2012 Presidential Race Officially Underway...

The only reason Obama won is because he is black and that's all that mattered to most people, that a black man was running for president and that he should win. I guarentuee 95% or more voted for him just based on this. If they actually listed to his campaign and ideas and compared them with mccains, McCain would have one hands down.
 
His post wan't vague at all. On the contrary, it was quite to the point. I agree with him 100%. I'd rather we not have a constitution than have one that is politically meaningless. In this instance, at least we wouldn't be lied to by the politicians.
 
exactly what part of the constitution does he think is being violated?

the above poster didn't say that we should have a constitution but not listen to it.

if your gonna say somethin, back it up! debates are more fun when you understand everyones position
 
I think that he was replying to the statement:
"the constitution was written hundreds of years ago, i bet you believe that the bible is a GREAT way to base your life off of also, huh?"
(Not to put words into his mouth) but I think he was inferring that Skijunkie views the constitution as old and outdated thus rendering it useless.
 
It's not about the Constitution being violated. Wording it like that makes it sound like you think that there's a specific clause in the document forbidding mandatory health care.
The Constitution gives certain powers to the national government. If any branch of government tries to do something that is not specifically spelled out as a power in the Constitution it is unconstitutional. The relevant section here is Article 1 Section 8, for what Congress can do. Most of the time they stretch the interstate commerce clause and the necessary and proper clause to cover what would (and should, on occasion) be unconstitutional.
Which power granted to Congress allows them to make healthcare MANDATORY for all citizens? Interstate commerce? Hell no, we can't shop around in different states for better prices. Necessary and proper? If it was necessary, why is there so much opposition?
And that's just the constitutionality of it. The US was founded on the belief (among others) that all men were allowed to do what they wanted as long as it didn't interfere with another man's right to do the same. Making ANYTHING mandatory is completely going against one of the founding principles of the country.
 
hahahahha are you really that fucking dumb?
Obama has spent more money then any other president in history. There is nothing he has ever done to reduce spending / debt. Likewise, he has no plans to reduce debt.
watch the news hey? the news contains about 1% useful objective opinion... it brainwashes people like u into thinking Obama is for debt reduction. congrats u have no thoughts of ur own!
 
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Agreed, Cleveland was such a boss.
Sidetracking for those who know nothing about Grover and because I think he is awesome:
Despite losing his first re-election bid in 1888 as a result of voter fraud in the state of Indiana, which tipped the victory to Harrison, Cleveland kicked his ass in the next election. In 1888, the main debate was over tariffs with Cleveland against all tariffs and Harrison in favor of protectionism. Harrison won because people felt that "aiding" American businesses was the right thing to do.
Fast forwards 4 years. Imported goods skyrocketed as a result of the protective tariffs to the point where no one could afford anything coming into the country. American business were actually doing worse because other nations responded to our tariffs by enacting identical measures of their own thus making it impossible for American business to sell their products abroad. (When will people learn that it's free markets FTW.) Cleveland wins by a landslide and continues to be a boss 4 years later.
 
Yeah............. Totally.............

*whispering*

Hey everyone else in this thread, I think this kid is handicapped. Sooo, be nice to him okay?
 
lol- show me facts- obama didnt increase debt- the money he spent was already there- not borrowed- no debt if you dont borrow- and he sure as heel didnt spend 3.5 trillion- unless you counting the 85 billion a month in middle east operations - which guess who got us into that shit in the first place?

also who the hell do the republicans think have a shot at winning- sarah palin? mitt romney?, they have a better chance winning a democratic primary
we live in a shit ass society where if you dont get it done within the first 2 weeks you fail
for instance the approval rating for republican congress men have dropped 8% since they gained office in november- and they havent even done anything yet

so here is the tip boys and girls, if you want to change your country dont get involved with politics- own a corporation and pay for your beliefs- at least something will get done then

 
thank you! I didn't want to waste my time spellnig it out for these idiots whos arguements consists of posting irrelevant youtube videos.

I'll say it one more time. Anyone who thinks Obama has done anything at all to reduce fiscal spending / the debt is sooooo far out to lunch its scary.

Watching the news for information versus studying the subject for 4 years and earning a degree. WHo do yuou think has more insight?
 
oh yes because we can just magically make the economy better, instantly end all military operations over seas and right away end all excessive government spending, all without any consequences... just like your boy ron paul would do, right? a fucking super hero that one.
 
dude we just finished defeating two military superpowers in a world war, of course the reduction in military spending was great
 
im in no way arguing for continuing this bogus war, all we are doing is spending way toooooo fucking much, making more enemies then we are defeating, all so that we can "spread democracy", im with ya on that woozy
 
Even if that were true, you are a fool to think his constituency would not expect what was promised to them and will react accordingly, Obama knows this as well. And he hasn't even come close to doing away with excessive spending. I disliked Bush as much as the next guy, but Bush was tossing around change compared to what is being spent now and what is being set up to be owed in the future.

obama_budget_deficit_2010.jpg


 
Yea, because appropriate measures were taken by Harding to counter the depression which ended it quickly:
"The economic situation in 1920 was grim. By that year unemployment had jumped from 4 percent to nearly 12 percent, and GNP declined 17 percent. No wonder, then, that Secretary of Commerce Herbert Hoover — falsely characterized as a supporter of laissez-faire economics — urged President Harding to consider an array of interventions to turn the economy around. Hoover was ignored.Instead of "fiscal stimulus," Harding cut the government's budget nearly in half between 1920 and 1922. The rest of Harding's approach was equally laissez-faire. Tax rates were slashed for all income groups. The national debt was reduced by one-third."http://mises.org/daily/3788So how is our current depression that much worse than the one in 1920? Harding simply had the balls to slash the budget in half which very few politicians in contemporary times will ever consider.
 
its not about magic fixes you dumbass, its about looking at economic history and seeing what has worked. gov't spending does not work, that has been shown time and time again.
 
both of you were right, i was wrong, ill admit it, times were much different, America was far less paranoid, and still was trying to be somewhat isolationists militarily
 
agreed, but think about how many American citizens died by German U-boats before we entered the war, in todays time it probably would only have taken one citizen, not a few thousand in Hawaii
 
I think America was equally paranoid then as we are now. You are right with the isolationism though. Most Americans could not believe how many soldiers we lost in WWI, even though it was nothing compared to the Europeans. They were wondering why 116,516 Americans were killed in action. What purpose did this loss of life serve for American interests? Mainly nothing.
It is pretty funny how many people laud Wilson as one of the great presidents where as most Americans in the 1920s were appalled with him.
 
thats where i disagree, McCarthyism and Communism ingrained the feeling that everyone is out to get us, at least with the Boomer generation, hopefully our generation will recognize that international paranoia is almost always pointless
 
lol at how the graph goes from '18 '10 '20, somebody doesnt know what comes after 18 and before 20 lolol
 
Maybe even both hands down.
Seriously, half of newschoolers needs to figure out their grammar and spelling before they try to move on to electives like economy, politics, or philosophy. I suppose I shouldn't be too surprised though, Bush couldn't even pronounce the word nuclear.
Back to the thread's topic, like it or hate it, Obama is going to win again, unless the GOP finds a real winner, a title which does not apply to a single one of obama's competitors from 2008. Just to re-cap why they don't have a chance in hell:Trump: not even going to make a serious argument for this one, the day Donald is even on the ballot is the day I move the fuck out of this countryPalin: She was nothing but a con for McCain's campaign, there is no reason to believe she would be any better at running for the presidency.Romney: The mudslinging due to Romney's mormon faith that would occur would make the Rev. Wright controversy from the 2008 election look like a joke. Not saying it is fair, but we will not elect a mormon.Paul: Will not have the money for his campaign, but even if he did, it would fail miserably. His ideas are wayyyyyyyyy to out there to gain the support of the republican party. As nice as it would be not having any federal income tax, he could just as realistically promise that he would end war.Huckabee: My guess for the republican candidate, but he won't win.
I voted Obama, and in just about every foreseeable scenario, I will again in 2012. Regardless of my political standpoint, it is pretty easy to see that obama most likely will win again. A lot of people will disagree and say that the midterm elections show that the republicans are being favored, but the presidency is different.
sparknotes: I just don't see a republican winning, I think (and really really hope) that most of america agrees that having republican control over both the executive and legislative branch is a scary thought.
 
Republican = Al Jazeera right?

Quit turning this into a Rep vs Dem game. Its stupid and makes you sound like a little kid taking sides on the playground.

I hope America is done giving people second chances, seriously, Ron Paul for pres. His ideas are not crazy, get over it. He is on national TV news just about every day now and people are taking him seriously.
 
I would like to think this is true but I just don't see the American public accepting Ron Paul.

As scary as it is, right now I'm guessing Obama will win again. I'm no political scientist tho.
 
Al Jazeera is a middle eastern news station, not sure how you made that connection from my post at all.
In a 2 party, multi branch system, I don't see how it could be anything but a rep. vs. dems game...
and with all of the times he has been in the news, you would think people have started to realize how unrealistic ron paul's ideas are. to name a few....Guns: No more big bad government controldrugs: see "guns". no more big government control, take what you want.Federal income taxes: he doesn't like them, lets get rid of them, cause the best way to get out of debt is to stop collecting money.healthcare: no more governmenteducation: no more federal governmentabortion: no more...... wait, nevermind, gunna go the opposite direction on this onegays: same story here.
it will never happen, sorry.
If he would have won in 2008, our country would be buried right now. He would not have bailed out the big companies (none of us liked seeing it happen, but without the bailouts we would have no economy right now), not to mention the impossibility of running a government without taxes.
 
You can see into the future right? Must be nice having a crystal ball.... You seriously must be young, the economy is really bad right now...there pretty much is no money available except for the already rich. Sure you can probably fight tooth and nail for a loan to get a house, but then what? Money is not easy to get a hold of at all currently and people are living on nothing but credit.

Sorry but you are wrong. Quit saying you are going to know exactly what will happen if Ron Paul is president. you are just blowing smoke.
 
Actually, from kindergarten until senior year, I went to private schools where democrats are the extreme minority, and I am now training to be a teacher myself.
but anyways, I dont care how small of a dent our taxes put on our deficit, if we didn't have taxes that money would have to come from somewhere else.
The thing is, I am not really even trying to argue about ron paul's ideas, because they are irrelevant. Paul doesn't even have a shot at being the republican candidate, much less the president.
 
Just gotta say one thing:

Two of the potential candidates for the presidency have REALITY SHOWS. Palin and Trump. Anyone else see a problem with that? the sad thing is, since they have the most media exposure, the lesser educated voter may actually support them. According to my sociology professor at UVM a lot of people vote for candidates just because they know who they are, even if they don't know what the candidate stands for. Scary.
 
I used to be skeptical about Ron Paul.
But honestly over the years hearing a few of his speeches here and there I have to say im 100% impressed. Sounds like he's really down to earth on what people really want.
If he ran up here in Canada he would get my vote year after year.
 
I think people are scared of either party having control over both the executive and the legislative branchs. Most of America saw what Bush and the Republican Congress did with the wars and grew to dislike this. Now they are seeing what Obama and the Democrat Congress did with the bailouts/tarp/healthcare/QE's and can't believe the budget deficits that the US is running (2+ trillion annually).
Instead of wising up and dismissing both parties as clueless and ignorant, the pendulum keeps swinging back and forth between these morons in Washington every 4-8 years.
 
political debates on ns are dumb. just a bunch of kids who think they know everything but really know nothing.
 
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