Christianity is made up..

agree 100%.

if you say you follow the bible because its god inspired, why not follow it 100%? whats with the contradicting parts?

thats some personal religion you follow, but not christianity.

if you read books this way, i am pretty sure you could create a religion out of ANY book with enough pages.

if you look at the advances in physics, biology and neuroscience, religion has very few resorts left. i personally would say that it has to be the goal of every civilization to understand its surroundings completely, and i am fully confident that in 20, 50, 100 or 1000 years, there will be no question regarding afterlife and the beginning of the universe left to ask.

again, believe what you want, idc, but dont close your eyes on logic and scientific evidence. that is all i can ask.

 
just watch some bill maher and it will make understand some of the stupid shit that makes christians look mentaly ill and show you why religion (christianity in particular) is just such fucking bull shit ferry tale

 
Bill maher is the man, but if you really want to learn about the BS you gotta read some Dawkins, Hitchens, and Sam Harris.
 
bill maher is a cunt. not even smart, the guy just cracks a witty remark in an attempt to make the other guy look stupid and somehow it wins the argument. I'm not religious, and im all for proving religious people wrong, but maher just looks like a stuck up douche bag arguing with them.
 
2870 deities have been recorded since the ancient sumerians started writing.... Christians believe in one more god than an atheist, whats the difference?
 
Link to video? And this thread is just dumb. Let people have faith in whatever they want. It's not yoour life so don't try to change their faith
 
The goal of science is not to prove religion wrong.

Also-- religion has to do with a lot more than creationism.
 
what is so horrible for us to be in the church? I get a great community of like minded people to have discussions with, it truly is a pick me up at the end of the week, and in general it does give a very good moral code to live by. If I am wrong, what am I losing? I'm still living life to the fullest, how is my faith hurting me? I dont think that my faith is hurting anyone, so what is the huge problem here. The bottom line to me is if I am right, I am going to have an amazing afterlife, if I am wrong, I am 6 feet under like every other person that has ever lived. To me, through all of my studies, there is just things that doesn't add up for me, things that science just cannot explain to me, and as a biomedical engineer science should be enough to keep me from questioning things. I have never been happier than I was worshipping when I was younger at youth conferences, maybe im brainwashed, but for some reason there was a happiness there that I havent experienced in any other portion of life. Church shoudn't really be fun, your sitting in a room with a bunch of strangers, listening to a guy talk and singing songs, but there is something special about it for me. You also obviously have not really sat down and looked at some of the evidence supporting christianity, because it really isnt a completely blind allegiance to some guy that lived thousands of years ago.
 
I can almost guarentee that I have as much, if not more experience in physics, biology, and ESPECIALLY neuroscience and I am still a believer.
 
If there is no God, then all that exists is time and chance acting on matter. If this is true then the difference between your thoughts and mine correspond to the difference between shaking up a bottle of Mountain Dew and a bottle of Dr. Pepper. You simply fizz atheistically and I fizz theistically. This means that you do not hold to atheism because it is true , but rather because of a series of chemical reactions… … Morality, tragedy, and sorrow are equally evanescent. They are all empty sensations created by the chemical reactions of the brain, in turn created by too much pizza the night before. If there is no God, then all abstractions are chemical epiphenomena, like swamp gas over fetid water. This means that we have no reason for assigning truth and falsity to the chemical fizz we call reasoning or right and wrong to the irrational reaction we call morality. If no God, mankind is a set of bi-pedal carbon units of mostly water. And nothing else.

Douglas Wilson
 
fuck christianity, that bullshit is for two people--idiots who believe, powerful people who use it to manipulate the idiots who believe it.

thinking men see it as bullshit and don't want anything to do with it
 
what makes you a "thinking man"? What makes you so much more enlightened and smarter than the billions of people that believe there is a God?
 
idiots, powerful people, thinking men. Three labels you created out of thin air with no support. cool.
 
god - one label you created with no support and base all your stupid fucking beliefs on. cool.
 
my friends girlfriend said she was gonna pray while he watched batman so no one came in a tear gassed the place and shot him. Guess what?! her praying worked and he didn't get shot. I now believe in god. - Religious logic.
 
oh my fuck. i need to escape the stupidity of this thread.

no-morality-without-religion.png
 
sorry, it was actually a mistake. I'm just typing ultra fast without giving much thought to what I'm typing right now cause I'm trying to cram as much homework in as i can before an exam
 
No, that's just a cop-out. It was only relatively recently that Christians began to acknowledge what rational people have known for centuries - that the Bible is, at best, only true metaphorically.
 
are you trying to tell me that jesus didn't survive in the desert for 40 days without food and water? GTFO!
 
It seems to me that the religious, or most people for that matter, have no problem believing this when it comes to animals. In Catholic school I was taught that animals simply behave the way they do because that's the way they're programmed. But for some reason, these same people have trouble assigning human behavior and morality to neuroscience as well.
 
That is exactly what humans are- bi- pedal units of mostly water. Why is that as bad as Wilson seems to think it is? Many people need to believe in god because without god we are not the special, chosen species; we are just one more group of animals trying to survive in a huge and scary universe that we will probably never fully understand. With out god it is up to us to decide what is right and wrong, what reality is, and what the truth is. But just because god is a convenient and reassuring idea doesn't in any way make god real. I wish I could believe in god- I want a happy eternal afterlife, guidance, and all the other things that a god is supposed to provide. But it is obvious to me that god is simply a feel good story that humans want so badly to believe in that they have convinced themselves that anything is evidence for the existence of god and that if you believe in something strongly enough (faith) it has to be true.
 
There is no evidence of a god, you would be a fool to argue that. We do have reasons to believe though that a god may exists and even more probable cause to believe that there is an external world.

The proofs that reach these conclusions are quite lengthy and are very dense. I hope you do not hold that against me. Kant's critique of Pure Reason is a very compelling argument. While it sets to achieve other things than prove an external world. Kant does suggest it in his 'Transcendental Doctrine of Elements'.

There is also the famous Scene in Plato's Republic commonly referred to as the Allegory of the Cave.

We can also place our skepticism on Science as it fails to achieve any resolution to issues such as genesis or a purposeful existences.

You can be an agnostic or even gnostic theist without blindly following any beliefs.
 
He didn't say it was bad-- some of you seemed to miss the point of the post entirely. The point is that for atheists, you can't assign "true" or "false" to meaningless fizz in the brain. Therefore your idea that God doesn't exist is no different than my idea that God does. There is no point in arguing God's existence for an atheist. You are not "right" about anything.

However, for those that believe in God, thoughts are not meaningless fizz for us because we believe in a higher being-- we are able to make sense of morality, tragedy, sorrow, love, faith, sympathy, empathy-- that these things are real, and mean something.

And when love is real for you, and you aren't detached from it, assigning it to meaningless reactions in the brain-- life can be more rich, enjoyable and fulfilling.

"the saddest moment in the life of an atheist is being extremely greatful but having nothing or no one to thank."

My question for all of you who are extremely opinionated to the point of just being mean about religion-- what will you do if you fall in love with a woman who is religious? Oh that's right...love is meaningless.
 
Quite possibly one of the most pathetic things I've seen posted by a member of the Christian cult here on NS, and that's saying something.

 
Ok snobunny, I'll explain.

First of all, you demean neuroscience/thought processes down to "meaningless fizz in the brain". I challenge you to find a credible scientist who uses this terminology, or a prominent atheist for that matter.

Your second point reeks of religious arrogance, where you throw in that classic non-sequitur that goes along the lines of "I believe in God, therefore only now can I know love/empathy/morality etc". Many atheists believe that these traits are innate within us humans, and that you don't need some crusty old book full of outrageous commands (ie. stone homosexuals) to tell you otherwise. Do you stop yourself from killing your neighbour because, deep down, you know it's wrong? Or because a god is ordering you not to??

Your third point is so banal it's not even worth commenting on.

As for atheists having 'no one to thank', what about the Universe itself? Or the Laws that govern it? I've personally never felt sad about having 'no one' to thank for a nice day or a stroke of luck. I'll give you a quote to ponder in response: "Isn't it enough to see that a garden is beautiful without having to believe that there are fairies at the bottom of it too?"

And finally, I come to your last point. What I found pathetic about this was that you tried to ask atheists a legitimate question, but then couldn't quite restrain yourself from having another dig. Where have you gotten the idea that atheists say that love is meaningless, snobunny?
 
I'm a Christian, however I don't claim to have all the answers, and am still shaping my believes as a I continue to learn. I do have one question for those arguing for atheism in this thread. What are your opinions about the many prophecies made throughout the Bible that have been fulfilled. The most compelling of these IMO are the many prophecies made by Old Testament authors, that are fulfilled in the documentation of Jesus' life in the New Testament.

I suppose you may think that the New Testament authors skewed the facts of Jesus' life to fit the Old Testament?

Here is an article that talks about this subject in greater depth. You can ignore the fact that it was written by Christians if you like, but the article is still valid in arguing my point.
 
You need to re-read the thread. Everything I wrote in that post was explaining the quote from above.

It wasn't a dig, it's part of the quote that I was explaining, that many had already said they agreed with. Again, please read the full thread.
 
A quote should reaffirm an a proof or work of logic (or explaining as you state. Other than that you post did a good job of relate the quote to the argument.

I am just curious, what have you read or who have you listened to that shapes your opinion?
 
but honestly it is.. if all it is is a few neurons firing in your brain, what exactly makes it so special? Cool, your body releases some shit that makes you all fluffy inside, but really all it is is blocking and opening neuronal pathways. If all we are is bundles of chemistry, then really nothing has a purpose, its just random chemical reactions, and whats the point of living? Your mind tricks you into believing that you are unique, that life is something worth living, but really all that you are is some chemistry that started one day, and is going to end. Maybe we should just all step outside and put bullets in our brain, allow the carbon in our body to be used in other reactions, considering thats all we are in the first place, just a couple reactions.
 
This is obviously why u are drawn toward religion. You can't accept the reality of your meaningless life on this planet and that the universe is completely indifferent to weather or not you live or die, and you look at it just as that.

I think of it different and personally find this to be a rather romantic and beautiful way to live my life. I am a product of the universe. I am part of the universe, and my body is an amazing example of natural biological engineering. We are so incredibly lucky that we have the chance to live and their are so many other people that will never be born because chance just hasn't allowed it. My life meaning comes from the idea that I, and we, get to experience a brief spark of consciousness and during that brief spark i want to try to live my life to its fullest and experience as much of the world and make as big of an impact as i can. My immortality will come from my legacy and the passing on of my genes. And then, when i die, my body will move on to other things and a few atoms of mine will be in another human, and a few others will be in a drop of dew, or in the trees, or maybe at the bottom of the ocean. I enjoy living my life thinking I coexist with the natural world.
 
But what is your consciousness? All it is is chemical reactions firing so why is it so special to you? Why are your chemical reactions any more special than the ones that a worm would have decaying your body, or a tree expanding due to the carbon you would release. How are you living your life to the fullest when all you are doing is mixing and matching different chemical reactions to make yourself think that you are "living your life to the fullest". How is skiing living your life to the fullest, just because it releases a couple chemicals to turn on some chemical reactions, how does that make it the fullest? Why have love, all that it is is some chemical reactions. How is our life any more special than a match burning or a dead body decaying, because our body tells us that our chemical reactions are somehow special? What is our life besides a series of chemical reactions that means absolutely NOTHING to the universe, so why live our lives? Couldnt the carbon in our body be used for something more useful? Your brains tricking you to answer that question "no". How are we lucky to live? All we are is reactions, what makes that so remarkable to you?

 
We don't know, and probably never will.

It's a scary thought. That is the purpose of religion; to provide an answer to those questions. "Where did the universe come from?" etc.

Religion exists to combat the fear of the unknown, among other things. Remember that primitive man used to tremble in fear of lightning? We now know in certainty why lightning occurs, but every day as we begin to answer the questions of the universe, we are faced with more unexplainable phenomenon. The cycle is never ending, and our minds are not capable of comprehending the concept of infinity. In a sense, we are stuck in a sense of limbo. Beautiful, but terrifying.

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So what you are saying is that the bible is like a huge game of telephone? How do those games end?

The only way religion will survive is if the original "god inspired" texts are re-written and re-interpreted to for modern times because from what we know now, lots of those "god inspired" writings do not make sense...at all. Basically the bible 're-interpreters' are saying, "Oh crap, this makes absolutely no sense and is extremely violent. Let's find a new interpretation for this to tell our followers. Yea, those explicit killings stated in the bible are just metaphors. I feel much better".

And when will this re-interpretation stop? And if men put those killing stories in there that were not from the original texts, what else did they add?

You have to realized that when the bible was written, we really didn't know anything about our world...
 
you are putting this at a very elementary level. 1st off you seem to emphasize humans as being special and unique when we really are just part of nature. ill answer all your simple ones in list forum.

1. the consciousness is something we don't fully understand yet, but what we know about it is that our brain functions like you said through chemical reactions and firing neurons.

2. They are special to me because a brain developed, learns, and adapts to its experiences. I was born with a different genetic code to you (nature) and i have grown up differently then you (nurture). my brain and the way it functions is different.

3. Im not making myself think I'm living my life. I am living my life and just analyzing the data when it comes into my brain which then i respond to by displaying certain emotions.

Whether you like it or not we are biological machines, and you seem to be diminishing the value of what we are by just referring to us as chemical reactions, because even though thats true you are not looking at the bigger picture. Think of the brain. The brain is an amazing creation and it is something that is very special. The way we can reason, compute, understand, infer etc. etc. is unlike anything else we know. Why does that not satisfy you? All these chemical reactions and electricity create consciousness, thats what consciousness is. Just because its made up of electricity instead of some kind of soul type thing doesn't diminish your life and your feelings, and i won't even get into why life is more worthy than inanimate objects because that should be obvious.

We live our lives because we are very lucky owners of our bodies, and this experience we are able to have is literally once in a lifetime. Skiing is a rush because its an overload of sensory data and potentially dangerous experiences which give us an adrenaline rush.

I would suggest you read up on this more because its so hard for me to explain all of this without writing a shit ton.

 
I worked in a neuroscience lab for a little over a year, I understand pretty decently how the brain works. It is an absolutely unbelievable thing, and that along with the eyes is really what makes it hard for me to believe all of this happened by chance.

I have another question for you though. Why is murder wrong? Like my previous points, all murder is doing is changing one set of chemical reactions into another, so naturally whats the problem with it? Why do we all not practice caniballism? Really all you are doing is recycling someones body instead of a worm or bacteria. Why is that so wrong? At the basis of your argument, all we are is chemical reactions, so really why are our lives any more important than anything else? All of that learning that you spent 12 years of your life, and maybe more doing is only training your brain to ignore/block some pathways and allow some other to exist, really whats the point? If all we are is giant super computers that analyze data and spit out reactions, isn't that kind of an empty existance?

Also, why do you dislike religious people so much? All thats different between me and you is a couple of neuronal pathways, and my neuronal pathways have happened to come to a different conclusion than yours, so whats the problem there?
 
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