"FUCK Vail" vs "EH Alrite" vs "YES vail"

iskeaah

iskeaah

Member
WHAT ARE PEOPLES THOUGHTS OF VAIL BUYING OUT SKI AREAS... I can see pros and cons of both. One being that the ski area gets huge upgrade on chairlifts and better terrain park maintenance. The pass (Epic pass or epic local) thousand dollars or the 500 dollars with blackout dates at big resorts costs a bit but makes sense because you can justify your purchase by only going to the mountain 6 times... This pass even makes sense if you are just going on a longer trip to one mountain or traveling to the many resorts bought out by Vail. The cons though include the massive day pass prices from 70 to upwards of a 100 dollars. Thanks for all opinions. Just wondering because I hate friends on both sides of the fence.
 
I just dont want the vail crowds in salt lake. Although the ikon pass is going to bring then here anyway but I feel like ikon pass isnt as popular as vail yet.
 
13960239:BigPurpleSkiSuit said:
I just dont want the vail crowds in salt lake. Although the ikon pass is going to bring then here anyway but I feel like ikon pass isnt as popular as vail yet.
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I agree... The lines in Washington are always bad so it kinda doesn't matter. I guess will see in a few weeks
 
People have been bitching about vail forever about everything. It's not creative and it's boring.

We get it, something something corporations. A ton of mtns are corporate or conglomerates. A ton of mtns charge $$$ for food etc. Idk. Ive worked at the smallest and biggest places. Everything has it's perks. People have different preference but "liek omg i hate vail" was played a decade ago.

Now go occupy wallstreet or something.
 
13960254:theabortionator said:
People have been bitching about vail forever about everything. It's not creative and it's boring.

We get it, something something corporations. A ton of mtns are corporate or conglomerates. A ton of mtns charge $$$ for food etc. Idk. Ive worked at the smallest and biggest places. Everything has it's perks. People have different preference but "liek omg i hate vail" was played a decade ago.

Now go occupy wallstreet or something.
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lol
 
well i can b a lil dissapointed with vail for buying northstar cuz ever since then the parks has been lowkey shitty compared to what it used to be. But at the same time they have like breck and shit, so i mean i have mixed opinions.
 
You can’t deny that the epic ikon passes are hugely beneficial to us as skiers. The amount of mountains you get access to for $500-700 just wasn’t a thing in the past. It’s such a good deal for us.

I dislike that they ruin local mountain cultures though and put yellowjackets everywhere but this is the price we pay for access and relatively cheap season passes.
 
13960264:crisscross said:
well i can b a lil dissapointed with vail for buying northstar cuz ever since then the parks has been lowkey shitty compared to what it used to be. But at the same time they have like breck and shit, so i mean i have mixed opinions.
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Vail bought Northstar 8 or 9 years ago. How old are you?

No big park shoots and the park isn't marketed at all really but still prety solid. Also several people building now were there before Vail bought it.

Also as far as mtns that just declined hard fast Buttermilk is a solid one. Luckily snowmass (same company) is building some sick shit. Wish they had a better trail for it but really solid builds.

Buyouts or cutting park funding killed a few old east coast hubs too.

Idk. I just feel like Vail ends up being a scapegoat for everything. Its not that I agree with everything Vail does, I just find it odd that they're such a target.

Idk. I don't think I'll ever understand it.
 
I could care less who buys who, but the problem is that it reduces competition and raises prices. Think of cell phone mergers and cable mergers; same concept. When did $80 for a cell phone bill become acceptable? When did $200+ for a cable bill turn into a value? When you have a place that's known for exorbitant prices already, spreading that elsewhere and reducing their competition allows them to do basically whatever the heck they want. I totally understand where people are coming from when their local mountains get bought up, and turn a bit more corporate rich America. Food prices go up. Season passes go up. The mountain gets a few more enforced rules. On the flip side, it likely does bring more tourism to the area and boost the economy because the corporate places have these big passes that people will buy and travel to. It also opens up more jobs for any of you who want to work at resorts.

$1000 is quite a bit especially for most Americans who have an average annual before taxes household income of around 50k. For many individuals it's half that. I will say, the local pass isn't horrible as it is similar to average season passes and allows some access elsewhere too for $700. Still imo you gotta ski a decent amount to make a season pass worth it; my goal would be at least less than $30/day for a good mountain and less than $15-20 for a small crappy place.

The people who should be complaining are the ones buying day passes. $100-200 is downright outrageous. I remember I went to Stowe the first and only time, and had to pay $130 window ticket price because I didn't buy the even still pricey $100 ticket online. I probably spent close to a season pass with all the day passes I bought last year; a season pass to everywhere would be sweet for the traveler. The Ikon pass definitely wins imo for the frequent traveler category.

Going skiing somewhere and buying day tickets, lodging, food, rentals (if ya need em) is like a fucking Disney vacation. All it does it serve to restrict new people from joining the sport or current people from progressing. Skiing is more so a rich person's sport than ever before.

I do love how their idea of adult starts at 13....it should be 18. At least have a teen ticket tier for fuck sakes.
 
I used to live near Vail and that shit sucks. I don't know what their other resorts would look like if they get bought out by them, but as a park skier I was extremely disappointed with the park situation. They really only had one park worth riding and the jumps were trash, the rails were OK but nothing special. Also the park staff never maintained the park or fixed any cruddy features that they put in that no one would hit. Not to mention the god damn yellow jackets. They nearly took my pass many times, took two of my buddies, and just ruined my day every time I had a run in with them. I don't think there is much you can do if they buy out your local, but I do feel for ya if you are anything like me. I quickly found myself missing the east coast. FUCK vail.

**This post was edited on Nov 13th 2018 at 9:33:17am

**This post was edited on Nov 13th 2018 at 9:33:52am
 
I could give a laundry list of why Vail Sucks and why Vail is awesome but that’s beating a dead horse.

I bought an Icon pass. I’m a weekend skier and travel. I live in Park City and don’t want to ski Vail owned. So best pass for me.
 
13960330:SkiBum. said:
I could give a laundry list of why Vail Sucks and why Vail is awesome but that’s beating a dead horse.

I bought an Icon pass. I’m a weekend skier and travel. I live in Park City and don’t want to ski Vail owned. So best pass for me.
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Yea I get ya, I just kinda wanted to share my experience of being at Vail. I honestly don't even know if Vail owned resorts are the same, but I can say if they are anything like Vail, I am not interested in giving them any of my money. I just moved to Minnesota so I'm pretty stoked on riding a good park all day and even night I think.
 
13960341:harambe420 said:
Yea I get ya, I just kinda wanted to share my experience of being at Vail. I honestly don't even know if Vail owned resorts are the same, but I can say if they are anything like Vail, I am not interested in giving them any of my money. I just moved to Minnesota so I'm pretty stoked on riding a good park all day and even night I think.
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Vail’s blueprint is very similar at all Vail owned resorts. If you dropped Joe from Texas in the middle of a Vail owned resort he would have a hard time telling you if it was Park City, Breckenridge, Northstar. They have even copied restaurant layouts and designs from resort to resort. Boring, yes. Profitable and smart, yes. Take away all feel from a resort, yes.
 
13960271:Rum_Ham said:
I dislike that they ruin local mountain cultures though and put yellowjackets everywhere but this is the price we pay for access and relatively cheap season passes.
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This one depends - Some mountains can keep most autonomy over their operations. e.g. A Basin has been on Vail passes a while but I'm pretty sure they're not owned outright by Vail, no yellow jackets, etc. With the Ikon pass, Ikon doesn't own the mtns like Vail so those mountains will hopefully maintain their independence while also benefitting from a broadened market.
 
Crested butte is the only one that worries me. I dont think vail will do anything that woudnt have or coudnt have eventually happened but will def accelerate it.

Idk i really like that place.

Also as far as passes I dig the collective deals more than the one company. I remember before aspen became Alterra, they were on the mtn collective. Road a bunch of different spots fo free but they were all still their own.
 
The only real problem I have with vail is in most cases they get rid of most cool grass root events at mountains which kinda sucks
 
Rob Katz moved a ski company from the mountains to a suburb. That pretty much says it all. Vail caters to the greatest amount of people, which is good for a business perspective. The newest Star Wars/Marvel/Michael Bay movie isn't winning Oscars, but thats not the point. All about that money.
 
13960543:aleclawrencee said:
The only real problem I have with vail is in most cases they get rid of most cool grass root events at mountains which kinda sucks
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They “take away” stuff that doesn’t make money, doesn’t fit their portfolio or isn’t a partner or sponsor of them.

Example - team riders/skiers. All of Vail maybe has 3-5 paid athletes.

Example - Starbucks. No local coffee, Starbucks brand and signs at all coffee locations.

The Vail resort in my backyard seems to still have concerts, beer gardens, stuff like that.
 
13960416:toast said:
This one depends - Some mountains can keep most autonomy over their operations. e.g. A Basin has been on Vail passes a while but I'm pretty sure they're not owned outright by Vail, no yellow jackets, etc. With the Ikon pass, Ikon doesn't own the mtns like Vail so those mountains will hopefully maintain their independence while also benefitting from a broadened market.
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Yep Abasin is owned by the Canadian real estate company, Dream Unlimited Corp
 
Blame Winter Park for starting it, not Vail. In the 98-99 season, WP implemented the $800 Buddy Pass which is where Katz got the idea for the Epic pass. The Buddy Pass cost $1,200+ in today's dollars and Katz price matched WP.
 
13960659:FullSendBud said:
What the fuck are yellow jackets. The ski police??? Bees???
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Yup ski police. They only seem to go after good skiers who are in control but going fast instead of gapers tucking down a crowded run.
 
13960403:SkiBum. said:
Vail’s blueprint is very similar at all Vail owned resorts. If you dropped Joe from Texas in the middle of a Vail owned resort he would have a hard time telling you if it was Park City, Breckenridge, Northstar. They have even copied restaurant layouts and designs from resort to resort. Boring, yes. Profitable and smart, yes. Take away all feel from a resort, yes.
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Dude that is so fucked man, I mean I get it, but skiing shouldn't be like that.
 
13960593:SkiBum. said:
They “take away” stuff that doesn’t make money, doesn’t fit their portfolio or isn’t a partner or sponsor of them.

Example - team riders/skiers. All of Vail maybe has 3-5 paid athletes.

Example - Starbucks. No local coffee, Starbucks brand and signs at all coffee locations.

The Vail resort in my backyard seems to still have concerts, beer gardens, stuff like that.
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Yeah, damn I forgot about team skiers. There used to be a dope like, Team Summit, maybe? I remember there was a big board at the bottom of chair 5 at Breck and it had all of the pro's names, def Bobby Brown and Woodsy and bunch more. They even gave love to smaller local riders for a while and would put on a yearly sunrise park shoot at Breck. And all of the painted lift towers at PC.... bummer.

And of course, bye bye to all of the park shoots that used to happen at Breck and Keystone. Damn, not cool stuff to think about.
 
After dealing with there so called customer service trying to get a problem with my pass upgrade fixed I am firmly in the FUCK Vail forever camp the sad part is the bastards now have my life long favorite mountain.Vail sucks big time
 
I'm not a fan of Vail buying somewhere and then turning the mountain and town into a "Vail" resort marketed to the same rich people that travel around to other "Vail" resorts. With Vail comes the droves of tourists which cause new hotels, condos and what not. Ski towns then lose a lot of their character and it becomes harder for there to be true locals there. I understand that this maybe isn't just a Vail issue and indicative of a larger trend of ski towns becoming more expensive and inaccessible to more people but I think Vail speeds the process up.
 
Crap the more I read the more I realize it is time to get back into the back country skiing is doomed.Vail Sucks
 
14071666:SkiBum. said:
That’s because no one goes to Stowe to ski park
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I personally know many kids who not only grew up skiing park at Stowe but still ski there for park. They literally have a freeskiing academy there: "Skifuture" where Ian Compton was a coach.
 
Anyone know if there are any mountains on both the Epic and Ikon pass? I have the ikon but have friends in Colorado with the epic.
 
14071676:J_Steez said:
I personally know many kids who not only grew up skiing park at Stowe but still ski there for park. They literally have a freeskiing academy there: "Skifuture" where Ian Compton was a coach.
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Stowe is the Beaver Creek of the east. The money is not coming from the park. And the parks are not a priority. The1% of kids that go there to ski park are also not the priority.
 
I had to deal with Vail so called customer service recently.You get a real sense of what they are about make the sale and then you are nothing to them.I upgraded my pass and the agent said now when you get off log on and upload your photo.When I went to site to upload I noticed my name spelled wrong I called back and explained there was a mistake,this was minutes later mind you.The agent said we cannot help you,you must go to a Vail resort with 3 forms of id .I told the agent I have no pass it was ordered minutes ago.No sorry we can’t do that.I said you got my name correct on credit card.What a bunch of boneheads.Vail SUCKS
 
And lookout the yellow jackets are coming.A crew made up of all the kids who got beat up in high school and could not get jobs as security guards
 
Vail only cares about one thing and one thing Only, its their Stockholders, so in order to make them happy they cater to the 1%. While they do some good and mask it with their charities and so on and so forth, the end of the day they are a business and only care about profits, so while some places will go down hill for the vibe others will thrive, when they take over local mountains the local aspect is lost all together after a few years. They do it because they can and its their formula, its not going to change, the only good changes Vail brings is the money behind them to help update infrastructure at mountains but overall there's nothing stopping them out there so in my opinion they will be a complete takeover at one point.
 
Stop Vail the yellow jackets are coming the yellow jackets are coming.Can believe they have my local favorite now.But all hope is not lost at least they may draw the fashion crowd away from some of the free from oppression mountains
 
You can always tell how lousy a corporation is when they hide behind 1 phone number and a general email address that nobody ever response to.Keep on Sucking Vail
 
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