Official 2015 Canadian general Election
- Thread starter mseward
- Start date
corona
Active member
right. NS ruined embedding.
http://globalnews.ca/video/2078338/...defends-use-of-isis-video-in-recent-attack-ad
How they've been elected 3 times is beyond me. There are a lot of idiots in this country. A lot of paranoid people too. Fear mongering has won elections before. Fucking sad.
http://globalnews.ca/video/2078338/...defends-use-of-isis-video-in-recent-attack-ad
How they've been elected 3 times is beyond me. There are a lot of idiots in this country. A lot of paranoid people too. Fear mongering has won elections before. Fucking sad.
mseward
Active member
13452674:VinnieF said:
Trudeau is right too, we definitely dont need to be engaged with isis. Seems hes the only politician that realizes how people end up joining a fucked up group like ISIS. Western society bombs/drone strikes the shit out of town on a whim that there could be a terrorist, innocent people die, angry teenagers who have lost their whole families now want revenge and are looking for a cause, ISIS recruiters have a cake walk.
and thanks to c51 i will probably get arrested for posting this
corona
Active member
Election about to kick off as early as Sunday according to the CBC.
This should have been obvious since with the new party funding rules put in place by the CPC a longer election means higher spending limits and this election will be long enough where only the Conservatives have enough money to actually make use of the full spending limits.
Stevie being crafty.
This should have been obvious since with the new party funding rules put in place by the CPC a longer election means higher spending limits and this election will be long enough where only the Conservatives have enough money to actually make use of the full spending limits.
Stevie being crafty.
corona
Active member
13470084:Rusticles said:
Yea Canadian politics is descending to the shit show that is American politics with fear mongering, dirty tactics, and personal attacks. Although the official platforms haven't been released yet so I'd hope the ads improve after that, but I doubt it.
corona
Active member
and the questions can by summed up by this:
"If you claim to be the best fiscal choice and the right person to save tax payer money, why are you calling an election that's going to cost far more taxpayer money then any other election in the past?"
"Canada has the best economy in the G7 with the best financial prospects yadda yadda yadda nothing at all to do with the question we have a balanced budget yadda yadda yadda."
"If you claim to be the best fiscal choice and the right person to save tax payer money, why are you calling an election that's going to cost far more taxpayer money then any other election in the past?"
"Canada has the best economy in the G7 with the best financial prospects yadda yadda yadda nothing at all to do with the question we have a balanced budget yadda yadda yadda."
corona
Active member
Anyone watch the leaders debate this evening? frankly more important than watching any of the baboons argue it out in the GOP debate.
Seemed like everyone was pretty much on their game. No one made any serious errors and no one stood out above the others. Harper obviously on the defensive pretty much the whole time. May put in some good jabs, the most important of which I though was about Harper telling the Conservative senators which way to vote to shut down a bill that had already passed the House. That's pretty fucked. Mulcair and Trudeau both strong but had some blunders. In all I don't see poll number changing much from this. Maybe a bit more support for Trudeau since he definitely did better than most were expecting.
Seemed like everyone was pretty much on their game. No one made any serious errors and no one stood out above the others. Harper obviously on the defensive pretty much the whole time. May put in some good jabs, the most important of which I though was about Harper telling the Conservative senators which way to vote to shut down a bill that had already passed the House. That's pretty fucked. Mulcair and Trudeau both strong but had some blunders. In all I don't see poll number changing much from this. Maybe a bit more support for Trudeau since he definitely did better than most were expecting.
Bumblesteeze
Active member
I watched both the Canadian debate and the GOP debate. Both debates were so different, but they were both entertaining.
corona
Active member
So in the event of an underwater oil well blowout, like the Deepwater Horizon spill in the Gulf, the federal government is giving Shell up to 21 days before they need to cap the well. 21 DAYS. This I need explained, cause my thick skull just isn't understanding how it's at all OK. This is a serious WTF moment. After Deepwater Horizon the US enacted legislation giving them 24 HOURS to have it capped. And here we're OK with a spill continuing for 3 whole weeks without any fucks given. Damn we suck.
dbchili
Active member
The liberals promising to raise taxes on the highest income bracket is a no go for me, that's stupid people there already pay basically 50% combined
The NDPs history of strong promises followed by mismanagement at the provincial level rules them out
The conservatives are all that's left. There's small issues no doubt, but the overall ability to manage the country isn't in doubt
The NDPs history of strong promises followed by mismanagement at the provincial level rules them out
The conservatives are all that's left. There's small issues no doubt, but the overall ability to manage the country isn't in doubt
corona
Active member
13475095:dbchili said:
If a provincial party from the early 90's rules out a federal party 20 years later, then really the only party left for you to vote for is the Greens.
Also what exactly was were the big promises Bob Rae made that he went back on? Are you talking about Sunday shopping? Cause he did go back on that one.
If that's why you wouldn't vote Liberal that's fair enough.
If you only think there are small issues with the Conservative government then you really need to follow the news more closely. They all have their problems, but damn, they have some serious issues. There's no doubt they can manage a country, but whether or not they've been managing it well is a whole other issue. One which the vast majority of Canadians think they've been doing poorly.
Canadianfreeride
Member
13475176:Rusticles said:
Ignorance is bliss.
corona
Active member
13447928:J.D. said:
If I'm so completely wrong about this, why is it 2/4 of the leaders in last night's debate openly and clearly said that making refineries in Canada to make value added products in Canada is the better option then exporting raw produce overseas? May taking the angle we want the jobs in Canada and it's better to refine in a country with far stricter environmental regulations and Mulcair that we want the jobs in Canada.
I realize you live in Alberta and by principle have to poo-poo any idea that's not about immediate financial gain for the province with no regard for the future or environment, but you have to admit that essentially calling me an idiot for thinking we should make value added products at home is pretty fucking weak.
Realize ~ the same % of Canadian's views are directly represented by these 2 leaders as is by the ruling party since the 2011 election and they are views shared by many people far more intelligent and educated in this matter then either of us.
corona
Active member
13475199:Rusticles said:
The problem is that the Conservatives can't seem to grasp that it's not entirely about our lives right now. No, no matter who gets elected you will not see any immediate changes in your life. But what about the lives of your kids and grandkids? Do you care about what they'll be left to deal with?
erikK
Active member
13475244:VinnieF said:
That second sentence - what on earth are you trying to say?
1 of the 2 leaders that said that was probably the legend from the Green Party lol so using that number is a little distorted.
Your english is terrible man, like really really bad.
I wish I could've watched the debate. Youtube's blocked in camp unfortunately.
corona
Active member
13475319:erikK said:
May as in Elizabeth May. Not as in may you please learn to read. Sentence makes complete sense and is 100% grammatically correct.
However it might be more clear if I add a couple apostrophes
May taking the angle 'we want the jobs in Canada and it's better to refine in a country with far stricter environmental regulations' and Mulcair that 'we want the jobs in Canada'.
Canadianfreeride
Member
13475199:Rusticles said:
You should consider the long and short term consequences when evaluating candidates. If what you really want is a few bucks to renovate your man cave, then maybe Harper is the best choice for you (the home improvement tax credit is a blatant bribe, and will likely never materialize if the conservatives are re-elected). If on the other hand you care about the long term future of Canada, the Canada that your children may inherit, I suggest you consider a candidate willing to roll back the gross violation of Canadian freedoms that is bill C51. C51 is a enormous increase in governmental power, and lacks any short of oversight which would protect citizens from the government. I suggest you research the implications of C51 thoroughly.
I needn't go into Harpers economic record, which mediocre at best. Hell, he even admitted last night that we might be in a recession. I don't want to tell you who to vote for, but I do think that you should fully educate yourself about all of the candidates, as well as consider the future of Canada, and not just the state of your man cave.
13475567:Canadianfreeride said:
Really? Bill C51? Oh jeez don't peek in on my email in the hopes of catching a terrorist. God what would become of me if someone took a peek at the dick pics I sent my wife.
I do recall prospering economically in each of the years he was PM so again, not too sure what to complain about.
corona
Active member
13475749:Rusticles said:
If you can't see the flaws in C-51 then you need to go back to school and take a crash course in Canadian constitutional law.
Also what about the environment? As a skier you must at least care a smidgen about the environment. Maybe you never got educated past high school, but you must also care about primary research too.
13475759:VinnieF said:
Bill C51 doesn't concern me or 100% of Canadians.
I care about the environment, none of the three leaders are going to be able to do anything different about it. I also care about food on the table.
The primary research, "muzzling scientists" part I agree with you, however I don't care enough to trust the other two with the west's economy.
CHU-TANG_CLAN
Active member
i usually try not to talk politics when I'm doing anything related to skiing as it is my get away. however i am a big fan of watching politics, and am extremely proud to see the people of newschoolers talking about this. I will be voting NDP. They seem to have a good platform and i like that hey are one of the major parties to want to scrap c-51.
however did anyone watch the debate on thursday? I thought green party did the best overall
however did anyone watch the debate on thursday? I thought green party did the best overall
corona
Active member
13475763:Rusticles said:
You must be joking if you don't think c51 affects any Canadian's.
2nd, a monkey could come up with better environmental policies than Harper. The other leaders absolutely will and can do far better for the environment.
And you trust a government that's added 150 billion to debt and gone into 2 recessions, and actually have had billions dissappear from budgets, selling federal assets to balance 1 budget etc etc? I mean I realize 2008 recession would have happened regardless of who would be in power but this is 7 years later and we're still far worse off then what the Liberals left us with in 2006
Lé.Skiing
Active member
I know after the debate it seems like a tough choice for who you should vote for, But I would urge everyone to Vote NDP. Even if you don't want to vote NDP.
What it looks like is Harper might actually get in again because he has split the votes. All he has to do is win seats and by the looks of it looks like he might fucking have this election AGAIN. So if you vote NDP think of it as a vote just against Harper. If you look back Harper always does this. he creates something to split the votes between Liberals and NDP or Green or whatever. Anyway so he basically gets everyone to split the votes between the opposition and which he always will get in because he has the majority of the eastern votes. Maybe I'm not explaining this right, but all I am trying to say is that even though everyone hates Harper he still has a good chance of winning yet again because he's playing the political system perfectly.
I mean you can really vote for who you want, but I'm going to Vote NDP and continue to tell everyone to vote NDP because I feel like it's the best chance to come out with a win this election.
If we get a small amount of wins for Liberals a small amount of wins for NDP and a small amount of wins for The Green Party, We will be so swept up in their little wins we won't realize that Harper and the Conservatives will make it off with the major win for most seats.
I keep coming back to this comment for the election and it's this: "United we stand, Devided we fall" We all have to make sure we vote for the same party or we will be too busy arguing over who we think is the best and Harper will make off with the win, which is what I think he is counting on.
Sorry for the bit of a long post, I just felt I had to share this with people in order to feel like I have done my part in sharing my predictions seeing as it has happened in the past it is kind of starting to seem all to familiar again. I want to get Harper out of there as badly as the next person, but as much as I hate to admit it Harper might actually make it in again.
Maybe if we all share this information we can nip it in the bud.
What it looks like is Harper might actually get in again because he has split the votes. All he has to do is win seats and by the looks of it looks like he might fucking have this election AGAIN. So if you vote NDP think of it as a vote just against Harper. If you look back Harper always does this. he creates something to split the votes between Liberals and NDP or Green or whatever. Anyway so he basically gets everyone to split the votes between the opposition and which he always will get in because he has the majority of the eastern votes. Maybe I'm not explaining this right, but all I am trying to say is that even though everyone hates Harper he still has a good chance of winning yet again because he's playing the political system perfectly.
I mean you can really vote for who you want, but I'm going to Vote NDP and continue to tell everyone to vote NDP because I feel like it's the best chance to come out with a win this election.
If we get a small amount of wins for Liberals a small amount of wins for NDP and a small amount of wins for The Green Party, We will be so swept up in their little wins we won't realize that Harper and the Conservatives will make it off with the major win for most seats.
I keep coming back to this comment for the election and it's this: "United we stand, Devided we fall" We all have to make sure we vote for the same party or we will be too busy arguing over who we think is the best and Harper will make off with the win, which is what I think he is counting on.
Sorry for the bit of a long post, I just felt I had to share this with people in order to feel like I have done my part in sharing my predictions seeing as it has happened in the past it is kind of starting to seem all to familiar again. I want to get Harper out of there as badly as the next person, but as much as I hate to admit it Harper might actually make it in again.
Maybe if we all share this information we can nip it in the bud.
LE Skiing, you are literally the worst person when it comes to politics. Just based on what you posted. That was awful and you should seriously be ashamed. This is not a sport with teams you root for or against.
Here is how you do not decide who to vote for:
1. Reading facebook posts.
2. Reading hit pieces.
3. Deciding who you don't like and voting for whoever can beat them.
4. Treating an election like something you can "win" or have a team or a side in.
Here is how you decide who to vote for:
1. Read the parties' platforms.
2. Do research into specific issues that you don't fully understand to attempt to figure out whether the parties' ideas on that issue will, in your view, produce positive results. When doing this, recognize your pre-existing biases and try to set them aside.
3. If you don't understand an issue, put your ego aside and recognize that you can't be an expert on everything. Then, try not to let that issue influence your vote.
4. Decide which party's ideas you honestly think will produce the best results for the country.
Here is how you do not decide who to vote for:
1. Reading facebook posts.
2. Reading hit pieces.
3. Deciding who you don't like and voting for whoever can beat them.
4. Treating an election like something you can "win" or have a team or a side in.
Here is how you decide who to vote for:
1. Read the parties' platforms.
2. Do research into specific issues that you don't fully understand to attempt to figure out whether the parties' ideas on that issue will, in your view, produce positive results. When doing this, recognize your pre-existing biases and try to set them aside.
3. If you don't understand an issue, put your ego aside and recognize that you can't be an expert on everything. Then, try not to let that issue influence your vote.
4. Decide which party's ideas you honestly think will produce the best results for the country.
corona
Active member
But JD, with the way our election system is set up sometimes a vote for who you want is truly a vote wasted so voting against a party can make a lot of sense.
Say I NDP government and I live in a riding that's only ever been Liberal or Conservative in a really close race and the NDP has never gotten more than 5-10% of the vote. A vote for the Liberals would give a better chance of getting the NDP government that I want then a vote for the actually NDP.
It's pretty fucked, but for a lot of people to get the government they feel best represents their values they need to vote against another party.
Say I NDP government and I live in a riding that's only ever been Liberal or Conservative in a really close race and the NDP has never gotten more than 5-10% of the vote. A vote for the Liberals would give a better chance of getting the NDP government that I want then a vote for the actually NDP.
It's pretty fucked, but for a lot of people to get the government they feel best represents their values they need to vote against another party.
Lé.Skiing
Active member
13480401:J.D. said:
I have read all the parties platforms. I have also watched the debate a few times. I know how to decide on voting, I'm not 11. I honestly believe in the NDP. I was confident before the debate and the debate only solidified my vote. Green party was a close second.
Just because my values differ from yours doesn't mean that I'm ill-informed. I'd just like to be proud of my country again. I can't see that happening with Harper in office.
Lé.Skiing
Active member
13480559:Anathema said:
Well I work at a job where we buy shit in USD and the Value of the CAD is going in the hole right now. There's bill c-51 that's utter shit. There's other stuff I could go on and on about, but I'm not here to whine and complain about my life. I'm here to talk about the politics of the Canadian 2015 election.
corona
Active member
maybe someone can explain this to me. So Harper is proposing making it illegal to travel to certain areas or the world. Section 6 of our charter guarantees freedom of movement to travel anywhere within Canada and to leave and return to Canada. Would this not directly violate the freedom of movement for the Canadian government to say where a Canadian citizen can and can't go in the world?
None of the talk about this in the media has anything to do with our freedom of movement so maybe I'm missing something big and it's not an issue?
None of the talk about this in the media has anything to do with our freedom of movement so maybe I'm missing something big and it's not an issue?
dbchili
Active member
13475172:VinnieF said:
The most important issues to me are, in order
1. Personal tax rates
2. Balanced budget
3. jobs, which are impacted by corp tax rates
On 1, ndp and the Tories are the same. Neither will raise.
On 2, both have said they'll balance. The difference is their ability to. Tories have a history of running a balanced budget and repaying liberal debts. They've demonstrated their ability numerous times, including through the recent recession that even the U.S. Couldn't get through. The NDP have no experience at the federal level, and a history of blowing it at the provincial level. Bob Rae was the best example, ontarios debt went from 35 to 90 billion in 5 years in the 90s (funny how Tories balanced during a much worse recession in the 00s). Similar comments earlier in this thread on the prairies indicate a pattern.
On 3, raising corp tax rates might help in the short run. But long run it disincentivizes corpns to host jobs in Canada. Further the ndp wanna blow this extra cash on the CPP which is basically a welfare scheme for senior citizens and provides little benefit to the people who pay into it and is a waste of federal money.
You guys focus on small issues like this c51 bill and who sold an oil sands corporation. Maybe ask yourselves "are they gonna blow it?" And if you wanna play the odds, the NDP are infinitely more likely to than the Tories.
corona
Active member
13482283:dbchili said:
You need to do some fact checking.
1- "Tories have a history of running a balanced budget and repaying liberal debts."
NOPE. You are out to lunch on this. Canada's surplus/debt pretty much matches those of other western countries as an overall trend. Like you can't blame Harper for the huge debt accrued during the 2008 recession, you can't blame Trudeau for the huge debt accrued during the 1980's recession.
here's a little interactive for you:
http://www.cbc.ca/news2/interactives/canada-deficit/
If Cons are so good at fixing the Liberal debt, why is it Mulroney entered office with 37 billion deficit and left with a 39 billion deficit. Then why is it Cretien entered with that 39 billion deficit from Mulroney and slowly over the years brought it to a surplus, maintained by Martin, which then plummeted to a deficit once Harper took office.
This seems to be exactly opposite of what you're suggesting. But the issue with this is all these times of recession and prosper aren't the result of the ruling party but are the result of times of global prosperity and recession which cannot be controlled by the Prime Minister of Canada.
The ONLY reason why the budget is predicted (by the Cons) to be balanced this year (non-partisan parliamentary budget office is saying it won't be) is due to one-time sales of assets like the Wheat Board, GM shares, and billion dollar contingency fund gathered on the backs of years of deficit.
Again, the recession in the 90's in Ontario is not because of Rae, it would have happened regardless of who was in power. It's how it's dealt with that makes the difference. I'm not arguing Rae was a good premier, but to judge the Federal NDP based on an Ontario government from 20 years ago is pretty fucking dumb.
As for corporate tax rates, why would it cause companies to move elsewhere? Canada's corporate tax rate is ~10-15% lower than that of the US, are they having a mass exodus of companies? A small change won't companies. The more sure-fire way to loose jobs is if the provinces raised the minimum wage significantly (Federal minimum wage won't do this).
As for CPP, with an increasingly aging population Canada needs a serious plan to make sure all the soon to be and current retirees don't become a huge financial burden on the rest of us an CPP is definitely one plan to help out. At least the NDP have a plan, granted it might not be the best plan. Cons have no plan at all for this.
And this isn't Conservative vs NDP either. The Liberals do exist and are considered Canada's natural ruling party for a reason. If the Cons are really the only saviour economically then you'd expect after spending 70% of the 20th century under Liberal rule we'd be seriously in the shitter entering the 21st century. Turns out after all that time under Liberal control we left the 20th century as packing way above our population and were one of the best countries in the world in practically every category you can think of.
dbchili
Active member
13482316:VinnieF said:
Honestly man, you're obviously better informed than me on some of these issues. But the bottom line is, as evidenced in my post and undisputed by you, the ndp have a history of over promising and under delivering. That pile of debt Rae accrued in the 90s was pure mismanagement, and the liberal and Tory record in this regard is much better (your examples show this)
People these days seem easily swayed by being promised they can have their cake and eat it too. This has always been the NDP tactic ( sure you can have a big retirement fund but not pay any more tax) and it's scary more people are buying in now than ever
We will see how they do in Alberta. Then maybe I will listen for the next federal election.
corona
Active member
for those who want a better understanding of where parties stand on most main issues, I highly suggest doing the vote compass thing.
After you're done the 'Compare the parties by issue' is really a useful thing for those who don't care to really dig for where parties stand.
After you're done the 'Compare the parties by issue' is really a useful thing for those who don't care to really dig for where parties stand.
corona
Active member
3 weeks to go. All 3 main parties have been statistically tied for the past 3 or so weeks. Looking to be a minority no matter what the outcome.
One point that really irked my recently:
Conservatives supposedly going to open up the dairy market in Canada. This I just plain out morally oppose, especially in our day and age. Right now we have a quota system for dairy that means small scale farmers (those with as few as 50-60 head of cattle) can actually make a living off their farms. Opening up the dairy market will undermine the quota system by then having cheaper dairy from massive factory farm operations from other countries available on our shelves. This could easily mean the end of small dairy farms. This hits home for me since in my area of eastern Ontario it's almost entirely small family run dairy farms which only exist because of the quota system.
Other issues include
-less eco-friendly dairy products. Right now I go to the grocery store for milk and it comes from farms within about 100km of the city. With an open dairy market the cheapest dairy products could easily be coming from as far away as New Zealand.
-reduced quality. Canada has probably the best quality dairy in the world. factory scale farms will be the only fiscally stable option and quality will suffer, along with all the other issues related to factory farm milk production and long distance shipping
On the other hand, you may save 50 cents when you purchase a gallon of milk.
One point that really irked my recently:
Conservatives supposedly going to open up the dairy market in Canada. This I just plain out morally oppose, especially in our day and age. Right now we have a quota system for dairy that means small scale farmers (those with as few as 50-60 head of cattle) can actually make a living off their farms. Opening up the dairy market will undermine the quota system by then having cheaper dairy from massive factory farm operations from other countries available on our shelves. This could easily mean the end of small dairy farms. This hits home for me since in my area of eastern Ontario it's almost entirely small family run dairy farms which only exist because of the quota system.
Other issues include
-less eco-friendly dairy products. Right now I go to the grocery store for milk and it comes from farms within about 100km of the city. With an open dairy market the cheapest dairy products could easily be coming from as far away as New Zealand.
-reduced quality. Canada has probably the best quality dairy in the world. factory scale farms will be the only fiscally stable option and quality will suffer, along with all the other issues related to factory farm milk production and long distance shipping
On the other hand, you may save 50 cents when you purchase a gallon of milk.