Official 2015 Canadian general Election

13507422:VinnieF said:
3 weeks to go. All 3 main parties have been statistically tied for the past 3 or so weeks. Looking to be a minority no matter what the outcome.

One point that really irked my recently:

Conservatives supposedly going to open up the dairy market in Canada. This I just plain out morally oppose, especially in our day and age. Right now we have a quota system for dairy that means small scale farmers (those with as few as 50-60 head of cattle) can actually make a living off their farms. Opening up the dairy market will undermine the quota system by then having cheaper dairy from massive factory farm operations from other countries available on our shelves. This could easily mean the end of small dairy farms. This hits home for me since in my area of eastern Ontario it's almost entirely small family run dairy farms which only exist because of the quota system.

Other issues include

-less eco-friendly dairy products. Right now I go to the grocery store for milk and it comes from farms within about 100km of the city. With an open dairy market the cheapest dairy products could easily be coming from as far away as New Zealand.

-reduced quality. Canada has probably the best quality dairy in the world. factory scale farms will be the only fiscally stable option and quality will suffer, along with all the other issues related to factory farm milk production and long distance shipping

On the other hand, you may save 50 cents when you purchase a gallon of milk.
Click to expand...

Forgive me if I'm missing something here, but does opening up the dairy market also mean there are going to be changes in food quality standards?
 
13507452:saskskier said:
Forgive me if I'm missing something here, but does opening up the dairy market also mean there are going to be changes in food quality standards?
Click to expand...

It's hard to say. The way it is now quality control is done at almost every step of the way.

-the farms themselves have specific standards they need to meet in Canada that may not need to be met in other countries producing milk that, although may not deteriorate the health quality, could easily deteriorate taste or other culinary qualities.

-the milk coming directly from farms is inspected before transportation and mixing with milk of other farms. does that happen in other countries? One uninspected farm may deteriorate the overall quality of a region every so slightly when mixed in with other farms, but will it deteriorate the quality enough for it to not pass the minimum grade?

I doubt this info is easily available, but let's put it in numbers (these don't actually mean anything) so it's easy to visualize what I'm saying:

say the passing grade for milk is 70%. If you grab the average milk from a shelf in the grocery store perhaps right now it scores 90%. So the milk we're drinking is quite a bit higher than the minimum standard. maybe then the milk that we start importing only scores 75%. It passes and can be sold, but still scores 1/4 less than what we're already consuming.

Also just think about it: if I'm buying milk from the store that yesterday was shipped from the Sealtest plant a few km away that a few days earlier was shipped from the surrounding farms within a 50km radius, would you not expect the quality to be higher than that of milk that went from farm to processing plant to shipping facility to being shipped to another shipping facility then finally to the store?
 
but for me quality isn't the main issue. The disappearance of smallscale family farms and the loss of many thousands of jobs across the country and in my community along with the principle of affordable local food products being accessible to all is what gets me.

Of course we don't know exactly how much of the market will be opened yet. I've heard the number 15%, which apparently will be more than enough to totally change the dynamics of dairy production in the country and will almost certainly result in the end of the quota system.
 
13507452:saskskier said:
Forgive me if I'm missing something here, but does opening up the dairy market also mean there are going to be changes in food quality standards?
Click to expand...

So from people I've talked to (haven't read any sources though):

hormone and antibiotic use in dairy cattle is incredibly strict here with practically no tolerance (except to treat animals that are sick, in which case they're milk will not be used)

hormone and antibiotic use in dairy is not highly regulated in the US and their milk is of lower quality as a result (certain antibiotics easily carry into the milk)

Since there are strict regulations at production level, there are not strict regulations at sales level on hormones and antibiotics in dairy products.

As the regulations stand now dairy products produced and packaged in the US and sold in Canada will not have to meet any restrictions on levels of hormones and antibiotics.

The large factory farms are the farms where hormone and antibiotic use is greatest and the large factory farms will be the only place US dairy will come from in Canada otherwise it won't be economical.

So yes. The quality of dairy products will absolutely take a dive.
 
13508990:VinnieF said:
So from people I've talked to (haven't read any sources though):

hormone and antibiotic use in dairy cattle is incredibly strict here with practically no tolerance (except to treat animals that are sick, in which case they're milk will not be used)

hormone and antibiotic use in dairy is not highly regulated in the US and their milk is of lower quality as a result (certain antibiotics easily carry into the milk)

Since there are strict regulations at production level, there are not strict regulations at sales level on hormones and antibiotics in dairy products.

As the regulations stand now dairy products produced and packaged in the US and sold in Canada will not have to meet any restrictions on levels of hormones and antibiotics.

The large factory farms are the farms where hormone and antibiotic use is greatest and the large factory farms will be the only place US dairy will come from in Canada otherwise it won't be economical.

So yes. The quality of dairy products will absolutely take a dive.
Click to expand...

A) The US was pushing to open up 9-10% of the market. Is that enough to drastically change the product quality Canadian consumers get? If it's a crappy product, don't buy it? I get it would be tough for producers, but not sure about a drastic change in quality (although I admit I'm no expert on the dairy market)

B) At this point, it's not happening:
http://www.producer.com/2015/09/far...anada-set-to-welcome-more-u-s-dairy-products/
http://www.thestar.com/news/canada/...-it-will-open-dairy-market-to-us-farmers.html
 
13509096:saskskier said:
A) The US was pushing to open up 9-10% of the market. Is that enough to drastically change the product quality Canadian consumers get? If it's a crappy product, don't buy it? I get it would be tough for producers, but not sure about a drastic change in quality (although I admit I'm no expert on the dairy market)

B) At this point, it's not happening:
http://www.producer.com/2015/09/far...anada-set-to-welcome-more-u-s-dairy-products/
http://www.thestar.com/news/canada/...-it-will-open-dairy-market-to-us-farmers.html
Click to expand...

maybe you or I wouldn't change the milk we buy, but what about all the milk products made in canada? would the producers not want to start using the cheaper options to make more money?
 
Honestly the amount of bullshit being thrown around just drives me nuts. I can't wait for this election to be over. I honestly want to punch Harper in the face for calling the election so early and making us slog through this shit.

That being said I think they are all idiots. Basically just having to pick the lesser of all the evils which in my case I think will be the NDP.

I think the conservative's use of fear tactics is just disgraceful, and I can overlook all the corruption in that party. (Senate scandal, KPMG tax fraud, F-35 issues). Honestly it's just time to move on.

As much as I like Trudeau....the party he represents is just rotting away. Same old liberals....same old shit. Some of the policies are new to try and make the party seem progressive but in you look at who he wants to put into his cabinet it's the same song and dance. I will say that the cons need to shut the fuck up about his experience. Hell....he has been in Ottawa longer then most of Harpers bum buddies.

I think the NDP just have the most common sense of all the three parties. I honestly am not super fond of Muclair but the platform and the party seem solid and not crazy.
 
lol Harper

"Tobacco is a product that does a lot of damage. Marijuana is infinitely worse"

how many deaths a year due to tobacco? how many deaths a year due to cannabis? tell me again which is worse
 
13511767:VinnieF said:
lol Harper

"Tobacco is a product that does a lot of damage. Marijuana is infinitely worse"

how many deaths a year due to tobacco? how many deaths a year due to cannabis? tell me again which is worse
Click to expand...

Marajauna. If we as a society have to live with people dying earlier because of their own decision to smoke tobacco, when they've already paid the tax on their cigarettes to cover the health care costs, then that's fine.

But if we have to live with the long term effects of dulled senses and lowered productivity for people who smoke weed then that isn't something we can quantify or tax, and the Canadian economy will ultimately take the hit.
 
13512096:dbchili said:
Marajauna. If we as a society have to live with people dying earlier because of their own decision to smoke tobacco, when they've already paid the tax on their cigarettes to cover the health care costs, then that's fine.

But if we have to live with the long term effects of dulled senses and lowered productivity for people who smoke weed then that isn't something we can quantify or tax, and the Canadian economy will ultimately take the hit.
Click to expand...

hold up. who said businesses would allow smoking weed/being high at work? Alcohol is legal but I can't think of many jobs where you won't get fired being drunk at work. So no, the economy will not take a hit.

Also how many work hours are lost each year due to smoke breaks? If a person takes 4 smoke breaks a day at 5 minutes each then that's 86 hours a year or about 1800 dollars lost by the employer at an average wage.

somewhere around 17% of Canadians smoke, 18 million people in the Canadian workforce, so about 3 million smokers.

5.4 BILLION dollars lost to smoke breaks alone if smokers take on average four 5 minutes breaks.

I suppose many jobs don't allow smoke breaks, but how much productivity is lost by those sitting at their desk craving a cigarette?

Points being:

1- Legalizing weed =/= allowing people to be high at work. Alcohol is a good example to look at.

2- If you're worried about lost productivity then you should really look at cigarettes and push for them to be illegal.
 
What got me this morning

Harper: "we will not sell out our Canadian values for money"

has sold out our values for money multiple times through multiple dealings with the Saudis
 
Just received my mail in ballot for to vote out of riding. Pretty excited that I'm able to vote while living two provinces away from home.
 
5 days left. Liberals starting to shoot up in the polls. Conservatives starting to put out desperate and pitiful attack ads (the one saying a Liberal government will mean kids will start smoking pot and we'll all have brothels in our backyards is just plain sad). NDP are floundering.
 
conservatives clearly arent working out. so liberal is the vote this year. but most likely who ever wins it will be a minority government.
 
I didn't think ads could get any more pitiful. then this happened today on Postmedia newspaper covers (like the Vancouver Sun, Ottawa Citizen, National Post, etc)

CRhi8vMUAAQoiwH.jpg
 
13524783:VinnieF said:
I didn't think ads could get any more pitiful. then this happened today on Postmedia newspaper covers (like the Vancouver Sun, Ottawa Citizen, National Post, etc)

CRhi8vMUAAQoiwH.jpg
Click to expand...

fuckkkkkk that shit.

go vote everyone.
 
13525109:saskskier said:
Liberals win a majority. Will definitely be interesting to see what happens and how much things will change.
Click to expand...

just the projection but looking very good for the liberals!

Nice hair though Steve.
 
Aha phew, it's looking to be a majority even! Was expecting a Liberal minority with closer seats between the Conservatives and NDP. Glad to see change though, the discussion on CBC is already looking promising. Good words and perspective from Bill Blair just now.
 
Wasn't expecting a majority, but pleased enough I supposed.

Canadians went straight for their comfort zone this election. There's a reason the Liberals are called Canada's natural ruling party and were in power for 70% of the last century.

Now let's see how many promises they follow through on. They have no excuses not to with a majority (barring the Senate being a stick in their spokes)
 
13525242:VinnieF said:
Wasn't expecting a majority, but pleased enough I supposed.

Canadians went straight for their comfort zone this election. There's a reason the Liberals are called Canada's natural ruling party and were in power for 70% of the last century.

Now let's see how many promises they follow through on. They have no excuses not to with a majority (barring the Senate being a stick in their spokes)
Click to expand...

Honestly, I'm wouldn't be surprised if tons of people voted Liberal because they didn't want Harper, not because they are comfortable with Trudeau and the Liberals.
 
13525250:saskskier said:
Honestly, I'm wouldn't be surprised if tons of people voted Liberal because they didn't want Harper, not because they are comfortable with Trudeau and the Liberals.
Click to expand...

That's what won them the majority for sure. Just a shit ton of people really not wanting Harper who decided to vote Liberal over NDP because they had the better chance of winning.

Still, not pleased that they can win a majority with less than 40% of the vote. Not pleased at all. Should be a minority.
 
13525257:VinnieF said:
That's what won them the majority for sure. Just a shit ton of people really not wanting Harper who decided to vote Liberal over NDP because they had the better chance of winning.

Still, not pleased that they can win a majority with less than 40% of the vote. Not pleased at all. Should be a minority.
Click to expand...

Well if the liberals follow through (ha), this should be the last first past the post election.
 
Welp..... Not too sure how Trudeau is going to be able to make the next 4 years as good as the last 10, but here's to hope
 
Now Harper can finally take his place in history as one of the worst Prime Ministers for Canada. I guess he'll be remembered how someone like Thatcher is remembered. Mostly with hate and disgust, but loved by the very few who were his core following.

Vincent's updated list of Prime Minister who were the best for this country:

Laurier

Mackenzie King

MacDonald

Pearson

St Laurent

Trudeau

Borden

Cretien

Diefenbaker

Bennett

.

.

.

21. Harper

22. Turner

23. Campbell
 
13525394:VinnieF said:
Trudeau
Click to expand...

Blows my mind that a Prime Minister can completely fuck over half the country and still be considered good

Here's to hoping his son has a little more empathy
 
13525416:erikK said:
Blows my mind that a Prime Minister can completely fuck over half the country and still be considered good

Here's to hoping his son has a little more empathy
Click to expand...

I don't have high hopes that he'll be much better for Western Canada. I mean at the very least, Harper was from Alberta and we've got an NDP gov't right now. There was next to no love for him here in the election yesterday. Back to the good ol' days of Ontario/Quebec being the only parts of Canada that matter to the feds.

Prove me wrong JT.
 
13525424:saskskier said:
I don't have high hopes that he'll be much better for Western Canada. I mean at the very least, Harper was from Alberta and we've got an NDP gov't right now. There was next to no love for him here in the election yesterday. Back to the good ol' days of Ontario/Quebec being the only parts of Canada that matter to the feds.

Prove me wrong JT.
Click to expand...

No doubt, I hope he does prove me wrong.
 
13525702:PoLaRpEaK said:
A part of me likes massive economic and social experiments.
Click to expand...

You do realize the party that was just elected is pretty much the same party that's been in power for something like 2/3rds of Canada's history, right?

This isn't some crazy new party with crazy ideas, this is the same old Liberal party that Canada always elects with very similar policies and ideologies to every other Liberal government.

There really is no experimentation going on here. It's the party that's had the single largest hand in shaping Canada into what it is today.
 
13525424:saskskier said:
I don't have high hopes that he'll be much better for Western Canada. I mean at the very least, Harper was from Alberta and we've got an NDP gov't right now. There was next to no love for him here in the election yesterday. Back to the good ol' days of Ontario/Quebec being the only parts of Canada that matter to the feds.

Prove me wrong JT.
Click to expand...

Trudeau went to school in Vancouver and lived in Whistler teaching snowboarding for a number of years. He's got some roots in western Canada. Here's hoping he puts those to good use.
 
Why does western canada always have to act like the rest of canada is out to get them? I've lived in Alberta and BC my whole life and that perception drives me nuts.

Trudeau and the libs aren't stupid, they aren't going to take away your precious tar sands or your fugly white pickup truck. They know the tarsands is a precious resource going into the future. But they also know that it can't go as unregulated as it has for too much longer. It's time respect was given not only to the oil companies, but to the thousands of hectares of destroyed forests, the polluted local waters, and the First Nations peoples in the area. It's about balance, and balance is why the Libs always come back to power.

Trudeau is the perfect face on a strong liberal party right now, and I have high hopes.

Save the CBC, save Parks Canada, save the libraries, save Canada post.
 
13526633:will_powder said:
Why does western canada always have to act like the rest of canada is out to get them? I've lived in Alberta and BC my whole life and that perception drives me nuts.

Trudeau and the libs aren't stupid, they aren't going to take away your precious tar sands or your fugly white pickup truck. They know the tarsands is a precious resource going into the future. But they also know that it can't go as unregulated as it has for too much longer. It's time respect was given not only to the oil companies, but to the thousands of hectares of destroyed forests, the polluted local waters, and the First Nations peoples in the area. It's about balance, and balance is why the Libs always come back to power.

Trudeau is the perfect face on a strong liberal party right now, and I have high hopes.

Save the CBC, save Parks Canada, save the libraries, save Canada post.
Click to expand...

Why do we need door to door mail service? Make exceptions for people who are elderly or disabled and unable to walk a block to the box, but otherwise I don't see any need for it.
 
I'm pretty happy even if I didn't vote Liberal. Getting Harper out was the number 1 priority. I don't agree with all of his party's policies but Trudeau strikes me as a really genuine guy who has the best interest of all Canadians in mind; he's not some old fuck corrupt politician. He campaigned on some promises that were politically difficult like ganja and deficit spending, let's hope he sticks to them all. Anyways, much of the good work the Liberals can do will be in fixing the mess Harper has left us.
 
a question if anyone can answer this for me:

Brazeau pleaded guilty to cocaine and assault charges. If you plead guilty to charges brought against you, how can you get those charges completely stricken with not so much as a mark on your record? Smells awfully fishy to me.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top