There is NO spoon!!

skisebski

Active member
No really! it doesnt exist! Do you people understand this? its fucking with me We were dicussing this stuff in my philosophy of perception class and i thought id share and promote hate free discussion haha.. Think about this: How can I be so sure that a spoon exists (or anything for that matter)? If the spoon is a stimulus, then light bounces off the spoon and into my eye…. and therefore my cognitive reaction to the light bouncing off my eye is me believing that it is a spoon… but how can an object be the stimulus and reaction at the same time? If it is our subjective reality (which means each person's own viewpoint) that creates the spoon, then how com everybody else is also seeing the spoon?? weird eh. Makes you want to question everything around you.
 
Your forgetting that the word "spoon" is used to define something thats looks and functions how people think a spoon should. Regardless if it is real or not, its still a spoon.
 
i had a philosophy course in high school, it was really cool and i def enjoyed it. but this conversation could go on forever i think. debate i mean
 
im not questioning the name, im questioning its existence, and everything elses existence based on how we define reality.
 
i get wat ur saying to a point but i really dont think that this can be discussed that much on the internet.... it would take tooo long, but thats my opion and if u want to then post away
 
GOLD%20ACCT%20SPOON.jpg


deffinettly photoshopped. the shadows are all messed up
 
i understand what your saying,and your questioning consciousness, and reality........and i think in our day and age alot of people have done that. BUT i think people over think , and over analyze everything. Like people who are like " the only reason your hand does pass through a wall is blah blah blah blah." At the end of the day if you think about this stuff, you end up just not living life.

The point is; there IS a spoon in your hand, you hand does not pass through walls, your not in a matrix. "I think, therefore I am." Don't let that shit take over man.
 
i think the point of this is to see which way the spoon is facing, concave side towards or away...yes?
 
I can tell this is a photoshop from some of the pixels and me seeing quite a few shops in my time......
 
There is a spoon, but it's not the one you are looking at. The spoon in your hand is only a shadow of the perfect spoon. There is a perfect image of everything, but the "reality" you are in is not perfect. Everything does exist, just in the real world. You are just living in a world of shadows. Check out Plato's cave.
 
get this. You exist in the future. about .5 seconds before you're consciousness would have you believe. Touch your toe. thats was pretty much instantaneous right? you can see your finger touch your toe at the same time as you feel it. But how can that be? it takes time for your brain to process the fact that your toe is being touched. Its not an instant operation.

Oh how about the free will? You think you decided to do things,You, the conscious entity? really you don't consciously decide to do anything, Your brain makes a decision before you become consciously aware that you are making a decicsion... Its the same delay.

We physicaly exist in the future, but live in the present.
 
human synapses travel much faster than .5 seconds but you are right but its more like .05 seconds.
 
the obvious answer to this is that the existence of the other people is as much in doubt as the existence of the spoon
 
since we are all posting therys heres mine.some people might find this retarded but eny way.SO..if you look at that chart of eveolution thing.when the monkey slowly turns into a human.well say that kept goin.we would eventually get scrawnyer and eventually lose all our hair we would get bigger brains and bigger eyes maybe because of the sun slowly burning out or something,this might also change our skin colour so we can absourb more light.So what im trying to get at is we would look like the common alian that we imagine today.say all of those sightings were true and they did exist.But say in the future we somehow invented time travel(which is impossible but say we found away around this)and the alians that we are seeing today are just people from the future screwing up or something or just tourists looking back into the past.think about it.its a pretty crazy idea.my cousin was telling me about it.
 
we did so much of this type of shit in 10th grade english. allegory of the cave and oedipus and that one about the country of the blind people siddhartha a lot of finding the truth shit and what others view the truth to be. its weird and messed up and best not to be thought about.
 
um, you can't sense the difference between the millionth of a second that something happens and the time your brain senses it. I can absolutely, 100 percent guarentee you that it is a LOT less than .5 second. You make the decision in your brain that your toe neeeds to be touched, you go for it. it's almost instantaneous, not enough to matter. you may exist in the future, but decisions are made the very second that you realize they are made. it takes no time for the brain to send messages to the brain.

If it was .5 seconds, you wouldn't be able to ski.

You have free will too, your brain is a web of cells that work together and make a decision, you are conciously aware of what is going on. 

Everything you said is just stupid. as is this thread. everyone sees the same spoon becuase it's the same for everyone, there is a spoon.
 
its kinda like the whole color thing, im looking at something that is red, and so are you, but we only say its red becuase thats what we have been told, even though we may not be seeing the same colors
 
You can think about this shit all you want, but honestly (for me), why bother? It's super complicated and it is too much thinking not worth doing when you could just enjoy the existence of that very spoon that you are questioning the existence of by utilizing its ability to scoop that amazing haagen daaz dulce de leche ice cream. If it is allowing you to get better leverage on scooping it rather than using a fork or your hand, then you know it must exist because the ice cream you are putting in your cup has come out in the concave of the spoon.

Through scooping the ice cream with the "spoon" it inevitably exists, and is the best way of transporting your ice cream to your mouth.

So, there actually is, in fact, a spoon.

(More philosophical shit)

Just as the color green you see may be different to the color green I see, but we will never know what green looks like to other people because we can't enter other people's minds. However everybody agrees that the color they are identifying is inevitably green, unless you are colorblind.

 
Yeah man, that's why it took so long for me to post, because I wanted to think of a well-structured response to introduce and prove my point.

Great minds think alike. ++karma from me to you brother.
 
lol. forsure dude. i never said i made this up, we were just talking about this stuff and i decide to post one part of our discussion. descartes touched on this shit hundreds of years ago. i just wanted to create some discussion and i did so im happy.
 
If you want to go on a mental trip, read chapter 11 of St. Augustine. He argues that there is no such thing as past present or future. How do you define the present? Now? Well that just past. You cant quantify what is "right now". You can infinitely subdivide time. So if there is no technical present, how could there be a past, and likewise there could be no future. It ends up just frustrating me and me wanting to throw something.
 
"It occoured to Libet, as it had to penfield, that having that reare access to the living brin opend the door to some tantalizing experimental possibilities. So, in his first set of experiments, Libet explored the timing of touch. Some paitents had an electrode planted in the samotosensory cortex, a strip of brain running across the tip from one side to the other. It is one of the more important destination for touch sensations travelling from the body to the brain. It maps those sensations (which otherwise are volleys of nerve impulses indistinguishable from any other) to their place of origin. The impulses reporting that you've stubbed your toe are only recognized as such because they arive at the toe region of the somatosensory cortex. This area is laid out in topographic fashion, with body parts arranged in a line from one end to the other. (Because body parts are laid out in order in the somatosensory cortex, an image of one's body can be recreated from them. Buth their size is proportional to their touch sensitivity, and the image that results is a disturbinly distorted version of the real body, a creature that shgould rightfully be haunting some dark fairy tale. It is called Homonculus) It then makes sense that an electrode firing a tiny pulse into any particular place on this map should create the feeling that the corresponding body part was being touched.

Once Libet showed that this was indeed the case, he had the potential for an experiment: Comparing the patients awareness of an actual touch on the hand with the stimulation of the related area of the brain. Touch a hand first, then compare that to a touch on the part of the brian that signals a touch on the hand. In both cases there was a significant delay before the patient became away of the sensation. The current passing through the brain electrode could be adjusted so that the time necessary to reach so called "neuronal adequacy" was approximately the same for both the brain and the hand. A typical delay was 500 milliseconds, or half a second. That is, you become aware of a touch on the hand about half a second after the actual touch; you awareness of an apparent touch also follows half a second after your somatosensory cortex is stimulated. (This doesn't include the actual time of travel from the hand to the brain, which is a short enough interval 10 or 15 milliseconds - to be negligible in these experiments.) "

-Jay Ingram "The theatre of the mind" pg 115-116

"So the sequence of events from the patients point of view was make the decision, check out the timer, and move the finger or wrist. Pretty simple. Now, if you had to guess what was reveiled by the recording electrodes, id bet you'd guess that at some point before the actuall movement, there would be some electrical activity that signalled the person's intention to make the movement (after all, the decision to move is made inside the brain somehwere). then maybe some more activity as the brain creates the signal to activate the muscles, then, after actual movement, it should fade away.

But that isn't what happened. There was indeed a busrst of activity in the brain that appeared to represent the decision to move. The problem was, it came before the patient reported making that decision. So in a typical case, electrical activity started in the brain, and about three tenths of a seconds later the patient reported making the decision to move, and about two tents of a second after that, the patient moved a finger.

Is it any wonder such results startled and confused the experts. sending many of them into denial? This experiment was saying that when you make up your mind to do something, it's too late: your mind has already been made up. The activity necessary to move your finger has already started -at an unconscious level - by the time you say to yourself "I'm going to move my finger now"

-Jay Ingram "The theatre of the mind" pg 120
 
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