Official Olympic Discussion: Men's Slopestyle

I was going to type and bunch of things. For skiing fans and the athletes competing, this contest might have been the most inconsistent, poorly judged event ever, which sucks.

That said, I think to the casual Olympic viewer, this was a bigger and more technical event than the snowboarding slope contest. These guys threw down and I think there are going to be a TON of people that are going to be blown away that skiers can do stuff like this, which is a win for us.
 
13893885:Andbrer said:
You look at the judges, who the fuck are they? why have they got absolute nobodies judging this? Putting out ridiculous shit scores so fucking awful wowwwwww
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Steel Spence is not nobody, he has been around a long time
 
You know I'm salty because it's probably been over a year since I've posted on NS. That judging was absurd. Hopefully pipe is more consistent.
 
Here's the side-by-side with some light commentary for Nick, Oysten, ABM and Woody's runs (may have gotten some of the tricks wrong so please edit as you wish)

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13894041:YearsLiking said:
Here's the side-by-side with some light commentary for Nick, Oysten, ABM and Woody's runs (may have gotten some of the tricks wrong so please edit as you wish)

View attachment 894490
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Ugh embedding active images don't show up well...you can zoom in. maybe ill throw it into a google docs and people can edit their feedback.
 
13894040:*TURBONERD* said:
You know I'm salty because it's probably been over a year since I've posted on NS. That judging was absurd. Hopefully pipe is more consistent.
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Sam exact situation here, it's been about a year. I didn't watch the event but watching Oysteins and Goeppers runs, Geopper got robbed. Oystein was not clean at all either in the air or on his landings where as Goepper nailed his jumps. Plus 2 superfeds wins out over a couple of pretzels? What? I was going to watch the full recap tomorrow when it's posted but now I'm not sure I should bother.

It's a shame too because the course is amazing, Red's run in snowboarding was super creative. Based off those two runs it looks like the judges weren't rewarding the creativity that the course lends itself to.
 
A more general question:

Why are ski and snowboarding slopestyle judged differently?

Ski judging is based on AFP's overall scoring but in snowboarding they use WST's criteria that splits judging into sections and overall that each contribute to the score. These are essentially same sports after all. Shouldn't judging be harmonized?
 
By giving Oystein that 95 on the first run it completely ruined the competition. Should’ve given him a 92-93 let him slip into 2nd or 3rd then see if he can kill it on his last run and come back. To be honest I do think he still would’ve won because he was on fire and would’ve upped the ante to win it on the 3rd run. But it was painful to watch after Woodsy laced up two triples and got a 91. For someone to score a 95 in the first run the run has to be PERFECT. I pray halfpipe scoring isn’t this inconsistent and we don’t see an athlete score a 95 for a run that would score a 91 in X-Games.

**This post was edited on Feb 18th 2018 at 5:40:19am

**This post was edited on Feb 18th 2018 at 6:06:58pm
 
Im pissed over woodsy. Fucks sake being 4th 6 times at x games and now this...being 4th with a run that should get him at least silver.
 
I would like to see it be based on a total score using the best two runs, tossing out the worst of the three scores. It would allow them to make a small mistake without having to throw the whole run away and balance the scores for the rest when a rider getting a 95 on their first run.
 
Y know what would be cool? If the judges could change the scoring at the end of the while run, so it's more fair and even, because let's say a guy does an amazingly progressive run, and I'd insane, judges give him a 99, if a guy does the exact same run, just does an extra spin off a rail, they're forced to give him a 100, which should be absolutely perfect
 
Teal should have won, he had the most flow on the rail section, with both 450's on, the sw 360 on 180 off, and that dub flatspin 1080 on the first jump was the hardest trick to stomp out of the whole comp. I really wish that sw up and kfed combos would stop getting points, shit hurts my eyes, they so ugly and uninspiring. Overall impression sucks, worst way to accurately judge a contest in my opinion.
 
Judges fucked it early, blew their beans on a 95 for a good run. 95 being pretty much a perfect score and a free medal.

Then by doing that basically said, you can only be 5 points better than this run no matter what you do. bunch of fucking morons.
 
if you rewatch the top 6 athletes, not a single run was perfect, each run was missing something, some of them had a slight erly off on the rail, or opened up on a jump or didnt land bolts or was just lacking some difficulty. the top 6 could have been interchanged in any way really, and someone still would have complained.

AFP judges and FIS judges all have the same criteria and these guys were the ones judging the world cups up to the olympics, they know their shit. and also don't get to re watch the runs over and over again

be stoked that this event even has the showcase it does
 
“You won’t see a score over 96”

Scores Øystein a 95 and won’t let anyone get past.

That not what we thought you meant! Travesty.
 
Oysteins first run should not have got a 95.00 - that judging was pathetic.

Apart from Steele spence and Phil Belanger who the f are these other nobody's who judged? Slovenia, seriously? Gtfo.

My take on it was that Evan's first run was underscored and should have podiumed 1st or 2nd, Woodsy also should have podiumed 2nd or 3rd - Goepper is painful to watch as always, he's basically the anti-poon of style in skiing and should have been given 4th or 5th or just a kick in the balls and shown the door. Oystein should have been a toss up for 3rd with ABM and Teal.
 
13894091:E.C. said:
if you rewatch the top 6 athletes, not a single run was perfect, each run was missing something, some of them had a slight erly off on the rail, or opened up on a jump or didnt land bolts or was just lacking some difficulty. the top 6 could have been interchanged in any way really, and someone still would have complained.

AFP judges and FIS judges all have the same criteria and these guys were the ones judging the world cups up to the olympics, they know their shit. and also don't get to re watch the runs over and over again

be stoked that this event even has the showcase it does
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No, im sorry.

Im with you, between nick, teal, evan, woodsy, abm and even ferdinand, it could have fallen any which way and everyone would have been happy.

And no ones run was perfect, youre right. But that included oysteins, he had tonnes of flaws and for a run with lets face it, less technical on rails and jumps, it would have to be executed flawlessly for a 95, and it absolutely was not.

In slvsh games where the judging is loose, yeah who cares. The games are for fun and theres not much at stake. These guys train for 4 years to do this 1 comp and to have it completely blown by judging incompetency is unacceptable. This is what the judges are paid to do, and they did a horrible job, and with so much at stake for these athletes.

theres a time and place for complaining, i always defend loose judging in slvsh because its more important to appreciate the content than nitpick at it when it has no impact, but the IOC is milking our sports popularity, in return they should be providing rock solid judging.

Can someone at NS please reach out to steele or ioc for a comment on what happened here?
 
It's one thing to have bad judging at the Dew Tour, or even X. It's another to have it at the Olympics. This is something that people actually watch.
 
The worst part about this is just the inconsistency of things. At times it felt like alot of the riders were judged on completely different terms.

Gus got a 90,8 in qual, barely even touching his tail on his 14 (he looked pretty damn shocked when he saw the score himself) Ferdinand gets his grab pretty damn well, and gets shit on by the judges with a 76,4.

It would definitely be alot easier to justify things like this if they could just keep this consistent through the contest.
 
For those of you who missed/ couldn't watch finals

[video]https://www.newschoolers.com/videos/watch/894508/Complete-Runs[/video]
 
13894052:SuckMySkis said:
Im pissed over woodsy. Fucks sake being 4th 6 times at x games and now this...being 4th with a run that should get him at least silver.
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He has missed a podium by ONE spot more consistently than any skier has gotten podiums(not entirely positive about this don’t quote me), so in my mind, he’s one of if not the best comp skier around right now. Also it’s crazy how he is so positive and hasn’t murdered someone yet lol
 
I haven’t posted here in like 5 years. That comp judging was the most infuriatingly stupid shit I’ve ever seen. Oyster Bratwurst shouldn’t have even been on the podium. #justiceforwoodsy
 
13894069:Lenzo said:
Oysteins flat drop trick was a nollie bio 7 safety
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Pretty sure it was a "sort of cork sort of Misty" according to the announcer lol. I was like, you mean a Bio? Like someone said in this thread, everything is just a cork now to everyone.
 
13894052:SuckMySkis said:
Im pissed over woodsy. Fucks sake being 4th 6 times at x games and now this...being 4th with a run that should get him at least silver.
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Same. His stuff is always super stylish, he manages at least one really clean run every time… yet somehow they always vote him out. And still he always stays chill and positive, congratulates the others, etc. Patience of a saint… cool guy.

13894138:Poikenz said:
For those of you who missed/ couldn't watch finals

[video]https://www.newschoolers.com/videos/watch/894508/Complete-Runs[/video]
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Thanks for that!
 
Woodsy should have been on podium. Throwing deep triples and someone said both left and right? i would have to re watch to be sure. A few bobbles shouldn’t over ride a run like that.

Also quali judging was a junk show. they should split it into two heats of 15 to help the judges keep their heads on straight. Olympics biggest deal and that judging was garbage. never seen X like that.
 
13894170:nkmo. said:
I haven’t posted here in like 5 years. That comp judging was the most infuriatingly stupid shit I’ve ever seen. Oyster Bratwurst shouldn’t have even been on the podium. #justiceforwoodsy
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Oyster bratwurst.
 
13893449:loganimlach said:
The inconsistency in judging right now is just fucking disgraceful. Jonas Hunziker’s run was busted as fuck
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Dude, right!?!

How did this dude qualify above someone like AHall? His skiing all day was trash. No fluidity at any point. How did he score above bellemare? Yikes.
 
13894255:BK said:
Woodsy should have been on podium. Throwing deep triples and someone said both left and right? i would have to re watch to be sure. A few bobbles shouldn’t over ride a run like that.

Also quali judging was a junk show. they should split it into two heats of 15 to help the judges keep their heads on straight. Olympics biggest deal and that judging was garbage. never seen X like that.
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I thought Woodsys run was sick but he came off 2 rails early and his other ones were more basic than Oystien's who definitely got overscored. He also did a 3 mute (classic but super simple) and looked like he might have gone down on the last triple. Sw trip octo is one of the best trips ever and he went to the gucci but everyone has seen him land it much cleaner.

From what i can tell Oystien got overscored on the run that he wanted to get to his feet and then potentially add on to and then everyone else got robbed in comparison. Aside from Steele Spence and Phil Belanger these judges look like complete randos. Maybe they took turns scoring runs individually?

No matter the scores, that was an insane slope course and everyone had at least a few hammers in there run
 
13894049:Film. said:
By giving Oystein that 95 on the first run it completely ruined the competition. Should’ve given him a 92-93 let him slip into 2nd or 3rd then see if he can kill it on his last run and come back. To be honest I do think he still would’ve won because he was on fire and would’ve upped the ante to win it on the 3rd run. But it was painful to watch after Woodsy laced up two triples and got a 91. For someone to score a 95 in the first run the run has to be PERFECT. I pray halfpipe scoring isn’t this inconsistent and we don’t see an athlete score a 95 for a run that would score a 91 in X-Games.
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this. even reading that head judges news article on here they said a 96 would be the highest score they would ever give out (which I agree and disagree but thats another topic). When that 95 dropped on a first run, it leaves no room for other scores. Ive judged contests before, its difficult, but you need to leave room for going up or down. Completly agree that at another contest thats a 91-92.
 
After watching all the runs together in that vid just posted, I feel I more clearly saw the different nuances between runs. I dont think that any aspect of the judging was so laughably outlandishly off except giving Oystein a 95 first run. Whoever had the final say on that should be fired. That early on with not even close to a perfect run almost ruined the whole comp. I remember sitting just being like, this is the most anticipated event in skiing, and its pretty much over within 15 minutes with a run that wouldve gotten an 85 at any World Cup/X

Having said that, I dont think Woodsy was that robbed. He would have had the best jumps probably in the field (maybe minus Ferdi), but he came up way too short on that last rail to be a podium run. Even though Im pissed Oystein got scored so high, he finished everything, while not the cleanest, and there were no hand drags/punches, which Woodsy definitely had one on his last trip with the octo.

It sucks Woodsy gets 4th so much, and it might be worth considering looking at all his runs, but I remember he never had one start to finish where he didn't come off early. The judging during qualies sucked and rewarded some for coming off early, but at least in finals, amongst the podium, there was nobody who came off obviously early or didn't finish a feature. ABM was real close on his switch 2 continuing 2, but I think objectively he completed more of the rail than Woodsy or Ferdi for hat manner. During a Slvsh game, if someone called a switch 2 continuing 2 on that feature, they would have probably had a few minutes looking at replays. I would say either Woodsy or Ferdi on that last feature would have been instantly a letter.

All said, if anyone was robbed, it might have been Teal. His run was clean as a bean, and his rail section was #1 no doubt. If he mixed in a switch dub 7 or one of his mind melting dub 9s, Im sure that added wow factor would have brought him into the podium.

Overall though, looking at all the runs, it was a sick comp. The diversity in runs was unlike any other comp. No two lines was the same, and it seems the only athlete that truly didnt mix up the line selection in anyway was Andri, and was penalized. They should have made the course perhaps a little less burly (rails were maybe too high off the ground), because it would have been good to see some more complete runs, not trashed by an early mistake. If the judging was good and there were some minor tweaks to the course to make it so not half the athletes were doing early-offs, it would have been the best slope contest ever hands down IMO.

But now let me tell you how I really feel......
 
It seems like if you come off a rail early they kill you for it. But if you do something crazy or risky on or off they don't care. Nobody slid either of the crazy rails because there'd be like no reward and they're probably really difficult.
 
I think the problem is a course is set. So first thing which is worrying is that the riders are slightly at the mercy of the slope designers. Then the weather/snow condition is set. Then you must drop. If you falter on any part of the course you are getting 40 points top. This is silly. There should have a "negative" mark down list, so if you do a small mistake on a rail you say lose 5 points, if you do a big mistake, like a fall, on rails, transistions, etc lose 12 points, fall on a jump 20 points taken off as a rough example. That way the measurement is how well you hit all the features not how perfect you are start to finish. Then as mentioned above, just take your top two runs (scrap the third) add the votes together and divide by two. So for example, Wester could get up and still show some brilliant skiing on the rest of the course without losing the entire run because of a mess up at the top.

But this does not happen because they base this voting methodolgy on the figure skating nonsense (where a similar row has been going on for decades) where there is some purist ideal of the perfect figure skater and anyone who falters a little must immedeately be dismissed as they are an insult to the pure Olympiad ideal of perfection. That is not a measure of sporting skill and prowess, that is a measure of idealism. A mix up voting system provides a fairer result of who lays down the best overall because we are trying to find out, in a form of words, who the best acrobat-free mover-skier is not who has a course that suits him, conditions that suits him and happens to do all the features with no slip ups.

**This post was edited on Feb 18th 2018 at 9:19:05pm
 
13894372:flashtrash said:
I think the problem is a course is set. So first thing which is worrying is that the riders are slightly at the mercy of the slope designers. Then the weather/snow condition is set. Then you must drop. If you falter on any part of the course you are getting 40 points top. This is silly. There should have a "negative" mark down list, so if you do a small mistake on a rail you say lose 5 points, if you do a big mistake, like a fall, on rails, transistions, etc lose 12 points, fall on a jump 20 points taken off as a rough example. That way the measurement is how well you hit all the features not how perfect you are start to finish. Then as mentioned above, just take your top two runs (scrap the third) add the votes together and divide by two. So for example, Wester could get up and still show some brilliant skiing on the rest of the course without losing the entire run because of a mess up at the top.

But this does not happen because they base this voting methodolgy on the figure skating nonsense (where a similar row has been going on for decades) where there is some purist ideal of the perfect figure skater and anyone who falters a little must immedeately be dismissed as they are an insult to the pure Olympiad ideal of perfection. That is not a measure of sporting skill and prowess, that is a measure of idealism. A mix up voting system provides a fairer result of who lays down the best overall because we are trying to find out, in a form of words, who the best acrobat-free mover-skier is not who has a course that suits him, conditions that suits him and happens to do all the features with no slip ups.

**This post was edited on Feb 18th 2018 at 9:19:05pm
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As much as i think the 2 runs thing would add more creativity, this is slopestyle it should be best run top to bottom. I think difficulty of trick should be taken more into account for bobbled landings but if you flat out fall or butt touch thats it.
 
I only watched finals, but honestly, leaving aside the actual way the points were dished out, I can't really say that the podium was totally wrong. Could you make a case for someone else getting a medal ahead of someone who got a medal? Yeah, probably a couple of guys could have been there. Can you make a case for changing the order? Yeah, I could see swapping Goepper and Oystein (which is hilarious because Goepper's bronze run I thought should easily have won in Sochi). Frankly, and I haven't seen this mentioned much, but if there's one guy I thought should have been on the podium who wasn't, it was McEachran. Once you take into account what usually gets scored in this sort of competition, that run was super clean.

But regardless, at the end of the day, I felt like the result was totally defensible. Maybe Goepper should've won, but it's not at all ridiculous to give it to Oystein. Maybe Woods should've medaled, but it's not at all ridiculous to say ABM's run deserved bronze. And if the result of a judged competition with this much variety and this much subjectivity to it ends with a defensible outcome, I don't care who shouldn't have got a 95 or how much it sucks that Woods ended up fourth again, you have to call that a win for the event.

13894075:VinniCash said:
Teal should have won, he had the most flow on the rail section, with both 450's on, the sw 360 on 180 off, and that dub flatspin 1080 on the first jump was the hardest trick to stomp out of the whole comp. I really wish that sw up and kfed combos would stop getting points, shit hurts my eyes, they so ugly and uninspiring. Overall impression sucks, worst way to accurately judge a contest in my opinion.
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This is fair, particularly with his first jump, but come on, you already know those types of "ahead of the curve, outside the box" runs wouldn't podium at an event like this. This is the Oscars - subversive arthouse films can't win. Doesn't matter how good your flow was. If you didn't end with a bang, you can't be on the podium.
 
13893599:morgan970 said:
can newschoolers interview the judges about their wack scores lol
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THAT WOULD BE SO SICK. we need the public to question the judges to see some imporovement. But with all due respect, it would have been insane to judge that contest.
 
13894445:~Turquoise said:
THAT WOULD BE SO SICK. we need the public to question the judges to see some imporovement. But with all due respect, it would have been insane to judge that contest.
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How are you not an Orange name?

Big up on the Olympics, ya crushed it
 
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