European oppinion...

Kotelet

Active member
I can't tell you how disappointed, sad and even frustrated I am that Americans went ahead and reelected Bush.

As an ex-conservative pointed out on CNN:

Before the reelection there was a clear distinction between Anti-Americanisim and ''Anti-Bush'ism''... Just because many people hated and/or were against Bush, didn't mean they hated and/or had anything against Americans in general.

Now that Americans have reelected Bush, with such a majority of votes (is it about 3-4 million?), this distinction has almost disappeared, many Europeans now consider Bush and the American people to be equal, and they share an equal amount of hate towards Bush as to the Americans.

Wether you care about this fact or not, is not what this post is about. This is merely and attempt to show my, and my fellow European friends', grave disappointment towards the US after this election.

May someone save us all...

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f*ck Bush
 
republicans for kerry...man i hate bush

_____________________________________________________

It tastes so good when it hits your lips.

 
thanks bush. i really appreciate what you've done for our country you asshole.

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Good Fun With A Hand Gun.

Future Canadian
 
hes fiscaly irresponseable, he will not make it through this term i believe.

'what?' Lauren every time you ask her a question for the first time!

skiing what i thought this was a porn site and every one i was talking to were sexy ppl ..i thought skiing was a sex term we all uesed. damn!-twintiprider

 
I concur. I have yet to talk to some other people I know from abroad to get a sense of what other nations are feeling. (South Korea, France, Canada, China, Canada)

This is disturbing, this is good.

As most of you may know by now, I'm a liberal, and by in large against Bush. This is disturbing because the thought that trends from the first term will be carried on to the second is frightening - white house secrecy, sparatic communication between burueas, poor maintenance of international relationships, I could go on but I won't saturate the post with such a list. You get the idea.

This may be good, because well, I have not lost total faith in the our democracy, despite the fact that Congress has now been slicked up to streamline the passing of the Bush agenda, I still like to believe that we will have enough loyal dissidence to keep legislation progressive, just, and intelligent. Dually so, I also hope that Bush, in the perpetually present attempt as with all 2nd term presidents, try to create a lasting and positive legacy, free of stains. We are too much involved in the middle east to retract now, we too much involved in many crises at home and abroad to retract from anything. Hopefully, out of the next four years we will see some positive changes.

(In honor of JD, a disclaimer; this post in now way represents my retraction of my values or political stance, I do NOT now favor the Bush administration, instead I sincerely hope that we will see positive changes in the coming years, after all that is all that can be hoped for.)

-AndrewP

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Per solitudinem ardere in remedium formidinis dictitabat.

'It is often said that the best remedy for fear is to burn alone.'

 
Well, the last time I checked Americans elected the American president.

First one on the lift, last one off.

Bush-Cheney '04

NS Idiot of the Week: benditto

 
Last time I checked America policed the world. Oh wait, that was a movie, nevermind.

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Rowen

'Aren't you Buzz Lightyear?'

*whispers* 'I love your movies!'

'URAAAAFWAAAGAAA!!!'

 
i'm going to go ahead and hijack this post with a nice long article:

Global memo to Bush: Be involved, but not bossy

By Peter Ford | Staff writer of The Christian Science Monitor

PARIS – The American people may have been deeply divided over their choice of leader, but the rest of the world is remarkably unanimous in its message to the new US president: 'Don't ignore us.'

'But don't boss us around, either,' say political analysts and ordinary citizens from China to Brazil, asked for their advice to the newly reelected President Bush as he looks forward to a second term of office likely to be dominated by the global 'war on terror.'

Few other countries would have chosen George W. Bush over John Kerry, international polls have revealed. But nobody anywhere doubts the impact that the US president has on his or her life.





11/04/2004

The GOP edge grows wider

A deepening divide between red and blue

GOP gains, but Congress still riven

Governor and statehouse races amplify a split nation

Welcome to the Year of the Voter

In Ohio, the electoral mayhem that didn't happen

A drubbing for same-sex marriage

Initiatives could set tone for national movements

Hanging in the balance in Ohio

If there is one task to which foreigners would like to see Mr. Bush devote himself, to judge by dozens of interviews on four continents, it is to restore America's reputation as a fair and honest arbiter of world affairs, damaged by what many abroad see as the administration's tendency to throw its weight around in its own narrow interests.

'Given that the president heads the most powerful nation in the world but that it has the worst reputation of all time, there is a paradox,' says Stanley Symington, a retired marketing executive in England. 'He should pay more attention to restoring America's reputation in the world, rather than to guarding its security.'

It would help, suggests Jagjit Bagga, as he walks around a fashionable shopping center in New Delhi, if the president adopted a more diplomatic tone with the rest of the world. 'America shouldn't be arrogant when it deals with other countries,' he says. 'It comes across that what they choose to do, they will do it and then expect others to follow.'

That perception undermines international support for American goals, though many people in many countries share them, says Jeanne Lescure, a retired French Metro worker. 'I understand that Bush is worried about security,' she says. 'We are all worried about it. But he goes about things the wrong way.'

A more productive approach, suggests Karsten Voigt, a top adviser to German Chancellor Gerhard Schröder, would be to pay more attention to America's friends.

'In the end even the world superpower USA needs allies and they can't get any better ones than the Europeans,' he told German radio on Wednesday. 'And in order to have Europe on their side they need to keep an open ear to our arguments.'

The most immediate and crucial test of such efforts, it is widely felt, will come in Iraq, now that even the fiercest opponents of the US-led invasion fear for the international fallout if Baghdad descends into civil war.

'If I could sit down with Bush, the first thing I would do is see how he could leave Iraq in a coherent fashion, with his head high and without dividing the European allies,' says Catherine Durandin, an analyst at the Institute for International and Strategic Relations, a think tank in Paris.

That is a goal broadly shared in the Middle East. 'This is the issue I care most about,' says Sumer Said, a young Egyptian woman who stayed up all night with friends in Cairo to watch the election returns. 'I want to see the American forces leave as soon as possible. But it shouldn't be immediately because then there would be chaos. The best thing the American president could do would be to set a timetable for withdrawal.'

On very different issues, Latin Americans would also like to see more cooperation from Washington. In particular, they want the US to negotiate a planned free trade agreement 'not as another instrument designed to benefit the USA, but rather as something to benefit the continent as a whole,' says Geraldo Monteiro, who teaches at the State University of Rio de Janeiro in Brazil.

US subsidies and tariffs on products such as orange juice, steel, and grain hobble their exporters, Brazilians argue. 'Brazil has great potential and I think the United States should recognize that and stop retaliating,' says Ronaldo Amaral, a teacher. 'Then we can export and go head to head with the US.'

Trade and investment issues top people's agendas in other developing countries too. In India, for example, New Delhi is anxious to see Washington loosen up import and export regulations and resist the popular urge to punish US firms that close factories and call-centers at home to set up shop overseas.

'As far as most Indians are concerned, economic issues are more important than diplomatic issues,' says Anurag Agarwali, a corporate accountant.

The same is true of Africa. 'Don't give us more aid money,' advises headhunter Peter Lotter as he sips a coffee in a Johannesburg mall. 'Help us get more factories.'

Washington could also help by expanding a US law that allows African countries making progress towards good government to export certain goods - from clothing to gum arabic - duty free to the United States. 'The only way to get African governments and dictators to recognize that the day of their fiefdoms is over is by waving a big carrot in front of them,' argues Raymond Louw, editor of Southern Africa report.

Beyond issues where the next US president could demonstrate his respect for global concerns rather than US interests, two eastern giants would like Washington to clarify its attitudes towards them.

One is China, whose relations with the US got off to a rocky start when Bush first took office over trade disputes, Taiwan's status, and a downed US spy plane.

'First of all, the administration should realize that China is a partner, not a competitor,' says Jia Qingguo, associate dean of international studies at Beijing University. 'They need to make this a strategic and consistent decision.'

The other is Russia, where the government's increasingly authoritarian approach appears to have given US policymakers pause for thought. 'It is time for America to decide whether Russia is a democratic market economy that could become a full partner, or whether it views Russia as something else entirely,' says Mr. Kremeniuk. 'On the basis of that assessment, set a strategy we can all work with.'

In Western Europe, and particularly in France, the hope is that friends will not be treated as enemies. 'Just because we don't agree on everything we shouldn't be classed as enemies,' says Ludmilla Crestia, a French student. 'Bush does not see us as an ally and I'd like him to change his mind.'

In the Middle East, however, Palestinians and some Israelis would like to see the next US administration treat its friends a little more sternly. As Israeli Prime Minister Ariel Sharon prepares to pull out from Gaza, American 'pressure is needed so that the withdrawal will not be from Gaza only' but from the West Bank too, says Mordechai Bloom, an Israeli bookstore owner in Jerusalem.

'No American president has given more to the Israeli rightists than Bush,' complains Hafez Barghouthi, editor of the Palestinian daily Al-Hayat Al-Jadida. Now, he says, Washington should not allow Mr. Sharon to unilaterally withdraw from Gaza, and instead force him to negotiate a peace settlement with the Palestinian Authority.

It is not only the Israelis and Palestinians who need America to resolve their problems, argues Ms. Durandin, the French political analyst. Given its overwhelming power, 'we all need America,' she says. 'And there is a great desire, all over the world, to recognize an America we can like.'

• Scott Baldauf in New Delhi; Andrew Downie in Rio de Janeiro; Ben Lynfield in Jerusalem; Abraham McLaughlin in Johannesburg, South Africa; Kathleen McLaughlin in Shanghai, China; Dan Murphy in Cairo; Mark Rice-Oxley in London; Andreas Tzortzis in Berlin; and Fred Weir in Moscow contributed to this report.

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You know the Nazis had pieces of flair that they made the Jews wear.

once back when i was a fetus i was aborted. it didn't hurt at all, but i was also high on life at the time. - thisangelicrage

its not rape....its surprise sex. you wake up and SURPRISE you had sex with me haha - huckster989

liberals think killing babies can be both fun and profitable, while conservatives think killing foreigners can be both fun and profitable - ice-is-scary
 
as a Canadian that was my first thought upon hearing about this majority election. the american people have officially validated and approved of the actions of the Bush administration. for many people across the globe i think it will now be hard to keep hatred for one from becoming hatred for the other. of course there are plenty of americans who still oppose this president, but the fact that the majority do not after all that has happened is VERY disturbing

P.O.W.D.E.R.

Playas Of Winter Downhill Expert Riders
 
See what most of you fail to realize is no one has a problem with a post like ECs it is critical and opitimsitic of the president. I understand he doesnt like bush and will continue to be critical but will at least give him a chance others on here who give no such hope are just as bad for America as they feel bush is! We need to do this united whether you like it or not.

Pete is currently sulking around Mt. Hood, shooting with Poor Boyz Productions and hitting on Kristi Leskinen. She hates guys, Pete lamented, so it’s not going good. Apparently Canada isn’t the only thing that’s tough for Pete to get into.

-kamikaze

 
as an american (no, im not proud of it), i apologize to the rest of the world for what they republicans in this country have done. my country has been hijacked by neoconservatives, and i have no control over that. i will remind you that 49% of americans voted against bush

skiing is life

without skiing i would have no life

hey, the fis is progressing. now you can only throw 2 twisters in a mogul comp.
 
believe me, im disapointed in us too. honestly, my first emotion upon learning that republicans controlled the senate, the house, and the presidency, was fear. they have this country by the balls and can drag it anywhere, no matter how mmany people protest, they can do whatever they waant now. if they will is a different story but potentially, they can do whatever they damn well please

Logic Headware....temporary site is up, its about to blow up. where will you be?

Logic Headware

'rap aint about bustin caps and fuckin bitches, its about fluency and rapping ingenuity' Del
 
those that ignore history are doomed to repeat it. looking at regimes throught history, countries and empires fall when there is a weak leader(we have got one), and huge national debt (we have that too). so, if the usa colapses, ussr style, dont be suprised

skiing is life

without skiing i would have no life

hey, the fis is progressing. now you can only throw 2 twisters in a mogul comp.
 
^I think of all the things that Bush has been accused of being, it definately hasn't been of being a weak leader. I don't know why you are so ashamed of being an American, you were born into this country, and/or immigrated and achieved citizenship. Of all things you should take this place in time to be active in keeping your leaders in check. Write your congressman on a regular basis, keep tabs on what you feel is important. And when you see injustice make sure to point it out and pursue it instead of bitch about it. Bush's policies directly affect my life, and its longevity... I'm a Marine, yet I'm not ashamed to be an American; you, obviously have had a good life and have never felt what it is actually like to sacrifice, and look out for someone other than yourself. It's an American virtue, I hope you learn someday before you whine about your status as an American citizen.

'...Smoking's bad, smoking killed my dad. Yeah, he was driving down the highway one day and as he was lighting his cigarette, it blew out the window. So he jumps out the door to save it, and ran himself over. Uh, you mind if I smoke?' -Olie Ollaussen, Ski Bum extraordinaire
 
maybe if they knew how bad Senator Kerry was they would have picked President Bush too.

thats my 2 cents anyways

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FREEZE_POOTER HAS GOT A NEW ICON!?
 
Dude i love how ethnocentric so many Americans are, 'american is the best, we know the most, everyone else is so inferior.' such bullshit. This election just proved what everyone around the world though, america is full of idiots...

“Has you ever had an abortion? Surely you should try something before you say it is bad. Because I was very anti-Burger King, but then I went there and I had the flame grilled, ain’t it, and you know it was like amazing.� -Ali G
 
I don't think the word 'hatred' should be used so frequently. I am European and I dosapprove of Bush's policies and actions. The fact that the American voters went ahead and approved of them doesn't stir hatred in me. It makes me sad. Bush believes that America and its citizens are better than everyone else (don't believe me? listen to his state of the union adresses...'God touched the Earth in one place, and that is now the United...blah blah' I almost collapsed laughing). The American people just proved that they think so too. I can already see future complications based on this belief...

I'm sad

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EUROPE KICKS ASS

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Useless Fact of the Moment:

'The starfish is one of the only animals who can turn it's stomach inside-out. '

^hahaha ONE of the ONLY ahahaha lmao
 
Remember Europeans, only one part of the presidency effects you, foreign policy and trade. America looks at it not one dimensionally like they do, but we have to look at it from the domestic front. This election has big in that area too with faith and values playing a big part. When foreigners look at the election they just see foreign policy and if it is not the best they will say 'How could they vote for him.' But America votes on much more then that, and many times domestic issues are more important.

Politicaly Active Since 1992

'Soberity is not an option.'

Drivin that Train
 
Yea seriously im not saying i dont care about foreign policy but i clearly will look at domestic issues long beofre i am concerned with it

Pete is currently sulking around Mt. Hood, shooting with Poor Boyz Productions and hitting on Kristi Leskinen. She hates guys, Pete lamented, so it’s not going good. Apparently Canada isn’t the only thing that’s tough for Pete to get into.

-kamikaze

 
holy shit that was as incoherent as punk_rider, sorry I don't know how that happened, try and decipher it

Politicaly Active Since 1992

'Soberity is not an option.'

Drivin that Train
 
alright, so because it was a little hard I'll give you the benefit of the doubt. I think the jist was that Europeans are only affected by America's foreign policy and trade, so those are the only things they see in an election here being important. I dont know if they do, because I'm not european, but i would like to make it clear that Europe and the rest of the world are affected by other issues than that. The US economy is so big now that it effects others around the globe. We are a lone superpower, so of course the rest of the world is going to be affected by the US's decisions. It isnt just as simple as foreign policy and trade....

=================================

Rowen

'Aren't you Buzz Lightyear?'

*whispers* 'I love your movies!'

'URAAAAFWAAAGAAA!!!'

 
yes but taxes, gay marriage, healthcare, jobs, and education don't affect the rest of the world. Those issues solely affect us and would be greatly ignored by those outside.

Politicaly Active Since 1992

'Soberity is not an option.'

Drivin that Train
 
They all kinda do to some extent, especially jobs and education.

=================================

Rowen

'Aren't you Buzz Lightyear?'

*whispers* 'I love your movies!'

'URAAAAFWAAAGAAA!!!'

 
really, how? In what way is the European population affected by US jobs and our education system?

Politicaly Active Since 1992

'Soberity is not an option.'

Drivin that Train
 
I love when you label yourselves a lone superpower...it's great. how? japan and germany have just as powerful economies.andmilitarilly, if china decided to, they could literally crush any other country in the world

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EUROPE KICKS ASS

___________________

Useless Fact of the Moment:

'The starfish is one of the only animals who can turn it's stomach inside-out. '

^hahaha ONE of the ONLY ahahaha lmao
 
China is the only competition. Superpower is not just a large powerful economy or a large powerful military, but both. That cancels both Japan and Germany and only leaves China. Sure Japan and Germany have very powerful and strong economies, but they don't have a military that can rank up to us or China.

Politicaly Active Since 1992

'Soberity is not an option.'

Drivin that Train
 
sounds good, but the US can't abuse this postion because it wouldn't stand a coalition anyway...so what good does it nake?

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EUROPE KICKS ASS

___________________

Useless Fact of the Moment:

'The starfish is one of the only animals who can turn it's stomach inside-out. '

^hahaha ONE of the ONLY ahahaha lmao
 
In regards to crystals post. A lot of those things that other countries want. Such as removing the laws that punish corporations for moving to 3rd world countries. Well if bush removes those laws then people will cry. 'your send all the jobs overseas' You cant have your cake and eat it too. Of course people in brazil would like us to lower tariffs on imports of oranges, and other products but then we have to subsidize farmers here in America who are losing business over it. Will that be cheaper in the long run? What is more important, the prosperity of Americans or the prosperity of other people around the world who would love to expliot our economy with their dirt cheap labor. I think we need to take care of our interest's at home (not at the expense of other nations) before we worry about the rest of the worlds 'well-being'. The international community acts as if they should have a lot more say in how we run our country, we are not the hot girl at the party who gets passed around. We sacrificed a lot to be what we are and we arn't about to let it slide into medicrody for the sake of others who only wish to expliot our prosperity.

We pay our debt sometimes.
 
I'm not really pissed off about Bush winning the election. I feel kinda sad about it. Like how u feel when u see a retarded kid trying to get up some stairs but he cant make it. He tries and tries but just cant make it, It's a mix between sadness, empathy and pity. I am truly sorry for me and my fellow Americans that a person such as Bush got elected.

Fist US president in history to have a majority of the people of Europe (71%) view his presidency as the biggest threat to world peace and stability.

 
'-Part of that is that we as Americans don't see the effects of Bush's dangerous policies firsthand like many worldwide do.'

^cus that is propoganda at its finest

-STARMAN DIED IN VAIN!
 
we are so wrapped up in our little happy world, where there are no consequences for our actions, we dont even notice the people we screw over. sad

skiing is life

without skiing i would have no life

hey, the fis is progressing. now you can only throw 2 twisters in a mogul comp.
 
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