Atleast Hear MSP out, I contacted them, here is there response.

CBROOKS

CBROOKS

Active member
Alright before I post the E mails i exchanged with MSP, I would like you to know 2 things.

1. I realize my first email was quite harsh, i was pissed as many newschooolers were.

2. This does not mean i believe what MSP is saying, this is just relayed from emails between myself and MSP.

Alright Boys and Girls, here they are.

The EMAILS!

Me to MSP

http://forums.creativecow.net/cgi-bin/new_page_wrapper.cgi?forumid=1&page=http://www.creativecow.net/articles/oneil_bill/shadows2/index.html

Alright, take a look at that little gem.

Now, open up your new trailer. Now, Press the play button. And tell me the fucking difference between your titles and that tutorial.

And if you do have an explanation for this, i STRONGLY suggest that you proceed to newschoolers.com and explain what has gone on in one of the numerous threads that have been made for the soul purpose of pointing all this shit out.

I really, sincerely hope that MSP is not going down the fucking drain like this. And that they didnt sink to a level this low.

Ohhh yeah! One More Thing MSP!

Explain this. TRUE OR FALSE MSP

the story goes: at the beginning of the season, TBC was lined up to make a second film, and began filming for it. they cut some of riders from the original film, and were going to make 'super pro' only film with 8-12 of the biggest names.

a little way into the season Steve Winter sat down with Helly Hansen to work out funding for the new MSP movie. Wanting more money for the film, Steve popped in a copy of Teddy Bear Crisis while with someone from Helly Hansen, and played the movie, counting the minutes and seconds of Helly Hansen product exposure and Oakley product exposure. All said and done, Oakley had more seconds of product exposure per dollar of funding contributed than Helly Hansen. Steve Winter explained to Helly Hansen that this was bullshit considering HH was TBC's presenting sponsor. HH also is the presenting sponsor for MSP's movie. Mr. Winter then told HH that no such discrepencies had occured in MSP's film, nor would such a thing happen in next years film. Explaining that MSP had much more promotional value to offer HH per dollar, Steve effectively convinced HH to withdraw from TBC as presenting sponsor, and rather to contribute the money to MSP instead.

Ostness, then struggling to find a presenting sponsor who could contribute as well as HH had, found TBC in a tight spot to be able have the neccessary funding in order to create a movie on the level of the original and still support himself.

Steve then offered Ostness more money than he could have made himself sans HH's funding, to film for MSP. Ostness, needing a for sure income and wanting to continue filming skiers for a living, accepted. This whole thing assured Winter more funding, more exclusiveness of the riders in his film (as MSP and TBC shared many of the same athletes), and effectively insured less competition when it came to DVD sales. This also effectively deprived us, the DVD consumers, of one of the most innovative film companies to come out in years.

Ostness is, as far I have heard, currently filming for MSP.

MSP responds

Chase-

Thank you for writing directly to the source so we can respond to you and the truth doesn't get distorted by an internet chat community. Our graphics to the teaser intro were outsourced to a friend in Canada. If this person went to this tutorial or happens to be the guy who created the tutorial we are not sure, it is the graphics to a teaser we threw together in a day. We like the way the graphics looked so we used them. The real issue here is the flat out lies and rumors started on newschoolers. We would like to be involved with the newschool community because we respect the kids and the community that is there, however we cant visit this site and respond to every question or comment posted by a user because when we do it will either be deleted or we don't have the time to respond to continous lies on this site. We are in this industry because we love the sport and the people within. If you look at the original thread it was stated that the ski industry is full of rumors and this very well could be one of them. Its obviosly a complete rumor and it will be cleared up now. There was never such a meeting, as far as we now Gary at HH was planning to sponsor the new TBC movie and Henrik and Kris decided to do a Jon Olson movie instead. The only comments we have had on TBC was that everyone in this office loved the film and thought it was the most creative ski film out last year. And to clarify other said rumors Kris Ostness did not work for MSP this year, although we respect his work and feel he is one of the best ski cinematograhers in the business. Scott Gaffney posted a response on newschoolers and it was immediatley deleted by someone at newschoolers. We have had lots of positive emails and support from the industry about these threads that keep getting deleted by Newschoolers. I wish you post this on newschoolers.com as will I, but I can guarentee you these will be deleted as were all previous MSP responses. Again we respect you for coming directly to us with your questions, we would rather spend our time skiing and filming than responding to all the lies on NS. Skiing is all about fun, lets keep it that way.

Cheers

Kevin

 
hahaha funny story...was talking to my bro yesterday (team manager for HH) about this whole thing, and the one thought that came to both of us is....either msp was getting screwed and was dealing with it, or more likely, they didn't know about this. Of course they outsourced their graphics, its what everyone does
 
same exact e-mail as int he other thread... again, anyone know who/why posts of theirs are being deleted... I've never heard of any mods doing that.
 
Haha yeah i didnt see that, but here you can see what My first email was. Thanks for respnding MSP!
 
See MSP didnt do any of that shit you guys are all calling them out for.

MSP kicks ass and i will always buy thier movies.
 
im not saying waht they are saying is false, but write to ostness and helly hansen and see if what they say is correct to what this letter says
 
So there making a Jon Olsson Movie now for release instead of a new TBC movie is this correct?
 
That's interesting. I've never actually seen Steve Winter post, I don't think... hey, Steve, if you or any of your buddies would like to come on here and register as, say, Steve W., and type out a post such as this one, then sign it, I seriously doubt anyone would delete it. I mean, god forbid. I didn't know you'd been doing that, as the only posts backing MSP on here seem to come from aliases like "Sno-man" and "fatbastard" acting all holier than thou in an "I'm in the industry and therefore am better than all you dumb kids, watch me hint that I know more about this situation than you while remaining anonymous and failing completely to stand behind any of my comments". It'd be a refreshing change to see the real MSP guys on here instead of those people, whoever they might be! I heartily welcome Steve to NS!

Those of you going "See? I told you they weren't all bad!" have to be the most gullible kids on the face of the earth... If you hit him enough he'll tell you he started theChicago city fire but THAT DON'T NECESSARILY MAKE IT FUCKING SO.

... Right. Well, believe what you will... as do we all... as I say, I await Steve's appearance with great anticipation!
 
I dunno - I read the response again more carefully this time. There is a repetitive reference to deletion of post(s). There is some built up frustration there.

We have had lots of positive emails and support from the industry about these threads that keep getting deleted by Newschoolers. I wish you post this on newschoolers.com as will I, but I can guarentee you these will be deleted as were all previous MSP responses. Again we respect you for coming directly to us with your questions, we would rather spend our time skiing and filming than responding to all the lies on NS. Skiing is all about fun, lets keep it that way.

 
uhhh oh guys, they're trying to get nser's to fight each other by saying they wrote positive things on here, when i'm pretty sure they never talked in any of the mSP threads i looked in in the past few years. this means war. i've got my prlvic thrusts down so i think they won't have a chance
 
I'm really curious about who's been deleting those posts... Maybe I'll ask paul to look into it so we can punish whoever it was. Hey Steve or any other MSPer who's had posts deleted, under what name was it? I think we can trace this back... Provided you aren't making shit up....
 
My eyes are too blurry to read this all.

Also, for the benefit of people that don't really give two shits about every detail of this, could someone please post a summary of this exchange of words in lamen's terms?

Pretty please?
 
same e-mail as in the other thread, except they added some personalization at the end to thank chase for his concerns.
 
chase said:

-why did you copy a tutorial?

-what really happened with the TBC HH thing?
 
righteous.

and he was all:

-"we made the teaser in a day. fuck it."

-"that event shall now be referred to as that which shall not be named. it never happened."

is this correct?
 
more like

-'we paid someone in Canada to make the graphics and then made the trailer in a day'

-'it never happened, we tried to post on NS to tell the truth but every single post we make gets instantly deleted by the facist NS overlords before any single person can lay eyes on the post. You all have very high thetan levels!'
 
*suck, don't worry, the i & the u are really close to each other, it's easy to make mistakes.

and thank you melvs, you're my favorite!
 
You can believe MSP's email response if you want, but think about this:

that's quite an elaborate story (about HH) for someone to have completely made up on their own.

also, looking at MSP's past track record, is it not believable? TBC was in many people's eyes the sickest movie last year, and won Vast awards. So why would HH choose to withdraw? Ski movie giant MSP pressuring them into it sounds pretty plausible.

That aside - they say they made their trailer in a day? I'm glad they care so much. Granted, the trailer isn't a movie, but I'd rather see film companies that are putting everything they've got into a movie, not giants coasting on easy and milking a cash cow.

The TBC trailer was intense, and definitely made me want to see the movie. MSP trailers are the same every year, with diferent skiing. I know what movie I won't be spending my money on (not like that is a change from other years).
 
I doubt that anyone will even read this post, but I'll ask the question anyway: isn't the point of tutorials learning how to do something? i quote jay michelfelder: "ralph waldo emerson once said, 'imitation is suicide,' but that's a bunch of bullshit."
 
I'm all for learning from tutorials. You gotta learn stuff and get infuences from some place. But their animation wasnt influenced by the tutorial, it WAS the tutorial.
 
As for the graphics issue, I would think that the company cannot exonerate itself for the direct plagiarism by blaming the person they contracted to do the work. Think about it: when a reporter copies something without proper citation, both HE/SHE AND THE NEWSPAPER ARE HELD RESPONSIBLE. It's the company's responsiblity to ensure that the content they are providing to their audience is legit. Laziness is not a defense! That being said, i'm guessing that the dude will never be hired to work on graphics for them again...
 
I just wrote msp a new email with some of the questions listed in here.

The new email!

We at NS really would like to sort this out Kevin. Can you give me the user name(s) that MSP used to post, the one with the deleted posts. And I am a little suprised such a large company, would "throw together" a teaser in a day. I mean its a very good teaser. A day for this?
 
I wish i would have read that before sending this off, i would have included it. I will be sure to do so in my next email.
 
well the graphics arent plagierism, as they come from a tutorial. They just show a rampant lack of creativity/ motivation
 
it is intersting to see this whole thing travel its course.

however, I dont give two shits if somebody in Canada did the graphics for them. As mentioned, they are still responsible. I'm all for using outside influences, and outside influences are inevitable. However, direct copying isn't. In college, or other places for that matter, you plagerise, you can be kicked out, punished, or whatever. But if you're MSP, it isn't your fault. Makes a ton of sense.

Seeing that alone, even if it is a trailer, is disgraceful and unethical.

In all seriousness, the allegations are rough, but I for one don't really care for their movies because of the allegations, I don't really like the movies because they aren't well done.
 
so who else is tired of the drama of a god damn trailer. They can put whatever the hell they want to into their trailer, they could have a 10 year old make an edit for all i care. The point is if you don't like their trailer then dont watch it and don't buy their movie...jesus christ.
 
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