skitheslopes
Member
I work at a boy scout camp called Camp Loll, it is an untold treasure. I can't explain most of the situation because it is complicated and I don't have enough information to present an un-bias statement.
http://attheagora.blogspot.com
^ the site with all the info.
v cut and paste of some info.
Camp Loll faces a great threat to its program and mission. As a
result of a recent lawsuit driven by the Sierra Club, non Profit
groups, such as the BSA, are now required to obtain Commercial Use
Authorization (CUA) permits. This gives the Concession Management
Division of the Park power to dictate the parameters of park use, and
in the case of Camp Loll, to destroy all we have worked for, and all
the benefits that our back country use brings to the thousands of young
people that access Yellowstone through Loll’s program. I cannot
overstate the danger.
With NO WARNING or discussion the
Concessions Division of Yellowstone has chosen to use the permit
process to end Camp Loll’s partnership with Yellowstone National Park.
Included among the permit conditions are requirements that will make
hikes to Union Falls, Scout Pool, and Terrace Falls impossible for all
but a tiny fraction of our campers.
First,
it is important to state that Camp Loll has long led the way in
adherence to the majority of the parameters set for in the
authorization permit. Ten of the twelve points of compliance are either
already Loll program elements or could easily be satisfied.
#1.
Loll already trains its guides in backcountry guidelines and promotes
all park regulations and programs. We go further to explain and
practice these conservation procedures.
#2. We have taken responsibility for our campers during their trips into the park for years.
#3.
We have sought to protect the quality of other visitors’ experience
through training that becomes part of our scouts’ life-long commitment
to wilderness ethics.
#4. We have ensured all our campers have proper safety equipment, and clothing.
#5. Our guides and Rangers have been trained in first aid and CPR for years.
#6. We have reported all accidents immediately.
#7 (see below)
#8. (see below)
#9. WE always use established trails, helped to build them and have helped to maintain them for years.
#10.
WAG Bags for packing out human waste – we have always followed the
parks policies in dealing with sanitation and will gladly follow this
NEW requirement.
#11. Ask that we contact Bechler Station with
numbers of trips and visitors one to five days prior to our use., and
supply monthly and seasonal reports. For years we have kept careful
record of these numbers and supplied them to the park. Our hike plan
policy will make it easy for us to supply this information to the
ranger.
#12. Simply states that any violation of this agreement will result in its termination.
It
should be noted that Camp Loll goes far beyond the letter of these
laws. They barely scratch the surface of the opportunities in practical
application that Loll provides to facilitating the spirit of
Yellowstone Park’s purpose of preserving wilderness and natural
national treasures by training a generation of supporters of
backcountry ethics and practices that are applied throughout the lives
of our campers in every wilderness they will ever visit.
Second, to points # 7 and # 8.
#7
States – All day use groups shall be no larger than 15 visitors (one
guide and 14 clients) and shall be spaced at least ½ mile apart at all
times. This is an arbitrary number. I have no idea where the
Concessions Division came up with it. Such caprice demonstrates a total
lack of understanding of the nature of our units or the service Camp
Loll provides to young people that are America’s most precious
resource, and to the Park itself, by guiding them into it.
#8
States – Permittee is allowed to guide one group of 15 to Union Falls,
one group of 15 to Ouzel Pool [Scout Pool] and two groups of 15 each to
Terrace Falls on any given day. . . This policy shows not only a
complete lack of understanding of the processes and services rendered
by Loll’s visits to these locations, but is in reality proof that the
permit is simply being used as a mechanism to exclude hundreds of
trained, well behaved, and low impact users from the back country, not
because they do any harm but in order to meet some uninformed agenda.
Realize that the group of 15 that goes to Union Falls will also
necessarily also be the group that goes to Scout Pool, and that 3 of
the hikers will have to be guides and 6 of them adult leaders and you
have a hike day which will allow 36 young people to visit these
treasures, natural wonders which are as much their birthright as any
other user of the backcountry. Realize also that the hundreds who would
thus be deprived of the visit would also not receive the desire to
protect and the motivation and knowledge to serve these wonders.
These
two points, #7 and #8 are clearly aimed at eviscerating Loll’s program
as it relates to Yellowstone National Park. This would not only be a
disservice to Loll but to Yellowstone and to America, conservation, and
our nation’s and our world’s future.
Consider:
1.
Camp Loll has made Yellowstone better by our presence. Not only do Loll
hikers strictly follow backcountry rules and policies by greatly
reducing their impact on the resource, but they clean up the messes
left by others.
2. Camp Loll is training generations to love and
protect not only Yellowstone but all national parks and wilderness
areas. Through the truths they learn on the trail with their staff
guide and unit leaders they learn life lessons that will improve
backcountry use in Yellowstone and elsewhere forever.
3. We have
followed the wise and just direction of the Park Service for years.
With the support of the Bechler Ranger, the Park Service, and the
Forest Service, Camp Loll has implemented a host of practices to reduce
our impact. We have accepted, implemented; indeed helped develop;
actions that have actually improved the backcountry. Our guides have
prevented lost hikers for years, we have taught thousands to walk
softly on the land, to show respect to others on the trail, to value
their American heritage and their National Parks.
4. Remember
also that the outdoor experience, the wonder of Union Falls, the joy
that comes from swimming in Scout Pool changes the hearts of the young
people that experience it. Yellowstone thus is granted a role in
shaping lives for the better. The greatest experience of many a young
life will forever be bound to the values of Scouting and the magic of
Yellowstone. Excluding thousands from this opportunity will damage
youth, and inestimably diminish the worth of Yellowstone to America and
its future.
5. These resources belong to all Americans. All
Americas have the right to enjoy them and the duty to protect them. How
can young people learn their responsibilities without experiencing
their rights. Camp Loll’s hiking programs give Yellowstone the
opportunity to fulfill its mandate to preserve and provide America’s
great treasure to its greatest resource, it’s youth. Do the rights of
those who despise the presence of these boys and girls, by definition –
a few selfish exploiters of their own solitude, outweigh the blessing
due the many who would thus be deprived of their opportunity to
experience and grow from the opportunities these wonderful locations
offer?
http://attheagora.blogspot.com
^ the site with all the info.
v cut and paste of some info.
Camp Loll faces a great threat to its program and mission. As a
result of a recent lawsuit driven by the Sierra Club, non Profit
groups, such as the BSA, are now required to obtain Commercial Use
Authorization (CUA) permits. This gives the Concession Management
Division of the Park power to dictate the parameters of park use, and
in the case of Camp Loll, to destroy all we have worked for, and all
the benefits that our back country use brings to the thousands of young
people that access Yellowstone through Loll’s program. I cannot
overstate the danger.
With NO WARNING or discussion the
Concessions Division of Yellowstone has chosen to use the permit
process to end Camp Loll’s partnership with Yellowstone National Park.
Included among the permit conditions are requirements that will make
hikes to Union Falls, Scout Pool, and Terrace Falls impossible for all
but a tiny fraction of our campers.
First,
it is important to state that Camp Loll has long led the way in
adherence to the majority of the parameters set for in the
authorization permit. Ten of the twelve points of compliance are either
already Loll program elements or could easily be satisfied.
#1.
Loll already trains its guides in backcountry guidelines and promotes
all park regulations and programs. We go further to explain and
practice these conservation procedures.
#2. We have taken responsibility for our campers during their trips into the park for years.
#3.
We have sought to protect the quality of other visitors’ experience
through training that becomes part of our scouts’ life-long commitment
to wilderness ethics.
#4. We have ensured all our campers have proper safety equipment, and clothing.
#5. Our guides and Rangers have been trained in first aid and CPR for years.
#6. We have reported all accidents immediately.
#7 (see below)
#8. (see below)
#9. WE always use established trails, helped to build them and have helped to maintain them for years.
#10.
WAG Bags for packing out human waste – we have always followed the
parks policies in dealing with sanitation and will gladly follow this
NEW requirement.
#11. Ask that we contact Bechler Station with
numbers of trips and visitors one to five days prior to our use., and
supply monthly and seasonal reports. For years we have kept careful
record of these numbers and supplied them to the park. Our hike plan
policy will make it easy for us to supply this information to the
ranger.
#12. Simply states that any violation of this agreement will result in its termination.
It
should be noted that Camp Loll goes far beyond the letter of these
laws. They barely scratch the surface of the opportunities in practical
application that Loll provides to facilitating the spirit of
Yellowstone Park’s purpose of preserving wilderness and natural
national treasures by training a generation of supporters of
backcountry ethics and practices that are applied throughout the lives
of our campers in every wilderness they will ever visit.
Second, to points # 7 and # 8.
#7
States – All day use groups shall be no larger than 15 visitors (one
guide and 14 clients) and shall be spaced at least ½ mile apart at all
times. This is an arbitrary number. I have no idea where the
Concessions Division came up with it. Such caprice demonstrates a total
lack of understanding of the nature of our units or the service Camp
Loll provides to young people that are America’s most precious
resource, and to the Park itself, by guiding them into it.
#8
States – Permittee is allowed to guide one group of 15 to Union Falls,
one group of 15 to Ouzel Pool [Scout Pool] and two groups of 15 each to
Terrace Falls on any given day. . . This policy shows not only a
complete lack of understanding of the processes and services rendered
by Loll’s visits to these locations, but is in reality proof that the
permit is simply being used as a mechanism to exclude hundreds of
trained, well behaved, and low impact users from the back country, not
because they do any harm but in order to meet some uninformed agenda.
Realize that the group of 15 that goes to Union Falls will also
necessarily also be the group that goes to Scout Pool, and that 3 of
the hikers will have to be guides and 6 of them adult leaders and you
have a hike day which will allow 36 young people to visit these
treasures, natural wonders which are as much their birthright as any
other user of the backcountry. Realize also that the hundreds who would
thus be deprived of the visit would also not receive the desire to
protect and the motivation and knowledge to serve these wonders.
These
two points, #7 and #8 are clearly aimed at eviscerating Loll’s program
as it relates to Yellowstone National Park. This would not only be a
disservice to Loll but to Yellowstone and to America, conservation, and
our nation’s and our world’s future.
Consider:
1.
Camp Loll has made Yellowstone better by our presence. Not only do Loll
hikers strictly follow backcountry rules and policies by greatly
reducing their impact on the resource, but they clean up the messes
left by others.
2. Camp Loll is training generations to love and
protect not only Yellowstone but all national parks and wilderness
areas. Through the truths they learn on the trail with their staff
guide and unit leaders they learn life lessons that will improve
backcountry use in Yellowstone and elsewhere forever.
3. We have
followed the wise and just direction of the Park Service for years.
With the support of the Bechler Ranger, the Park Service, and the
Forest Service, Camp Loll has implemented a host of practices to reduce
our impact. We have accepted, implemented; indeed helped develop;
actions that have actually improved the backcountry. Our guides have
prevented lost hikers for years, we have taught thousands to walk
softly on the land, to show respect to others on the trail, to value
their American heritage and their National Parks.
4. Remember
also that the outdoor experience, the wonder of Union Falls, the joy
that comes from swimming in Scout Pool changes the hearts of the young
people that experience it. Yellowstone thus is granted a role in
shaping lives for the better. The greatest experience of many a young
life will forever be bound to the values of Scouting and the magic of
Yellowstone. Excluding thousands from this opportunity will damage
youth, and inestimably diminish the worth of Yellowstone to America and
its future.
5. These resources belong to all Americans. All
Americas have the right to enjoy them and the duty to protect them. How
can young people learn their responsibilities without experiencing
their rights. Camp Loll’s hiking programs give Yellowstone the
opportunity to fulfill its mandate to preserve and provide America’s
great treasure to its greatest resource, it’s youth. Do the rights of
those who despise the presence of these boys and girls, by definition –
a few selfish exploiters of their own solitude, outweigh the blessing
due the many who would thus be deprived of their opportunity to
experience and grow from the opportunities these wonderful locations
offer?
