Ski Resorts Prepare For a Future Without Skis
- Thread starter Parkboy
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solitaryman
Active member
the only good thing is, by the time our knees are all shot.... the snow will be too!
hawaiiansteeze
Active member
wow like come on yes the snow fall amount on the US changes from year to year. yes it could be very cold this year even though it was pretty warm last year( in CT). but you cant deny the fact that the climate is changing and we need to be concerned about it. your sounding like a close minded fuck by posting something like that
AhrenStein
Active member
One of the most ignorant comments i have ever read on ns. You should be ashamed of yourself for thinking like that.
titsLOL
Active member
he sounds closed minded for being the only one who's actually thought about what's happening instead of just hopping on the global warming bandwagon? the earth really does go through cycles like this, sure the holes in the ozone aren't helping, but that doesn't mean it's wrong for people to be optimistic and have their own opinions.
skijunkiedtm
Active member
ah, he can use the exact same argument against you, the climate and temp change year to year so you cant say for fact that the climate is changing and that we need to be concerned by it.
CYCLES the earth has gone through many ice ages major and minor and many warm periods.
CYCLES the earth has gone through many ice ages major and minor and many warm periods.
skimanskimanskim
Active member
Your a fool, watch the movie Al Gore made, parts of it are exadurated but most of its true.
icon1234
Active member
I also believe that the earth is just going through cycles, but I do believe that global climate change is also out there. But I believe that "global warming" wont effect us until 40-50 years from now. People are saying "o no we are 10 degrees over normal 1 day it must be global warming," I look at our record highs and it seems allot of them were in the early 1900's. Some winters will be bad some will be good you can’t just say we had a bad winter it has to be global warming... I mean all the media coverage on global warming just got popular in the past 2-3 years if even that, we need more time to give us accurate estimates of what is really happening.
skijunkiedtm
Active member
C-y-c-l-e-s, how old are you? even if your 50 I don’t think that is enough time to show trends of global warming considering how old this planet of ours is, also if you where 50 you would remember the media driven scare of the on coming ice age in the 70's
icon1234
Active member
I dont think tsunamis, or earthquakes have anything to do with global warming because they both have to do with plates and not temperateure, (I think so dont quote me). But I am sure we have had worse huricane seasons in the past, just because we had one bad huricane (katrina) every one jumps on the global warming band wagaon. Could it just be we had a bad season...
skijunkiedtm
Active member
wronge, climate and change has been in the media 4 times in the past 110 years, every time fliping sides. read http://www.businessandmedia.org/specialreports/2006/fireandice/fireandice.asp
icon1234
Active member
Interesting, but I meant more on gaining popularity in the upcoming years. I mean prior to like 2001 I had no idea what global warming was and neither did my parents, just now with "an incontinent truth" and constant media attention has it gotten known by the general public. I am sure that there has been skepticism about global climate change for a long time as that article proves, but I meant the idea of "global warming" to the way we see it today has just now gotten popular. But maybe I lived under a rock prior to 2001 and not heard anything about it...
skithesprings
Active member
Disclaimer: if you are just going to skim over this and start flaming, dont bother.
as stated before, everybody is jumping on the global temp bandwagon because they've jumped straight to conclusions. This controversy is all over a 2 degree rise in average temperatures.
it happens, in fact its happened before. we have an iceage then the temperatures gradually rise peak then fall again. and yes, i know the amounts of greenhouse gasses we pump out arent helping, but it was happening anyways.
even though it may be in 5000 years, eventually it will get to the point where the temperatures have peaked and start to decline and everybody will start to bitch and moan about the world wide crisis of global cooling. (except for the skiers!)
as stated before, everybody is jumping on the global temp bandwagon because they've jumped straight to conclusions. This controversy is all over a 2 degree rise in average temperatures.
it happens, in fact its happened before. we have an iceage then the temperatures gradually rise peak then fall again. and yes, i know the amounts of greenhouse gasses we pump out arent helping, but it was happening anyways.
even though it may be in 5000 years, eventually it will get to the point where the temperatures have peaked and start to decline and everybody will start to bitch and moan about the world wide crisis of global cooling. (except for the skiers!)
AhrenStein
Active member
yeah, pretty much
connoroh
Active member
Anyone on this website who has seen al gore's movie instantly believe that they are an expert on the matter of "global warming". Sure, carbon is up, glaciers are melting. But think of some of the shit that went on before we were around. ICE AGE? Before you start saying, oh, but the polar bears. I am not saying go out and drive 6 hummers. Im just saying that it MAY be a coincidence that the planet is warming up. And there really is no possible way to really predict the future temperatures. Yes, pollution sucks. I don't like pollution. I use biodegradable everything. I don't drive an suv. I want the temperatures to stay the same as they are. But you have to think for yourselves instead of blatantly believing that everything al gore said.
I am not asking for a war here, but i'm saying people can believe what they want. There was even a skier article (in skier) that talked about this very topic.
I am not asking for a war here, but i'm saying people can believe what they want. There was even a skier article (in skier) that talked about this very topic.
Scolson
Active member
user098123
Active member
Well, COskibum is partially right. And everyone calling him "The most ignorant person I have ever heard on NS" is pretty damn ignorant too.
The facts are:
Is there a 'global warming'?
Yes of course there is!
Are humans the sole cause of 'global warming'?
No of course not!
The earth is going through a cycle, just as he said. The earth warms up over many hundreds of years, and then it cools down rapidly into an ice age, and then slowly begins warming up again. There is tons of scientific evidence to prove this. While humans may partially be a cause of global warming, we don't have a huge impact.
Get this, the Methane production from cow farts is much much worse than CO2. Here is a snippet from earthsave.org:
"Methane is responsible for nearly as much global warming as all other non-CO2 greenhouse gases put together. Methane is 21 times more powerful a greenhouse gas than CO2. While atmospheric concentrations of CO2 have risen by about 31% since pre-industrial times, methane concentrations have more than doubled. Whereas human sources of CO2 amount to just 3% of natural emissions, human sources produce one and a half times as much methane as all natural sources. In fact, the effect of our methane emissions may be compounded as methane-induced warming in turn stimulates microbial decay of organic matter in wetlands—the primary natural source of methane.
Methane is produced by a number of sources, including coal mining and landfills—but the number one source worldwide is animal agriculture. Animal agriculture produces more than 100 million tons of methane a year. And this source is on the rise: global meat consumption has increased fivefold in the past fifty years, and shows little sign of abating. About 85% of this methane is produced in the digestive processes of livestock, and while a single cow releases a relatively small amount of methane, the collective effect on the environment of the hundreds of millions of livestock animals worldwide is enormous. An additional 15% of animal agricultural methane emissions are released from the massive “lagoons†used to store untreated farm animal waste, and already a target of environmentalists’ for their role as the number one source of water pollution in the U.S."
Alot of people are woefully ignorant on Global Warming, you should read up more on it.
The facts are:
Is there a 'global warming'?
Yes of course there is!
Are humans the sole cause of 'global warming'?
No of course not!
The earth is going through a cycle, just as he said. The earth warms up over many hundreds of years, and then it cools down rapidly into an ice age, and then slowly begins warming up again. There is tons of scientific evidence to prove this. While humans may partially be a cause of global warming, we don't have a huge impact.
Get this, the Methane production from cow farts is much much worse than CO2. Here is a snippet from earthsave.org:
"Methane is responsible for nearly as much global warming as all other non-CO2 greenhouse gases put together. Methane is 21 times more powerful a greenhouse gas than CO2. While atmospheric concentrations of CO2 have risen by about 31% since pre-industrial times, methane concentrations have more than doubled. Whereas human sources of CO2 amount to just 3% of natural emissions, human sources produce one and a half times as much methane as all natural sources. In fact, the effect of our methane emissions may be compounded as methane-induced warming in turn stimulates microbial decay of organic matter in wetlands—the primary natural source of methane.
Methane is produced by a number of sources, including coal mining and landfills—but the number one source worldwide is animal agriculture. Animal agriculture produces more than 100 million tons of methane a year. And this source is on the rise: global meat consumption has increased fivefold in the past fifty years, and shows little sign of abating. About 85% of this methane is produced in the digestive processes of livestock, and while a single cow releases a relatively small amount of methane, the collective effect on the environment of the hundreds of millions of livestock animals worldwide is enormous. An additional 15% of animal agricultural methane emissions are released from the massive “lagoons†used to store untreated farm animal waste, and already a target of environmentalists’ for their role as the number one source of water pollution in the U.S."
Alot of people are woefully ignorant on Global Warming, you should read up more on it.
currentwestman
Active member
spell exaggerated then maybe i'll consider watching it.
J.C.
Member
things aren't half as bad as they were one year way back when my old man was in college. he said that Snowbasin here in Utah didn't open until late january! we are doing just fine and global warming is all political shit and isn't at all true. just two years ago i recall having 3 feet in my backyard! last year i never got more than about 8 inches and yesterday we had a foot in some places. the weather can change but its not changing forever. sorry
skijunkiedtm
Active member
what about the "OVERWHELMING MAJORITY of the world's scientific community" that was in agrement 30 years ago about global cooling? what do you say to them?
user098123
Active member
How about the OVERWHELMING MAJORITY of scientists that have believed in...well...ANYTHING. Look at History, seriously. In any scientific field, a new model and theory comes along based on scientific evidence, it looks highly plausible, and all the scientists agree with the data/math that comes along with the new theory. The OVERWHELMING MAJORITY of the scientists believe in this theory. 5 years, 20 years, 50 years, maybe 200 years later, another scientist comes along with NEW evidence, disproves the old theory and comes up with a NEW theory.
It's call the way science works. 30 years ago, they believed in something different. Big deal, they probably didn't have as good of technology, didn't have the data, and they went with what they had. That's how science works. The OVERWHELMING MAJORITY means pretty much nothing in science, whether they are right or wrong.
It's call the way science works. 30 years ago, they believed in something different. Big deal, they probably didn't have as good of technology, didn't have the data, and they went with what they had. That's how science works. The OVERWHELMING MAJORITY means pretty much nothing in science, whether they are right or wrong.
o0Pape0o
New member
Is global warming a bullshit? i dont think so, i just think its too early to see the changes right now...maybe in a couple decade we will see the snow disappear or something. If scientifics say there is a prob we should trust them and try to correct it. Its not just because we dont see the weather changes right now that we can say that global warming is a bullshit....anyway we got more snow than ever for a 3th december in Quebec.
tride
Active member
Wow, you're right.
All science is a farce, education means nothing, and there is no point in listening to educated people who spend their lives studying things, because it will all be proved wrong in the future anyways.
From now on I will only base assumptions on what kids on internet sites think, because they are much more likely to be right about things in the long run.
Now please excuse me while I go and burn any scientific journal that might be littering up my house with useless information, while I'm at it I'll start chain smoking because the whole "smoking causes cancer" theory is also supported by an overwhelming scientific majority, so it must also be bullshit.
All science is a farce, education means nothing, and there is no point in listening to educated people who spend their lives studying things, because it will all be proved wrong in the future anyways.
From now on I will only base assumptions on what kids on internet sites think, because they are much more likely to be right about things in the long run.
Now please excuse me while I go and burn any scientific journal that might be littering up my house with useless information, while I'm at it I'll start chain smoking because the whole "smoking causes cancer" theory is also supported by an overwhelming scientific majority, so it must also be bullshit.
-dva-
Active member
THIS IS A RANT. feel free to read the highlights at the end if you're that lazy
these threads piss me off so goddamn much its unreal. half of you guys don't even know what the real issues are, and just come in spouting off shit that you've heard without actually understanding what it means.
first to address COskibum (and others on the "its just cycles" bandwagon). so far you haven't defended your ideas with anything other than the point that you're entitled to have you're own beliefs. your statement that its just "natural cycles" is beyond shallow. yes, the earth goes through natural heating and cooling cycles. climatologists aren't idiots. the real concern is how FAST the upwards cycle is occurring right now. there are a number of issues associated with this, including the fact that its fucking up biodiversity in a huge way. there's other stuff too, but i'm not trying to write a book here. the main point is that there's a lot more to this than just cycles. oh, and ironXcross, the hole in the o-zone is almost completely unrelated to climate change. in fact, climate change is going to dictate how big or small the hole gets, not the other way around. get your facts straight.
now for the other side...klazo, are you serious in saying that climate change causes earthquakes? skyways is correct in saying that they (and tsunamis) are a result of plate tectonics. and while its likely that theres a connection with the hurricanes, very few scientists are willing to make a concrete conclusion on that one yet. its still way too early in the game.
now GLrunner, you say "While humans may partially be a cause of global warming, we don't have a huge impact. Get this, the Methane production from cow farts is much much worse than CO2." No one who knows anything thinks that CO2 is the lone cause of climate change. All of the numbers you see in major studies are reported as "equivalent CO2" values, meaning that they take the methane issue into account. but the most ridiculous thing about your post is that you try to differentiate agriculture (the cows) from human causes. humans are why animal agriculture exists, so to say that its the cows fault not ours is absurd. so before you claim that everyone is so woefully ignorant (although they might be), make sure you've actually read the shit that you're posting.
end rant.
highlights for you lazy ones!
-it's more than just cycles, you have to consider how fast the change is happening in the greater perspective of geologic time
-earthquakes and tsunamis are NOT results of climate change
-its too early to tell if climate change is really whats driving the hurricane changes
-animal ag. is part of the greenhouse effect that humans are responsible for. its not the cows fault
these threads piss me off so goddamn much its unreal. half of you guys don't even know what the real issues are, and just come in spouting off shit that you've heard without actually understanding what it means.
first to address COskibum (and others on the "its just cycles" bandwagon). so far you haven't defended your ideas with anything other than the point that you're entitled to have you're own beliefs. your statement that its just "natural cycles" is beyond shallow. yes, the earth goes through natural heating and cooling cycles. climatologists aren't idiots. the real concern is how FAST the upwards cycle is occurring right now. there are a number of issues associated with this, including the fact that its fucking up biodiversity in a huge way. there's other stuff too, but i'm not trying to write a book here. the main point is that there's a lot more to this than just cycles. oh, and ironXcross, the hole in the o-zone is almost completely unrelated to climate change. in fact, climate change is going to dictate how big or small the hole gets, not the other way around. get your facts straight.
now for the other side...klazo, are you serious in saying that climate change causes earthquakes? skyways is correct in saying that they (and tsunamis) are a result of plate tectonics. and while its likely that theres a connection with the hurricanes, very few scientists are willing to make a concrete conclusion on that one yet. its still way too early in the game.
now GLrunner, you say "While humans may partially be a cause of global warming, we don't have a huge impact. Get this, the Methane production from cow farts is much much worse than CO2." No one who knows anything thinks that CO2 is the lone cause of climate change. All of the numbers you see in major studies are reported as "equivalent CO2" values, meaning that they take the methane issue into account. but the most ridiculous thing about your post is that you try to differentiate agriculture (the cows) from human causes. humans are why animal agriculture exists, so to say that its the cows fault not ours is absurd. so before you claim that everyone is so woefully ignorant (although they might be), make sure you've actually read the shit that you're posting.
end rant.
highlights for you lazy ones!
-it's more than just cycles, you have to consider how fast the change is happening in the greater perspective of geologic time
-earthquakes and tsunamis are NOT results of climate change
-its too early to tell if climate change is really whats driving the hurricane changes
-animal ag. is part of the greenhouse effect that humans are responsible for. its not the cows fault
ElliottP
Member
no dumb shit. you're a fool because your to fucking lazy to look up any information to grow your opinons at all. any one who is arguing you on this page has info. you. being the dumbest person on NS, have none. i can't fucking beleive you. i had hope for the world. but i forgot there are people as dumb as you.
user098123
Active member
Well, first of all to Tride, that was mostly just a counterpoint to yours. Obviously you have to believe certain scientific theories and laws within reason. As snowplow4lyphe pointed out, "this gravity shit is real too" might help aid your argument, it really doesn't. We actually can't really scientifically explain the forces of gravity. We've attempted with different scientific explanations of the universe (see String Theory), however, we are no where near proving or testing them, as many of them require multiple dimensions, i.e., over 10, and I'm sure you can both understand how difficult it would be to test something in 10 dimensions, seeing as how we live in 3.
The point I was getting at, Tride, was that you cannot put too much stake in what the overwhelming majority of scientists say on certain issues, primarily issues that do not have a lot of foundation and are relatively new in the science world, or difficult to prove. With global warming, there is very little evidence to base any strong theories off, and it is primarily all speculations at this point. In another hundred years, we might know more, and i hope we do, but for now, there is a lot of bickering between the uninformed and the informed alike. You say that you might as well pick up 'chain smoking', however, that is just a statistic. Statistic's have no baring on the individual per se, but on a populous. Regardless, it is a proven fact that smoking can be detrimental to your health, it is NOT a proven fact that the earth is currently going through an abnormal stage of global warming.
To snowplow, you have a valid point, I'm not denying that. For the record, I have 'ready my shit' and written multiple research papers on the topic, if you would like to go into some more in depth discussions I will gladly partake. What I was getting at in my post was more to educate people on the ways in which the said 'global warming' is coming about according to certain accredited scientists. A majority of the people believe (on NS as well as abroad) that our industrial means of production and transport are causing huge amounts of CO2 pollution, and is one of the leading causes of global warming. I was giving some information on some of the other leading factors on the issue. But yes, you were mostly right, a large portion of the animal agriculture is because of humans, and is made worse by our actions. It would still be prevalent without our influence I'm sure, but not nearly to the scale it is today.
Regardless, away form all of that, there really is no right answer to global warming. Many scientists believe that it exists due to human influence on the environment, and that we are setting ourself up for disaster. Many scientists also believe that it is just a natural cycle of the earth, and the slight increase of temperature over the last hundred years or so would occur regardless. Personally, I feel it is primarily the natural cycle of the earth, and human influence is really not doing much. Does this mean I think we should carry on with our current wasteful lifestyles? No, not at all. Things need to change environmentally, whether it is for the well-being of generations to come or possibly to slow down global warming of even just to repay the Earth that we live on and try and preserve some of what is left. That's for the individual to decide, especially at this point in time where concrete evidence illuminating a course of action is still in the works.
The point I was getting at, Tride, was that you cannot put too much stake in what the overwhelming majority of scientists say on certain issues, primarily issues that do not have a lot of foundation and are relatively new in the science world, or difficult to prove. With global warming, there is very little evidence to base any strong theories off, and it is primarily all speculations at this point. In another hundred years, we might know more, and i hope we do, but for now, there is a lot of bickering between the uninformed and the informed alike. You say that you might as well pick up 'chain smoking', however, that is just a statistic. Statistic's have no baring on the individual per se, but on a populous. Regardless, it is a proven fact that smoking can be detrimental to your health, it is NOT a proven fact that the earth is currently going through an abnormal stage of global warming.
To snowplow, you have a valid point, I'm not denying that. For the record, I have 'ready my shit' and written multiple research papers on the topic, if you would like to go into some more in depth discussions I will gladly partake. What I was getting at in my post was more to educate people on the ways in which the said 'global warming' is coming about according to certain accredited scientists. A majority of the people believe (on NS as well as abroad) that our industrial means of production and transport are causing huge amounts of CO2 pollution, and is one of the leading causes of global warming. I was giving some information on some of the other leading factors on the issue. But yes, you were mostly right, a large portion of the animal agriculture is because of humans, and is made worse by our actions. It would still be prevalent without our influence I'm sure, but not nearly to the scale it is today.
Regardless, away form all of that, there really is no right answer to global warming. Many scientists believe that it exists due to human influence on the environment, and that we are setting ourself up for disaster. Many scientists also believe that it is just a natural cycle of the earth, and the slight increase of temperature over the last hundred years or so would occur regardless. Personally, I feel it is primarily the natural cycle of the earth, and human influence is really not doing much. Does this mean I think we should carry on with our current wasteful lifestyles? No, not at all. Things need to change environmentally, whether it is for the well-being of generations to come or possibly to slow down global warming of even just to repay the Earth that we live on and try and preserve some of what is left. That's for the individual to decide, especially at this point in time where concrete evidence illuminating a course of action is still in the works.
Parkboy
Active member
Regarding the natural cycle of the earth's warming and cooling periods, i just want to show a couple graphs for people to refer to.
Graph 1
Showing temperature and co2 levels from the past 650,000 years as recorded from ice core samples
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/thumb/6/63/Co2-temperature-plot.svg/800px-Co2-temperature-plot.svg.png
Graph 2Â Showing different models between natural cycles, human related temperature rise, and observations of what has ACTUALLY happened.
http://www.cypenv.org/images/forcing.jpg
Graph 1
Showing temperature and co2 levels from the past 650,000 years as recorded from ice core samples
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/thumb/6/63/Co2-temperature-plot.svg/800px-Co2-temperature-plot.svg.png
Graph 2Â Showing different models between natural cycles, human related temperature rise, and observations of what has ACTUALLY happened.
http://www.cypenv.org/images/forcing.jpg
Parkboy
Active member
invaderskier36
Active member
so sad
Parkboy
Active member
if you can't read see if this link works
http://travel.nytimes.com/2007/12/02/travel/02skiglobal.html?ex=1354424400&en=616facdae21549ce&ei=5088&partner=rssnyt&emc=rss
http://travel.nytimes.com/2007/12/02/travel/02skiglobal.html?ex=1354424400&en=616facdae21549ce&ei=5088&partner=rssnyt&emc=rss