Re: the article The truth about this hell shitty industy and how w

Jibtech

Jibtech

Active member
Let me start by saying this,

I am very happy someone else wrote this aritcle for me. I've always been to lazy, and figured it would go unheard or no one would listen. I'm glad there are kids out there who realize this shit.

Before I get into anything else I have to point out one mistake, but only because this one mistake is a prime reason athletes in this industry get treated like shit.

By no means was/is the 1080 the best selling ski ever. infact it couldn't be further from the truth. I think what you ment was, it is the best selling twin tip of all ever. I don't know the truth of that statment either, but it is reasonable none the less.

Now that being said-

Support those who really support skiing. Every one stop, go back and read that sentance a few more times till its permantly planted in your head. Now that you know this, make it your wepon.

You worked a summer of of crapy minumum wage labor. the only reason you'd work in taco bell, or some other crap job is to save money and get a pair of twin tips. Finaly the day has come, you go to the store and buy some 1080's (doesn't have to be salomon, insert, Rossignol, Dynastar, etc.)

boom good bye money, hello twin tips. Meanwhile back in france some fat french salomon executive is laughing at you. Don't think that Salomon is the only company treating their riders like shit. Most of the big names out there aren't making nearly as much money as you think.

Twin tip skis make up a TINY and I mean TINY TINY TINY portion of big ski manufacturers total sales. There were less than 5,000 twin tips sold in the US TOTAL between all the manufacturers! Most big ski manufactures survive off of rental ski productions, rossignol makes over 10,000 pairs of rental skis alone every winter.

So why are they laughing? Because they take your 500 bucks and dump it back into rental ski development. Its like a little bonus for them, like finding quarters in a couch. Its simple economics, why the hell would they want to put money into somthing that is so little to them on paper? They make a couple hundred twin tips a year... so what? They aren't out on the snow, and they don't see the potential. They could care less.

So now you ask how do I make them understand? SUPORT THE COMPANIES WHO REALLY SUPPORT SKIING. Give it time, over the next few years there are bound to be rider centered companies poping up here and there, Snowboarding is a perfect example, All the ski manufactuers jumped on the wagon right off the bat and failed miserably because they brought their skiing industry bullshit to the snowboarders. A snowboarder in the early 90's wouldn't be caught dead on a ski manufactuer's snowboard. What did the snowboarders do instead? They said fuck you and did it the right way. They started their own companies. Once the ski corperations realized their mistakes, and how much of the action they were really missing out on, they were forced to re-structure, and re-gear. Now companies like Rossignol Snowboard and Salomon Snowboard stand some what independent from the skiing side of the companys, and are run the right way athlete-centric. Snowboarders are now thinking twice about riding on a ski manufactures snowboard. Give it a few more years and there will be plenty of skier owned and opperated companies to choose from, its just a matter of time.

Whether you want to belive it or not, Jason Levinthal is the Jake Burton of skiing. Everyone just hates on him and his company because they started out making ski-boards. At this point everyone should be kissing his ass, or at least giving him respect, because he truly cares about the sport of skiing and its direction. Siver Cartel, is another perfect example. Oakley has a fantastic team and cares about their athletes. There are other companies out there that do care about skiing, I just don't want to start naming them for fear of leaving someone else out. Like I said before: Give it time, the winds of change are blowing.

 
Good article... on a different scope, there are webistes out there with single poeople pouring hundreds of dollars a month into them without getting anything in return. They are also good examples of this. That's all I have to say about that. :)

Matt

 
thats the best damn response to an article i've ever seen....oh yeha mean, people think skiers are like regular athletes...making a mil a year, haha fuck no....the freestyle team of salomon doesnt' really do shit for their company economically....so thats why they barely get paid...the biggest prize money for a ski event is like 20k or something right....haha golf is like millions.....deperssing subject

 
well said dave . . .the truth does hurt

Joe: 'Red, do something with your life'

Red: 'I do. I smoke weed all the time. And I took a shower earlier. What am I? A fucking superhero? That's plenty.'
 
good respose harvey, I wonder who matt could be talking aobut.

'Hey this is kinda like Speed 2, but with a bus instead of a boat.' - milhouse
 
Good words dave. And a question to all, why do you kids dislike line... They are doing what no other company right now is doing, and thats listening to you. If its because you are not a fan of their skis, wel fine, but dont hate on them just cause of that. Karma my friends, karma

 
i love line...iv rode nothin but thier skis..but now im trying something different because thier just not what im lookin for in a ski. don't get me wrong..i love line..and they always will be the best company..period!

...................

Me need sig
 
this is the key reason why we have to stop being such dicks to new people in the sport. Always, when some new kid wants to get into it, and gets a pair of twins for christmas, he is discouraged by being called a poser. Opening up our sport to the masses, and attempting to get as many new people into it as possible is going to be what will allow us to have the money that we deserve.

Until every kid out there will not buy ANY other type of ski but a twin, we have no power.

Why can't we all just get along?
 
does that mean racers have no power? not every kid buys racing skis but it is still alot bigger than newschool.

'Im a rageoholic, Im addicted to rageohol!' -Homer
 
i think line is a great company....it's just right now they dont produce the quality that other companys can....due to only being involved in making skis for a short period of time, they still have some stuff to learn...give line a few years, and they'll be awesome...right now, i'm still not impressed

 
Ah... my key point I forgot to drive home, so instead of taking your money to some corporate monster, who couldn't give a shit, take it to a little guy who really cares, and they will re-invest it in OUR sport, by means of designing new and better gear, etc. I guess what it boils down to is: SUPPORT THE COMPANIES WHO SUPPORT OUR SPORT. Do I have to say it again or do you kids get it now?!?!?!

:)

 
I dont get you guys, you all talk about how you dont want your sport to be in the mainstream cause then we will have a bunch of posers who suck ass, and i agree. But then you complain about how the pros dont get paid shit, what do you expect!? The pros are just normal skiers like us who happen to be at the top of the sport, but i really dont think the rest of us are that far away from their ability, i guess what im saying is, give me three more years of skiing all day as long as i can and trying to improve and push myself, then i'll probably be able to throw down a bio 1260 (of course, by then cr will prolly be throwing 1620's) but whatever

I'm as close to god as you'll ever get....
 
well... I'm all for posers. more money for the sport. I think the people that are against posers are the same people as the ones that don't care about the situation that the companies have with the skiers.

So yeah. Support small companies that support skiing. if you're gonna buy a hat.. buy a jibculture hat or something. Instead of buying a shitty chick flick that you'll watch once, buy a ski movie.

MD... Dain bramaged.
 
there arn't too many people here who don't want skiing to go mainstreem - and those people are fools. or are skiing for ther wrong reasons. 'cause if you ski just 'cause it's fun to ski, why the hell should you care if it gets popular? and if you wanna make something out of the sport, you'd want more money if you get there.... and if you're just skiing 'cause it's not cool to the general public than... you're just wierd and i wouldn't trust you with my life.

Darryl Hunt

aka - highschool

representing the H.J.S. forever

'Can't we all just get along'? Doug Bishop (see what i did there? I quoted doug on his signature - it's madness, madness i say!!!
 
You all are totaly missing the point. If things don't change the sport will hit a recession. How long do you think a company like Line can work in the red before going under. Or even, *gasp* PoorBoyz who has yet to turn more then a few cents. If you aren't out there supporting this industry and people who will directly re-support OUR industry (yes it is your industry too, if you buy movies, goggles, skis, poles, clothing you are part of this industry web) there is no telling where our sport will end up.

So to say that line skis aren't as quality as salomon or rossi. No fuck you idiot, lets look at some numbers, Like 80-100 years of making skis to about 4. You cna't expect that same quality but I will tell you that I rode lines all season and thye dind't shit out on me. What about PBP? how many ofyou bootleg them from your friends instead of helping johny make a dollar so that he can make a living doing what we all enjoy watching.

THANK YOU DAVE for posting this because people aren't thinking about what they do and the affects that it has on the industry and the sport.

-Paul

 
I think you're preaching to the chior for the most part here, but good points nonetheless

Joe: 'Red, do something with your life'

Red: 'I do. I smoke weed all the time. And I took a shower earlier. What am I? A fucking superhero? That's plenty.'
 
nice. i love line skis. rossis and salomons de-lam all the time. good article

- - - - - - - - - - - - - -

'forget cheezy bread, lure into the darkside you will...

now the cinnabread is it where it at'

-me after my friend had the choice of cinna or chezzy bread
 
yea i think we should make a list of good companys and post them everywhere to put pressure on other companys to change, if we could post this list all over the web, no doubt companys would see it as well as most consumers, and we could boycott some of the other companys and force them to change. I am not an industry in sider or anything but from what I've read:

Good companys:

line

oakley

smith

orage

siver cartel

if everyone chipped in to this list we could get something going....

 
well the thing is a list is just that, 'Wow I read the list, good companies those are, can't wait till my new 1080's show up...' The fact of the matter is that people new to the sport won't most likely see that list before they buy there equipment. However if they see you at the hill wearing some sms pants, sporting the Line sticks and throwing down big? MAJOR INFLUANCE THERE. People are persuaded by what they see, in the magazines, on the hill, and what they here from there friends.

My final sugestion if you really want to help change things. Find a kid who's interested and coach him a little, teach him some grabs and get him going. Tell him what rad gear is for when he, or his parents, fork out cash for gear. Not only will it bring more people into the sport but support the right companies and people letting the sport grow. There are other ways to do that as well but that is one that will make a HUGE impact on one person who will in turn (hopefully) do the same for another and another. Rad cycle it would be. I've done it a little, will more next year.

-Paul

 
hmmmmmmmmmm, I'm quite interested as to why this thread stoped? Do you people just not like knowing what is really happening when you buy gear or when you are being your part of this industry? This is really concirning me the lack of replys and imput that you people have on this issue (since it is one of the BIGGEST in our sport). Just wondering why

-Paul

 
umm i bought 1080's last year...ok shoot me...yeah i tried lines and they werent for me. i tried next years shit i liked the rossi's but i have Siver cartel, and a orage jacket.

~Kevin
 
nice job dave. i can tell that you lived with iberg... you now share the same views as him...you are learning the ways of the shaolin.

and the wutang sword style well my son.

'what the fuck you mean is he fuckin dead? the nigga layin there wid all types of fuckin blood comin out his head'
 
i totally agree with all of this accept one thing...if i think a product is inferior, i'm not gonna buy it just to support a different company...if my salomon skis last me 5 years and my line skis last me 3...i'm gonna get the salomons...because i dont have the money to buy skis every 3 years...even every 5 is pushing it...i'm all for supporting the little guys, but i'm also gonna look out for myself. I'm obviously not gonna get sponsored, becuase there's more important things in my life right now that are keeping me from skiing more than 15 days a year...so if my skis break, or dont perform as good than i'm screwed. and i have one question....if the 1080s arent the top selling ski ever, what is?

 
there are tons of skis that have sold way better than 1080s . . . x screams for one have probably sold ten times as many . . . and rossi cut beginner rental skis, 1080s aren't even close

no signature
 
I totally agree with Pocket-Rocket.

Why would I spend my 500 dollars that I worked all summer in a taco bell on a pair of skis that will not perform as well or last as long as another pair of 500 dollar skis.

I completely agree with the fact that we have to suport the rider based companies, but you can't expect kids to buy an inferior product simply to help the progression of the sport...

As of right now, I would still buy a pair of 1080's because they are simply better than the smaller companies skis, and will last me longer.

 
the truth is lines are no longer much more inferior than other companies. they still are a little, but they mak that up with their warranties. they will replace skis much easier thean any other company because they understand grinding is normal and not purposely destroying your skis(just an exapmle.)

remember yesterday.live for today.plan for tommorrow.

-686 enterprises

 
if you are truly against skiing on lines because you think they arn't as good as the big bad 1080's than (for now) you're obviously going to buy the 1080's (which personally I don't think are the close to the best twin out there anyway - and i've seen about 4 or 5 pairs of the new 1080 out this year with mad delamination problems).... but that's still not stoping you from suporting Line or other company's... but a bunch of hoodies, hats, stickers, whatever - just buy a bunch of shit and you're be doing a small part.

Darryl Hunt

aka - highschool

representing the H.J.S. forever

'Can't we all just get along'? Doug Bishop (see what i did there? I quoted doug on his signature - it's madness, madness i say!!!
 
Well....Salomon sponsors me, gives me free skis, clothes, etc...So I'm not one to complain.

I've met Mike Douglas once or twice at a corporate thing and he's not that upset about not having a pro model or the fact that his contract is up next year. He, in my eyes, will always be the most inflential skier to date, and yes Salomon SHOULD keep him on and give him a pro model, but has anyone on this site asked Douglas himself weather or not he wants to stay on? How are any of us supposed to know weather or not he's going to retire after this year and just chill, ski for fun and such. The ski media will ALWAYS have on eye on him so its not like he's just going to up and disappear!

Sure, Salomon isn't the best company, and they may not treat thier riders the best, but thats what I'd expect from a company who's foundation lies racing and family ski vacations, not freeskiing. It's the same way with Rossignol, Dynastar(I'm speculating here). But please, don't pass judgement on a company because of how they treat one rider, who may or may not want to stay with that company.

Seth:'That's a weird looking rail, I'll give you a buck if you can slide it!'

Me:'Thats not a rail, thats a guys leg!'

Seth:'*pause*Okay, two dollars!'

 
About the poser ideas, who cares there will always be posers in everything, even if its tennis or something. Better to skier poser than snowboard posers anyway.

I think Line is an awesome company, who cares they make skiboards? All the major companies make them too. From now on I will be pouring all my money into newschool, skier run companies.

________________________

Andrew

'We're on a mission from God.'

-Jake and Elwood Blues
 
yea i just supported the cause by buying from fresh. yea! I think line makes up for their lower quality (which now probably isnt really even a factor) with rider relations, like i broke my dynastars grinding, so i went to the shop, and i couldnt get them repaired or new ones even though i had a 2 year warranty, then I phoned dynastar and wrote them an email, and still they wouldnt even cover the cost of repair, then I wrote them a formal buisness letter and didnt even get a reply, with line in a few days they will solve your problem. and about mike d, in propoganda listen to the words of the song in his segment (veteran-ignite) as someone pointed out, is that just a coincidence?

 
shit, this pulls so many parallels to skateboarding. first of all, do you think you're some hardcore motherfucker cause you don't want the popularity. Shit dude, look at it from the business standpoint: Companies with money invest in skiing which means growth. this can put line and such at a disadvantage so for now we should all buy line shit to help them grow into a healthy enough state to survive big companies coming in. Getting back to the original article, look at skate decks. id say like 80% of decks are pro models and they get royalty. Hey! need some summer reading? pick up Hawk: Professional Skateboarder (all of those same hardcore fucks, shut up and listen). it goes through A HUGE PART of the business involved w/ alt. sports. its a fun book too and if you think Tony is a sellout, PULL YOUR HEAD OUT OF YOUR STUPID CONCEITED ASSES, tony hawk is a legend and pioneer and a million 'selling outs' couldnt erase his legacy.

CO represent!!!

I have one thing to say: The whole world is turning lesbian.

'Two hundred years of American technology has unwittingly created a massive cement playground. It took the minds of twelve-year-olds to realize its potential.'

'For me it is just if its sounds good, I listen!' -ski_bum_
 
yeah, svhucker...but the xscreams have like 6 different models...and they've been around longer...so it's an unfair stat...i bet if you compared single season sales of each individule model...i bet the 1080 would be very near the top if not right at the top

 
dude, that article is interesting..it made me think...but i already forgot what i was thinking, something about companies sucking i guess...

but now that se7en has pointed that out, i got to thinking...again...but i remember...

there might be some dumb stuck up people working for companies, but there could also be some wicked nice people that can make the company good(or something)...i like almost every ski that i've skiid on, they've all been quality...

therealgomer...where can i find that book?...it seems interesting...

and i know it's skateboarding, but anyone who thinks hawk is a sellout is retarded, he was just a sick skater who represented his sponsors well, like birdhouse, i had never heard of birdhouse before tony hawk, cause he was being sick and i could see the logo and stuff...and it's wicked cool he started his own companies after he retired

damn, that was quite off topic for awhile...

-Mr. Jeff Kiesel

DO A FLIP
 
now ya know why I would aso like to get sponsored by line...

and that I would so like to get a pair of skogs 2003.............

President of the crazed posting brother of NS.com

I'm feeling greeaaaattt!!!!

 
Some more figures for everyone-

I did some research on things and it seems the sport IS growing: last season 01/02 there were less than 5,000 twin tips sold TOTAL. This year alone with the Rossi Scratch, a mid season release: they've already moved 10,000 pair. So basicly the 1080 aint got shit on anything.

Best selling ski of all time? Thats a tough call I don't think any of the skis since the shaped ski revoltion (I hate to say that but I couldn't think of anything else to describe it) have a chance as best selling ski of all time, the only one that might come close would be the Salomon X-Scream, but I'm just guessing, and I have no Idea. There have been plenty of popular skis out there back in the day, Rossi 4Sm, the olin Mark series, who knows there were a TON of skis made and sold back in the day.

 
I'd bet the best selling ski ever was the olin series... everones parents garage has at least a pair or 2 of those things.

I think im going to buy next years lines.

... but whatever the leaders of our sport are crack addicts so who knows whats gonna happen.'

-Schwags

THC (triple Hybrid Core)

is just soemthing tanner Hall made up

THC is 'conincidently' the name of the drug in Marijuana... And the designers of the skis 'conincindently' smoke so much weed
 
is line really gonna be charging $700 for their skis next year? that's what I've heard and boy you'd have to be a fool to pay that.

no signature
 
I agree with prins. A prime example of this is igneous. They made some of the best skiis out there. They guys on powdermag.com will easily pay out 900 dollars if a used pair surfaces. Igneous was true to the sport until they were sadly put out of business by giant corporate fuckers.

D

-Where are you going?

-Aspen

-ahh, California, Beautiful

(Dumb and Dumber)
 
My take on the whole industry thing...

Yes, companies like Rossignol, Dynastar, Salomon, etc, are not focused on newschool progression as much as a company like Line is, but then again as you guys said... You work all summer to afford this shit, you go for the best product. Whether that be Line, Rossignol, Dynastar. I say, buy what you want. Not all skis are created equal. While companies like Line are new, they are also looking for ways to progress the sport faster than the larger companies, case in point, the new Line multi-pivot binding. They're trying to revolutionize things, make it safer and make some coin. Good for them. I can assure you that if a company like Line was not around, the larger companies would not be progressing the technology or hardware as fast as they are, why you may ask, because they wouldn't have to...

As far as the 'dedicated ones', do you guys realize how this sport has evolved over the past 2 years, 3 years, 4 years? Look back. Each season your local resort is adding elements, making more snow, buying groomers, hiring full time park managers, park rangers, building rails, more competitions, etc. So, it's defanitly going somewhere. Look at the dedicated people that pour countless hours into this sport, Dave Levin with Jibtech Productions, Neil Satirokopolus (Neil Smith) with SASFilms, Matt Harvey with Newschoolers.com... These are the hardcore people that are progressing the sport, devoting counteless hours of time and not to mention MONEY to the cause. Seriously, this is all it how starts. Don't forget about yourself, just because you can't fuckin throw a d-spin or a 900, doesn't mean that you suck! As long as you're havin fun, doing your own thing and living the way you want to who is anyone to tell you what to do or how to have fun... Seriously. This is how the sport progresses, you don't have to be the best skier on the mountain, just as long as you're doin your own thing that's all that matters...

What a fuckin rant. I'm sure I will have more to say the more empty this bottle of Jack gets...

ozskier.com

'Skiing is not a hobby, it's a lifestyle.'
 
damn! The Dave can write good. You dave are you going with us to poison tom? Keg is already on ice. Hit me up today on my cell.

e-money

 
The $700 is partly true, next year Line skis are gonna be much higher quality, so they are gonna increase their prices to that of the other twins out there like the 1080,ect. In their brochure they have 3 prices high, mid(street), low. From what I understand most shops will be selling them at street price which is around $500 us, but some rip off stores will sell it for the higher $700 price. I am not completely sure on this i just got it from the lineski board.

 
all next yrs line prices are in the equip. section.

remember yesterday.live for today.plan for tommorrow.

-686 enterprises

 
Ozskier,

You did have some good points but if you re-read what people wrote you can see that we aren't saying you even need to buy skis from line or the other companies 'money' product. Getting a Hoodie or a hat for $50 or less will support these guys and really help out. It would be rediculious to want people to spend upwards of 500 on gear they didn't think would last very long (althought line has some of the best warenties.

I personaly do think of myself as a dedicated one so I will respond to whta you said on that as well. The sport has exploaded and this is by no means a way to stop that. Rather to encourage people to support the causes which will DIRECTLY re-support this revolution. I can think of countless people beond those you listed who have given more than most of us will ever know about. As for the idea of knowing the amaount of growth on the hill and competition level I have a very good grasp on it, I'm a terrain consultant for a few resorts around here and run a major event every year and have seen the growth and williness of the areas to go further and try more for me and the sport. Everyone should just have fnu on the hill and try to support those companies and people who push the sport.

-Paul

 
this is my point of view....just two companies i support...

i ski, i buy rossignol skis because i get them at 60 percent off...i buy all other products based on their relationship with skiers and having an effect on the sport...for instance:

dragon goggles - sponsored vinny dorion in 1998 at summer x games....one of first goggle companies to sponsor a 'real' newschool skier.

Sessions - the owners are super cool and give a lot of money to nonprofit organizations in the southern california area...they are involved with skateboarding and snowboarding as well....also is incorporated with sessions recording which doesn't exploit bands and keeps everything real..

my point is, buy products for other reasons than image and price..make the right choices because your money is what decides a pro skier's salary

Oh and another fuckin thing! i know most of you burn your cds which is ok once in a great while..but those bootleg all the time - get a fuckin job and stop buying dope....unless of course its pop music.

peace,

scott

SMS freeride session 2!
 
problem also doesn't go away by just having a thread on some forum on the net. (don't worry, i know what you mean, i'm just hastelin')

Darryl Hunt

aka - highschool

representing the H.J.S. forever

'I wish I was done with school!!!

I wanna start my life!! :))' Johan (the swede)
 
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