Bush documents a HOAX

h3ofilms

Active member
www.drudgereport.com (sorry i always fuck up links)

three independent typographical experts independently hired by cbs news and 60 minutes have declared that the documents showing that President Bush did not complete his military commitments and just 'vanished' before a physical have been declared FORGED

what type of asshole forges those type of documents?

p.s. Bush is a full 9 points ahead in the newest polls

Hibachi King Drops 8/31/04
 
no surprises there

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Good Fun With A Hand Gun.

alpentalik: i had lots of dust bunnies...they were nice and soft, but then i realized that they had pubes in them.
 
is... is that.... wait, nevermind, not surprised.

-Pat Melvin

WBP|films

'Who's not 18 yet? What? LA LA LA LA LA LA! I can't hear you.' - Jay
 
oh dear. good stuff.

Mercy's eyes are blue

When she places them in front of you

Nothing holds a roman candle to

The solemn warmth you feel inside

 
In all fairness. Mike Drudge ISN'T the most unbiased person on the internet. Anyways, it says that it MAY have been forged. Granted, I dont' deny these may smell a little fishy, but I will wait till I have all the facts. Now there's a new idea. (yes, I'm refering to the 'failed intellegence' that led to the war in Iraq)

-Pat Melvin

WBP|films

'Who's not 18 yet? What? LA LA LA LA LA LA! I can't hear you.' - Jay
 
'the documents showing that President Bush did not complete his military commitments and just 'vanished' before a physical have been declared FORGED '

So then isnt that saying that he did complete is military commitments??? Im confused, what you just posted sounded like it was good for bush. Its saying the papers that said he went awol are fake....Which means he did serve.

'Don't fuck with me 'cause I'm going to delete everything you ever post and have ever posted - Flanker, A moderator
 
not papers, just a recently found memo. The memo doesn't really make sense to me either, but I'm no expert. Anyways, it doesn't change anything, except that whoever brought this to CBS forged it. That is IF IT WAS FORGED.

-Pat Melvin

WBP|films

'Who's not 18 yet? What? LA LA LA LA LA LA! I can't hear you.' - Jay
 
Let me break it down how I see it.

All this Vietnam shit just just that. Shit. George Bush didn't even set foot in the country. Kery not only went to vietnam, he got a peice of shratnel lodged in his shoulder while he was there.

I don't blame bush for finding a way out of vietnam, a war I think we had no reason to be fighting. I would have done the same thing, infact, I'd have probably peaced out and gone to Canada.

However, I blame Bush for creating a war in Iraq that's shaping up to be a spitting image of Vietnam. A war with no exit. Yesterday's New York Times front page headline ran this:

'U.S. Conceding Rebles control Regions of Iraq'

the first paragraph of the article goes on to read:

'As American deaths in Iraq opperations reached the 1000 mark, top pentagon officials said tuesday that insurgents controled important parts of central Iraq and that it was unclear when American and Iraqi forces would be able to secure those areas.'

Thats the reason this vietnam stuff really urks me. Its a non issue that's become one of the center pieces of the election on BOTH sides of the fence. Just a bunch Partison squabbling. Its pretty rediculous and distracting from the issues that are effecting us in the here and now.

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qualities solidity well finished after sale services (if broken, ..). so what do you think? out of one fact: armadas black and PINK is ugly and faggy!
 
I read the New York Times every day, and it is the most liberal rag in the nation, I only read it because it is free and I can't find a Wall Street Journal and I am not stupid enough to read USA Today. But really, just reading through todays paper I was just blown away by the bias, I mean it makes moveon.org look like a neo-fascist nazi organization. But really,, can you trust a paper that had a reporter reporting from the front lines of Iraq while he was in his loft in SOHO

Politicaly Active Since 1992

'Soberity is not an option.'

Drivin that Train
 
FUCK MAN... what the fuck is liberal about Top Pentagon Officals reporting the FACT that insurgents control important regions of central Iraq, and that they are unsure of when we will be able to re-take control?

Do the facts become liberal spin when they dont fall into bush's pretty little plan?

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qualities solidity well finished after sale services (if broken, ..). so what do you think? out of one fact: armadas black and PINK is ugly and faggy!
 
honestly, i couldn't give more of a shit on who fought where for how long and whether or not they were injured. i care about how they are going to rebuild our nation. this is why i'm against george bush, because i don't think the person who put our nation in a $200+ billion deficit is going to get us out of it. i also don't trust a man who rushes into war alone without the support of the UN.

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Good Fun With A Hand Gun.

alpentalik: i had lots of dust bunnies...they were nice and soft, but then i realized that they had pubes in them.
 
thank you dave. bigJ, please, understand, when hte GOVERNMENT says something, it is assumed to be fact. I can see how you're reluctant to believe this though, after all the lies they've told us.

-Pat Melvin

WBP|films

'Who's not 18 yet? What? LA LA LA LA LA LA! I can't hear you.' - Jay
 
For conservatives, many things factual become liberal solely because they have no spin on them. This is why sooo many people and organizations are becoming labeled 'liberal', everything now is becoming labeled liberal by the conservatives because they feel they are under attack from all sides. Facts become the enemy. Not all facts, there are many facts that favor BUsh and his admin, but there are many many more that do not, and these become liberal biases in the eyes of conservatives. This is not a new defense mechanism of the republican party, but it is an effective one. Also these documents being forged is going to hurt Kerry and help Bush no matter how insignificant. The Bush admin is going to say 'look how our leader is under attack by these false aligations and he is still performing under fire' Shitty.

`-=`-=`-=`-=`-=`-=`-=`-=`-=`-=`-=`-=`-=`-=`-=`

'haha he told his parents ahbout his ginormous cock.... what a fag' - linemaverick540

'I wonder why haters tend to be idiots?' J.D._May

 
here's the thing... and I said it before. the white house released these documents after CBS talked about them. So, therefore, either the White HOUse is trying to hurt bush, or they're true.

-Pat Melvin

WBP|films

'Who's not 18 yet? What? LA LA LA LA LA LA! I can't hear you.' - Jay
 
'when hte GOVERNMENT says something, it is assumed to be fact.'

can i quote you on that in the future melvs?

Mercy's eyes are blue

When she places them in front of you

Nothing holds a roman candle to

The solemn warmth you feel inside

 
only if you include the rest of the post so people can see what I was refering to.

Also, the point I was making is why would the White HOUse release these documents that hurt bush if they were forged? Why would the white house forge these documents in the first place?

-Pat Melvin

WBP|films

'Who's not 18 yet? What? LA LA LA LA LA LA! I can't hear you.' - Jay
 
Therefore, they are not forged, the White House would not shoot itself in the foot during the most important election in a long ass time.

Politicaly Active Since 1992

'Soberity is not an option.'

Drivin that Train
 
To the kid that said that the NY times is liberal. Ny state is a democratic state. I would expect it to be slightly to the left but it is one of the most imformitive and non biased newspapers out there. Also i agree with what jibtech said, the pentagon isnt gonna release bullshit, they already did that with the whole 'weapons of mass destruction' in iraq and look at 9/11. we let them walk in take our own planes and kill our people. The bush administration may think its making america safer now but in reality they're the ones that fucked up and made it more dangerous than ever. Americas reputation is in the hands of our president. Bush tainted our reputation with his pre-emtive strike into iraq in order to get rid of those terrible weapons of mass destruction. Instead we killed thousands of innocent people, made the middle east hate us more, and all we have to show for it is one thousand troops dead. So Vote Bush if any of the above sounds good to you.

www.magichat.net

H30 Films

check out Hibachi King @ www.h30films.net

 
im sure glad we have saddamm hussein though cause this whole war we could've been looking for that fucking towel head bin laden that knocked down OUR towers.

www.magichat.net

H30 Films

check out Hibachi King @ www.h30films.net

 
Its pissing me off so fucking much that the majority of the debating over the election is about stuff that happened 30 years ago. I dont know if bush did serve I dont know if kerry did exagerate his heroism but I dont think that either should in any way effect the election the way they are. From now on there should be NO political posts about vietnam

Jesus saves!

Gretzky gets the rebound. he feeds the puck to LeClair. he shoots! he scores! the crowd goes wild
 
Dude, it is very liberal, it isn't a bad paper, easily top 2rd or 3rd, I know what I am talking about with it, just read it one day and you will see the liberal bias

Politicaly Active Since 1992

'Soberity is not an option.'

Drivin that Train
 
The documents are real.........the story about them being fake is just spin......they make a BS story about them being a hoax, use some BS 'expert opinion' to support it ,the average american reads it once ,posts on message board,tells their friends, and then goes back to watching American Idol,Survivor,Fox news, etc

 
BigJ, sorry, but you haven't got a clue what you're talking about. The times is reallly very moderate. Many of the top editorialists are republican, as are many of the perspectives expressed. You cons just like to cry 'LIBERAL MEDIA!' every time a story comes up that doesn't accord with your political beliefs. From now on, don't allege bias unless you actually have a reasonable (by which I mean experience with a couple of dozen international papers) understanding of the political spectrum, so that you're able to make accurate comparisons. my chief complaint about the state of politics in the U.S. is that your political spectrum is way, way off in relation to the rest of the world (spatially and temporally).

------------

In a haze

A stormy haze

I’ll be around

I’ll be loving you

Always

Always

Here I am

And I’ll take my time

Here I am

And I’ll wait in line

Always

Always...
 
WHO CARES?

Both candidates and all their backers need to shut up about what happened 30 years ago and start talking about real issues. All this shit had very little substance to it in the beginning, but come on people! This is absurd!

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See my website, Common Sense: www.ThoseDamnLiberals.org

I'm an atheist/moralist.

My parents were hippies. Both my grandfathers were Mennonite conscientious objectors in WWII. It's complicated.
 
Anyone who doesn't think the NY Times is a liberal rag should read this article straight from the times.

THE PUBLIC EDITOR; Is The New York Times a Liberal Newspaper?

By DANIEL OKRENT

Published: July 25, 2004, Sunday

ARTICLE TOOLS

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OF course it is.

The fattest file on my hard drive is jammed with letters from the disappointed, the dismayed and the irate who find in this newspaper a liberal bias that infects not just political coverage but a range of issues from abortion to zoology to the appointment of an admitted Democrat to be its watchdog. (That would be me.) By contrast, readers who attack The Times from the left -- and there are plenty -- generally confine their complaints to the paper's coverage of electoral politics and foreign policy.

I'll get to the politics-and-policy issues this fall (I want to watch the campaign coverage before I conclude anything), but for now my concern is the flammable stuff that ignites the right. These are the social issues: gay rights, gun control, abortion and environmental regulation, among others. And if you think The Times plays it down the middle on any of them, you've been reading the paper with your eyes closed.

But if you're examining the paper's coverage of these subjects from a perspective that is neither urban nor Northeastern nor culturally seen-it-all; if you are among the groups The Times treats as strange objects to be examined on a laboratory slide (devout Catholics, gun owners, Orthodox Jews, Texans); if your value system wouldn't wear well on a composite New York Times journalist, then a walk through this paper can make you feel you're traveling in a strange and forbidding world.

Start with the editorial page, so thoroughly saturated in liberal theology that when it occasionally strays from that point of view the shocked yelps from the left overwhelm even the ceaseless rumble of disapproval from the right.

Across the gutter, the Op-Ed page editors do an evenhanded job of representing a range of views in the essays from outsiders they publish -- but you need an awfully heavy counterweight to balance a page that also bears the work of seven opinionated columnists, only two of whom could be classified as conservative (and, even then, of the conservative subspecies that supports legalization of gay unions and, in the case of William Safire, opposes some central provisions of the Patriot Act).

But opinion pages are opinion pages, and ''balanced opinion page'' is an oxymoron. So let's move elsewhere. In the Sunday magazine, the culture-wars applause-o-meter chronically points left. On the Arts & Leisure front page every week, columnist Frank Rich slices up President Bush, Mel Gibson, John Ashcroft and other paladins of the right in prose as uncompromising as Paul Krugman's or Maureen Dowd's. The culture pages often feature forms of art, dance or theater that may pass for normal (or at least tolerable) in New York but might be pretty shocking in other places.

Same goes for fashion coverage, particularly in the Sunday magazine, where I've encountered models who look like they're preparing to murder (or be murdered), and others arrayed in a mode you could call dominatrix chic. If you're like Jim Chapman, one of my correspondents who has given up on The Times, you're lost in space. Wrote Chapman, ''Whatever happened to poetry that required rhyme and meter, to songs that required lyrics and tunes, to clothing ads that stressed the costume rather than the barely clothed females and slovenly dressed, slack-jawed, unshaven men?''

In the Sunday Styles section, there are gay wedding announcements, of course, but also downtown sex clubs and T-shirts bearing the slogan, ''I'm afraid of Americans.'' The findings of racial-equity reformer Richard Lapchick have been appearing in the sports pages for decades (''Since when is diversity a sport?'' one e-mail complainant grumbled). The front page of the Metro section has featured a long piece best described by its subhead, ''Cross-Dressers Gladly Pay to Get in Touch with Their Feminine Side.'' And a creationist will find no comfort in Science Times.

Not that creationists should expect to find comfort in Science Times. Newspapers have the right to decide what's important and what's not. But their editors must also expect that some readers will think: ''This does not represent me or my interests. In fact, it represents my enemy.'' So is it any wonder that the offended or befuddled reader might consider everything else in the paper -- including, say, campaign coverage -- suspicious as well?

TIMES publisher Arthur O. Sulzberger Jr. doesn't think this walk through The Times is a tour of liberalism. He prefers to call the paper's viewpoint ''urban.'' He says that the tumultuous, polyglot metropolitan environment The Times occupies means ''We're less easily shocked,'' and that the paper reflects ''a value system that recognizes the power of flexibility.''

He's right; living in New York makes a lot of people think that way, and a lot of people who think that way find their way to New York (me, for one). The Times has chosen to be an unashamed product of the city whose name it bears, a condition magnified by the been-there-done-that irony afflicting too many journalists. Articles containing the word ''postmodern'' have appeared in The Times an average of four times a week this year -- true fact! -- and if that doesn't reflect a Manhattan sensibility, I'm Noam Chomsky.

But it's one thing to make the paper's pages a congenial home for editorial polemicists, conceptual artists, the fashion-forward or other like-minded souls (European papers, aligned with specific political parties, have been doing it for centuries), and quite another to tell only the side of the story your co-religionists wish to hear. I don't think it's intentional when The Times does this. But negligence doesn't have to be intentional.

The gay marriage issue provides a perfect example. Set aside the editorial page, the columnists or the lengthy article in the magazine (''Toward a More Perfect Union,'' by David J. Garrow, May 9) that compared the lawyers who won the Massachusetts same-sex marriage lawsuit to Thurgood Marshall and Martin Luther King. That's all fine, especially for those of us who believe that homosexual couples should have precisely the same civil rights as heterosexuals.

But for those who also believe the news pages cannot retain their credibility unless all aspects of an issue are subject to robust examination, it's disappointing to see The Times present the social and cultural aspects of same-sex marriage in a tone that approaches cheerleading. So far this year, front-page headlines have told me that ''For Children of Gays, Marriage Brings Joy'' (March 19); that the family of ''Two Fathers, With One Happy to Stay at Home'' (Jan. 12) is a new archetype; and that ''Gay Couples Seek Unions in God's Eyes'' (Jan. 30). I've learned where gay couples go to celebrate their marriages; I've met gay couples picking out bridal dresses; I've been introduced to couples who have been together for decades and have now sanctified their vows in Canada, couples who have successfully integrated the world of competitive ballroom dancing, couples whose lives are the platonic model of suburban stability.

Every one of these articles was perfectly legitimate. Cumulatively, though, they would make a very effective ad campaign for the gay marriage cause. You wouldn't even need the articles: run the headlines over the invariably sunny pictures of invariably happy people that ran with most of these pieces, and you'd have the makings of a life insurance commercial.

This implicit advocacy is underscored by what hasn't appeared. Apart from one excursion into the legal ramifications of custody battles (''Split Gay Couples Face Custody Hurdles,'' by Adam Liptak and Pam Belluck, March 24), potentially nettlesome effects of gay marriage have been virtually absent from The Times since the issue exploded last winter.

The San Francisco Chronicle runs an uninflected article about Congressional testimony from a Stanford scholar making the case that gay marriage in the Netherlands has had a deleterious effect on heterosexual marriage. The Boston Globe explores the potential impact of same-sex marriage on tax revenues, and the paucity of reliable research on child-rearing in gay families. But in The Times, I have learned next to nothing about these issues, nor about partner abuse in the gay community, about any social difficulties that might be encountered by children of gay couples or about divorce rates (or causes, or consequences) among the 7,000 couples legally joined in Vermont since civil union was established there four years ago.

On a topic that has produced one of the defining debates of our time, Times editors have failed to provide the three-dimensional perspective balanced journalism requires. This has not occurred because of management fiat, but because getting outside one's own value system takes a great deal of self-questioning. Six years ago, the ownership of this sophisticated New York institution decided to make it a truly national paper. Today, only 50 percent of The Times's readership resides in metropolitan New York, but the paper's heart, mind and habits remain embedded here. You can take the paper out of the city, but without an effort to take the city and all its attendant provocations, experiments and attitudes out of the paper, readers with a different worldview will find The Times an alien beast.

Taking the New York out of The New York Times would be a really bad idea. But a determination by the editors to be mindful of the weight of its hometown's presence would not.

With that, I'm leaving town. Next week, letters from readers; after that, this space will be occupied by my polymathic pal Jack Rosenthal, a former Times writer and editor whose name appeared on the masthead for 25 years. I'm going to spend August in a deck chair and see if I can once again read The Times like a civilian. See you after Labor Day.

The public editor serves as the readers' representative. His opinions and conclusions are his own. His address is Public Editor, The New York Times, 229 West 43rd Street, New York 10036-3959; or e-mail: public@nytimes.com. Telephone messages: (212) 556-7652. The public editor's column appears at least twice monthly in this section, and his Web journal can be found at nytimes.com/danielokrent.
http://query.nytimes.com/gst/fullpage.html?res=9D01E7D8173DF936A15754C0A9629C8B63

And for you liberal ass-hats out there that think Bush was the only one after this war take a look at this.

7. 'Iraq is a long way from here, but what happens there matters a great deal here. For the risks that the leaders of a rogue state will use nuclear, chemical, or biological weapons against us or our allies is the greatest security threat we face.' - Madeline Albright, Feb 18, 1998

6. 'He will use those weapons of mass destruction again, as he has 10 times since 1983.' - Sandy Berger, Feb 18, 1998

5. 'We know that he has stored secret supplies of biological and chemical weapons throughout his country.' - Al Gore, Sept 23, 2002

4. 'We have known for many years that Saddam Hussein is seeking and developing weapons of mass destruction.' - Ted Kennedy, Sept 27, 2002

3. 'In the four years since the inspectors left, intelligence reports show that Saddam Hussein has worked to rebuild his chemical and biological weapon stock...' - Hillary Clinton, Oct 10, 2002

2. '...the threat of Saddam Hussein with weapons of mass destruction is real.' - John Kerry, Jan 23, 2003

1. 'If Saddam rejects peace and we have to use force, our purpose is clear. We want to seriously diminish the threat posed by Iraq's weapons of mass destruction program.' President Bill Clinton, Feb 17 1998

These quotes are from the same Demoncats that have called President Bush a liar because he agreed with them that there were weapons of mass destruction in Iraq.

Right In America

Getting it Right In America.
 
hahaha, graves! you are the man. i've heard all this stuff, but i could find the sources ive been looking for, you are a Godsend

jd, what you make of this???

______________________________________

'Really, I gotta say that I'm glad you exist, 'cause if there wasn't there'd be noone to make fun of and diss.'

Solider in the NS ARMY

Rollers of NS unite!!!

603 for life

I'm conservative, just so you all know.

Member Number: 5172

 
'7. 'Iraq is a long way from here, but what happens there matters a great deal here. For the risks that the leaders of a rogue state will use nuclear, chemical, or biological weapons against us or our allies is the greatest security threat we face.' - Madeline Albright, Feb 18, 1998

6. 'He will use those weapons of mass destruction again, as he has 10 times since 1983.' - Sandy Berger, Feb 18, 1998

5. 'We know that he has stored secret supplies of biological and chemical weapons throughout his country.' - Al Gore, Sept 23, 2002

4. 'We have known for many years that Saddam Hussein is seeking and developing weapons of mass destruction.' - Ted Kennedy, Sept 27, 2002

3. 'In the four years since the inspectors left, intelligence reports show that Saddam Hussein has worked to rebuild his chemical and biological weapon stock...' - Hillary Clinton, Oct 10, 2002

2. '...the threat of Saddam Hussein with weapons of mass destruction is real.' - John Kerry, Jan 23, 2003

1. 'If Saddam rejects peace and we have to use force, our purpose is clear. We want to seriously diminish the threat posed by Iraq's weapons of mass destruction program.' President Bill Clinton, Feb 17 1998


...so that means that that Madeline Albright, Sandy Berger, Al Gore, Ted Kennedy, Hillary Clinton, John Kerry, and Bill Clinton were all wrong. So were George W. Bush, Dick Cheney, Colin Powell, Condoleeza Rice and Donald Rumsfeld, to name a few.

None of this changes the fact that NO WEAPONS OF MASS DESTRUCTION HAVE BEEN FOUND.

When the Republicans start trying to rationalize their argument by saying that a bunch of Democrats were wrong right along with them, you know they're in trouble.

-----------------

See my website, Common Sense: www.ThoseDamnLiberals.org

I'm an atheist/moralist.

My parents were hippies. Both my grandfathers were Mennonite conscientious objectors in WWII. It's complicated.
 
Agingeri you failed to see the basis behind my post. Those quotes have all come from people who have 'now' openly opposed Bush's actions, despite being in clear support of such matters in the past (they are just playing politics, Clinton wanted Iraq badly, he just didn't have the balls). In no way was I saying their comments should be reason to go to war.

Right In America

Getting it Right In America.
 
^I thought that clinton just dropped a couple bombs on iraq just cause that seems to be the tradition among presidents nowadays

Jesus saves!

Gretzky gets the rebound. he feeds the puck to LeClair. he shoots! he scores! the crowd goes wild
 
'Those quotes have all come from people who have 'now' openly opposed Bush's actions, despite being in clear support of such matters in the past'

...so there are some hypocritical politicians out there. Tell me something I don't know.

It still doesn't change the fact that the war was a mistake.

FYI: I, like many other democrats, NEVER thought we should invade Iraq, and I, like many other democrats feel a bit misrepresented by the likes of Kerry and Clinton on this topic.

-----------------

See my website, Common Sense: www.ThoseDamnLiberals.org

I'm an atheist/moralist.

My parents were hippies. Both my grandfathers were Mennonite conscientious objectors in WWII. It's complicated.
 
under clinton it was only supperficial bombing. as oppossed to the surgical bombing in afghanistan or iraq, if you want ill find some quotes to support that, but i think you agree with me

______________________________________

'Really, I gotta say that I'm glad you exist, 'cause if there wasn't there'd be noone to make fun of and diss.'

Solider in the NS ARMY

Rollers of NS unite!!!

603 for life

I'm conservative, just so you all know.

Member Number: 5172

 
haha, someone said this is shaping up to be vietnam, no exit in site.

I believe we acheived our goals: eliminated a heinous dicatator, Vietnam acheived nothing

Had a 'few' less fatalities: 1000 in this war and how many again in Vietnam?

And I believe we have a few countries behind us helping with the clean-up efforts.

But seriously, I believe Bush could have done a slightly better job, but then again we all expect everyone in leadership to acheive perfection, but that has never and never will happen.

Kerry is a joke in my opinion, but if you feel like losing more of your paycheck to government, and then ultimately to the dredges of social reforming sucking humanity. Then go ahead, vote for him. But I will kick you in the balls.

Micheal Earl Willard
 
'I believe Bush could have done a slightly better job'

I know exactly how he could have done a much better job: he didn't HAVE to invade. If he hadn't invaded, Saddam Hussein would still be in power, yes, but there would be 1,000 American soldiers that were still alive and nearly 15,000 innocent Iraqi civilians. Besides, our primary goal (before we invaded) wasn't to unseat Saddam, it was to find those WMD's (there weren't any and a lot of officials said so before we invaded) and protect America from the threat posed by Iraq (come to find out they posed no threat).

In this case, was war really used as a last resort?

-----------------

See my website, Common Sense: www.ThoseDamnLiberals.org

I'm an atheist/moralist.

My parents were hippies. Both my grandfathers were Mennonite conscientious objectors in WWII. It's complicated.
 
enter the 'slightly'

he should have given his primary objective to the public from the getgo, eliminating saddam not wmds, that way he could avaoid all the ridicule.

I have more to say, but I've debated this topic to death, and I grow tired of trying to inform the ignorant.

Micheal Earl Willard
 
This war was the furthest thing from a mistake. We removed a dictator that had killed at least 6 figures of his own citizens during his thirty year regime (some estimates say deaths were in the millions, however, it will never be known because of all the people that 'vanished'). Sadly American lives have been lost in this war as well as some civilian casualties, those are the only regrets. Saddam, whether people like to admit it or not, was an imminent threat. For years we left the catastrophic Iraq in the filthy hands of the United Nations and they failed to complete their task. Just as they have failed to complete their task in the Darfur region of Sudan. Just as they failed to complete their task in Bosnia and numerous other cases across the world. As the UN and the French were lining the pockets with proceeds from the Oil for Food program, thousands upon thousands of Iraqi children were starving to death, as Saddam continued to build his personal empire. If the UN had done its job, we would not be where we are today. Saddam had to be removed, as his predecessors (his two sons) would have only brought more terror to the Iraqi people and a bigger threat to the world.

Unfortunately the United States has become the World's police force. As NATO continues to fail and the UN continues to scratch the back of terrorists (their flag flies side by side with the world's second deadliest terror group, Hezbollah, on the Palestinian border right next to Israel) it has fallen on the shoulders of the US and Britain to carry out the UNs failures. (I would rather have the UN do their job, but all the do is slap people on the wrist, again reference Sudan)

For those of you that are going to accuse me of being a War Monger (I am sure some of you well), I ask you to ponder this situation. It is 1935, there is plenty of intelligence chatter being picked up by every intelligence agency in the world about a suppressing dictator named Hitler. FDR, despite the objections of ass-hats across New York and California, decides to launch a pre-emptive strike against the *cough*sovereign*cough* nation of Iraq. With their panties in a bunch people line the streets of New York in protest calling for the resignation of FDR and his 'fascist' staff. Would you have objected to that war, knowing what you know today? Would you have cried 'foul' to that pre-emptive strike? Would people have accused FDR of being a murderous capitalist pig? Would people have lined the streets holding signs saying 'No Blood for Bratwurst and Beer'? I doubt it. We all know what Saddam has done, just imagine what he would have been capable of.

Unless of course you watch the Dan Blather interview with Hussein, then you would have thought of him as an 'average joe.' They should have just showed him petting a puppy for an hour.

www.iraqthemodel.blogspot.com

www.chrenkoff.blogspot.com/

Right In America

Getting it Right In America.
 
''he should have given his primary objective to the public from the getgo, eliminating saddam not wmds, that way he could avaoid all the ridicule.''

Defense department statement by Paul Wolfowitz:

''...There have always been 3 fundamental concerns. One is weapons of mass destruction, the second is support for terrorism, and the third is the criminal treatment of the Iraqi peoples...The third one by itself as I think I said earlier, is a reason to help the Iraqis but it's not a reason to put American kids' lives at risk, certainly not on the scale we did it.''

Not worth the risk? Then why'd you do it?

Before the war started, the liberation of Iraqis was always added as an afterthought; you were always hearing things about 'our security' and 'our interests'. Really, if the US army went around liberating veryone under an oppressive regime, they'd be at war with half the world! Liberation sounds nice enough, but it's not worth dying for, and it isn't worth our money, according to the current administration... but cheap gas, cheap clothes, cheap TVs... that's more like it!

------------

In a haze

A stormy haze

I’ll be around

I’ll be loving you

Always

Always

Here I am

And I’ll take my time

Here I am

And I’ll wait in line

Always

Always...
 
^took the words right out of my mouth. or my hands depending on how you look at it

Jesus saves!

Gretzky gets the rebound. he feeds the puck to LeClair. he shoots! he scores! the crowd goes wild
 
I hate the conservative diversion tactics... yes, some Democrats 'flip-flop'. Does that affect my beliefs? No. Does it affect my argument? Nope. Oh no, some newspapers have a liberal slant because they cover stories that might cast Bush in a bad light, and *gasp* maybe they treat gays like normal human beings. But guess what? Other news sources have a conservative slant, and in fact it's nearly impossible to find a truly balanced one. Does this negate facts? No. Facts are facts, and despite the words those filthy liberals print around them, a source like the New York Times is not going to lie. Writing off everything they say as 'liberal propoganda' would be convenient, but it doesn't work that way.

The fact is, we had no good reason to go to war against Saddam. Bin Laden flew planes into the WTC, and I have yet to see him captured on the news, despite the fact that the US military could easily capture or assassinate him at a fraction of the cost of the Iraq war. Saddam was contained- even if he possessed WMDs, his archaic delivery systems would give him a range of a couple of hundred miles at best, and certainly not across the world to the USA. And there was no proof that he had WMDs... and there still isn't. What's the deal with that?

But Saddam had ties to terrorist groups, you might say. Yes, Al-Qaeda may have had training camps in Iraq, but that doesn't mean they had any kind of concrete link to Saddam. And I would almost find Saddam's hosting terrorists more excusable than our own government setting up a prison camp for detaining prisoners without trial- oh, is that prohibited by the constitution? Why don't we just put it in fucking Cuba. That makes it OK, right? Saddam was a horrible person, but at least he wasn't a goddamn hypocrite. And then how about we turn a blind eye to the abuse of Iraqi prisoners in their own country- weren't we supposed to be liberating them? Oh, I see, that was just another bullshit reason to invade.

You can waffle on about liberal spin and flip-flopping dems and swift boats all you like, it doesn't change the facts- specifically the fact that we invaded a country for no reason at all. The fact that Bush's foreign policy is a huge fucking international trainwreck. What he's done is inexcusable.

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The government can put a gun in my hands and send me to die in Iraq, but I can't buy a beer.

I fucking LOVE the USA.
 
^funny thing about the prison without any trial being against the constitution. THE FRIGGIN CONSTITUTION IS FOR FRIGGIN AMERICANS!!!!! NOT ENEMY COMBATANTS!!!!! can i say it any LOUDER????

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'Really, I gotta say that I'm glad you exist, 'cause if there wasn't there'd be noone to make fun of and diss.'

Solider in the NS ARMY

Rollers of NS unite!!!

603 for life

I'm conservative, just so you all know.

Member Number: 5172

 
^ What the fuck? Many of those held in Guantanamo were American citizens or 'suspected terrorists' who had no proven ties to anything. Guantanamo actually isn't a POW camp, and I believe it was started before the Iraq war, not sure about Afghanistan. But do some research and you'll find that those held at Guantanamo weren't 'enemy combatants.'

_____________________________________________

The government can put a gun in my hands and send me to die in Iraq, but I can't buy a beer.

I fucking LOVE the USA.
 
who did what or not?

_____________________________________________

The government can put a gun in my hands and send me to die in Iraq, but I can't buy a beer.

I fucking LOVE the USA.
 
'he should have given his primary objective to the public from the getgo, eliminating saddam not wmds, that way he could avaoid all the ridicule.'

...except that if he had just come out and said that Iraq posed no threat to America but we were going to invade them anyway just for the hell of it, he would have been laughed out of the white house.

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See my website, Common Sense: www.ThoseDamnLiberals.org

I'm an atheist/moralist.

My parents were hippies. Both my grandfathers were Mennonite conscientious objectors in WWII. It's complicated.
 
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