Lets drill in Alaska

Itsbackfliptime

Itsbackfliptime

Active member
If it'll make gas cheaper then lets do it. My friend has a bunch of oil/natural gas wells on his property at his cabin and they're not a big deal at all. So far I don't think they've killed any animals and it attracts way more deer and stuff cause they planted clover in the openings. So why not do it?

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Hmmm, I've had many a debate about this. I'll provide information concerning this issue in a bit. I've got pleanty.

Sarah

Reppin' 907
 
Or we can wait untill the whole world runs out of oil, then drill and have it all to ourselves, and sell it for Billions, to those fucking countrys who r riping us off now

He who hesitates masturbates
 
The problem is not the wells, its the impact from everything else, roads, trucks, buildings, pipelines, all that shit. No I am not sarcastic, I do not believe we should drill in ANWAR, it is a waste of great frontier, wildlife, and beautiful country. Again, I am with Bush on everything but Marijuana and the Environment.

Politicaly Active Since 1992

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drill alaksa and it will solve this problem for 6 months, take the money and put it in hydrogen fuel cells, christ

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It's pointless to drill one of nature's last untouched places in the world. The oil in Alaska will last US 1/2 year based on US's consumption rates.

Jesus said, 'Lucky is the lion that the human will eat, so the lion

becomes human. And foul is the human that the lion will eat, and

the lion still will become a human.'

 
Statistics are actually different than you may think. Here's a REALLY rough outline for my debate class last year when we had a huge thing on ANWR (since it IS in our state). Some of it's kind of confusing, but I have a ton of detailed statistics that we used in the actual debate that I can post later if you'd like. This was just my rough outline so I knew which arguments to give when. We didn't know which side we were going to be (affirmative or negative), which is why we had to prepare for both.

Drilling on ANWR Outline for Debate Class

Affirmative

Resolved: The Arctic National Wildlife Refuge should be opened to oil and gas exploration and drilling.

Contention I: Topicality

Harm/Need 1. Limited Domestic Supply of Petrolium

A. Increase in gas prices

-- 800 mile pipeline from Prudhoe Bay to Valdez

B. Foreign oil dependency

-- Strained relationships with countries

C. Less availability

Harm/Need 2. Job Availability

A. Less jobs for drillers

-- Won't decrease unemployment rates & gov't costs

B. Less construction jobs for home builders

-- Less expansion of communities & businesses

-- Less economic increase

Harm/Need 3. Less State and National Income

A. Less oil that could be sold to increase state & gov't income

B. Not helping towards massive state debt

-- Library cuts, etc.

Contention II: Inherency

I. Present system prohibits drilling in ANWR

II. Gas prices are currently almost record high

III. Much of US gas is imported from foreign countries

IV. Little income for Alaska other than petrolium from north slope

V. Not as many construction & drilling occupations available as there could be

Contention III: Solvency

I. Gas prices should decrease

II. Larger abundance of gas in the state

III. Alaska will have a much larger income from exporting

IV. Many new construction, drilling, & other job opportunities will be opened

V. Better ties with foreign countries

VI. Unemployment rates should drop

-- Gov't. spending on unemployment should decrease

Negative

Resolved: Opening the Arctic National Wildlife Refuge to oil drilling and exploration is unnecessary and may have a predominantly negative impact on the state of Alaska.

*Definition of national wildlife refuge:

-- Refuge: Place that provides shelter and protection from danger or distress

Contention I:) Topicality

Harm/Need 1. Dependency on Foreign Oil

A. *Statistics on % dependency

B. ANWR would only decrease dependency a small amount and for a short period of time (give stats)

Harm/Need 2. Accessibility to Oil & Amount

A. U.S. Geological Survey estimates:

-- Only six months worth of oil in ANWR

-- Not available for another ten years

Harm/Need 3. Contradicts Purpose of National Wildlife Refuge

A. *Restate definition of wildlife refuge

B. 'What little remains of that wilderness is part of our heritage and deserves to be protected.' - Brooks Yeager, VP of WWF

C. If one wildlife refuge open, gives support to open others

Harm/Need 4. Other Resources

A. Nonpolluting renewable resources instead of fossil fuels

B. Would help with independence from foreign oil

Harm/Need 5. Economic Influence

A. Wouldn't help with much income because of such small supply & availability

B. Only payable in installments ten years down the road

C. Would be a greater cost to drill

Harm/Need 6. Job Creation, or Not?

-- Would only supply jobs for limited time because of small amount of oil

*Include researched statistics

Closing: Drilling on the Arctic National Wildlife Refuge would overall be a negative thing and cause more harms with the economy, wildlife, terms of national wildlife refuges and parks, and just be a hassle to the state instead of a benefit.

Sarah

Reppin' 907
 
Yep sporegasm, that's a statistic we used, and in case you couldn't tell... I was on the negative for the debate, which just happens to parallel my real thoughts on the issue.

Sarah

Reppin' 907
 
drilling in artic nation wildlife refuge is a big mistake. doesnt have that much oil. the diference between anwr and bb is that the caribou calf in anwr and not in bb so it might hurt them and why drill there.it would support the country for 1/2 a year. its dumb

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As a sidenote, BigJ, you may rest easy knowing that yours and Gw's views on drug use are not quite so different as you might think, given his rather... erm... colourful... past. His political stance on drugs is very possibly just that: political.

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isnt the oil a world market so if somethin in the middle east happens and u dont even get your oil there your gas prices still go up?

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you've got to run like an antelope; out of control
 
we should all use vegetable oil. With the rate fast food places are popping up around the country theres probably enough to go around

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you guys arent remembering clinton...literally right before his term was up, he labled alaska a national landmark or something. it would take forever to be able to be allowed to drill there.

'if the president is anything like you, atlantaski, i hope someone smacks him with a golf club and shits in his mouth.' CrystalNeedsSomething...

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just go diesel fuel and you can make your own for 10 cents a gallon out of old chinese food and another ingredient, my friend does for his ol' mercedez. when you think about it you pay more for a gallon of milk than a gallon of gas, something to think about. but if you are all into destroying wildlife, then you should be more for just killing all the towel-heads in iraq and middle east and taking the oil for ourselves., i mean we are already over there having fun killing people and decreasing the worlds population anyways

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wow. i almost missed that one thing. man that was a subtle little thing there

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I think they should put more money into hydrogen-powered technology and electric cars rather than drilling more oil and shit. I watched a show on TV that showed the impact of greenhouse gases on the Canadian Arctic, and it's melted away lots of land and polar bears are dying of starvation and some big burg near iceland will eventually break off and it'll melt into some river that usually warms North America, but the icy water will cool it and North America will become much cooler. It was... 'The Nature of Things'.

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haha Alaska....hmmmm we're so boring lets PAY people to live here.

Jeepers Creepers, where'd you get the neat sneakers?!?!

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J.D. May, I assume you are talking about President Bush's prior use of drugs and alcohol. And if you meant it as a bad thing I disagree. He came out of his addictions and now is strongly against; it seeing as it almost ruined his life. I do not think his policies on drugs are solely politically motivated.

'Hey look, a gay INTERACIAL newly wed couple, burning the American Flag.'
 
How about starting to use electric or hydrogen fuel operated automobiles? With them, you wont have to worry about surging oil prices and shit like that, and the same time C02 levels will be decreased drastically and helping the environment.

I'm gonna pick up a electric/hydrogen fuel operated car as soon I'm bored with driving my new WRX within 5 years from now.

Jesus said, 'Lucky is the lion that the human will eat, so the lion

becomes human. And foul is the human that the lion will eat, and

the lion still will become a human.'

 
Also not to mention the US Govt will rebate you $2,500 to 3k in tax refund once you buy new electric or hydrogen fuel operated vehicle.

Jesus said, 'Lucky is the lion that the human will eat, so the lion

becomes human. And foul is the human that the lion will eat, and

the lion still will become a human.'

 
Well although this is rather irrelevant and not put to much good use in this thread. This just reminds me of something I learned in age of empires. Since gold is the first ressource to run out and is the most important, you try and mine your opponent's gold, or the farthest possible gold from yourself that you can first. Because later you migth not have that possibility, but you are much less likely to lose control of your own gold. It works the same way for oil. Except I dont think its so much a game against the world so it doesn't really apply.

-Michael Lifshitz-
 
'haha Alaska....hmmmm we're so boring lets PAY people to live here.'

-PLUMPwonton

Hahahahah I hope you're fucking kidding me. Alaska is one of the most expensive states to live in. Whoop-dee-doo... So we get a check each year for being a resident (this year will be an all-time low of $900). Taxes, higher prices, and whatnot make costs of living WAYYYY higher than many states. For example, we have very high cigarette and alcohol taxes. I've never smoked a cigarette in my life, but put it this way... A $5 pack of cigs in say California is $7 here. Keep that in mind.

Also, boring? Are you KIDDING? Being a skier, I'd expect you to view this place as a paradise. Mountains all over the place. I don't know how much you like the outdoors, but there are SOOOO many awesome places to hike, camp, fish, etc. here. I LOVE living in Alaska, and I don't get bored. Sure, we don't have HUGE malls and whatnot here, but we do have the sames kinds of things all other places have. I'm not a mall/glamour & glitz/city person anyway. Guess it depends on the person, but I definitely don't find this place boring.

Sarah

Reppin' 907
 
Last time I heard NYC is the most expensive place to live in, I mean a pack of ciggarette's 8 dollars in NYC. Ciggarette's nasty anyways.

Jesus said, 'Lucky is the lion that the human will eat, so the lion

becomes human. And foul is the human that the lion will eat, and

the lion still will become a human.'

 
^ San Francisco is the most expensive city to live in, Hawaii is the most expensive state to live in and Alaska is a very close second. The cost of just shipping things there raises the cost of living for those folks, not to mention the climate is not really condusive to industry. The poeple of Alaska are a tougher breed of American, both physically and mentally. As far as being boring, I think Sarah hit the nail on the head. IF YOU SKI ALASKA SHOULD BE YOUR GOAL. Just ask any big mountain skier, they will point you to Haines and tell you it doesn't get any better than that. Alaska I think is by far the most beautiful of our states as well. I'm all for lower gas prices, but not at the expense of Americas last real frontier. As a skier I would almost consider trading in my children to go heliskiing there for a week( of course I wouldn't trade them for a week, I would request two months). Anchorage is a beautiful little city as well with a full fledge university so you have lots of night life(more night life for six months than anyother state in the union). Don't bash on Alaska cause it's just not cool. and @ $7 bucks a pack i wouldn't smoke ciggerettes either. Holy shit is that steep. oh and Sarah you guys only get $900 a year now that is crazy, five years ago you guys where getting somewhere in the area of $1500, I'm curious what happened to make that go down so much?? I know the cost of living hasn't dropped.

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holy shit i dont see why we just dont put our money into building NUCLEAR FUSSION PLANTS....you know its so fuckin efficient if we work on it...and it doesnt give out pollution. all it gives out is helium which is harmless.

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the problem with hydrogen is that it costs more to amke it then it is worth. Gas also gives a lot more power than hydrogen does. Until we find a better way of making hydrogen fuel it jsut isnt feasible. I also think drill in ANWR is a bad idea. Considering how long it would take to set up the place for drilling, we would be actually drilling there for a less amount of time than we would be preparing it for drilling.

Is Bush really serious about doing this?

Insane_skier:

Under my name It sais beginner.

I am very discouraged to the fact that the site adminster didn't look at my profile or ask before doing something like this. I may be new to this website but I have been skiing more then most of you.

PLEASE research or ask before making such assumptions like this one.

 
I did a presentation on this as well. There is only enough oil there to sustain our nation for around 6 months! Although it would benefit the economy there, I dont see how that could possibly justify envirnmentle impplications.

The rockies are next, how do you feel about that?

 
yeah gas is rising in price but think about how much we have taken it for granted. The price of gas has not risen at or even close to the rate of inflation until te past few years. Driving a car is a priviledge not a right, so as a priviledge get used to paying for it

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Yeah Muteman hit that one right on. Hydrogen isnt just so simple. Hydrogen doesnt just float around waiting to go in a vehichle. It is virtually impossible to just find pure. It is the most plentiful element in the universe, yet it also bonds with just about anything. So to get it, processes have to be done. For these, you need energy... I, for one, would also not want to be around when there is a big crash with hydrogen cars.

signatures are for pussies

 
To me it seems that there are no real strong candidates for a new energy source yet. Hydrogen is the front runner but it isn't good enough. I think hybrid is the way to go for now until we can think of something totally new and something that is renewable.

Insane_skier:

Under my name It sais beginner.

I am very discouraged to the fact that the site adminster didn't look at my profile or ask before doing something like this. I may be new to this website but I have been skiing more then most of you.

PLEASE research or ask before making such assumptions like this one.

 
Response to stixonmtholly:

Yep, some of the best heliskiing in the world is here in the great AK: Cordova, Valdez, Haines. You always see footage from one or more of these locations in ski movies.

Anchorage is actually a really rad city, like you were saying. Population is around 300,000, but it's EXTREMELY spread out. It looks nothing like your typical American city. South Anchorage is beautiful. Anyway, to some of you... Don't knock it 'till you've been here to experience for AK yourself.

About the PFD... Actually last year, it was around $1500, over $1900 the year before, and over $1800 the year before that. The very first PFD was $1000. The reason it's so low now is because it's based on a moving average... In other words, it's dependent on the past either three or five (can't rememeber which exactly, sorry, but I believe five) years earnings. It's heavily invested in the stock market, so when the market started going down in 2000/2001, so did the earnings for those years. The really high years we had made the average really high, therefore giving us those huge PFD checks which were twice what they are now. Since less of those years are being included in the averages to determine the amount of our PFD checks, the amount has been steadily decreasing the past couple years. Not sure if what any of what I'm saying is making sense, but they do the moving average so that we don't have one REALLY high year and then nothing the next. If this doesn't make sense, I'll rewrite it when I get more sleep.

The cost of living definitely hasn't gone down. The PFD has nothing to do with our cost of living. It's not really like a reembersement or anything... It's just a 'benefit' for being an Alaskan resident because they were making so much money on certain resources I guess... give me a week to catch up on sleep, and I can give you an exact answer. Anyway, the cost of living has actually gone up a lot. Because of this, minimum wage was raised a year or two ago from $5.65 to $7.10. Sure, people may say 'dude, Alaskans make so much more than we do', but look at costs of housing, house and motor vehicle insurance, everything. It's unbelievably expensive. Food and everything is more expensive up here. If they DIDN'T raise minimum wage, there's no way in hell anyone would be able to afford to live here besides the upper-class. There'd be nobody attending the colleges because students wouldn't be able to afford to live in the dorms, much less an appartment. I could go on, but I'll hold off until later. I hope that answered your questions.

Sarah

Reppin' 907
 
well i mean, hydrogen which looks like the best contender looks like the best way to go. i mean, with the proper funding and effort behind the program, we can be energy efficient on hydrogen and fuel cells instead of oil in no time. the technology is already there, we just need to apply it. i mean, we're gonna hafta make the change soon. if we can put a man on the moon in the span of a presidents term, we can do just about anything.

 
when i exploded a hydrogen bomb, it made a much bigger bang than the gas bomb, stupid gas bomb

 
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