America + patriotism

Eat a poo.

Whats so bad about smoking pot in a robe your whole life?

doesn't matter if nothing got done, that would slow things down make it better.

why do weapon inspectors of USA have to go looking for weapons in Iraq, do any other countries do this?

AND FUCK THE AUSSIES THEY BET US LAST NIGHT. BASTARDS. aha na peace out

im going to watch skiing videos now.

 
I didn't say that americans 'are a bunch of spoiled rich kids' At least i don't think i did..i was pretty drunk writting that. What i said or what i meant to say was that americans ACT like spoiled rich kids...and however that related to whatever i wrote...i forget now..

 
hahah, yah, i like to write 'smart' statements when i'm drunk, just to see if i can pull it off. Likewise with sending drunken emails to ex-girlfriends..........

 
Oioioi,

Do any other countries do Weapons Inspection, or is just the US?

Why are they invading? over such a little things or is there other stuff, can someone tell me?

Is it like Saddam won't let them in so USA are suss that he might be up to something against them???

TELLLLLLLLL MEEEE!!!!!

 
I think the US does that through the UN. With iraq that was part of the deal...iraq doesn't get blown to bits and the US/UN gets to make sure they aren't stock pileing weapons.

 
Most weapon inspectors seem to be english not even americans. We would invade Iraq, not for oil but because of his human rights violations. He is a facist dictator, who runs a military regime that murders thousands of people. Thus not a nice guy, so he shouldnt run the country.

As for the kid saying that us Bombing japan causes birth defects and deaths to this day is very uninformed. There is only about a 2-4% increase in certain cancers and none in many others by the bombs. And there are no genetic mutations caused by the bomb. Think what you want but trust me, I know this a lot better than you. Plus if you look at the ecology of bikini atoll which we blasted with the largest bomb ever blown up on the surface...i forget how many times larger than the japan ones but it was MUCH bigger. The island is flurishing, the reefs are actually in better shape now than most other places in the world...It is now considered one of the best diving spots in the world. The islanders have returned as have many different spieces. Thats in about 50 years not thousands. You recieve more radiation from the earth itself, the sun, and the buildings you live in than the radiation created by nuclear bombs and powerplants. Dont listen to what green peace says they are only hurting the world with their shit about nuclear technology.

A brave man will not live forever but a coward will never live.
 
to the person who said that droping the bomb on japan was one of the biggest mistakes america has made should be hit with a long stick with a nail in it. So you think there would hvae been less japanese casualties from a culture that had NEVER lost a war had we invaded? I can promise you that they would have fought to the last man in the amry, so that means that all of the men in japan older then 15 or 16 would be DEAD. I'm pretty sure that is more then the people who died in the two cities. Oh and also know that no russians or americans died in that battle.

You need to wake the fuck up and realize that war isn't nice. People die, and in general the side who kills more of the other side wins. We had the upper hand in technolagy so we used it, we used it in the gulfwar and I didn't hear any complaints. I can also make a pretty educated guess that we are using it against al-quida.

 
it is stupid to say that the gulf war was fought over human rights violations. Saddam Hussein was killing Kurds for years before he invaded Kuwait (he was Americas ally for much of that time) and it was only when he invaded Kuwait and endangered the U.S's oil supply daddy bush got pissed off and invaded. And furthermore most of the deaths in Iraq these days are caused by lack of medical supplies caused by the sanctions imposed on Iraq by the U.S.

Bellisimo... Its Italian for grouse
 
hey lagwagon, mate. Australias population is 19 million and New Zealands is 3.5 or so. that makes us roughly 5 and a half times bigger, not 20. we won 82 gold medals at the commonwealth games while NZ won 11, roughly 7.5 times more. if we were to go by your reasoning we should only have won 5 and a half times more. but i do agree with what your mum had to say about racism in australia, i hate the way my country seems to be run by rednecks and populated with rednecks. the new zealand government and new zealand people seem to be far more moderate.

Bellisimo... Its Italian for grouse
 
Sadly, politics in New Zealand is a pile of ass. They're all just as bad as each other. Change from left to right biased over a few years and do nothing but change the name of certain laws and acts and say, oooh look what we did for the country. Teachers are terribly underpaid, the hospitals are running out of money, prison sentences are shockingly tiny and all our country's leaders can do is argue and bitch at each other about who burnt a painting with some famous person's signature in it to cover up spending. Fucken hell.

~~Phunkin Phatt Phreerider~~

'We are slaves to the labor of love that winter brings us every year.'

*I love Matty Enns*
 
dude, all the peope ranting about how canada and the US aren't at all alike are bein closed minded as HELL.....as far as this topic goes, the US and canada are like the same country....compared to the middle eastern countries, most of europe, asia, that whole thing....just cause we have different policies on some stuff (which is really trivial if you think about it) doesn't mean that we are as different as night and day

anyway, i think that this hwole new patriotism thing after 9/11 is BULLSHIT...i mean, for a little while right after i know that everyone was pissed and would have wanted to go to war and 'bome em back to the stone age' in a second, but once everyone cooled down it's become almost 'trendy' to be patriotic....and the fact tat criticism, the one thing that makes a republic work, is now considered to be unpatriotic.

remember kids, it's unpatriotic to think.

dude, one time, I snorted ketchup off of a pizza. that sucked.

Oh yeah, republicans suck, you right winged conservative bastards, have fun burning in hell!!!!
 
'to the person who said that droping the bomb on japan was one of the biggest mistakes america has made should be hit with a long stick with a nail in it. So you think there would hvae been less japanese casualties from a culture that had NEVER lost a war had we invaded? I can promise you that they would have fought to the last man in the amry, so that means that all of the men in japan older then 15 or 16 would be DEAD. I'm pretty sure that is more then the people who died in the two cities. Oh and also know that no russians or americans died in that battle.'

Actually, at the time when America dropped the bomb Japan was losing ground rapidly. The American forces had closed around many of the islands near Japan. Also, the Japenese solders became more and more willing to surender to the Americans who captured them as they lost ground. Was the bomb a mistake? If somebody could find out the savillion casualities, perhaps we

could better judge. (It was dropped on a largely savillion populated area.)

So was it a mistake? Not if you wanted to end the war quickly. Because that's what it did. (As far as I know.)

(and sory for m' horrabely awfulll spellink)

A moment is the most you can ever expect from perfection.
 
yeah. take the amount of people that were killed by the blast, multiply that by 10 and that's how many people are deformed or suffering from cancer from it.

MD... Dain bramaged.

'I am now a moderator... and all I had to do was suck harveys cock! who would have guessed?' - Dave Pauls.
 
ok maybe not 10.. but you get the idea.

MD... Dain bramaged.

'I am now a moderator... and all I had to do was suck harveys cock! who would have guessed?' - Dave Pauls.
 
yeah well dudes everything i have ever learnt about radiation is that it last for thousands of years, and is one of the most deadly things ever.

Are those facts just being told to you to make you believe that it's alright, coz theres to much doubt in my mind thats everything pretty much fine.

but thats my opinion, and you guys may be right btu theres still that doubt.

and that Ozemale dude: that was the biggest guess i have ever said, so i don't care if its 19 mill or whatever, you should still fucking cane us with that many more, i just think we do pretty well to keep up with you as we are. you agree?

sorry if i offened you or your country, its just that we get soooo much shit when you guys beat us in anything... and i don't see why we should, when its that close.

 
You are wrong...the long term affects of the bombs were not as severe as you would think. Trust me, I am actually a nuclear engineer. We have done a bunch of training on the affects of radiation since thats what I will be dealing with, not nearly in the ammounts as those people but still more than you get. I work for the goverment and have secret clearance so I have seen the studies that the public hasnt. Dont let all the tree hugging fucks convince you that radiation gives everyone cancer and that it causes birth defects. Radiation is less likely to cause cancer than exposure to some house hold chemicals, that are unregulated by the government. You can get radiation sickness which is your body trying to expell the contaminated particles you inhale or ingest. The people who died months after the bombs didnt die of cancer they died of the burns and other affects of the explosions, like burst internal organs.

As for the false patriotism...I think the worst thing after the terrorist attacks has been every fucking corporation and every politian trying to use it to their advantage. Ashcroft is the worst at this...the man says that anyone who get in his way is unamerican even if some of the things he wants to do basically revoke the bill of rights.

A brave man will not live forever but a coward will never live.
 
yo, yeah dude, i have talked to some teachers at school and they said that the radiation would be pretty much gone but only coz it was a bomb, but in a case of a nuclear power plant, the radiation just keeps absorping into the ground doesn't it, and is much more severe, since you are a nucler engineer you should be able to tell me???

so yes i admit i may have been wrong, but still right in a bit of my point of view.

peace out,

ps i am at school now, and i am soooo sick of it, theres this girl called libby and she fucks me off so bad!!!raaaaaaaaaaaaa

 
RiverRipper, gravteck and others-

The fact that you guys are jusitifying dropping atomic bombs on Japan and killing hundreds of thousands of innocent civilians, people just like you and me, absolutely sickens me. The U.S. has been at war with Iraq since 1991. Our soldiers killed 300,000 people during the Gulf War and as many as 100,000 innocent Iraqi women and children since then who in no way support Saddaam Hussein have been killed by U.S. bombs and from starvation and disesase as a result of sanctions against the country. And to say our government gives a shit about human rights violations, these stats show we have killed more civilian Iraqis than Saddaam has civilian Kurds. Besides Turkey has dispalced and killed more ethnic Kurds than Iraq has, but since we need Turkey as an ally in the region we could care less what they do to some kurds. Human rights violations are just an excuse to cover up actual military and political aspirations. Japan waged war against the United States, bombed us at Pearl Harbor without provocation. We have bomed and killed innocent Iraqis when the only problem is Sadaam. So if Sadaam decided to drop a couple of nukes on U.S. cities would it be okay becuase it is war time. GOD NO, it would be despicable, it would be just as wrong as when we did it to Japan. 'War' or not. Somebody declaring war doesn't justify killing civilians, thats what Osama did when he decleared his 'holy war' against the U.S. We need to stop justifying the violence on all sides. If its cowardly and disgraceful when Osama and Sadaam do it (which it certainly is), I don't want my own country doing it too.

'There are only two powers in the world...the sword of the oppressor and the spirit of the oppressed. In the long run, the sword is always defeated by the spirit.'
 
oi, witchbaby. do you reckon you could make up your mind whether the japanese would have fought to the last man or not? in the first part of your post you said they would and then you said that they were more likely to surrender to American forces. i don't really grasp your reasoning. and also, nothing can justify the Hiroshima bomb. It was dropped onto a civilian population not a military target. no matter how many people died in the invasion of the Japanese homeland, the vast majority of them would have been soldiers for whom dying is an accepted risk. the people who died at Hiroshima and Nagasaki were civilians and had nothing to do with the war aside from the fact that they were Japanese. if the boot was on the other foot and Japan had dropped a nuke on San Francisco and it was so they could end the war wuicker i don't think you would be quite as quick to defend it.

Bellisimo... Its Italian for grouse
 
oh, and lagwagon. shit man! do you want the exact population of australia or something? well here it is, according to the Australian Bureau of Statistics, Australias population at this point in time is 19 720 802 people. is that enough of a non-guess for you

Bellisimo... Its Italian for grouse
 
Holy christ if you were sitting in front of me I would kick you in the face. I would fucking drop the bomb myself on a country that attacked us while in the process of peace treaty talks. I dont care if they were civilians, they attacked us unprovoked cause they thought if they hit us hard we would give up quickly.

In my opinion those 140,000 civilians or whatever it was is better than 140,000 dead US soldiers if we had invaded. Figure how many of the kids on these boards may not have been here if it werent for those bombs. I know both my grandfathers fought in the war. The Japanese gave up a lot faster than they otherwise woudl have cause they knew with a single plane we could whipe out a city. If we had invaded they would have had more hope of fighting us off.

A brave man will not live forever but a coward will never live.
 
'In my opinion those 140,000 civilians or whatever it was is better than 140,000 dead US soldiers if we had invaded.'

Ohhh, I know what I forgot to consider- the fact that you are simply so much more important than any god damn Japanese person could be, right? This is basically the definition of racism, by saying that one human has the right to live over another human because they are of a different race. War is about soldiers fighting, if the men who volunteered to fight Japan died in combat it would have been tragic, of course (my grandpa fought on the Europenan Front during WWII and he was a very important person to me and I would have hated if I never would have known him because he died in combat). But the kids going to school or the women going shopping or the men walking to work who were in no way related to the Japanese leaders responsible for the rest of the war didn't deserve to be horribly slaughtered. Just because you live in the most powerful country in the world doesn't mean that the lives of others are worthless. If your grandpa had been living an innocent life in Hiroshima or Nagasaki rather than fighting in the U.S., how would you have felt? If you were living in Iraq and being starved to death, watching your family die of diseases that 10 cents of vaccinations could cure, all because you happen to live in a country ruled by a crazy man and because of some oil. The violence has to be stopped from all ends or else the cycle will continue. As far as I am concerned murder of a human being is murder of a human being, American, Japanese, Iraqi, whatever. This devaluing of human life and ignorance of other cultures characterized here has perverted American patriotism for many people and made it more like American self-rightousness.

'There are only two powers in the world...the sword of the oppressor and the spirit of the oppressed. In the long run, the sword is always defeated by the spirit.'
 
people really don't realize how many die in at the hands of the US government. just watch blackhawk down then you'll get an Idea. it's one of the few movies that is very accurate.

everyone arguing that it was a good idea must be 'the ends justifies the means' kind of people. But in your case the means is thousands of people to 'speed up' the inevitable end of the war. so you saved howmany american lives? not enough.... not enough at all.

MD... Dain bramaged.

'I am now a moderator... and all I had to do was suck harveys cock! who would have guessed?' - Dave Pauls.
 
why can't usa ever keep its hands to itself?

like all the other big countries, like canada, russia australia?

i know im gonna get shit for this but??? it seems like that, on the news, in NZ.

 
Ozmale, the first part of my post was what Prins said earlier. And in no way was I defending the bomb. I was stating what happened.

Japan was losing ground, the war would have ended soon despite the bomb being dropped. But it was dropped. Well what ya gonna do?

Do you think the war would have gone on longer if Japan had had the technology and the US didn't? No. The war would have been over as soon as THEY dropped the bomb.

A moment is the most you can ever expect from perfection.
 
NO! IT IS NOT RACISM! It is a pride of ones own. would you rather have your family dead or another persons family dead? You would choose the other persons family to die. Not because they're different but because they're not your own. I'd rather see noone dead but if it came down to it I'd have someone else die than Americans/canadians. I hate people using the word racism like it's toilet paper. I'm sure the Americans didn't drop the bomb because they were japanese but because they were the enemy. They liked the Chinese about as much as the Japanese back then but the only way they dropped it on Japan was because they were the enemy. And Hitler was building a bomb we had to show him what would happen if he dared do that to us. Most of you people go around saying shit like 'ooooohhhhh don't bomb Japan cause they pearl harboured everyone dat's wrong' You people are Hipocrites. If I were to walk up to you an kick you in the face you'd go back and fight me too you wouldn't just sit there and say 'oh man what the hell did he do that for? I'm gonna yell at him' cause I'll just keep kicking you in the face you idiots. the point is YOU'D FIGHT BACK.

+++An eye for an eye leaves the world with one eye+++
 
'why can't usa ever keep its hands to itself?

like all the other big countries, like canada, russia australia?'

RUSSIA!? RUSSIA?!...RUSSIA? FUCK! wree you in a cave for the last 50 years? Russia keeps it's hands to nothing it sells weapons to anyone with enough of their commie money they still do that they're so hard up for money that they'll sell bombs to whatever psychotic comes knocking at their door.

On another note America doesn't keep it's hands to itself cause every oppressed peoples come up to the US and say 'oh America please help us' and we do and then we're the monsters well FUCK YOU! We'll stop giving aid to people and helping people and let your fucking wives get raped by bearded sandrunners and facist dictators.

+++An eye for an eye leaves the world with one eye+++
 
you obviously don't value life. what would you rather happen - 10,000 americans die (or canadians in my case) and 100,000 japanese? The answer would the americans or canadians if you valued human life at all. This is why patriotism is a bitch. Suddenly 1 american is more valuable then 10 people of any other nationality. that's BULL SHIT! This is exactly the mentality that causes war, this is why people are starving. Because in this 'everyone's equal' society it seems that some are more 'equal' than others. Just because you were lucky enough to be born in a great nation doesn't mean that you are worth more than others.

-Mike

Mercer: drinking mans protein shake

Me: hahhhahahahaha

Mercer: sick ass

Me: That's the funnyest thing I've heard all day

Mercer: good make it your sig on ns.com faggot

Mercer: and hump the vacume while your at it.
 
Errr I think you're kind of missing the point, you're not going to win a war if you trade an equal amount of lives, the premodern winners of war in a nutshell was whoever lost the least, and held their strategic positions the most effectively. Wars start because stupid politics and religion get in the way. If the Muslims didn't hate the Jews and vice versa and fight every 2 years. Then the US wouldn't have to help the Jews. So then all the Muslims hate the jews and go all extreme and are more patriotic than americans in that america is the devil sense, and then pull their terrorism crap on america.

Then some side on a starving or internally troubled nation asks for help, the us comes, helps out how they think is appropriate, and sets up camp to keep the peace, and then someone gets pissed that america is there, and more war starts.

 
nah you're missing my point. I was trying to say that the war would be won by the allies anyways. Dropping the bomb sped that up and people support it even though it killed more people in the long run (although more americans were spared) which goes against human decency. So patriotism makes people go back on values, like the value of human life. And the second that We are better than someone else we can justify doing twisted things to them. (slave labour, dropping bombs, etc. etc.)

-Mike

Mercer: drinking mans protein shake

Me: hahhhahahahaha

Mercer: sick ass

Me: That's the funnyest thing I've heard all day

Mercer: good make it your sig on ns.com faggot

Mercer: and hump the vacume while your at it.
 
I wasn't necessarily just saying american patriotism is bad... all patriotism is. and another thing. there is much more going on than you hear. when you say that they are taking drastic measures against america... they're only drastic because it's in your own backyard for once.

I'll write some stats out for ya american lovers here:

5,000 Iraqis die every month from US sanction. (1,614,303 as of january) - Madeline albrights response to the millions dead 'we think it's worth it'

Over 2 million southeast asians in the 60s and 70s.

In the 80s regan funded an illegal organization in nicaragua that killed people in vast numbers.

The CIA helped kill over a million people in Indonesia.

In india an amercian company released poisonous gas killing 16,000 people.

thousands of innocent civillians killed in the '89 Panama invasion. not to mention the other times they invaded Panama.

Dresden during WWII 100,000+ innocent people killed.

Guess what children I've got another bed time story... Mr. CLinton was sponsering the Colombian 'death squads'. good thing that's in the past, oh wait... Bush is still sponsoring them.

Let's do some adding up here.

1,614,303

2,000,000

1,000,000

16,000

5,000

+ 100,000

4,735,303 - Patritisim kills.

yeah. US is a good country ethicly speaking right?

Oh there are much more cases of smaller numbers but I didn't have to do too much searching to come up with these numbers.

Read this article :http://www.phoenixanarchist.org/flyer.pdf

I think a good quote from it is :

'historically patriotism has not been an expression of the values of equality, justice, or freedom. It has more often been used as a tool to whip the public into agreement with decisions it had little hand in making and to silencing those who have different opinions.'

-Mike

Mercer: drinking mans protein shake

Me: hahhhahahahaha

Mercer: sick ass

Me: That's the funnyest thing I've heard all day

Mercer: good make it your sig on ns.com faggot

Mercer: and hump the vacume while your at it.
 
I think crashing a plane into a building anywhere is drastic, I think people strapping themselves full of explosives and running into a mall in Israel drastic. I think that some of Sharon's soldiers (yes the people supposedly on our side) firing on ambulances forcing the red cross to give limited aid over the past few months as drastic. The problem isn't patriotism, the problem is blind faith in leaders, kind of like religion. The people who could run a government well don't get into politics... Does anyone else have a problem w/ being led by a man who has a lower sat score than you.

 
Just want to leave you with a few thoughts.

Russia sells weapons to anybody???? In WW2 the americans were selling weaponry to the germans and their pals while canada and most of allied europe were losing lives. Then the U.S. decided to join in and tipped the balance. In Normandy, the Americans landed way too far down the beach and that's why they took the most casualties. Everyone makes it sound like they were so dedicated...pfft. Yes, many men from the states did die for what they believed in...if only they knew what their government was doing.

second. Afghanistan. Want to know why afghanistan had the tactics and weapons, the capability to bomb and fight back against america? because you supplied them with it all. When the former U.S.S.R. was moving into afghanistan, instead of fighting them yourself, you gave the people of afghanistan the guns and let them go die.

Cuba. Here's the reason for the trade embargo on Cuba. Florida is...i don't know exactly, but not far from Cuba. Before Che Guevara and Fidel Castro revolutionized Cuba it was the place where the mafia from florida, etc did business b/c it was relatively safe. Drugs, prostitutes, whatever. When Cuba had their revolution the americans got pissed and put a trade embargo on them to try and strangle them back into submission. Luckily Canada and other countries didn't agree and still have free trade with Cuba. yeah, Fidel is a tyrant but cuba has the best healthcare and lowest death rate of all the countries in that area. Think on that.

You want five cents off the banana? ohhh ok! we'll just lay of a few thousand people in south america and let their families starve to death...who cares...they were going to die of disease anyways.

Vietnam. Dont have to say anything

Hiroshima-genocide

How about when American forces went into berlin? that was no different than 9-11. sorry, history is written by the winner. There was no 'kill only military' when they went into Berlin. it was shoot anyone who doesnt look like an allied soldier.

Yeah, committing suicide and ramming a 747 into a tower filled with people is pretty damn disgusting. I heard a good saying one time 'if jesus ever came back to live and saw the things done in his name, he'd never stop puking'.

NOW...i'm not saying just because you're from america or japan or anywhere means you're a bastard. That would be f'n ignorant. Canada did some pretty fucked up things during the war too. So did everyone, it was a war, people were fighting for their lives.

But guys, we live the way we do, eat and live comfortably, and most of all, of course, ski, because alot of people in 3rd world countries are suffering.

It sucks, but life isnt fair. Just don't promote it.

hey man, that dogs pissing on your 1080's!!!

THAT BASTARD!!!!
 
i think this thread is getting a bit out of hand. i have absolutely nothing against american people but the U.S's foreign policy leaves a bit to be desired. In the 60's there was a democratically elected socialist government in Chile that the U.S. didn't like so they decided to fund a fella called General Augusto Pinochet to take over and install a military dictatorship because, hey, anythings better than a commie government. and Mike, you can pretty much add all the people who were killed during Pinochets reign of terror to your stats

Bellisimo... Its Italian for grouse
 
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