Gear you Avoid

Bdoobz

Bdoobz

Member
Title pretty much sums it up. What companies/gear/whatever do you guys avoid? Bad experience with a company or other reasons?
 
14077856:itzPebbs said:
Line, Faction, J Skis, Full Tilt, and Virtika. All garbage made in China with no durability
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Full tilt isn’t all to bad depending on the boot. I’ve got a pair of cami Seth Morrison’s and they’re still holding up good. Virtika makes good insulated pants too.

I do agree about line though, they’re kinda shit. JSkis are flimsy too.

Also marker griffin bindings, anything Saga makes, and I generally avoiding any ski that isn’t moment, on3p, or Vishnu
 
Good Quality Brands: Deviation Works, J Skis, ON3p, Gilson Skis, Harvest Skis etc.

Bad Quality Brands: Line, Volkl, K2, Faction, etc.

**This post was edited on Nov 18th 2019 at 1:58:57pm

**This post was edited on Nov 18th 2019 at 1:59:37pm

**This post was edited on Nov 18th 2019 at 4:11:11pm

**This post was edited on Nov 30th 2019 at 3:18:10pm
 
14077923:ThatYoungSkiBum said:
All big brands have turned to shitty quality because of the scale of manufacturing, Big factories pumping out thousands of skis with finger linked cores, layup imperfections, etc. If you want the most durable products it has to be made in The USA, Next best is Canada. The quality from those two countries is just better period.
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I'm not trying to get into a pissing contest with this, but to claim that one country builds better skis than another country is simply not accurate and not factual. It's not about the physical location of the factory- it's about the factory itself, the people inside it, and the attention to detail that the factory cares to put in. Another often overlooked point that matters is what price point you are trying to build a ski for. Making 1,000$ skis is awesome and super fun, but probably the hardest R&D nut to crack is to make a cheap, durable ski (think something around 299$), sell to retailers (not direct to consumer), and still turn a profit. Unsuccessful products in this area happen because brands are trying to do the almost impossible. It has nothing to do with where the factory is located or that brand doesn't care or is out to try to screw skiers. Far from it. No matter the brand, every brand cares (perhaps some more than others, true)- no one works in this industry to get filthy rich. If that is someone's goal, they are in the wrong industry to begin with.
 
14077948:onenerdykid said:
I'm not trying to get into a pissing contest with this, but to claim that one country builds better skis than another country is simply not accurate and not factual. It's not about the physical location of the factory- it's about the factory itself, the people inside it, and the attention to detail that the factory cares to put in. Another often overlooked point that matters is what price point you are trying to build a ski for. Making 1,000$ skis is awesome and super fun, but probably the hardest R&D nut to crack is to make a cheap, durable ski (think something around 299$), sell to retailers (not direct to consumer), and still turn a profit. Unsuccessful products in this area happen because brands are trying to do the almost impossible. It has nothing to do with where the factory is located or that brand doesn't care or is out to try to screw skiers. Far from it. No matter the brand, every brand cares (perhaps some more than others, true)- no one works in this industry to get filthy rich. If that is someone's goal, they are in the wrong industry to begin with.
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I agree, I do think that Chinese factories can/will cut corners when they can. Finding a good factory and making sure there is constant oversight is the key thing for a quality product. I'm not going to write off a company making skis in China but i need to see the product/reviews about it first.
 
14077954:CLQ said:
I agree, I do think that Chinese factories can/will cut corners when they can. Finding a good factory and making sure there is constant oversight is the key thing for a quality product. I'm not going to write off a company making skis in China but i need to see the product/reviews about it first.
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They cut corners by using 8 year old kids. Vishnus are made in China and everyone wants them.
 
14077957:CatdickBojangles said:
They cut corners by using 8 year old kids. Vishnus are made in China and everyone wants them.
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Bold statement, I would love to hear your source on any ski company using 8 year old kids
 
used to be a saga fan, but have boycotted since their last episode of crap. switched to 686 and seems to be a better quality. only time will tell how long this 686 will last

recently ive avoid all brands that dont use 2.5 by 2.5 edges with 1.8mm base.i usually base what skis i buy on their construction and materials used. kind of stuck to kitten factory and on3p. however, i couldnt refuse a pair of dirt cheap line SFB brand new from last year so i snagged them. well see how long they last. seem like a fun ski

havent had good luck with marker, so i tend to stay away from them.

i also avoid full tilt. i used to be a fanboy until i went to a real bootfitter. Most pro fitters will tell you theyre not great (at least the ones ive spoken to). much better ride quality and features coming from other brands. especially with me being a bigger guy, 3 piece isnt my jam.
 
companies I support and trust: on3p, moment, dakine, 686, look PIVOT, tyrolia bindings, dalbello boots

Companies i dont: line, faction, full tilt, saga, marker
 
14077856:itzPebbs said:
Line, Faction, J Skis, Full Tilt, and Virtika. All garbage made in China with no durability
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Can’t rip on brands just because of where their skis are made. Vishnu’s are Chinese and mine only have 2 edge cracks after 3 seasons of abuse
 
Saga seems to produce the worst quality I have ever used. Its more like toy gear the way it falls apart.

I avoid any ski producer that isn't in the States, because I want to support these guys. I end up with Moments or ON3P's pretty much always. A lot of companies, like Armada, just pay another manufacturer to make skis for them abroad. I think its pretty fuckin' rad that there's guys in my backyard designing and making skis that are unique and top notch quality, who actually ski these skis on the same terrain I ride, who will talk to you about the skis they make and explain their process. I broke a ski made by one of these companies and it was questionable whether it was a warranty issue - but they were like here you go, new set of skis no problem.
 
As bad as it sounds, I avoid gear with dad or Jerry stereotypes such as Spyder (imo total dad and rich guy gear even though it's really not that different in price). Same concept for DPS even though I've heard they can be pretty badass skis; wouldn't pay that much anyway. Although I copped a pair of red spyder pants at goodwill for $17 basically brand new, baggy, and has cargo patch pockets, so I bought the one brand I hate for no good reason lol. Hypocrite

I avoid marker now because Newschoolers tells me to although I used marker bindings before and never had issues with them.

I avoid Rossignol anything because even if it's their top of the line shit, I will always think of ski resort rentals because growing up those were the rentals that resorts carried.

I used to avoid Patagonia because the rage was so outrageously annoying. But now I have a few jackets and they're dope. Same for North Face.

I avoid Saga because I highly dislike their designs and I think their clothing looks cheesy, same for Jibberish. Now avoiding Saga for another reason. Avoiding backcountry.com for a good reason.

Anything "heated" avoid.

And any company that claims to make "ski socks" but they're cotton...
 
Line cause they're either toy skis or overpriced. some of them used to have extruded bases ffs

J Skis cause they're tacky and i don't see why they sell skis for top shelf prices but also act like they're some small fledgling company that can't properly sponsor skiers

salomon bindings that aren't STHs or the old metal 916s cause ive had too many salomons blow up on me without good cause

marker bindings cause theyre fuckin gay
 
Saga because the quality is literally laughable.

Full Tilt for the same reason. Plus the slogan “comfort is performance” is by far the dumbest thing a boot manufacturer has ever said.

Armada skis really aren’t all that great. My dollos were basically unridable before the end of the season.

Jiberish because the quality has really gone gone down the shitter
 
14078396:SofaKingSick said:
Line cause they're either toy skis or overpriced. some of them used to have extruded bases ffs

J Skis cause they're tacky and i don't see why they sell skis for top shelf prices but also act like they're some small fledgling company that can't properly sponsor skiers

salomon bindings that aren't STHs or the old metal 916s cause ive had too many salomons blow up on me without good cause

marker bindings cause theyre fuckin gay
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Marker bindings are gay? explain please...
 
14078721:BigTexas said:
Marker bindings are gay? explain please...
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it's somewhat in jest, i just have fun hating on them cause i think they're tacky but i've just experienced, witnessed, and heard so many stories of markers being undependable (even more so before the royal family bindings but definitely still with those) despite the non-discount prices they sell for
 
14078396:SofaKingSick said:
J Skis cause they're tacky and i don't see why they sell skis for top shelf prices but also act like they're some small fledgling company that can't properly sponsor skiers
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big facts right here
 
Bindings in their first year of production. Shifts, old and new dukes, and others usually have initial problems and they're super expensive
 
14078912:sambuswell said:
Bindings in their first year of production. Shifts, old and new dukes, and others usually have initial problems and they're super expensive
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This is about it for me. I've gotten lucky with my Kingpins but I know others didn't.

Same can be said for some AT boots where the walk-mode was significantly changed. Less common for sure though.
 
14077961:CLQ said:
Bold statement, I would love to hear your source on any ski company using 8 year old kids
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I bet Bogner makes a ski with a core made out of ground up Chinese kids.
 
14078396:SofaKingSick said:
Line cause they're either toy skis or overpriced. some of them used to have extruded bases ffs

J Skis cause they're tacky and i don't see why they sell skis for top shelf prices but also act like they're some small fledgling company that can't properly sponsor skiers

salomon bindings that aren't STHs or the old metal 916s cause ive had too many salomons blow up on me without good cause

marker bindings cause theyre fuckin gay
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You’re using gay as an insult in 2019 and calling OTHER people tacky?
 
14078951:NinetyFour said:
This is a super old instance of a bad product:

https://www.wildsnow.com/2888/salomon-quest-tech-fittings-failure/

Does anyone else remember that? Didn't it cost a guy a leg or something?
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Yeah here;s the thread on TGR- https://www.tetongravity.com/forums/showthread.php/191256-Salomon-Quest-Tech-inserts-failure-thread
I just had a team of surgeons come in and tell me that they are cancelling the rest of my scheduled surgeries for right now and will now need to replace my entire femur/knee and then follow up with multiple surgeries to repair every ligament and tendon in my knee area, cause they all have been completely torn. They labeled it as one of the worst ski accident they have seen. And despite what they initially thought of being able to reuse my old bone mass, they now have concluded that there was just too much damage and lost bone to make enough of surface to make it worth while. And walking again with out assistance is going to be difficult. My knee may bend again but not without pain and crunching constantly and severe arthritis is imminent. Looks like my outdoor recreational pursuit days may be over.
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Confused on why people hate on Faction, itsl seems their durability has been fixed and is on par with other brands, but still nothing insane
 
14079329:LukeTheWaffle said:
Confused on why people hate on Faction, itsl seems their durability has been fixed and is on par with other brands, but still nothing insane
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The perception that for a couple years of production their skis were snapping like twigs will damage the reputation of a ski brand, especially to this market where people beat their skis really hard.
 
Brands we avoid... companies that aren't actually participating in the categories of skis they make (or ones that get in, then leave freestyle).. and brands without an active NS account ;)

to note some above comments.

yikes! sorry for existing ha! The amount and length of time we've been in freestyle produces a bigger set of people who have an opinion on the brand and our gear (which is great). We're glad we are able to create that, keeps us honest and helps push us forward.

Also, IMO where something is made derives the quality is pale in comparison to engineering and resources to develop a great consistent product (and actually deliver it on time). Speaking about LINE, we have a lot of resources, own our factory and have a very large development & test center in Seattle coupled with a bunch of smart people who are skiers (and NS members) who make it.

always feel free to ask any questions if you have them. -jm
 
14078951:NinetyFour said:
This is a super old instance of a bad product:

https://www.wildsnow.com/2888/salomon-quest-tech-fittings-failure/

Does anyone else remember that? Didn't it cost a guy a leg or something?
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no my friend did not loose his leg

yes it did cost ameri sports an arm and a leg to legally compensate the person whose ill thought, out ,not really vetted or tested,

save a couple bucks with shitty fucking tech inserts ski boot to replace knees and other surgerys

yes Sick Rick Armstrong is a turd for joining tgr to shill shit products and never offering an apology

yes he did git knees replaced

no he probably wont ever be able to ski at the same level as before the incident

yes he can still slay some pow pows

 
I wouldn't say I outright avoid any particular brand. Line in 2012 was complete shit. I always had good luck with their skis before then. Never seen anything as bad as the 2012 skis from them recently.

I purchase products that fit what I am looking for, whether that be quality, style, fit, shape etc. My next pair of park skis will most likely be Dynastar Menace 98's because that ski feels great and looks perfect for what I want. Is Dynastar "core" or cool? No. I don't care because everything about that ski is screaming my name.

I'm not a fan of the royal series of Marker bindings, but I have two pairs of skis mounted with them.

I avoid Salomon skis. The QST may be one of my least favorite lines of skis. But I sold a shit load of them when I worked in the ski shops. It's all about what and who the product is good for.

Take note, we are a very small group who puts durability to the test of all the equipment we ski. Just because we break them does not mean they are "bad" products, they will work well for a lot of the skiing population. That being said, Saga quality is trash. Stitching, buttons, and everything fell off and apart without even skiing.
 
Rossi's gimmicks have gotten really stale lol. Im hoping that black ops marketing campaign they had a few years ago when the ski was being made in limited quantities was a joke because at that time there were TONS of similar freeski/jib-specific pow skis on the market that do that skis job just as good, if not better.......But it guess it was something groundbreaking for rossignol.

The only bindings I have experience with from Salomon though are STH Drivers and the STH2 16s which have been nothing but solid, I like those toe pieces a lot for some reason

**This post was edited on Nov 23rd 2019 at 12:23:21pm
 
14079694:Lemuel said:
I wouldn't say I outright avoid any particular brand. Line in 2012 was complete shit. I always had good luck with their skis before then. Never seen anything as bad as the 2012 skis from them recently.

I purchase products that fit what I am looking for, whether that be quality, style, fit, shape etc. My next pair of park skis will most likely be Dynastar Menace 98's because that ski feels great and looks perfect for what I want. Is Dynastar "core" or cool? No. I don't care because everything about that ski is screaming my name.

I'm not a fan of the royal series of Marker bindings, but I have two pairs of skis mounted with them.

I avoid Salomon skis. The QST may be one of my least favorite lines of skis. But I sold a shit load of them when I worked in the ski shops. It's all about what and who the product is good for.

Take note, we are a very small group who puts durability to the test of all the equipment we ski. Just because we break them does not mean they are "bad" products, they will work well for a lot of the skiing population. That being said, Saga quality is trash. Stitching, buttons, and everything fell off and apart without even skiing.
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why do you avoid the the qst line
 
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