Can I trust line skis

[MitchWAndrew]

i have line sir Francis bacon 2017 skis and I love them they flow over everything and have a beautiful design my only problem is they seem weak they chip way too easy and the flex seems a little bit lower than most can I trust a big producing company just as well as I trust a local company. My real question is. Are line skis mass produced or are they hand made and crafted by God’s like local brands.

 

[Snowgoner]

Line Skis are made in a factory in China.

 

[Greatbump]

Broke my Line Tigersnakes on the first day I rode them. Tried to warranty them but it was void because I had used them in the park even though I didn't break them in the park. Buy at your own risk.

 

[japanada]

i have line sir Francis bacon 2017 skis and I love them they flow over everything and have a beautiful design my only problem is they seem weak they chip way too easy and the flex seems a little bit lower than most can I trust a big producing company just as well as I trust a local company. My real question is. Are line skis mass produced or are they hand made and crafted by God’s like local brands.

They are meant to be a softer ski, even the handmade US companies like Icelandic, ON3P and moment make some soft and buttery skis. All lines are made in china though. Maybe the pescado is different tho?

Broke my Line Tigersnakes on the first day I rode them. Tried to warranty them but it was void because I had used them in the park even though I didn't break them in the park. Buy at your own risk.

What broke on them? I have warrantied many line skis from delams and snaps in that occur in the park. Line does market about half their skis as park skis.

 

[Avifarer]

i have line sir Francis bacon 2017 skis and I love them they flow over everything and have a beautiful design my only problem is they seem weak they chip way too easy and the flex seems a little bit lower than most can I trust a big producing company just as well as I trust a local company. My real question is. Are line skis mass produced or are they hand made and crafted by God’s like local brands.

what do you mean flex is lower? you mean softer? the bacons are designed by EP and meant to be a softer more playful ski. any time you are going to be spinning or doing tricks with metal edges banging against top sheets you run the risk of chipping. doesnt really matter what company it is.

 

[Casey]

So the way you need to think about durability is not that every ski is worse. The ideal prototype is a great product, but when skis are mass produced some slip through the cracks of the quality control process. That's when the customer becomes the company's qc department, which isnt good.

 

[Greatbump]

What broke on them? I have warrantied many line skis from delams and snaps in that occur in the park. Line does market about half their skis as park skis.[/QUOTE]

Pic related

 

[MitchWAndrew]

What broke on them? I have warrantied many line skis from delams and snaps in that occur in the park. Line does market about half their skis as park skis.

Pic related

Right under where my bindings were the ski was ripping out of the ski so they replaced them

 

[tomPietrowski]

Line Skis are made in a factory in China.

A factory owned and operated by k2 and line. It's one of the best out there. Location is not really important these days. All skis are still protyped and developed in the states but then produced in our own factory oversees. All this does is allow us to keep end costs for you the user down.

 

[.nasty]

A factory owned and operated by k2 and line. It's one of the best out there. Location is not really important these days. All skis are still protyped and developed in the states but then produced in our own factory oversees. All this does is allow us to keep end costs for you the user down.

This. stupid kids have no idea how air tight that factory is.

who gives a shit if your ski is "handmade in the USA"? Most of them are garbage.

 

[SofaKingSick]

All this does is allow us to keep end costs for you the user down.

wait, you work for Line?

 

[tomPietrowski]

wait, you work for Line?

K2

 

[SofaKingSick]

K2

word well not to get on your case, then, but how has this stuff helped "keep end costs for you the user down"?

line's skis aren't even cheap.. some of them cost as much as 800 or 1000 and they have like two skis that are under $500 and those have extruded bases and, if i had to guess, less premium materials than the rest of line's skis (and almost certainly less premium materials than, say, Armada ARV86, which are almost the exact same price).

so how exactly is the Line consumer seeing these costs being kept down?

 

[tomPietrowski]

word well not to get on your case, then, but how has this stuff helped "keep end costs for you the user down"?

line's skis aren't even cheap.. some of them cost as much as 800 or 1000 and they have like two skis that are under $500 and those have extruded bases and, if i had to guess, less premium materials than the rest of line's skis (and almost certainly less premium materials than, say, Armada ARV86, which are almost the exact same price).

so how exactly is the Line consumer seeing these costs being kept down?

Well I don't know line quite so well but I just had a quick look. The msrp of the pascado is $900 and they have pricepoint skis down at $350. So compare the pascado to say a black crows nocta. That skis runs way over $1100. The arv 116 is $870 so it's pretty much on par with what other big brands can do and less then the smaller brands. $350 for a park ski is cheap really.

Aramada also build in big established factories which are already paid for, for the most part. If aramada needed to make there own I gaurentee you they would cost a lot more unless they did similar to what we do.

Another way to look at it is big brands actually spend a lot of money on r and d. These costs add up and need paying for. So again building out of the USA allows for these costs to be tacked up by the brand rather then passed along to consumers.

Also consider the amount of skis being made. Take for example a brand I really like on3p. They make sick skis but imagine they sold skis in the numbers k2 or line do. To keep up with that demand they would need to invest way more in manufacturing and also increase there work force. Being that they build in the USA that would be really expensive so would mean that costs increase. You can get away with building in the USA when numbers are relitivly small but scaling up is hard to do.

So overall to answer your question. Prices are about on par and certainly cheaper then if made in the USA as an example.

 

[SofaKingSick]

Well I don't know line quite so well but I just had a quick look. The msrp of the pascado is $900 and they have pricepoint skis down at $350. So compare the pascado to say a black crows nocta. That skis runs way over $1100. The arv 116 is $870 so it's pretty much on par with what other big brands can do and less then the smaller brands. $350 for a park ski is cheap really.

Aramada also build in big established factories which are already paid for, for the most part. If aramada needed to make there own I gaurentee you they would cost a lot more unless they did similar to what we do.

Another way to look at it is big brands actually spend a lot of money on r and d. These costs add up and need paying for. So again building out of the USA allows for these costs to be tacked up by the brand rather then passed along to consumers.

Also consider the amount of skis being made. Take for example a brand I really like on3p. They make sick skis but imagine they sold skis in the numbers k2 or line do. To keep up with that demand they would need to invest way more in manufacturing and also increase there work force. Being that they build in the USA that would be really expensive so would mean that costs increase. You can get away with building in the USA when numbers are relitivly small but scaling up is hard to do.

So overall to answer your question. Prices are about on par and certainly cheaper then if made in the USA as an example.

hmm, line's website has the pescado at $1050 (magnum opus and mordecai at $950) and the price point park skis at $450 and $500, and i don't think black crow is a good brand to use as a baseline anyway, but their site has the Nocta at $850 MRSP (https://www.black-crows.com/nocta-skis).

so idk where youre getting your numbers, but MSRP on a company's website is a good place to compare what they offer for what prices. and i don't see how one can argue that those are reflecting the lower prices of production in china... are you saying those same skis would be even more if they made them somewhere else? that'd be ridiculous and un-sellable to all but the most uninformed buyers

further, it wasnt a comparison against US-produced companies like on3p. a more relevant comparison is armada like you mentioned, but again, i don't see better prices from line's china-produced skis than for armada's europe-produced skis. so im failing to see where these supposed consumer cost savings are happening because i sure don't see them in the MSRPs

 

[.nasty]

hmm, line's website has the pescado at $1050 (magnum opus and mordecai at $950) and the price point park skis at $450 and $500, and i don't think black crow is a good brand to use as a baseline anyway, but their site has the Nocta at $850 MRSP (https://www.black-crows.com/nocta-skis).

so idk where youre getting your numbers, but MSRP on a company's website is a good place to compare what they offer for what prices. and i don't see how one can argue that those are reflecting the lower prices of production in china... are you saying those same skis would be even more if they made them somewhere else? that'd be ridiculous and un-sellable to all but the most uninformed buyers

further, it wasnt a comparison against US-produced companies like on3p. a more relevant comparison is armada like you mentioned, but again, i don't see better prices from line's china-produced skis than for armada's europe-produced skis. so im failing to see where these supposed consumer cost savings are happening because i sure don't see them in the MSRPs

MSRP is basically useless, nobody sells skis at MSRP pricing. haha stop being a tool

 

[SofaKingSick]

MSRP is basically useless, nobody sells skis at MSRP pricing. haha stop being a tool

1) you and i might not pay MSRP but some do, and regardless, the MSRP that a company sets is absolutely relevant to this conversation and affects what price the skis are sold at

2) i don't think im being a tool by asking these questions; it's what's being discussed. if you want to actually engage in the subject i'd be happy to hear it but otherwise i'd ask that you keep the pithy one liners out of gear talk discussion if you can. thanks

 

[tomPietrowski]

hmm, line's website has the pescado at $1050 (magnum opus and mordecai at $950) and the price point park skis at $450 and $500, and i don't think black crow is a good brand to use as a baseline anyway, but their site has the Nocta at $850 MRSP (https://www.black-crows.com/nocta-skis).

so idk where youre getting your numbers, but MSRP on a company's website is a good place to compare what they offer for what prices. and i don't see how one can argue that those are reflecting the lower prices of production in china... are you saying those same skis would be even more if they made them somewhere else? that'd be ridiculous and un-sellable to all but the most uninformed buyers

further, it wasnt a comparison against US-produced companies like on3p. a more relevant comparison is armada like you mentioned, but again, i don't see better prices from line's china-produced skis than for armada's europe-produced skis. so im failing to see where these supposed consumer cost savings are happening because i sure don't see them in the MSRPs

Which country are you in?

i just looked at lines Sight and there is no pricing. Evo and backcountry both have the pascado as msrp $899.
https://www.backcountry.com/ski?show=all&p=brand:Line&nf=1
https://www.evo.com/shop?text=LINE+SKis

a the nocta sells for $1050 in whistler
https://comorsports.com/catalog/product/ski/skis/black-crows-nocta-ski-2018/

yes thats canadabut for the most part k2 and line sell for similar prices in the USA and Canada.

So sorry if its differnt in your market but those those are the prices we have in North America.

So not aure where to go to go from this. Blackcrows are a good example of a smaller brand which use a smaller factory, although it's a differnt brand still and not there own, and they cost a lot more.

Armada are an interesting example. In Canada pricing is similar to line. Within 10% for the most part tallthough this may be differnt in the states. Armada again though outsource so you could perhaps say they do not have the control or quality checks that your own factory offers so this could be part of the reason for the price difference. Also remember having your own factory involves a lot of costs which outsourcing does not but it also offers a lot more in terms of flexibility and controls so there are points for both making inhouse and outsourcing.

Basically if you outsource like armada you may be may be able to reduce costs but you can't garentee quality as easily. So hopefully that explains armada.

 

[SofaKingSick]

Which country are you in?

i just looked at lines Sight and there is no pricing. Evo and backcountry both have the pascado as msrp $899.
https://www.backcountry.com/ski?show=all&p=brand:Line&nf=1
https://www.evo.com/shop?text=LINE+SKis

a the nocta sells for $1050 in whistler
https://comorsports.com/catalog/product/ski/skis/black-crows-nocta-ski-2018/

yes thats canadabut for the most part k2 and line sell for similar prices in the USA and Canada.

So sorry if its differnt in your market but those those are the prices we have in North America.

So not aure where to go to go from this. Blackcrows are a good example of a smaller brand which use a smaller factory, although it's a differnt brand still and not there own, and they cost a lot more.

Armada are an interesting example. In Canada pricing is similar to line. Within 10% for the most part tallthough this may be differnt in the states. Armada again though outsource so you could perhaps say they do not have the control or quality checks that your own factory offers so this could be part of the reason for the price difference. Also remember having your own factory involves a lot of costs which outsourcing does not but it also offers a lot more in terms of flexibility and controls so there are points for both making inhouse and outsourcing.

Basically if you outsource like armada you may be may be able to reduce costs but you can't garentee quality as easily. So hopefully that explains armada.

i live in the US; every price i've quoted has come directly from each company's website. your being in canada fuzzes these numbers, and your quoting shop prices fuzzes it further. in fact, your link to the whistler shop shows those skis at $840 with a supposed original price of $1050 crossed out. i'm not sure if you're purposely being disingenuous there but this is a difficult discussion to have with these inconsistencies

i gotta get back to work anyway but i'd encourage people reading this to consider what they get for their money from these different brands. ive observed Line since 1999 and skied tons of their skis and consistently scratch my head wondering how they price things how they do. im not comparing them to smaller brands like black crow, im comparing them to other big brands like armada or rossi etc

 

[tomPietrowski]

i live in the US; every price i've quoted has come directly from each company's website. your being in canada fuzzes these numbers, and your quoting shop prices fuzzes it further. in fact, your link to the whistler shop shows those skis at $840 with a supposed original price of $1050 crossed out. i'm not sure if you're purposely being disingenuous there but this is a difficult discussion to have with these inconsistencies

i gotta get back to work anyway but i'd encourage people reading this to consider what they get for their money from these different brands. ive observed Line since 1999 and skied tons of their skis and consistently scratch my head wondering how they price things how they do. im not comparing them to smaller brands like black crow, im comparing them to other big brands like armada or rossi etc

No sorry man I was trying to find the regular price ie the price crossed out. That price is the regular season price not the sale price which all skis will be now. The same was true for the evo and backcountry prices. I was going off the crossed out price as that is the Regular price but obviously at this time of years all skis are on sale.

In canada line skis are on on par with the brands like armada and Rossi and that was what I was trying to show I was not trying to deceive you at all.

Perhaps pricing king is differnt in the states but I know for line and k2 we try to keep it similar to Canada but I don't know about armada etc but judging from the links I sent it seems similar.

But yeah ear I told you why there pricing is on par with armada so in other words not bad considering they do all there own manufacturing.

If there is is anything else let me know.