How the hell is mccain supposed to lower gov spending if he stays in iraq

ok, i dont know what state(or country) you live in? but here in MN our schools are over funded if anything.. in the small town i live in, 4000 people, the school board wanted to pass a referendum for 600,000$$ to put astro turf on the football field! We have high schools that are bigger than some small colleges! i know this is not necessarily true around the whole state or around the whole country..

and one of the biggest things i fear in the whole world is a welfare state, honestly i can see a day where america becomes like this.. where we are one big country, just like the EU. our sovereignty as a individual nation could one day disappear.

the second is i fear our political correctness will also be our undoing.. i dont care what statistics you throw at me but i believe that one of the most dangerous things facing americas survival is the small group off some muslin's, who will stop at nothing, until this country and way of life have been completely wiped off the face of the earth.. i realize that not all muslems are like this, i actually know some, and they are some of the nicest people i know..
 
well it's a good thing good ol' George Bush brought our country into Iraq to get all dem evil terrorists and Al Qaeda out huh?!!!! I mean who do dem sand nigs think they are? where would the world be if we did'nt go to get dem wmd's?!
 
haha, why dont you watch a news report, read a news paper. saddam was not muslem.

and as far as i know the only WMD'S al qaeda had, was a few commercial airplanes filled with american citizens..

 
hahaha i like his puffed out lower cheek areas

i swear hes keeping a bomb in there in case of a terrorist attack during one of his speechs
 
That's because school funding largely comes from that districts property taxes. I have a great school system as well, but that is certainly not the case in much of America.

I'm struggling to find much real information on school funding, but here are a couple numbers from the 2004 Census Bureau. Missisippi spent the lowest per student on average at 5,382 a year, while D.C. spent 13,187. New York and New Jersey also more than double DC. That's a pretty huge variation, particularly when you consider that those numbers are state averages, so there could be a far wider range of spending within those states. Basically, what I'm trying to get at is that our public education system is certainly flawed and needs major work as well as better distribution of/increased funding.

I really really suggest doing some research into the quality of schools in poorer communities throughout America. I think you'd be appalled, and it might change your view a little bit on the need for more work on the public education system to help give everyone their basic right of education. There are still many schools where there simply aren't even enough chairs or textbooks available, let alone computers, and the idea of spending 600,000$ on turf would be laughable.
 
yeah i totally agree, i guess i should have clarified, i was more or less ranting about the area directly around me..

i would defiantly agree that some schools are way under funded, but i would also say there are just as many, if not more, that are way way, over funded.
 
wiki shoots down vancouver living:

"Those who live in Clark County and work in Oregon have to pay Oregon's relatively high income tax"

Shopping in Oregon when living in Washington not perfect either because "Washington does have

a use tax that is due on all purchases made in Oregon that are then

returned to Washington"
 
a question for all the fervent McCain supporters. just curious. how many of you all are signing up for basic training (seriously)? for those who aren't , your are pathetic human beings! cause its cool to support that motherfuckers policy and defend his positions in paragraph long posts on a skiing website but its another story when the shit is hitting the fan and you are putting your bullet/car bomb dodging skills to the test.
 
I feel like McCain is more realistic in his views on the war. If we pull out, as someone said in another thread, the quality of living for the world will go down and this will effect everyone, not just us. Also he didn't want to go into Iraq with the small force, he knew that we needed a large troop flush. I'm not saying i supported the war, I simply didnt know enough about it. But it certainly wouldve been handled better with a lot more troops as opposed to the unsized force we sent. We can't just pull out of Iraq, we dont have a choice.
 
yo man you can never stop the government from spending money and going into debt, i mean has there ever been an affordable war? plus it would destroy the bond market
 
before you call me an "ungrateful fuck" why dont you learn to read!!! i corrected myself and apologized for my mistake!!!@#@#

further more you dont know anything about me! i pay for just about every possession i own! my parents feed and cloth me!

also why dont you learn to read some more, in my next post that you quoted, i said, "i should have clarified better, i was more or less ranting about around here" talking about the school district i live in!

also, i guarantee i have just as good, or better a work ethic than you!

i am currently holding down 3, thats right count them 3 jobs! during the summer i work 40hours a week! i make 400$ a week, i got the job by applying and having a great cover letter. guess what, i havent missed, or even shown up late, for 2 and 1/2 years at that job, our report time is 630 in the morning!!!

when it snows i shovel snow into the wee hours of the night, i make 14$ an hour at that job!

during the fall, after school, and on the weekends i pick pumpkins and apples at an orchard.

at the same time, i maintain a 3.5 GPA.

 
hey i agree with you whole heartedly on this one,

in fact ive said in some posts i think its terrible how much money some of the schools have around me!
 
hey let me give you a little tip, in the real world, you cant really call someone an "ungrateful little fuck."

"god you're fucking daft" you would probably be fired pretty fast.

i really dont see a need to direct these comments at anyone, isnt the idea of liberals to, hear all opinions, think with an open mind, (all good things)
 
ok what can i say to make you understand, the reply i typed on the "Social justice and equality"

was typed when i made a mistake reading the persons post! i have corrected myself! apologized to the person, everything!

i still believe life is what you make of it, and it isnt the governments job to make sure you have a great one.

im going to call a truce on this one, i believe one way, you believe another. agree to disagree.

and if i ever make it down to hyland, i will shoot you a PM, just dont call me an "ungrateful little fuck"

 
OK, having lived in Sweden, one of the most soialist countries in the world, I'm going to have to set a few things straight.

People are not all paid the same wages across the board in a socialist country. That'd be a communist country. Then again, there would be no wages in communist society at all, given that wage labor is one of the many capitalist evils for communist thinkers... But I digress. The point is though, that you're afraid of something that is blatantly untrue about a socialist society. There are upper echelon jobs, and lower echelon jobs. The same type of idea that if you work hard, you will go far that you find in America, still applies to most Western nations, even though they may be more socialist that the USA. Just look at France, the national identity is one of ruthless competition and elitism, within a societal framework where everyone gets due human treatment.

The point that drew is making, and that I also see in this country, is that this supposed idea of the "American Dream" of rags to riches, though obviously having taken place in particular, uncommon events, is not the actual dynamic of this country. Not just anyone can go from working by the hour to making their own fortune here, or go from absolute poverty to financial security, with mere motivation and resolve alone. Ever since the USA was founded, "we the people" did not encapsulate everyone; it did not mean slaves, women or Native Americans. This isn't a gripe on the USA in particular, this was a general Western ting to not exactly included everyone in their universal freedoms.

As we have moved forward and away from this segregationist past, there are still relics of this racist, sexist, elitist past. Though general perception of difference seems to be slowly changing towards the acceptance of all people within the new liberal mentality, the institutionalized oppression and vicious cycles of the past are still around.

I do not doubt that your dad has worked hard to get where he is. However, unless you correct me, I doubt that he grew up in the projects, on an indian reservation, or went to the community college down the road, or had to drop out of school to work to help feed his family, or who had a mother working 2 obs just to put food on the table...

You, and I, and pretty much anyone who can afford the luxury to sit down and converse with strangers through computers, are living a life of privilege. I was born into it, as were you. We never had to deal with the struggles that children born into the lower echelons of society have had to deal with. Though you may be right in some cases that people, through hard work and determination, could better their lives from where they are, it is easy to dismiss people who come from the have-nots as lazy and go on working and studying via the wealth we have of not having to worry about survival, or being born into a situation where one is not provided the means to be even begin to change their situation.

Because the amount of work that you are doing, you do not out of necessity, but out of possibility. What about the person who wishes they could work, all they want to do is work to make money for their family, but they are branded as illegal immigrants, and have to work menial, backbreaking jobs for no money for you and me, but more than what their home country can provide? What of the family that cannot afford college and the medication needed to keep their wage gainer alive?

In Sweden, and France, taxes are higher than here in the USA, yes. But the wealth is redistributed, so that hopefully all children can have quality education, education being the only means to improve your situation. Universities in France, and Sweden, are extremely cheap. Like, 500 bucks a year in tuition cheap. And they're nothing to scoff at. And there is still a hierarchy of schools. Only the most motivated will get into the Sorbonne or Stockholms Universitetet.

Also, everyone has affordable healthcare provided for them s that they know that tomorrow, they will be taken care of if an emergency came around that would cripple the family.

If the USA spent only a fraction of its defense budget on societal improvement, we wouldn't even necessarily need to raise taxes at all to get a base level of human quality of living.

Do you wish everyone could enjoy the same privileges as you and I? The choice of clothing they wear, their choice of university, the same ability to see a doctor, have access to orthodontia and have education paid for and provided for them, so that everyone can succeed from the same base level?

We hold these truths to be self evident, but we don't seem willing to provide a structure for them to be so. I think that Obama, through his socialist policies, could do the USA good in helping alleviate societal tensions across the board issued from a lack of human quality of living. I hope he takes a look at Europe when doing it too.
 
No, the government's job is to look after its people and make sure that they are able to reach their highest collective level, in pursuit of happiness, freedom and human achievement.

Thus, providing the bare minimum for people to try, fail, and yet still be able to live with basic human dignity, is essential for the nation to reach its maximum collective potential, lest the few reach theirs and keep all others from fulfilling their aspirations.
 
first off duh thankyou, for not lowering yourself and your opinions by using uncalled for language.

haha funny you should mention it but, yeah he did go to community college.

want to know anther story, one of my bosses, the one i shovel snow for, actually did have to drop out of school to help his family. but he worked his ass off and now owns 30% of the company he works for/ owns. he actually makes way way more than my dad, and lives in a way way nicer house.

you are right, i work because i can, but by working i am going to be able to pay cold hard cash for my first year of community college, a decent car, and gas, plus pretty much everything else i use. i honestly end up paying for just about everything i use/ want.

and when i talk about working, my first job is literally cleaning toilets, (park worker) number two is shoveling snow, and glamerious number 3 is picking pumpkins out of the mud.

 
not topic related but let me tell u a story about mccain.

mccain thinks about other people. his father admiral mccain was head of the navy when his plane was shot down. he spent 6 years in a pow camp. they told his father after a few years they would let him and someone else go in exchange for something i dont remember. maccain broke his leg in the crash and the guards at the pow camp broke both of his arms. 2 broken arms and a broken leg that was never fixed and when they came to get him to be released he said no, you release my men first not me and stayed like 3 more years in the this condition so other people could go ahead of him. that is a real fucking man a real fucking person whether you like him or not that is the truth and anyone who does that is an amazing person in my book.
 
well the obvious answer is, i will get my own insurance.

and dont belittle my opinion that welfare is run wrong, welfare is great, if the person on welfare is doing something to better their situation, and not just setting around on their ass all day.

also dont put thoughts in my mind, i have never said, glen beck, told me it was wrong... i compile my opinions through a very broad spectrum, of TV and radio..

to be honest i have seen first hand, closer than half of the people on NS, what welfare does, and what it can turn you into.

good job for not swearing:)

the credibility meter just went up!
 
i can honestly say, i applaud your mom, i can see where you are coming from, my dad is also a employee of NWA, and in the last couple of years, has taken a 45% pay cut, and is just now starting to make what he did pre 9/11.

and the type of welfare that your mom used to save your family's house is great in my book, because, she didnt stay on it, she took the initiative and bettered her situation.

i will use some exaples of how welfare is run so bad it is terrible thing. (if you can break your rule, i will to)

my family does foster care for infants, and i cant get into specifics, (honestly i cant, its the law) but let me assure you , that i have seen numerous times, where a mother chooses, (im emphasizing chooses) to stay on welfare based on that if they get a job, they will loose every benefit they currently get. if i had my way, if you honestly needed welfare, you would get it, but you would get more benefits if you were working a job.

example number two, my little 6 year old sister who is adopted, was born into welfare, (on a side note, she swept every D team race in MN this year, just bragging a little:) so dont get me wrong, welfare saves lives, and can do good.

now lets break the rule again, half of my great uncles are on welfare, they have no legitimate reason to be on welfare! other than, its easy!

so when i advocate cutting allot of welfare, that is the type of welfare, im talking about..

again, i am fine with welfare, (when used properly) but it can also lead to very bad things if left unchecked.
 
you should learn to read because i do believe that i did not state anything in that story about voting for him. i said he was an amazing person thats it.. learn to read k thanks.

 
i dunno man i like mccain i like obama hillary is retarded. obama will run small business owners into the ground which leads me more on the mccain side being that my dad owns a small business. but ya it was just a good story i thought i would share. he is a good guy whether you like his policies or not im just saying he is a hero and an amazing person. the whole sex thing with the lobbyist is bs. if it was true this shit would have came out like years ago.
 
The sex with the lobbyist isn't the big deal. It's the fact that he was directly involved in the squandering of 3 billion taxpayer dollars during the Keating scandal. No wonder he's spent the last ten years trying to prove his fiscal responsibility.
 
i think they have yet to prove him guilty for that and its funny he is the only republican the rest involved in that were democrats lol
 
i should have clarified better, my boss, who i referred to earlier.. had to drop out of high school.. and he worked some really really crappy jobs. but he never gave up, and now he owns 30% of a company, and is doing great in life. they also just moved into a 500,000$ house. mind you, this was all accomplished through hard work and determination..

anther example of someone beating the odds is, my grandpa.. he graduated HS, started work climbing telephone lines, and living in a motel... he worked and worked, learning about the industry(no formal education mind you) eventually he was hired as the manager of a local telephone company.. after that job, he was the lead consultant for martin and associates.. a 100million dollar company in SD. after retiring from that job, at the age of 60, he was asked to sit on the board of directors of a large telephone company in Iowa..

you might ask why did your grandpa beat the odds? well i have enough native american blood in MY vanes that i could qualify for every government subsidy in the book. my grandpa's, great grandma litteraly walked on the trail of tears.. he never used this to get ahead, or qualify for free money. nothing! today, he has brothers, who still are literally living off the hand of you and me, and every other tax paying american.

now look at my examples, some people choose (for no real reason) to be on welfare.. if i had any say in the matter, they would get nothing, zilch, nada!

some people need welfare, some (or maybe most) dont need it, they are on it by choice..

 
I just want to point out that the fact that people can beat the odds really means nothing about whether there should be odds in the first place. Think about how much more successful someone like your grandfather could have been had he been given more legitimate chances to begin with.
 
i guess what you could sorta sum it up as, my grandpa never complained, never gave up, and took life at face value... he also didnt look to the government to fix his problems..

also, success has many different meanings, he could very well still be working making mad$ if he wanted too.

 
Oh, I agree with you more than words could ever express about money not being the meaning of success. I'm certainly planning my life to be one of poverty with a view.

I guess I just don't see why the government of such a prosperous nation can't do a slightly better job of dealing with preventable problems. And it's back to the same point, it's amazing your grandfather was able to do that, I'm sure he's an extremely intelligent and driven man, but the fact that he suffered and worked through his problems so well doesn't mean that future generations should experience the same problems. And this isn't to say the government should fix everyone's problems, because that's ridiculous, but it can at least level the playing field.
 
wow, i cant believe, i keep forgetting to answer this, yes they are white, and i am white..

but really that is just a skin color, i can give you plenty of personal examples of how people of all races have flourished in their environments..
 
anyways dirt on mccain - keating 5

obama - the weatherman and he is a moron. ok tell me how this works he passed a bill that says, if someone breaks into your house and starts shooting at you and you shoot him and he doesnt die he can sue you..... wtf please if someone is shooting at me in my house and i shot him how the fuck can this guy sue me for trying to kill me.

hillary - none needed she is a lesbian bitch that will ruin our country.
 
As I have stated in threads before, McCain is bad-ass. No joke that guy has my respect. However, as much of a boss McCain is, I disagree with his platform, and I if a presidential candidate has completely different ideals for where our country should be heading is different than mine, I cannot vote for that candidate.
 
you're not alone, i have agreed with everything you said.

its just that some of these ignorant morons believe the shit thats fed to them daily.
 
haha it should say, just about all the media is run by democrats...

to drew, i agree, your view point is severely altered depending on where you get your news, that is why i draw my information from a couple of sources, talk radio, (jason lewis, listen to his show with an open mind, i dare you:) TV i watch an even split of fox and CNN..

and print, all i have is the star and urinal..
 
the thing you gotta understand even if its written in a different country there is somebody behind it with money that is on one side. the world is fucked up im sorry.
 
ya im just saying unless you know first hand its so hard to know what is true and not true these days!
 
the only way to achieve change and make democracy real is to start a process of constant questioning, permanent provocation, and continuous public conversation between citizens and the state. It's a conversation quite different from the conversation between rivaling political parties, the one so conveniently placed upon your finger tips each day by the corporate media. It's as if the virtual world has become more real than the real world. I don't think enough people realize the leverage they have by letting their, voice, their opinion be heard, not on an internet forum, but by mailing, emailing, calling, if possible meeting with their congressman and women, senators, etc. imagine if all 300 million americans were actively involved with the state.
 
im pretty sure the convo has progressed beyond this, and i didnt read all the thread, cause lets face it, it would have probably made my head hurt....

anyway, my point has to do with the original thread question- none of the candidates are gonna get us out of Iraq. even obama would do a very slow withdrawal, and doesn't have any sort of set timetable. he also has said that he would keep a military presence there to go after terrorist groups or whatever. in addition to that, he is in favor of increasing military size, which i assume would correlate with increased military spending, along with all his other types of spending.

so... the question should be, "since no candidate is gonna get us out of iraq, how will we reduce spending in other ways?"
 
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