Can we stop pushing small children so hard to ski?

.Roockley.

.Roockley.

Active member
I'm over coaching (I think).

I really enjoy skiing and thought that sharing my stoke with people would be fun. After 4 years away (instructing and general skiing) from the UK I came back to coach some freestyle at the indoor slope. In that time the vibe seems to have completely changed from hanging out with friends, goofing around to having to progress as much as possible as quickly as possible.

Children as young as 6 are on the academy which is sick, but tonight is the final nail in the coffin for me. The last few weeks I've noticed pushy parents (who don't ski or come and ski at the same time as the kids) pushing them to learn more tricks. One kid started crying and when I asked why he said his dad said he had to land a 3 over the kicker or else he would be grounded. He thought the jump was too big for him to try and refused to ski so his dad couldn't see him. After telling him he could do what he wanted instead of that he did a few laps and his dad took him off the slope. I'm pretty sure he made a complaint against me (lolz)

Why the fuck are we telling kids this is what skiing is having? If they don't enjoy they aren't going to stick around and want to be better.

Any one else noticing this?

TL;DR. Soccer moms turning into ski moms. It sucks.
 
Thats fucked up. We dont have freestyle teams where I live so I've never experienced anything like that but thats whack. Fuck that shit.
 
What have your interactions with the dad been like? How do the other coaches approach the coaching- fun factor vs pushing trick progression?

Maybe you're in the wrong program?
 
i dont want to live in a world where skiing becomes a competitive sport. If i see a single "soccer mom" at my local ski hill telling her son that his 360s aren't erect enough im moving to Africa
 
13540500:californiagrown said:
What have your interactions with the dad been like? How do the other coaches approach the coaching- fun factor vs pushing trick progression?

Maybe you're in the wrong program?
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Not much really, the kid normally turns up late after the session starts and I see the dad at the end for a few minutes before they leave.

There's 3 coaches, we swap each week but normally there's an advanced group, womens group and a little kids group, everyone is roughly the same ability in each group.

It's a very chill atmosphere, if the kids want to learn something then yeah we will push them to try it but otherwise it's just getting them more comfortable hitting features and suggesting things to try
 
13540503:.Roockley. said:
Not much really, the kid normally turns up late after the session starts and I see the dad at the end for a few minutes before they leave.

There's 3 coaches, we swap each week but normally there's an advanced group, womens group and a little kids group, everyone is roughly the same ability in each group.

It's a very chill atmosphere, if the kids want to learn something then yeah we will push them to try it but otherwise it's just getting them more comfortable hitting features and suggesting things to try
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Then pull the kids old man aside and tell him that kids progress the most when theyre having fun, NOT when theyre doing it cause they're afraid of parental wrath.

If he's sucking the fun out of it for the kid, you should tell the dad.
 
13540509:californiagrown said:
Then pull the kids old man aside and tell him that kids progress the most when theyre having fun, NOT when theyre doing it cause they're afraid of parental wrath.

If he's sucking the fun out of it for the kid, you should tell the dad.
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Been there done that, he laughed it off but when I went to get back on the lift he was giving his kid a death stare
 
13540515:.Roockley. said:
Been there done that, he laughed it off but when I went to get back on the lift he was giving his kid a death stare
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So, let little johnny know that the snowdome is a safe place and he doesn't have to do what his dad tells him there. He just has to have fun and try to get better at his own pace, and you'll be there to help him the whole way.

Try to make it fun for the kid even when his dad doesn't.
 
13540515:.Roockley. said:
Been there done that, he laughed it off but when I went to get back on the lift he was giving his kid a death stare
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Just parents pushing their dreams on to their kids. In racing it is horrifying how the parents act when their kid doesnt place well. One dad would scream at his daughter for placing lower than third place, and the next day she would show on the hill with a brand new set up in order to "go faster."

Freeskiing is now a worldwide sport in the Olympics and the asshole parents that want famous kids are starting to cross over to this world of skiing. You cant talk any reason in to them. They want what they want and they will yell this is my fucking kid not yours if you try to step in, even if you are the coach. Welcome to the aftermath of getting the sport into the Olympics.
 
13540519:californiagrown said:
So, let little johnny know that the snowdome is a safe place and he doesn't have to do what his dad tells him there. He just has to have fun and try to get better at his own pace, and you'll be there to help him the whole way.

Try to make it fun for the kid even when his dad doesn't.
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Well the kid kind of has to live with his dad outside of being at the snowdome. If the snowdome is a chill place, that's cool, but if the dad grounds the kid or screams at him 24/7 for disobeying then it's still not super chill
 
13540731:AlsoKnownAs said:
Well the kid kind of has to live with his dad outside of being at the snowdome. If the snowdome is a chill place, that's cool, but if the dad grounds the kid or screams at him 24/7 for disobeying then it's still not super chill
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yeah, cant do much about the home life, so why not make the skiing a safe/fun place?

gotta do what you can, and realize that you cant change everything.
 
same up at cairngorm it feels a bit pushy with the ski club wanting us to have coach support at all events like chill we just want to have fun and send it
 
13540731:AlsoKnownAs said:
Well the kid kind of has to live with his dad outside of being at the snowdome. If the snowdome is a chill place, that's cool, but if the dad grounds the kid or screams at him 24/7 for disobeying then it's still not super chill
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If he does make the snowdome a safe/fun place the kid would probably start to enjoy skiing more because he's away from his dad when he's there and will want to go as much as possible and progress even more. It's a huge win for the kid and a win for the dad.
 
Shitty parenting I guess? Ski teams don't really do that as far as I'm aware. I do have a memory of going night skiing with my friend when we were 13 or 14 and his dad wanted him to get rodeo 5 and cork 7 (which he had never done) and were were skiing in an icy af park with little kids everywhere. There's a shot of me doing a cork 3 over a little kid who was completely oblivious. But when his dad asked if he did any new tricks and he said no, his dad was pissed.
 
Okay, about to rant because this shit pisses me off.

So if you've ever been to crystal you know that most of our "Black Diamonds" are just open and steep straightaways. They aren't particularly difficult, I can go switch down most of them.

But as a small child, those hills look scary as fuck, I remember looking over one when I was about eight. It looked like it was where the world ended and dropped off. I did NOT want to go down it.

Fast forward to last year. I'm heading up the lift with the boys (lift goes right above this slope) and I see two little kids about 1/4 of the way down. Both have lost their skis and poles and because of the steepness of the slope they where struggling to get them back on. I hop off the lift and ski down to them, grabbing they're poles and taking them down. Then I just went under them so I could hold they're skis while they clicked in.

As they get clicked in I hear something. What could it be? Just their asshole father standing at the bottom of the hill shouting up that they are worthless skiers and he should never take them skiing. The dads walks back to the lodge deck where the rest of the rich preppy shithead parents are sitting.

I check to make sure the kids are ready to go and then I ski down to the bottom and hop on the lift. Almost to the top of the lift when I look down and see that the kids have fallen again. So once more I go down and help them get up. At this point all the rest of the parents are now shouting at the kids "why don't you just slide down on your ass" and numerous other things along the lines of that. Now that shit pissed me off.

So I helped the kids down the rest of the hill, and me and one of my pals (German with a short temper) ski over to all the parents drinking and laughing at the lodge. More or less I called the dad a shit head and told that he should get his balls out of his purse and be a man instead of a bitch. Yelling ensues. My german friend knocks all they're drinks off the edge tells them to fuck off and gives them the finger. We leave.

Apparently they called patrol on us. Patrol knows us so I explained the situation, patrol went and talked to them, turned out one was skiing on a stolen pass, and they where all kicked off the mountain.

Moral of the story fuck you if your a pushy parent you're a piece of shit /rant
 
eh for every pushy parent there are probably 50 little brats ruining the ski day crying about their boots or having to pee or something
 
topic:.Roockley. said:
I'm over coaching (I think).

I really enjoy skiing and thought that sharing my stoke with people would be fun. After 4 years away (instructing and general skiing) from the UK I came back to coach some freestyle at the indoor slope. In that time the vibe seems to have completely changed from hanging out with friends, goofing around to having to progress as much as possible as quickly as possible.

Children as young as 6 are on the academy which is sick, but tonight is the final nail in the coffin for me. The last few weeks I've noticed pushy parents (who don't ski or come and ski at the same time as the kids) pushing them to learn more tricks. One kid started crying and when I asked why he said his dad said he had to land a 3 over the kicker or else he would be grounded. He thought the jump was too big for him to try and refused to ski so his dad couldn't see him. After telling him he could do what he wanted instead of that he did a few laps and his dad took him off the slope. I'm pretty sure he made a complaint against me (lolz)

Why the fuck are we telling kids this is what skiing is having? If they don't enjoy they aren't going to stick around and want to be better.

Any one else noticing this?

TL;DR. Soccer moms turning into ski moms. It sucks.
Click to expand...

Hi I don't know where in the UK you teach but down south in MK as a instructor I've never witnessed this on freestyle nights. All the regulars come down to shred and their parents are really cool and chill. I've never witnessed a pushy parent, pushing there kids to do freestyle. However on Sno Academy; in the mournings, we get the occasional dad or mum that thinks their child should be in the higher level but other than that not really noticed it down south. I'm sure it happens however I haven't witnessed it yet.
 
13540498:50Kal said:
I've seen way to many kids being forced to ski and start crying.
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Funny Story first time I skied I had a 105 degree fever but my dad dident know so when I just wouldn't stand up and was being a bitchy kid he started screaming at me.... How I love skiing so much now, I have no fucking clue.
 
13540498:50Kal said:
I've seen way to many kids being forced to ski and start crying.
Click to expand...

Funny Story first time I skied I had a 105 degree fever but my dad dident know so when I just wouldn't stand up and was being a bitchy kid he started screaming at me.... How I love skiing so much now, I have no fucking clue.
 
13540498:50Kal said:
I've seen way to many kids being forced to ski and start crying.
Click to expand...

Funny Story first time I skied I had a 105 degree fever but my dad dident know so when I just wouldn't stand up and was being a bitchy kid he started screaming at me.... How I love skiing so much now, I have no fucking clue.
 
13541037:FridgeBangers said:
Hi I don't know where in the UK you teach but down south in MK as a instructor I've never witnessed this on freestyle nights. All the regulars come down to shred and their parents are really cool and chill. I've never witnessed a pushy parent, pushing there kids to do freestyle. However on Sno Academy; in the mournings, we get the occasional dad or mum that thinks their child should be in the higher level but other than that not really noticed it down south. I'm sure it happens however I haven't witnessed it yet.
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there's a lot of things wrong with the place i work (not going to name names so i don't get banned from skiing there, it's pretty obvious though)

yeah, academy is bad when you have that but another thing i picked up on was a kid saying he has to learn a trick to do for his competition run cause his parents said

i think i'm just jaded
 
13541043:.Roockley. said:
there's a lot of things wrong with the place i work (not going to name names so i don't get banned from skiing there, it's pretty obvious though)

yeah, academy is bad when you have that but another thing i picked up on was a kid saying he has to learn a trick to do for his competition run cause his parents said

i think i'm just jaded
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Yeah I think I know where you work now ;) Totally agreeing with you on the old soccer mom idea. skiing is mean't to be fun; I can remember when I went to this comp and this Dad sat his son down and told him what he wanted him to do on what features. I was like what... why not tell them to go out there and have fun that way he will not feel under pressure therefore have good time.

All it dose is push them to hate the sport rather than enjoy it.
 
13540983:Lonely said:
Okay, about to rant because this shit pisses me off.

So if you've ever been to crystal you know that most of our "Black Diamonds" are just open and steep straightaways. They aren't particularly difficult, I can go switch down most of them.

But as a small child, those hills look scary as fuck, I remember looking over one when I was about eight. It looked like it was where the world ended and dropped off. I did NOT want to go down it.

Fast forward to last year. I'm heading up the lift with the boys (lift goes right above this slope) and I see two little kids about 1/4 of the way down. Both have lost their skis and poles and because of the steepness of the slope they where struggling to get them back on. I hop off the lift and ski down to them, grabbing they're poles and taking them down. Then I just went under them so I could hold they're skis while they clicked in.

As they get clicked in I hear something. What could it be? Just their asshole father standing at the bottom of the hill shouting up that they are worthless skiers and he should never take them skiing. The dads walks back to the lodge deck where the rest of the rich preppy shithead parents are sitting.

I check to make sure the kids are ready to go and then I ski down to the bottom and hop on the lift. Almost to the top of the lift when I look down and see that the kids have fallen again. So once more I go down and help them get up. At this point all the rest of the parents are now shouting at the kids "why don't you just slide down on your ass" and numerous other things along the lines of that. Now that shit pissed me off.

So I helped the kids down the rest of the hill, and me and one of my pals (German with a short temper) ski over to all the parents drinking and laughing at the lodge. More or less I called the dad a shit head and told that he should get his balls out of his purse and be a man instead of a bitch. Yelling ensues. My german friend knocks all they're drinks off the edge tells them to fuck off and gives them the finger. We leave.

Apparently they called patrol on us. Patrol knows us so I explained the situation, patrol went and talked to them, turned out one was skiing on a stolen pass, and they where all kicked off the mountain.

Moral of the story fuck you if your a pushy parent you're a piece of shit /rant
Click to expand...

+K for you sir!
 
This is legit the most annoying thing to hit Skiing in the U.K since i started.

I've always been one to goof around and never to take my Skiing to seriously, why would you? I personally think it takes all the enjoyment out of the sport. From my experience Kids defiantly learn quicker and enjoy their time Skiing more in a relaxed atmosphere.

Pushy parents comes for a definite lack of understanding of the sport, why use professionals to coach/teach your kids if your advice is better? I think the bottom line is that, pushy parents, those who but pressure on every run to improve and lose the focus of enjoyment comes from a lack of understanding and are influenced from other sports the Kids may play, football, rugby etc...
 
13540498:50Kal said:
I've seen way to many kids being forced to ski and start crying.
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Yeah but there is a fine line here. When I was learning to ski I was pretty little (3 at the time) I was really not a fan. I would say there is no problem with strongly encouraging a kid to stick with it, even if they aren't having a good time (I am super glad my dad and brother did). However, what that guy did to his kid is the kind of thing that ruins skiing for a person.
 
I live and ski in norway, where I own and operate a small hill and snowpark. I'd say about 80% of our regulars or locals if you will, are under the age of 15. Since Norway seems to be turning out a large percentage of the worlds best skiers and snowboarders, it's interesting to see the the culture surrounding youth that ski or snowboard. All our parents are very chill and forthcoming, basically they just drop of their kids, then pick them up 3-4 hours later. They all ski and snowboard together in a group, and they always seem to have a great time. We don't really do anything but keep an eye on them, and sort out the occasional argument or some fairly innocent bullying. And basically they all progressed a shit ton this season. They got a bit of coaching on Wednesdays, but other than that they sorted themselves out and would just every now and then ask advice for a trick. Point is, if you wanna be the next Øystein Braaten or Torstein Horgmo, it seems you should take note of how the Norwegians go about it.
 
13540983:Lonely said:
Okay, about to rant because this shit pisses me off.

So if you've ever been to crystal you know that most of our "Black Diamonds" are just open and steep straightaways. They aren't particularly difficult, I can go switch down most of them.

But as a small child, those hills look scary as fuck, I remember looking over one when I was about eight. It looked like it was where the world ended and dropped off. I did NOT want to go down it.

Fast forward to last year. I'm heading up the lift with the boys (lift goes right above this slope) and I see two little kids about 1/4 of the way down. Both have lost their skis and poles and because of the steepness of the slope they where struggling to get them back on. I hop off the lift and ski down to them, grabbing they're poles and taking them down. Then I just went under them so I could hold they're skis while they clicked in.

As they get clicked in I hear something. What could it be? Just their asshole father standing at the bottom of the hill shouting up that they are worthless skiers and he should never take them skiing. The dads walks back to the lodge deck where the rest of the rich preppy shithead parents are sitting.

I check to make sure the kids are ready to go and then I ski down to the bottom and hop on the lift. Almost to the top of the lift when I look down and see that the kids have fallen again. So once more I go down and help them get up. At this point all the rest of the parents are now shouting at the kids "why don't you just slide down on your ass" and numerous other things along the lines of that. Now that shit pissed me off.

So I helped the kids down the rest of the hill, and me and one of my pals (German with a short temper) ski over to all the parents drinking and laughing at the lodge. More or less I called the dad a shit head and told that he should get his balls out of his purse and be a man instead of a bitch. Yelling ensues. My german friend knocks all they're drinks off the edge tells them to fuck off and gives them the finger. We leave.

Apparently they called patrol on us. Patrol knows us so I explained the situation, patrol went and talked to them, turned out one was skiing on a stolen pass, and they where all kicked off the mountain.

Moral of the story fuck you if your a pushy parent you're a piece of shit /rant
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amen
 
My dad was always somewhat pushy with any sport I did. But he knew where to draw the line. He never made me do anything I didn't want to, but he could always persuade me to do it. I'm glad he used methods of persuasion rather than just threatening me.
 
13541406:THEDIRTYBUBBLE said:
My dad was always somewhat pushy with any sport I did. But he knew where to draw the line. He never made me do anything I didn't want to, but he could always persuade me to do it. I'm glad he used methods of persuasion rather than just threatening me.
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It's really a bit of the "Tiger Mom" argument. Parents can totally go off the deep end or there can be some solid balance. Just like there is good coaching and bad coaching (think crazed high school football coach barking out threats) there is balanced parenting. Motivating a kid in school, sports, life in general, but no need to be a dickhead about it. In the end, most kids do want to please their parents, but really it should be fun because if the kid isn't having fun eventually they'll burn out on it whatever it is the parent is trying to get them to do anyhow. And if they suck they certainly better be having fun. Ha.
 
When I was 4-5 years old I hated skiing but then my parents made me ski. Now I'm super happy that they did
 
I am Pretty sure i know where you mean, i ski there. but yeah i can see what you are on about more and more kids every time just pushing themselves way over the limits
 
My current home hill is just this tiny lap park. Most days there's around 8 or so adults, and 3-4 kids younger than 13. All of those kids ride there with their dads who are completely relaxed.

Anyways after watching them ride last season without a doubt all of their progression has been from riding with a group who is shredding pretty hard. When they see people throwing down they work their own way up to the same tricks and get them pretty quickly. They all went to a kids freestyle jam last year at a resort and cleaned up 1,2,3,4. I feel like this is waaaay better then screaming them into stuff they're not comfortable with any day of the week.
 
screw those parents, if they want to coach em themselves, tell em to pull their kid from the team.

I've done plenty of coaching in skiing and climbing and there are always parents who are simply too pushy. You don't want them around so just try to be straight up. Parents don't have to be your friends and you don't have to take their shit as long as you do your job well.
 
Can you kick the kid out of the program. It sounds like you'd be doing him a favor. Or try and make the dad start to do the things he expects his kid to do
 
I had to take a USSA entry level class a few years ago. The guy who was running the class told us that parents will take the entry level class so they can be in the start gate of comps.

Whats more fun then having your coach and mom telling you what to do. Good luck telling mom you dont want to corked 7 after she spent 5k buying your gear, tickets, rental car ect... Oh and she spent the time to take the coaching class.
 
I do a freestyle "team" (really more of a club with "coaches") and honestly its so fun. You don't have to do shit if you don't want to. There are smaller kids on it who do there own thing with a coach and i see them playing like follow the leader and simon says and shit and they look so stoked. They do progress but there isn't any pressure at at because the coach basically just asks them what they want to do, maybe go take a run or two and then come back. I joined it last year and basically just roamed around and asked for tips when I wanted. We had tons of rail session and jump sessions and we all just fed off the vibes and someone throwing a crazy trick. The coaches do help, but couldn't give less shits on what you learned or not if thats what you wanted to do. They ask wha you want to do and cater to that, otherwise it really isn't a team at all, more like a gathering to ski together and have a good time while learning something or doing something. I think I progressed this way so much faster than just being pushed the whole time.
 
13541826:ParryWithAnA said:
I had to take a USSA entry level class a few years ago. The guy who was running the class told us that parents will take the entry level class so they can be in the start gate of comps.

Whats more fun then having your coach and mom telling you what to do. Good luck telling mom you dont want to corked 7 after she spent 5k buying your gear, tickets, rental car ect... Oh and she spent the time to take the coaching class.
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I say push kids harder. Snowboarding parents push their kids a lot more and they have a quad-spin. I think skiing parents need to push much, much harder or freeskiing may never have a quad.
 
Personally, I really dislike any and all paid park coaching.

As a kid growing up, I started skiing in 6th grade and started park in 8th grade. My older brother skied park too, but we were at the age that he didn't want to associate with me nor did he want me to even be close to as good as him. So I had no one to teach me how to do anything. My early learning was purely based on me watching the older kids slide rails and do tricks. After that it was trial and painful error.

It was a slow process. Many times I would ask myself why do I do this. I had no idea how to do tricks. I would try and try, and my body was only capable of hitting the ground. The welts and bruises hurt. But then I would catch a glimpse of an older kid in the park slaying it or I would be watching a Wallisch edit once I was home. The pure excitement I would get from those moments solidified my love for skiing.

Paid coaching is an unfair shortcut. My parents never spent a cent on my skiing minus the cost of gas to get me to the slopes back when I was under 16. If I wanted coaching I had to pray when I asked an older kid he would say yes.

Kids who love skiing will progress and stay with it all their lives. Paying someone to teach your kid only inspires kids to feel that skiing is just another grade school sport that you quit after a while.

With that beings said I fully support unpaid coaching. If a kid comes up to you and asks for help, fuck yeah. Coach that kid and help him out whenever you can.

(Disclaimer: if you are a ski coach and it is your source of income in order for you to live or to continue skiing, keep doing what your doing. Eating and Skiing are mad important. You're the exception)
 
As a current skier of competition and a past racer I can say that I have seen the asshole parents/coaches in racing more than freestyle..Thank god.

I get why racing is more hardcore since no matter what, youre trying to win. Park skiing is way better since you can be on a team and the coaches just love to have you around and see you get better. Even when you are competing they want you to do the run you want to do, I really only saw one coach be to pushy with a nervous kid, he made it sound like he was pathetic if he didnt do the run the coach wanted, luckily I saw the guy be way more chill at another comp. I sometimes see parents at comps being slightly upset their kid didnt win even though they usually have no idea what most tricks are. I luckily grew up with parents who forced me into years of racing, I hated it but they didnt do it to make me the next Chodey Miller, they did it so I became a well rounded skier. While other parents who were also coaches shouted at their kids, my parents just wanted me to do well and they still support me when it comes to competitions, having my back if I didnt do well, not yell at me to pack my shit up and say they were pissed off. A proper park coach is one that has fun with the kids, maybe is a little more serious with the advanced kids and just has fun while helping the kids get better.
 
I agree that's way hardcore, and different from my situation. I was always pushed very hard, and cried many occasions. I would even attempt to skip skiing at all costs possible. It's quite different though because both my parents would at least ski with me. I now can't get off the hill so somehow they did the job.
 
topic:.Roockley. said:
I'm over coaching (I think).

I really enjoy skiing and thought that sharing my stoke with people would be fun. After 4 years away (instructing and general skiing) from the UK I came back to coach some freestyle at the indoor slope. In that time the vibe seems to have completely changed from hanging out with friends, goofing around to having to progress as much as possible as quickly as possible.

Children as young as 6 are on the academy which is sick, but tonight is the final nail in the coffin for me. The last few weeks I've noticed pushy parents (who don't ski or come and ski at the same time as the kids) pushing them to learn more tricks. One kid started crying and when I asked why he said his dad said he had to land a 3 over the kicker or else he would be grounded. He thought the jump was too big for him to try and refused to ski so his dad couldn't see him. After telling him he could do what he wanted instead of that he did a few laps and his dad took him off the slope. I'm pretty sure he made a complaint against me (lolz)

Why the fuck are we telling kids this is what skiing is having? If they don't enjoy they aren't going to stick around and want to be better.

Any one else noticing this?

TL;DR. Soccer moms turning into ski moms. It sucks.
Click to expand...

shut it danny you teach 12 year olds on flat rocker pow skis with zero edge hahahah

more manhood mondays nerdz
 
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