of Iraq. Today we're there rebuilind Iraq into something better than it ever was. Do not argue as to who are WE to say it's better, until you lived in a country where you could be murdered in the street over an opinion you made, or tortured because you were friends with someone who opposed the leaser, AND enjoyed it! We can discuss this for years, and believe me it will be done by some, but, what's done is done and there's no going back. We did what we did because no one else felt they could. That might seem wrong, but if no one is willing to stand up for what they see as right and good, then they've failed themselves and the entire world. We came to Iraq and it will be a better place. I couldn't give a shit about the WMD's. I knew when we went there that that wasn't the real reason for going, it was so much more. Whatever, I'm out of thoughts on this for now.

 
i like you you put stuff pretty well.

______________________

Picture a pasture open to all. It is expected that each herdsman willl try to keep as many cattle on the pasture. when a herder adds a cow to the pasture, he reaps the benefits of a larger herd. Meanwhile the cost of the animal - damage done to the pasture - is divided among all the herdsmen....... the herdsmen are getting nervous. putting more cattle on the pasture isnt helping anyone. (mental commons)

______________________

****NWFT****
 
that is absolutely sickening. what the fuck is wrong with this? im glad im canadian

--------------------

S3p Represent

PBP Junkie

TMC For life

www.tmcmogul.com

five0 is a crazy sexy nutcracker motherfucker.'
 
Well,i would GIVE A SHIT about the weapons of mass destruction,since they were one of the main reasons to go to war.

I understand that you believe you'll make Irak a better place,but...i think that you're gonna leave by June 30th,Irak being a mess,and a civil war will explode,and God knows what else will happen,since the U.N. sucks at keeping shit in their place.

------------------------------

Proudly defending the right of being a Spaniard.Hell yeah!
 
why june 30th. i dont think we will ever get out. we will just continue to mess it up.

______________________

Picture a pasture open to all. It is expected that each herdsman willl try to keep as many cattle on the pasture. when a herder adds a cow to the pasture, he reaps the benefits of a larger herd. Meanwhile the cost of the animal - damage done to the pasture - is divided among all the herdsmen....... the herdsmen are getting nervous. putting more cattle on the pasture isnt helping anyone. (mental commons)

______________________

****NWFT****
 
its america's war not austrlia's; john howard if you're reading this (which i highly doubt) pull our troops out you little short dumb fuck

___________________________

''Shake it like a polaroid picture''

 
^^Nice to see where your priorities are... I just want to remind you that what you see on the news everyday is all the bad stuff going on in Iraq. Reporting mostly the negative is the mainstay of todays mass media. So to you, everything must sound like it's in the shitter if you go by what you hear on the radio and TV. But just saying we're only there fucking the place up more than before is a pretty ignorant thing to say if you've never gotten the chance to see for yourself. Granted the insurgency is doing thier best to impede the rebuilding process, but I'll say it again, they're not Iraqi's... They have their own agenda, and they couldn't give a shit about the future of Iraq for the people. You can't really say much in defense of that, because it's been proven time and time again in just the last months. Do you really think a downtrodden Iraqi civilian would take up arms against his own people and kill his neighbor's because some cleric told himf to do that? Iraqi's are still human beings, and with that they still pursue much of the same things we do, and I stated that earlier. Throwing your land into disarray is not one of those things that I see an Iraqi civilian doing in order to further thier picture of future Iraq. That is for these radical muslim clerics who call themselves leaders to do. These men have their own Ideas for what they see Iraq of tomorrow, with thier minds clouded with greed and hatred they use the fact that they're leaders of the church in order to recruit people from the region to fight for their personal cause. The only thing standing the way of their 'victory' are the peacekeeping, and rebuilding forces. Overall the american presence in Iraq is definately not ran on a selfish idea of conquest and imperialism. And that's a no contest, we're there to improve the country's infrastructure, and stabilize the region in order to safely activate a democratic government. So, currently, what's so wrong with that? We're taking casualties almost daily, but we're determined to do what we came to do. July 30th will come and go, but you can be sure the way things are going our withdrawl will not happen... If that's how I can translate your opinion of the U.S. than I got the message, but pulling out just cause we have an excuse, before our job is finished is not something the U.S. is known for. I'm almost positive I'll be there again soon. But to us it's not a waste of time, nor does the matter of our being there come up to question in our minds all that often.

 
exactly we are going to stay as long as it takes to do a good job, and either way the liberal pussies will have something to say about it, because if we pull out now and dont do a good job of rebuilding iraq into a good democratic nation then all the pussies will complain about that, and if we stay in iraq for a little bit longer then the liberals will cry about that, and we are going to stay and finish the job and we will turn iraq into a decent country, which will be a huge improvement from the shithole it was before we got there, but the liberals will still complain about WMDs, so we made a mistake and there were none, big deal pussies dont cry about it, but what we did do is make a whole country one hell of a lot better so what can you say to that, nothing, but there will always be some trivial thing that the bleeding heart liberal pussies will complain about, because thats the kind of people they are, they dont care if we improved the life of millions, they complain over and over about why we went to war, its time for people to start focusing on the huge positive aspects of this war, and stop bitching about the why we went to war, and also by going to war we probably saved thousands of american lives from terrorist attacks, and you really cant deny that, so basically this war accomplished a lot of good, lets leave it at that and stop bitching endlessly about the reasons we had to go to war

--------------------

HIGH NORTH SESSION 4

The Hot Sauce Champion of the World
 
To me it looked as if those guys were up to something dodgy, they clearly had some weapons, and if i were the guys in the chopper, i wouldn't want to risk being shot down. The way they were running around and acting so suspiciously kinda said they were up to something. At the end of the day, its war, and whether you agree with what went on in that video or not, it happens everyday, and that incident (if it was an incident) would be nothing compared to what some of the Iraqi rebels would do if they got hold of some U.S. troops.

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www.teamksm.co.uk
 
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