PEOPLE POST MORE ON IG > NS
- Thread starter X_ANKILLA
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X_ANKILLA
Active member
14294790:eheath said:
Can you really not understand how things grow Like Slime Molds. Your lack of Imagination and Big Picture Understanding is Pitiful for someone "SO REAL."
Imagine Instagram's audience is in the Center starting point. NS is one of the spots of Sugar placed around the Mold. THE MOLD ONLY GROWS TO A SPOT BECAUSE IT HAS A REASON TO.
TACO-DOG.exe
Active member
i agree with eheath, at the end of the day NS is a business. although a community orientated business it still needs money and interest to grow. with a parent company locking them down it's very hard to do that.
you can't really compare newschoolers to instagram because they're completely different platforms meant for different things. people go on social media sites because they want to see everything that's going on that might interest them. might include friends from high school, skiing, hockey, mtb, interior design or whatever the fuck you're into. you won't be able to find things like that from reliable sources here on newschoolers, but i could follow the official NHL insta page to see what kind of promos they have and find a discussion about it in the comments section.
comparing our forum section to reddit is also pretty silly. reddit has 1.6 billion people visiting every day with discussion and content on literally any topic that isn't hurtful to others. sure there's threads on NSG for some of the major news happening in the world but it still doesn't compare. keep in mind that freestyle skiing is still a very niche market and the general public didn't know it existed until it was introduced into the olympics.
until as many people who own a car take interest in sliding a handrail and spinning around a bunch of times on skis then i don't really see this site making big moves in the future. don't get me wrong, i live for skiing and the culture and i pretty much grew up on this site but it's just the direction the world is moving to.
you can't really compare newschoolers to instagram because they're completely different platforms meant for different things. people go on social media sites because they want to see everything that's going on that might interest them. might include friends from high school, skiing, hockey, mtb, interior design or whatever the fuck you're into. you won't be able to find things like that from reliable sources here on newschoolers, but i could follow the official NHL insta page to see what kind of promos they have and find a discussion about it in the comments section.
comparing our forum section to reddit is also pretty silly. reddit has 1.6 billion people visiting every day with discussion and content on literally any topic that isn't hurtful to others. sure there's threads on NSG for some of the major news happening in the world but it still doesn't compare. keep in mind that freestyle skiing is still a very niche market and the general public didn't know it existed until it was introduced into the olympics.
until as many people who own a car take interest in sliding a handrail and spinning around a bunch of times on skis then i don't really see this site making big moves in the future. don't get me wrong, i live for skiing and the culture and i pretty much grew up on this site but it's just the direction the world is moving to.
Christian_Bale
Active member
14294758:eheath said:
It's true that idk how NS operates, but is the forum really gonna die though? I'm not aware of a better way to have online discussions about skiing with random skiers all over the world. Where else would these discussions take place?
MiIfHunter
Active member
Two tricks and a tranny
daytactic7
Member
It wouldn’t really work that well because the main point of instituting those features on Instagram is just to collect more data on the user. That’s not what NS is about, and it’s a good thing that NS doesn’t have those features. In terms of the video side of NS, I think adding “reels” would just ruin it. Nothing of value should be posted on Instagram because Instagram is just an algorithm, it would be a shame to see NS become filled with the same sort of BS, other than the BS it’s already filled with.
if you know what I’m sayin
if you know what I’m sayin
X_ANKILLA
Active member
14294909:skierwoman said:
Right dude, I was kinda surprised about that yesterday.
The funny part is I'm just droppin old footage and content. And people all of a sudden are like WHOOOOA, And I'm over here like....This is 3 years old and yall callin me NICE WIT IT NOW? it's 2021. It took 3 years to get shit recognized. So therefore I have 3 years of content to Throw at NS.
14294773:r00kie said:
Bro evan heach has been on this site since you were swimming in your daddys nut. Man has executed plenty of great ideas
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First off, great thread, definitely a variety of important points and ideas in there. I wanted to reply before but wanted to do a proper job so here's probably my longest ever forum post.
The baseline is that NS has always been a tricky business, both from an income point of view and from a technological point of view. For how long we've been around (long before my time) both advertisers and owners have never really understood it. We've been bounced from owner to owner and had conflicting instructions in the process and that has meant excess budget for tech has been a rarity. So by and large we've always relied on everyone involved in the site, from coders to writers, working for significantly less than they'd earn elsewhere (or for nothing). It's not an excuse for not being better but what I'm saying is that I can guarantee that every red, green, purple name on here is contributing to this place because they love it and skiing. We are so grateful to every one of them, and you guys who come here day in day out.
The tech behind NS is OLD and we've been round and round the idea of a reboot countless times. The forums are the most complicated aspect of that, because porting all the interlinking aspects of the site over to something new would be a HUGE cost. To us the interaction on here is too precious to consider losing, so for now, major work of that size doesn't seem very likely. There may be some tweaks we can make, but a total rebuild of the site is beyond us at this point.
And while I appreciate the idea of a more scrollable feed, I'm not sure it would be a great direction for NS either. We do need to grow the audience (more Jerries is spot-on) but while forum traffic isn't what it once was, NS is doing fairly well as non-gigantic megacorp social media websites go.
It is definitely an old-fashioned point of view but as you ( [tag=129479]@X_ANKILLA[/tag] ) rightly identified in your other thread, we'd prefer to see more edits and movies. I personally think it's unlikely that we could win the battle against Instagram for quick cuts even if we tried but we believe there are enough good quality longer form producers out there that we don't need to fight the battle in that way at all. Our premiere season last fall was definitely a vindication of that idea, we got a ton of traffic and a ton of visibility from having those movies on NS.
^ My, and I think more generally, OUR vision for NS is to try and grow towards producing more and better content. We don't really want to be a part of the move to dumb down and shorten content any more than we have to stay afloat. We can use our own 'gram for that. We do see traffic coming in from there too, though of course, we'd like more. Nor will we be replacing PBP/Level 1 by flying helis around for shots or sending crews to India or anything like that. But we are trying to shift our budget towards supporting more video projects, be they edits/movies, produce a higher quality of articles that tell the stories people want to read, and [tag=195966]@cydwhit[/tag] among others has done a great job of showing us that too can work. We want to be a place where producers want to put their content, rather than having it lost in the shitshow of 5 second attention spans that is social media. Watch this space for more on that, but we will be bringing brack premiere season in the fall.
There is quite clearly plenty more to do. And I'd love this thread to continue because we are definitely keeping an eye on it for ideas and things we could tweak within the cards we've been dealt. My dms are always open too. For my part, a couple of questions...
- What is it about moving towards 'gram/tiktok model that you think would be most beneficial? Is it the auto-playing video? Is it the shortness of the clips themselves? Or is it the upwards scroll?
(One big obstacle for me is that skiing looks like shit filmed vertically 99% of the time, and that is almost a requirement of the scroll style feature.)
- I don't think NS has much of a problem with IG directly, it's more YouTube (as a platform for 'proper' edits). Aside from paying more producers to create for NS, what would make you post your videos here rather than embedding from YT? As far as I can tell, the NS video player no longer has any of the bugs it used to, so it works smoothly and reliably.
- Do you think we should filter the video feed more? Show less content? Redesign the site to enable more viewing direct from the homepage? Autoplay all videos as you scroll (on mobile?) There might be some possible tweaks we can make, but what they should be is kind of dependent on what the people want... and part of the issue with that is you do generally reduce commenting/interaction with that kind of model. How many meaningful comments do you see on 'gram?
I think the issues with the ownership may have been overstated by Zorko and perhaps even myself above. There are definitely some major complications, but we do also have benefits from that situation. We also do get a budget that allows us to continue to run the site, tweak it, add, develop etc. But the stuff that is out of reach is the stuff that would require total bottom up re-designs, and which would probably require an investment that looked more like multiple years of revenue than a small increase in the dev budget. Unfortunately, a major change of how the site flows would probably constitute that.
We're looking at bringing this back in the fall. Ironically given the thread so far, that was an [tag=38820]@eheath[/tag] project, he made those clips.
No, the forums won't die. They may never go back to 10 years ago, but forum traffic is fairly steady and has been for a couple of years now. Every time something big in skiing goes down, there's a discussion here. I don't see that changing too much. How else would anyone know what size Vishnus to get?
The baseline is that NS has always been a tricky business, both from an income point of view and from a technological point of view. For how long we've been around (long before my time) both advertisers and owners have never really understood it. We've been bounced from owner to owner and had conflicting instructions in the process and that has meant excess budget for tech has been a rarity. So by and large we've always relied on everyone involved in the site, from coders to writers, working for significantly less than they'd earn elsewhere (or for nothing). It's not an excuse for not being better but what I'm saying is that I can guarantee that every red, green, purple name on here is contributing to this place because they love it and skiing. We are so grateful to every one of them, and you guys who come here day in day out.
The tech behind NS is OLD and we've been round and round the idea of a reboot countless times. The forums are the most complicated aspect of that, because porting all the interlinking aspects of the site over to something new would be a HUGE cost. To us the interaction on here is too precious to consider losing, so for now, major work of that size doesn't seem very likely. There may be some tweaks we can make, but a total rebuild of the site is beyond us at this point.
And while I appreciate the idea of a more scrollable feed, I'm not sure it would be a great direction for NS either. We do need to grow the audience (more Jerries is spot-on) but while forum traffic isn't what it once was, NS is doing fairly well as non-gigantic megacorp social media websites go.
It is definitely an old-fashioned point of view but as you ( [tag=129479]@X_ANKILLA[/tag] ) rightly identified in your other thread, we'd prefer to see more edits and movies. I personally think it's unlikely that we could win the battle against Instagram for quick cuts even if we tried but we believe there are enough good quality longer form producers out there that we don't need to fight the battle in that way at all. Our premiere season last fall was definitely a vindication of that idea, we got a ton of traffic and a ton of visibility from having those movies on NS.
14294733:asparagus said:
^ My, and I think more generally, OUR vision for NS is to try and grow towards producing more and better content. We don't really want to be a part of the move to dumb down and shorten content any more than we have to stay afloat. We can use our own 'gram for that. We do see traffic coming in from there too, though of course, we'd like more. Nor will we be replacing PBP/Level 1 by flying helis around for shots or sending crews to India or anything like that. But we are trying to shift our budget towards supporting more video projects, be they edits/movies, produce a higher quality of articles that tell the stories people want to read, and [tag=195966]@cydwhit[/tag] among others has done a great job of showing us that too can work. We want to be a place where producers want to put their content, rather than having it lost in the shitshow of 5 second attention spans that is social media. Watch this space for more on that, but we will be bringing brack premiere season in the fall.
There is quite clearly plenty more to do. And I'd love this thread to continue because we are definitely keeping an eye on it for ideas and things we could tweak within the cards we've been dealt. My dms are always open too. For my part, a couple of questions...
- What is it about moving towards 'gram/tiktok model that you think would be most beneficial? Is it the auto-playing video? Is it the shortness of the clips themselves? Or is it the upwards scroll?
(One big obstacle for me is that skiing looks like shit filmed vertically 99% of the time, and that is almost a requirement of the scroll style feature.)
- I don't think NS has much of a problem with IG directly, it's more YouTube (as a platform for 'proper' edits). Aside from paying more producers to create for NS, what would make you post your videos here rather than embedding from YT? As far as I can tell, the NS video player no longer has any of the bugs it used to, so it works smoothly and reliably.
- Do you think we should filter the video feed more? Show less content? Redesign the site to enable more viewing direct from the homepage? Autoplay all videos as you scroll (on mobile?) There might be some possible tweaks we can make, but what they should be is kind of dependent on what the people want... and part of the issue with that is you do generally reduce commenting/interaction with that kind of model. How many meaningful comments do you see on 'gram?
14294762:r00kie said:
14294778:BradFiAusNzCoCa said:
I think the issues with the ownership may have been overstated by Zorko and perhaps even myself above. There are definitely some major complications, but we do also have benefits from that situation. We also do get a budget that allows us to continue to run the site, tweak it, add, develop etc. But the stuff that is out of reach is the stuff that would require total bottom up re-designs, and which would probably require an investment that looked more like multiple years of revenue than a small increase in the dev budget. Unfortunately, a major change of how the site flows would probably constitute that.
14294762:r00kie said:
We're looking at bringing this back in the fall. Ironically given the thread so far, that was an [tag=38820]@eheath[/tag] project, he made those clips.
14294812:Christian_Bale said:
No, the forums won't die. They may never go back to 10 years ago, but forum traffic is fairly steady and has been for a couple of years now. Every time something big in skiing goes down, there's a discussion here. I don't see that changing too much. How else would anyone know what size Vishnus to get?
14295006:SFBv420.0 said:no one including myself becomes a ski bum because
"Money is everthing"
continue to jack the corporates dong for duckets and revel in your negativity and regrets
I never said it was everything, but its certainly holding NS back not have any money to do cool shit.
TOAST.
Active member
14294775:X_ANKILLA said:
Unless you have a massive phone, I believe you're doing yourself a disservice. Chromecast that shit to a TV.
Anyway thinking more about this I think my biggest issue with becoming more like IG/tiktok is the superficial bullshit in the comments and captions. "Tag a homie that would do this" then a million fire emojis in the comments. I see NS as much more of a community than that.
Maybe an easier way to send videos to your friends to get them to watch something sick on here would be a good idea as long as this wouldnt be tagging people in the comments.
14295031:TOAST. said:
And the reposting, of the same clips, from the same skiers, 100 times, on 100 different pages, to sell shitty t-shirts that are unrelated to skiing and do nothing to actually support the community.
Does skiing really need more of that? Is that really what people want? Why would NS want to put its extremely limited budget towards trying to copy Instagram to compete with Facebook, an industry titan, as a small niche ski forum? I thought you all thought the fagan brothers were cringe, yet you want to model the oldest website in skiing after that?
Would it not be better to put that limited budget towards supporting journalists, video creators, events, comps, and interviews? You know, the things that a very large portion of the website traffic comes to see?
NS doesn't sell you as a product like Instagram and facebook. They don't bombard you with ads for shitty Chinese products or mobile games. They don't use algorithms to force you into weird communities or remove your content because it has 15 seconds of a copyrighted song in it. The site is barely even moderated compared to the other apps and websites mentioned here. They aren't always trying to sell you some product or begging you to subscribe and follow.
It's just ski content and shit posting and that's the way it should be.
X_ANKILLA
Active member
14295027:Twig said:
Bruh super appreciate this Longer response. Gives a lot of insight that I didn't have when I made this. And i think you have solid points to why the IG model for NS wouldn't be the best. Because Quick shit definitely gets people's attention. But it's Superficial.
As a Producer of Content, man I'd looooooove anything that puts more eyes onto my Efforts as a Skier and as an Artist. Because I'm trying to Grow my Audience and get my name out there for Career opportunities. And the current system isn't Bad. I will say it'd be cool to see articles written on up and coming skiers though. Skiers that are still underground.
Also that auto play function of the main page is interesting. I'd be curious.
Also as a person who posts Art and Pics on here, that side bar of photos on the home page is genius. Love it.
doubleblackjack
Member
So un-core
twinkle_toes
Member
Instagram is literally a social media giant. Their parent company is Facebook no? The reason their platform is so successful is because they literally hired a team of behavior analysts/ psycologists to keep people glued to their screens for as long as possible. Its a different business model and its kinda fucked up haha
That reason is exactly why I deleted the social media apps, and kept the newschoolers app. Instagram isnt really a fair comparison and the platform gives me a headache lol
i love the NS forums the most because none of my friends actually like talking about skiing lol. And if i feel like watching edits i’ll sit down and watch em on my laptop. I don’t really miss the overstimulation of watching vids on instagram tbh
That reason is exactly why I deleted the social media apps, and kept the newschoolers app. Instagram isnt really a fair comparison and the platform gives me a headache lol
i love the NS forums the most because none of my friends actually like talking about skiing lol. And if i feel like watching edits i’ll sit down and watch em on my laptop. I don’t really miss the overstimulation of watching vids on instagram tbh
asparagus
Active member
I don't know if this would work but something that could eventually lead to a change is if we stopped posting ski clips on social media and instead used it to advertise our newschoolers edits. If lots of mediocre skiers such as the average newschoolers member stopped posting ski vids on instagram, eventually some more skilled skiers might take notice and start doing the same. If AMs noticed this and started putting out more ski content on newschoolers then eventually some pros might do the same. It would be pretty unlikely to happen, but it isn't that hard to start (basically post a few clips from your edit on instagram and leave a link to the edit)
TLDR imagine what would happen if a bunch of the skiers you follow (whether they're good or bad) started referring you to newschoolers edits via their instagram. Lots of people watching ski vids on instagram would probably start flocking newschoolers.
TLDR imagine what would happen if a bunch of the skiers you follow (whether they're good or bad) started referring you to newschoolers edits via their instagram. Lots of people watching ski vids on instagram would probably start flocking newschoolers.
twinkle_toes
Member
14295137:asparagus said:
Most of the friends I have on Instagram aren't passionate enough about the sport to watch a full edit I'm assuming. The short 5 second instagram clips cater to people who just want quick entertainment I guess.
A lot of my other skier friends are like 26+ and all talk about how Newschoolers is dead and pretty much haven't logged on for years lol. Idk why
What brought me to newschoolers and kept me here was literally just my passion for park skiing and finding a likeminded community. I also feel like a lot of kids gravitate towards snowboarding nowadays when they want to pick up a mountain sport. I feel like if more people were hardcore into park skiing it would help grow the NS community idk
I'll do my part by buying newschoolers stickers and slapping them on the back of my car how's that lol
X_ANKILLA
Active member
14295142:twinkle_toes said:
Honestly, What if [tag=123327]@Newschoolers[/tag] did a Giant Sticker campaign, Bruh like for real though. Some how created a Contest for Best Stickering. Some Dope Prize, but just to get a shit ton of park skiers to Sticker TF outta their resorts and Best/ Funniest Sticker Slap Wins. haha that'd be Funny. Every Resort Nation Wide, Every chair lift. Covered with NS Die Cuts.
BradFiAusNzCoCa
Active member
Interestingly, I found out that NS stickers were back in stock because of the insta and I bought them through the insta store lol
I didn’t see any news on it on NS so I probably wouldn’t have known otherwise. Maybe I missed an announcement somewhere
I didn’t see any news on it on NS so I probably wouldn’t have known otherwise. Maybe I missed an announcement somewhere
14295143:X_ANKILLA said:
TACO-DOG.exe
Active member
14295027:Twig said:
a feature i'd be stoked to see is a video section filter for the early season / mid season / spring and summer edits. and maybe for year too. there's been hundreds of legendary edits dropped on ns which is a pig part of why i keep coming back. and to go back to see all the top rated member videos from spring 2009 would be an insane trip down memory lane.
TACO-DOG.exe
Active member
14295281:.Dad said:
woops i feel like a dummy. there's already a filter for year lol
JoshWong
Active member
I've been thinking for years that NS needs to do some kind of subscription based platform. I think it's the only way for longer projects to receive any kind of funding for riders. There's a lack of money for riders and projects. Simply because they don't have the value they used to have for companies. It isn't good business to sink big money into those things anymore sadly.
I think viewer based subscription content is one of the only solutions; think onlyfans, patreon, or even the largest scale-Netflix type ideas.
I think viewer based subscription content is one of the only solutions; think onlyfans, patreon, or even the largest scale-Netflix type ideas.
twinkle_toes
Member
14296845:JoshWong said:
Then all the 10 year old kids with no jobs will complain about how they can’t pay for a membership and NS will lose half it’s users
Christian_Bale
Active member
14296857:twinkle_toes said:
I agree. I think having everything free = more inclusive. Introducing more cost barriers might make it harder to grow the community