Abortion
- Thread starter Steamboiz
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louie.mirags
Active member
12984363:the_trap said:
No matter how shitty their life will be, no matter how immature their parents are, no matter how loveless the parents relationship is.
Wallisch_pl
Active member
12984375:louie.mirags said:
Ignore the 12 year old. You'll learn how retarded you sound soon enough
Implying we are supposed to know if their life will be shitty...
louie.mirags
Active member
12984395:Wallisch_pl said:
lol I'm retarded because my opinion differs from yours. And I spent yesterday debating with that dude if Noah's arc is a true story. The last thing I'm going to do is debate with you any further about abortion.
You'll understand when you're older..
SARTRON
Active member
12983838:Wallisch_pl said:
First of all, its not all about keeping your legs shut. Secondly, you dont have the right to call a rapist a father, his actions were driven by selfish wants such as power, control, domination or just mere sex. by calling a rapist a father you are putting the blame on the woman for now she is, by necessity set by you, a mother and forever tied to her horrible event. how terrifying is it to be a college student, high school student, mother of three beautiful children, to be raped, and now pregnant. Youre saying that shes bound to keep the child of the man who haunts her dreams, never could she escape her tormentor and the night her life changed. and guess what, that didnt happen because she opened her legs but because men dont know how to behave. sorry but ive been there and its never an easy situation.
thirdly, what if the person is terminally ill or is sick, has any sort of complications and understands that the child will not live a blessed life. a lot of it is situational but none of that is about closing your legs. unfortunately birth control fail, condoms fail, and sometimes youve gotta sacrifice a bit for the good of an overall outcome.
i just dont agree that men have the capable means or understand to judge and rule on this topic.
milk_man
Active member
12984375:louie.mirags said:
So because their life isn't gonna be perfect, they don't deserve to see the light of day?
I bet that if that baby actually had the decision whether to live or die, they would choose life. Because that baby wants to see and explore the world just like any other kid wants to.
cobra_commander
Active member
Any women who lacks the intellectual capacity to understand how the opions of men are relevant to the abortion discussion could be presented as evidence for the repeal of the 19th Amendment.
Getting an abortion should require the consent of both parties. Getting pregnant requires two people, both have the right to be emotionally invested in the child. Obviously a raper would have forfeited that right. Any party that gets an abortion without the other's consent should be tried for murder.
Regarding the legalities of it, I am obviously of the opinion that it should remain legal, I do however think there are too many abortions in the United States. This stems from a shift in cultural opinions that view teen sex as being consequence free. Play adult games, win adult prizes.
As our country moves closer to a single payer healthcare system, the ethics of who pays for the abortion will need to be addressed. So long as a sizable set of the population views abortion on a similar platform as murder, I am fully against using any public funds to support abortions.* if you are on Medicare, Medicaid, or a subsidized health plan, fork out your own money. The voting block did not endorse your recriational sex, don't expect them to pick up the responsibility.
If girls have a problem with this, they are welcome to get a dildo, and otherwise keep their legs closed. If you still have a problem with respecting the opinion of men with how this country treats life, welcome to the fucking republic. Your vote is no more important than mine.
*except in the case of rape.
Getting an abortion should require the consent of both parties. Getting pregnant requires two people, both have the right to be emotionally invested in the child. Obviously a raper would have forfeited that right. Any party that gets an abortion without the other's consent should be tried for murder.
Regarding the legalities of it, I am obviously of the opinion that it should remain legal, I do however think there are too many abortions in the United States. This stems from a shift in cultural opinions that view teen sex as being consequence free. Play adult games, win adult prizes.
As our country moves closer to a single payer healthcare system, the ethics of who pays for the abortion will need to be addressed. So long as a sizable set of the population views abortion on a similar platform as murder, I am fully against using any public funds to support abortions.* if you are on Medicare, Medicaid, or a subsidized health plan, fork out your own money. The voting block did not endorse your recriational sex, don't expect them to pick up the responsibility.
If girls have a problem with this, they are welcome to get a dildo, and otherwise keep their legs closed. If you still have a problem with respecting the opinion of men with how this country treats life, welcome to the fucking republic. Your vote is no more important than mine.
*except in the case of rape.
Phil-X-
Active member
12984428:SARTRON said:
It takes a male and female to have a child... masturbation is something that is performed by an individual with no effect on anyone else. I never said anything about supporting or not supporting abortions, but to say men dont have a say in the manner is messed up
SARTRON
Active member
12984523:cobra_commander said:
What do you think costs more, an abortion or putting a child into foster care for 18 years? Both of which are funded by tax payers.
and seriously guys, its not about girls keeping their legs closed. you said yourself that both parties should have a say in whether or not to keep the baby, which makes it more than the girl not being able to keep her legs closed. it should be a responsibility but on both parties but what it really is is a burned put on the female. if women can buy a dildo then why dont men get a vasectomy? for the same reason that have choices and rights.
SARTRON
Active member
12984547:Phil-X- said:
i never said that men dont have a say in the matter, I said that they dont have a right to judge and rule on the well being of my body and the choices I need to make for the sake of myself.
and the masturbation statement wasnt in reference to 2 or 1 people performing an act, its the fact that i would be limiting your capable actions and thus taking away your natural rights.
Wallisch_pl
Active member
12984413:SARTRON said:
It is about keeping your legs shut, unless rape, like I said. Well most of the times rape is just a girl getting drunk, saying yes and crying rape because women can't take actions for what they do when they're drunk. It's not like men literally have the instinct to have sex with women too. You're saying that if a women is raped, just because that fetus was brought by the rapist it's the fetus' fault and it shouldn't live.
If a person is terminally ill they're most likely in the hospital until death, what, do you think they just have sex with other patients? even on the off chance it happens, she can keep the baby until she dies or birth it.
You say it's situational and not closing your legs, but in the end all it comes down to really is closing your legs. Another thing about rape, feminists believe that like fucking society needs to teach them that women can dress how they want so they don't get raped. It's not society, it's human instinct. The other rapes which I don't hear about as often is where men will just kidnap women and rape them which really you can't do anything about it,...in that case I guess abortion could be chyll
SARTRON
Active member
12984578:Wallisch_pl said:
no the whole first part what you said is wrong, its so fucking wrong. a woman is to blame for her drunk actions? so a man is just along for the ride, completely innocent? Rape is NOT a girl getting drunk. rape is a person, male or female, walking home from the library and getting jumped by a creep or asking a good, trusting friend to take them home because they are intoxicated and coming to in their friends bed naked, clothes ripped off and your friend finishing up. fuck you and your understand of rape. this is rape culture and its wrong. by telling women that they are asking for it with their dress style or god forbid drinking and enjoying their time like everyone else, that they are at fault for what happened and the consequences to come. i hope some day you will feel the horrible wrath of rape and the possible outcome of a baby because you are so shielded with misogynistic ideals that you cant see in front of your own nose.
also, human instinct is controllable you fucking twat. no one heard about my rape because it was private and personal and fucked me up for so many years to come. I could barely go to class or the bars because i convinced myself that what happened was my fault. but it was through support and reading ignorant posts about rape and abortion,such as you displayed, that i realized i wasnt at fault and that my rapist though it appropriate to take it upon himself to undress me while i mistakenly considered myself to be asleep in a safe place.
so yes, this IS society and NOT natural instinct. if you blame this on instinct than why dont we just say murder and child abuse are ok because it was their instinct to endorse such acts. maybe its a womans natural instinct to get rid of the unwanted baby shes carrying. the claim to natural instinct throws all responsibility out the window.
louie.mirags
Active member
12984578:Wallisch_pl said:
It's not even worth debating against a post this ignorant. Sex is a natural act that people are not going to stop doing. It's an instinct that all animals have to breed. We have an instinct to populate the earth. Your hateful words arent going to change whats in our DNA. Just because you have a problem getting laid, doesn't mean all women are sluts who can't keep their legs shut. The fact you keep bringing up random scenarios about rape, it's not even worth arguing with you.
The amount of times you say "keep your legs shut" is just sad. You have some serious women issues. Eventually you'll grow up and hopefully become a man women want to date. Or they'll probably be targets of your anger since some girl probably embarassed you at the middle school dance or something. So, stop with the passive aggressive slut bashing and made up scenarios and realize how dumb you sound.
Wallisch_pl
Active member
12984638:SARTRON said:
Holy shit I can't keep trying to explain this. You might have the reading capability of a 6 year old so I'll dumb it down for you yet again. When woman is kidnapped, and raped, that is unpreventable. When woman dresses slutty, flirts with freinds, gets drunk, and even says yes (oh wait she was drunk so she can't fess up to her actions) then it's preventable.
HAHA i need to add that you say human instinct can be controlled...okay then women shouldn't feel the need to have sex/get an abortion (because abortion is now an instinct)
This really hits close to home, doesn't it...no one asked if you were raped, why are you trying to tell me? I can say that it's human instinct because it's human instinct to have sex. It's not fucking human instinct to kill your off spring, do you think we're fucking roosters??? I mean I'm all for murder, I'd fucking love that. it's bad enough we're already posed with laws our "government" puts out.
12984866:louie.mirags said:
You've already stated several times that you were going to stop debating but yet you keep running your mouth lil bitch.
Have you changed your mind? You just said it's human instinct to repopulate the earth. man, you must be really mad to say that I have trouble having sex....jeez that hit way to close to home man. LOL again stating it's not even worth arguing, you keep making yourself look retarded.
Then you finish it off with taking my comeback about being young. I'm still laughing at your attempts to make me sad by saying that I have women issues, that's when you know you've lost the argument
cobra_commander
Active member
The drunk argument pisses me off so much. Yes you are still fucking responsible for your own actions. If I get drunk, hop behind the wheel and plow into a family, I don't get to blame it on the car company, or the family for being in the way, or my friends for pressuring me to drive
That would be a fucking great argument in court, "but your honor, (sob) I was drunk, my friends took advantage of my intoxicated state (sob), I didn't really want to drive (sob).
It's still your body, regardless of if you are drunk or not. It was your choice to get drunk.
That would be a fucking great argument in court, "but your honor, (sob) I was drunk, my friends took advantage of my intoxicated state (sob), I didn't really want to drive (sob).
It's still your body, regardless of if you are drunk or not. It was your choice to get drunk.
Zimmerman
Active member
12985108:milk_man said:
It isn't as simple as this. If it wasn't okay to kill living things, I'm sure we would all be good friends with the member chicken.
The question lies on the right to life. No one is arguing that life does not begin at conception. That is scientific fact. When a human gets its right to life is what matters, and saying that it happens at conception is just as arbitrary as any other point of development.
louie.mirags
Active member
90053
Active member
The US is weird, why is it that everyone has such extreme views on everything? You seem to simply the abortion debate by choosing to be either pro life or pro choice when the reality is that it's far more complicated than that and a balance needs to be struck between the two. It's the same with your politics you either follow republicans or democrats and all their policies rather than agreeing with different aspects of each. At least that is the way it seems to me.
saskskier
Active member
12986325:louie.mirags said:
This is a phenomenal video that definitely represents that trauma that comes along with being removed from an abusive home and placed the system.
I've been a social worker for a couple of years now and work with these kids, their biological families and the foster homes they are placed in. The kids that come into their homes often have huge challenges. Trust issues, trauma issues coming from neglect, emotional/physical/sexual abuse, medical issues, mental health issues (fetal alcohol spectrum disorder is one of the most common), extreme behaviour issues (criminal, sexualized, violent, etc), and the list goes on.
There is extensive training that is mandatory for all foster parents, but few are truly prepared for some of the kids who come into their homes. It's a steep learning curve, even for those who have raised kids of their own. Despite those challenges, all of the foster homes I've worked with have been absolutely amazing.
Yes, there are bad foster parents, but they are few and far between. It's like any profession though. The worst always make the most noise. You always hear about the bad, but rarely about the good.
louie.mirags
Active member
12986340:tusken_assraider said:
woah man.. not everyone. There are so many different types of people in America (and other countries as well). To say everyone is like that is wrong. I chose not to vote either of those parties because voting is worthless. Just research how George W. Bush won his first election.
But, to answer your question: It seems that way because that is what the politicians want. They pin people against each other to distract the general population from caring about the major changes they are making. The government, for the most part, picks and chooses the content the population sees. The more we argue about gay rights and abortion, the more shit politicians get away with. It becomes a liberal VS conservative issue while the billionaires who run the country laugh at the 99%.
louie.mirags
Active member
12986354:saskskier said:
For sure man. I may even wind up adopting a child one day. I just wanted to show the dude I quoted that foster care may not be better than just terminating the pregnancy before the child is born.
Every once in a while the internet delivers a good shitstorm. There needs to be some sort of eboxing rounds. Every 5 pages the people arguing the hardest fight it out to determine who's view is right.
It's like war accept for lower budget and far more exciting.
People who change their opinions in these threads 0. People entertained by the game of internet hot potato, millions.
It's like war accept for lower budget and far more exciting.
People who change their opinions in these threads 0. People entertained by the game of internet hot potato, millions.
90053
Active member
12986355:louie.mirags said:
Yeh i wasn't trying to say that it's just I know very few people personally who are so one sided on topics like this, or like gun law etc. as some of the people on ns haha I guess it's probably because of its a pretty young demographic but still they're probably regurgitating there parents views on matters
louie.mirags
Active member
12986378:tusken_assraider said:
I used to be like that! Now whenever my dad talks politics I feel like he's trolling.
12986378:tusken_assraider said:
Sometimes the kids rebel against their parents and support the opposite because they're rebels and it's trendy.
Ignorance is fucking glorious.
Zimmerman
Active member
12985658:milk_man said:
So you're saying that in all cases it is always not okay to kill a human being? What if you are being threatened? What if the person has given up their right to life (if you think certain criminals do this)? So obviously not all humans have a right to life. Would it be that crazy to say a fetus doesn't either? Especially since the fetus is using another human's body in order to live?
milk_man
Active member
12990729:Zimmerman said:
So I did not say that in all cases it is always not okay to kill a human being. I got nowhere near even implying that. I said everyone has a right to life.
And that body that the fetus needs to live, made a choice (a huge amount of the time, the only time they didn't choose is in rape) by having sex. They took the risk of getting pregnant and they think that there can just be an easy way out for their stupid decision. Abortion is their way out of the situation that they caused.(most of the time, unless its rape.)
12951467:Mr.Mitten said:
It's not, unless your being charged in a JAG court, and I agree with that. You kill a mother, you don't stick your hand in after and slit the neck of a thing with no brain function. What if the baby was going to shoot up a school or set peoples houses on fire, see how stupid this argument is.
Scaredwhiteboy
Active member
I hate when people try to act like this is an issue of women's rights. It's not at all. I don't care how far along the baby is, murder is murder. If you can kill your baby before it's born, why not let people kill their babies after birth too?
I would never get an abortion. I personally think it's extremely irresponsible and selfish. Of course there are extreme cases where a woman needs an abortion because she will die or something along those lines. Rape is another valid point. But I feel like if YOU make the mistake of not using a condom or birth control, then it's YOUR responsibility to take the consequences. Not just get rid of your baby.
That being said, If a woman wants an abortion, then let her. I will always disagree with it, but it isn't my place to say "no you can't have an abortion because I think it's wrong for you."
That being said, If a woman wants an abortion, then let her. I will always disagree with it, but it isn't my place to say "no you can't have an abortion because I think it's wrong for you."
louie.mirags
Active member
13211923:gengar. said:
/thread
connecticunt
Member
I saw this quote on the Internet the other day and its pretty relevant.
"Opinions on abortions are kinda like nipples. Women's are a little more important but men's are all you ever see."
Around 85% of women who want to get abortions are unmarried. This means that once the baby is born, the mother is usually the sole caregiver. They are the ones stuck with the responsibilities of taking care of the child and finding time to work while the father can just send in his child support and be done with it. My boyfriends mom had him when she was 19 and his father was never around. He owes over $60k in child support for him and his brothers and nothing is happening. I'm not saying that he should've been aborted, but people don't realize that when the parents aren't married, usually the father has no part in the child's life.
Abortion is one of those things that should be left to women in my humble opinion.
"Opinions on abortions are kinda like nipples. Women's are a little more important but men's are all you ever see."
Around 85% of women who want to get abortions are unmarried. This means that once the baby is born, the mother is usually the sole caregiver. They are the ones stuck with the responsibilities of taking care of the child and finding time to work while the father can just send in his child support and be done with it. My boyfriends mom had him when she was 19 and his father was never around. He owes over $60k in child support for him and his brothers and nothing is happening. I'm not saying that he should've been aborted, but people don't realize that when the parents aren't married, usually the father has no part in the child's life.
Abortion is one of those things that should be left to women in my humble opinion.
no_steeze
Active member
13212166:connecticunt said:
The only role of the man in that situation is to offer support to whichever side the woman chooses, but if that were always the case I don't think the debate over abortion would be nearly as big.
I think that really the only downside to abortion is the emotional toll it takes on the woman. I just can't conceive of the idea of choosing to raise a child in an unfit environment and giving it a shitty life purely because of some government regulation, especially when the population of the earth is projected to hit 11 billion by 2050.
It's hard to shake the primal instinct of reproduction and protecting our offspring at all costs, but considering the size of the population and its projected growth I think we need to take a step back and embrace the unique position of our species. We are at a point were we can focus on quality instead of quantity when it comes to human reproduction since we're intelligent enough to understand that all populations reach a carrying capacity so what's the rush to get there?
If we have the intelligence to reach the point where we are rational enough to understand that maybe we don't want to have a child, then I think it's our right to break free from primal instinct. All other species simply follow them because a) they don't know any better and b) most of them aren't rapidly growing dominant creatures that are destroying the planet they live on
cobra_commander
Active member
13212166:connecticunt said:
If he didn't stick around for the first one, why did she keep running over to him for sex?
connecticunt
Member
13212241:cobra_commander said:
From what I've gathered, he made it seem like he would stick around, stayed with the mom for about 5 years in which she had two more sons and then ditched.
This is one of those times where I'll agree with traditional logic and say people probably shouldn't raise kids with people they aren't married to. I'm also being kinda hypocritical because I was going to do just that, but its just too much of an emotional risk to the kid. It's not fair to be born into a bad situation. It's been proven that kids who grow up in a house with both parents get better grades, commit less crimes, and are less likely to have problems with mental health.
Abortion isn't always the answer but sometimes it's the best solution.