I wish this thread would just go away...there's roughly 3 pages of worthwhile material, and they've been completely buried by rampant idiocy.
It never ceases to amaze me that people refuse to read even the first few pages of a thread...this thread constantly gets bumped, and every single time it's by someone who clearly didn't take the time to at least skim the thread and they end up posting the same thing over and over again.
There have been a ton of great ideas posted, I'm going to C + P them here now, Also, it's clear that the development of a ski game by a major studio like EA (in a newschool sense anyway) is highly unlikely, But despite that, it's fun to fantasize and dream about one.
Soooo.....here's a highlight reel from this thread that hopefully people will actually look at:
MY MATERIAL:
I think most people are in favor of a relatively complex control scheme because it's ultimately more rewarding to master. The last thing I want, is a button masher. I want to feel like I'm improving.
This game is likely to never even be produced, why not think big and have fun considering the possibilities?
Why wouldn't the right analog/ollie system work for jumps? It works perfectly in SKATE, and it's much more intuitive than holding then releasing an arbitrary button. Also, it allows you to control the intensity of the pop as well as potentially to subtly alter the axis of rotation.
I agree that the GTA, open environment, explore the village idea is unnecessary and sort of takes away from what's important. Not to mention, it sounds like it would be incredibly difficult to execute. But, it would be nice to have the ability to click out of your bindings in a manner similar to Shaun White in order to hike a rail, access different locations, etc. Plus, I'd like to see some ridiculous yard sales.
The rail/jibbing system might need to be on the simple side, but I think upping the difficulty would make landing tech tricks just amazingly satisfying. I agree, that there shouldn't be a "lock on" button...grinding should be about simply taking the right angle and speed into a jib and timing the ollie. I still stand behind the idea of X/A corresponding to your feet and using your front foot to perform swaps. Obviously, if you spin on to a box and you want to then blind swap, or blind spin out, you wouldn't necessarily need to grip.
As a fun add-on, I think maybe a "Focus" mode would be cool. If executed right, it could avoid being cheesy. For example, maybe you have the ability to enter a slow-mo where you have greater control of your rail tricks after stomping a certain amount of tricks or just maintaining a really solid line. This of course would be optional, and would be best in small doses.
I can't stress how important the animations would/will be. I like the idea of choosing your "style": laid back vs. athletic/aggressive...it would really personalize the experience. Also, the game should recognize your preferences and respond to your tendencies. I haven't played Stoked, but I thought the "hucker" vs. "style" was a really great idea.
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Thoughts on controls (above all most important in my mind):
I'd like to see a complex control scheme ala SKATE, that features a fairly steep learning curve that encourages trial and error. I think what's so special about SKATE, is the sense of achievement you feel upon mastering tricks. I like the idea of aping the "different buttons correspond to different body parts" system used in skate.
I'm definitely in favor of a behind the skier view.
(XBOX360)
Riding:Left Analog (Body/Hips): Left and right control turns (pressure sensitive). Holding "up" causes the rider to take an aggressive stance/tuck. If the rider is in the flats or has completely stopped, up skates. Double tap to holding up causes the rider to sit on his/her tails for maximum speed into jumps. Pulling back (down), causes the rider to scrub speed (pressure sensitive) by snowplowing, or quick speed checks, to an all out hard stop by pulling all the way back.
Right Analog (Skis): Left and right, in conjunction with the left analog being pressed in the same direction, makes as sharp a turn as possible. Pulling all the way back or forward, causes the rider to prepare to pop off of either tails or noses respectively. A quick "SKATE ollie/nollie"movement=small pop, where as a slow and deliberate movement that allows the "crouch animation" to complete=max pop. Pushing halfway forward or back causes the rider to enter into a press. The degree/duration of press is dependent on skis used, and snow type. Buttering is accomplished by pulling halfway back* (*while riding forward, everything is reversed for switch riding/tail butter spins), then swiveling 180 degrees (left or right) to forward accompanied by pressing the Left Analog stick in the same direction. Amount of spin is affected by speed of movements, and terrain (doing so off of a knuckle or over a roller will cause you to spin more).
Digi pad
layer chosen gestures. Ideas: Down=rideaway/bang Up= fist pump/claim Right= Goggle fix/Headphone adjust Left= Pull Pants up/crotch grab thing others: Candide one arm behind back-slight crouch, pole clap, bird, sarcastic racer/gaper tuck, etc.
Back: Toggle i-pod controls --> at which point LB and RB skip through playlistY: Toggles TrailmapB: click in/out of bindings when stoppedLB/RB: Look left/right while skiing straightLT/RT: Handplant WHEN "quick" ollieing over a jib/knuckle. Player must pull back on left analog stick and press LT/RT/both to handdrag. Timing is critical. Releasing the trigger to late will cause the rider to fail to "pop" of his hand(s).X/A: Zoom in/out
In Air:Left Analog: 2 of the 3 rotation axis. After ollie/nollie Left and Right will cause the rider to spin upright. For bigger spins, the player must quickly throw the left analog stick in the opposite direction of the intended spin just prior to takeoff before throwing back in the other direction (direction of the spin). For non inverted off axis spins (bios and corks), the player rolls the left analog stick either forward or back respectively after setting the spin either left or right (at about 180). Up and Down cause the rider to flip. Diagonals control inverted spins (d-spin, rodeo, misty).
LB/RB: Control the 3rd axis of rotation. When pressed without the Left Analog stick, the rider will do a "ear to shoulder" lincoln loop. If used in conjunction with Left Analog, depending on timing, the rider will over/underflip. Experiment.
Digi Pad: customizable. Goof/old school tricks. up=superman, down=laid out backie, left=spread eagle, right=screamin'. others: urlacher, boner, mannequin (for zeros), rollin' the windows up, etc.
Right Analog: Controls "orientation" of skis. When not grabbing, left and right cause the rider to shifty/twist at hips. Pressing the Right Analog stick in the same direction as a spin will make the rider spin faster. Pressing forward will bring the noses up and forward towards rider (think lifting toes), back will drop the tips and bring the tails closer to the rider's butt (think curling toes down). "Orientation" of ski affects which grabs you will do....
LT/RT: Left/Right hands. Grabs! Either LT or RT alone will do a safety, both will do a truckdriver. When combined with the Right Analog stick, the rider will do different grabs. I won't list them all, and I think the "arsenal" should be customizable, but here are some ideas.LT/RT and down = Blunt/TrueTail, LTandRT and down = Octo, LT/RT and up = true nose, LTandRT and up = rocket/double nose...you get the picture.
B: bail!
On Rails:Case sensitive, controls affected by surface type and width.
All controls still apply, and jibbing is really just an extension of the control scheme and is open-ended.
For example: Popping and spinning onto a wideish box. If the rider 270s onto the box, he will continue to spin on the surface. Unleeesss......He grips the edge!! Which brings us to:
X/A (Left foot/Right foot): Scissor/grip jibs. Rider pops, spins a right 270 onto a flat box and lands right foot forward. Pressing A will cause the rider to grip edge with front (right) foot, thus stopping the rotation. This allows the player to straight slide and simply "fall off" the end of the box and spin 90 degrees in either direction to land switch or reg, OR pretzel 270 (and up) out. This is done by quickly ollieing with the right analog stick and spinning (in this case left). Same principle applies for any sort of swap. Front or blind (on a box) is determined by which side to the box the rider lands on. Popping onto a box left foot forward to the right side and pressing X will initiate a blind swap toe dip. Landing left foot forward on the left side and pressing X will initiate a front swap toe raise.
Rails are essentially the same, scissoring is still done with the front foot's corresponding button, but the player must also push either left or right on the left analog stick in the direction of the desired swap/spin out. Example: Urban style down rail on the skier's right. Ollie(nollie) spin right 90 degrees to left foot forward skier slide. To front swap, I would press X (left foot) and left on the left analog to drop my heel. A quick ollie, and a left 180, and voila. K-feds and any combo of swaps/spin outs should be possible.
Back to the initial example of the wide box hypothetical.
If the player takes too harsh of an angle in approaching the box (box on skiers right, starts waaay left, and takes a sharp angle to his right) he will slide off to the right. Landing on either a box or rail directly under the bindings will produce the most stable slide. BUT, landing behind or in front of them allows you to do presses, IF the corresponding direction (up=nose press or down=tail press) on the right analog is pressed.
That's all I got control wise for now.
The option to design parks, move objects, build urban lips, bc jumps, wallrides, etc. would be fantastic.
Obviously, extensive rider customization (ala SKATE) is cruuuuucial. Sponsorship by ski manufacturers, boot cos., outerwear/accessory cos., etc. is important. Ski choice should affect rider's abilities i.e., stiff skis are better for jumps/pipe, soft skis more playful/buttery. Riding Bents in the park should feel different than Walls. Riding a rockered pow ski should feel different than a more traditional big mt. charger. In addition to this kind of customization, there needs to be a "style" feature. Sleepy, steezey, lazy VS. Athletic, aggressive, technical. The style choice should affect animations such as landing jumps, making turns, skating, popping, etc.
I think the inclusion of pros similar to SKATE feels about right.
For the love of god.....no collection challenges!!! I don't care if they're letters, coins, or fucking guitars...it's never fun. Ever. Challenges should resemble those in SKATE and focus on particular set-ups, tricks, photo ops, etc. They should involve all of the skills in the game and should serve the duel purpose of helping the player progress. There should be essentially 2 career paths. Comp skier vs. Film skier. Player chooses his focus. Ultimate goal to have Segment of the Year/Athlete of the Year at Powder Awards, or alternatively win JOSS/X/Dew. Get photos, make edits, earn sponsors as you progress.
Big focus on on-line multiplayer. Also, the ability to freeski and to set "drop in points". Real-time weather simulation.
Environments should be varied, and resorts should feel like living, breathing places. Strong balance between big mt., tree/pow/bc booter, park/jib.
**************************Quick little add-on:
Jibs/Rails: In addition to the Right Analog allowing you to press (by pressing forward or back assuming that your bindings are where they should be for either a nose or tailpress), Left and Right on the Right Analog stick should allow you to "crook slide" (pressure sensitive). Halfway = solid crook, whereas throwing the stick left or right quickly and completely should perform a surface swap.
Taps/bonks should be achieved simply by ollieing (whether already on the rail/jib or not) and "orienting" your skis with the right analog stick in the desired direction. For example: I'm skier sliding an up flat box left foot forward. At the kink, I ollie (quick pull back on the right analog --> quick flick forward) and spin 90 degrees left THEN I quickly push the right analog stick forward at the apex of the ollie, thus "lifting my toes" and tapping my tails on the flat section, before continuing the spin to switch out.
As I said before, X/A would be responsible for gripping rails/boxes (based on the lead foot). Maybe the rear foot further modifies the trick....one footers? Andy Parry style trickery? hmmm... Example: I'm sliding a rainbow rail right foot forward. I press and hold X (left foot) beginning at the apex of the rail and the skier lifts his left foot for a gnar gnar onefooter. OOOORRRR, I'm on a flat box right foot forward and I press X and it initiates a hippy killer or jack knife.
Something I didn't mention about grabs: As in SKATE, grabs can be modified after the fact by pressing the right analog stick in different directions. Example. I'm spinning a right rodeo 5 and I grab trailing safety by pulling the LT (left hand). While holding LT I NOW press up/forward on the right analog stick (remember ski "orientation") and my boring safety becomes the poked out high safety that Sammy Carlson does. Booyah.
Anyone, feel free to take my obnoxiously long suggestion and make edits or add your ideas by copy and pasting. Maybe an asterisk and a footnote to point out the change.
I know this likely won't yield results, but it's fun to think about. You never knooooooww....
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How about a film company, magazine, or even NS, is having a flim/photo session at your local mt., or a nearby mt., and you poach the setup and kill it. You catch their eye, and are invited to shred?
There should be multiple opportunities to get coverage, and the player should have the freedom to choose which opportunities to pursue or not. Your "career" will be affected by the choices you make, companies you decide to work with, etc.. NS, or an NS inspired website could act as a "challenge manager"...you could enter "on-line" edit contests similar to real contests. And of course, a mock superunknown.
The Gulch!! Stumble upon a shorthanded film crew building the Chad's takeoff....offer to dig/guinea pig it. GTS and boooyah.
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1.) I'm really opposed to the "stat" idea. I appreciate the intentions: Slowing the progression so that it's more true to the "on the come up" feel...I mean, it does seem ridiculous to potentially throw a dub cork 12 in your first am slope run. BUT, I think that if the controls and physics are spot on and as in depth as some people have suggested, you won't be pulling dubs until you've reeeaaally gotten a feel for the game. I also sort of like the idea that having limited "stat points" to assign to different skills because it forces you to sort of "define" your riding and specialize (Jon vs. Will Wesson). BUT, I think it just sort of makes the game too arcadey and moves away from the organic, authentic feel. I DO like the idea of ski selection, ski length, and binding placement playing a role though. This could be a sort of compromise. Ski flex, sidecut, length, waist width, mounting location, etc. should all affect your riding.
2.) Storyline. Frankly, I think the quickest and easiest way to tank a game is a cheesy storyline/plot. This game's mechanics and gameplay should take center stage. I DO however absolutely love the idea of rising from obscurity to standing atop the freeskiing world. I think the "plot" should be really minimal. No gimmicky nonsense. I just want to be a talented young skier, looking to catch a break and ride along side my heros!! Gay, I know.
3.) Someone suggested bumping into pros who then act as tutors and mentors, ala SKATE. I love this idea. It's a good way to introduce some of the more complex and difficult tricks, as well setting up opportunities for coverage and attaining more sponsors.
4.) A huge part of skiing involves scoping things out. Someone threw out the idea for a speed meter that would help you find the proper speed to land in tranny on big jumps. I don't really like the idea, but it gave me another, haha...no offense bud!
Shaun White featured absolutely awful and incompetent computer controlled non-player riders. Here, they should really serve a purpose. They should stand at the top of jump in-runs, and yell drop. You should be able to see where they drop from, whether they scrub speed or sit on their tails, etc. It would be cool if it was necessary to speed check jumps, peep landings, and all around keep it real. You don't throw a sw 10 the first time you hit a 80 ft. step down. You should set a "sesh marker", watch others hit the jump, speed check yourself, straight air to find the sweet spot, and THEN go off.
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