NS - Sold out?

Mr.Bishop

Mr.Bishop

Active member
Staff member
A quote:

"On another note, quick question to the admins of this site: is there any controversial issue on which you guys won't whore yourselves out to one side or the other? It wasn't always that way... time was when you had actual individual opinions. Now it seems like whenever one of these things comes up you're a bunch of spokesmen with red names prostituting yourselves uniformly out to whomever you owe some sort of industry allegiance. That's kind of sad. And you can hate me all you like for my saying so, but Jesus, it's what I see around here, and far too often."

When you read something like this and know that it's directed straight at you, some people get really angry. I do too, and then wonder... are they right?

Many media sources in skiing are one-sided. However, working at NS is totally different. I read as much of as what's posted on this site as my tired eyes can manage. What I will always feel is the beauty of this site, is it gives every person an equal voice to state their opinion.

Those opinions might not always be good, and yes I do have the ability to just systematically delete everything I don't like, but I never do that. I much prefer dealing with my own problems.

So, I'm opening this question up to all of you. Don't be shy to say negative things if you want to.

I only ask that you give your honest opinion.

Increase the peace?

The only piece I'll increase is that which deletes your peeps.

 
i think ur just fine bishop same with all the other admin, and mods...good job keep it up

S-STATUS-Reprsent

NUFF SAID

 
i think that a few of the mods sometimes take sides and delete certain threads that may question a company or persons reputation when others are never deleted at all, that bothers me.

 
yeh i forgot about that....when u said that it brought bakc a few memories...

S-STATUS-Reprsent

NUFF SAID

 
I understand where you guys come from, and why you need to do certain things you do, but sometimes I do see stuff that is just an open topic of discussion...okay argument, that deals with reputations, companies and their messages, and things like that, get moved around, deleted, or edited on here that really dosen't give a full voice to the issue.I think that's what NS is here to do, give everyone their fair shake and say on related topics.

For the most part, you guys are totally on and do everything you should do, just certain times in certain situations, things get shot down becase they may be "too hot" for the site to handle.

But in all, I love you guys and I love the site. Keep it up!

 
Wasn't meant to be a pot shot or anything personal, Doug... I like you guys. It's just what I'm seeing happen more and more on the site... or at least it looks that way to me.

 
Sometimes i get the feeling that original "players" from NS have moved on elsewhere. like they have found another website or other wise have maybe outgrown the site. i think the regional forums continue to do what they were intended; keeping local scenes connected. but the main "ski gabber" is pretty much shit anymore. i really cant read another post about Chad's Gap without becoming irritated. i dont know- i just dont feel a sense of respect among the member here anymore. i think it's time for an overhaul of the site.

 
Doug, I love you and the site and everyone else here, you do a great job and you keep the site flowing smoothly.

On the other hand, just sometimes the iron fist comes out and you have to get rid of stuff that you don't really have the heart behind or need to keep it clean, "too hot" as said earlier.

You said it yourself to me in one of our conversation, dealing with the whole MSP deal, you totally had an opinion on that and even said thats what you loved about NS, the site gave everyone a voice to be heard. Tt hasn't reach that point at all yet, but in the future it could, that the far out opinions and totally biased statements get shut down because of their backings, that hasn't happened, and its totally in your power to not have it happen.

You guys do a great job, no question about it, and I thank you for that.

Stay Classy Newschoolers
 
I never experienced problems with any of the male mods it's allways them female mods that get sand in their vages and get all hurt by statements or comments that you make whether it has to do with them or not.

-People say marijuana ruins your life, I just say I take the scenic route-
 
You're not feelng the "online community" you're feeling the online city of Newschoolers.com. That happens when a site expands, grows, and gets notice.

Oh, and one last thing, NS, totally not sold out.

Stay Classy Newschoolers
 
your opinions just have more power over what an average member. So it may seem that way.

✓Adrian

✓Jibwest

✓Whats commin next, you just can't choose but if you tune into NS Radio then you just cant lose. - GhostDragon
 
yea i agree with this. when the NS heads of state say something, the average NSer thinks it has more weight b/c of who it is coming from.

--------------

~ J u L i E ~

Yankees '05

It took me seventeen years to get three thousand hits in baseball. I did it in one afternoon on the golf course.

~Hank Aaron

 
NS sold out along time ago... thus i left all summer and the more and more i look at it, i doubt i will be on here much this winter. fuck ns and what its become, i donated to harvey because this site was cool and i enjoyed coming on, now its just a bunch of 13 year olds who talk alot of smack, and the same threads that have been posted for the past 2 years. WEAK

man and i thought being away for a few months i would notice a diff in NS but nope

.:Tyler:.

-----------------------------

Cos I know what I've gotta do

I couldn't stop now even if I wanted to

They told me give it up its impossible

Never bury my head in the sand like the ostrich do

And I'm young and I still got a lot to prove

I can't stop won't stop unstoppable

 
^agreed, way to many 13 year old kids who say all they want about cirten companies, people, and whatever just because there behind a computer screen. If they said half the shit they say to someones face thell get the shit knocked outta them. Its a protective shield for wrongly opinionated assholes. But i love NS.

_________________________________________

www.ambushclothing.com

DROPPING OCT 1st

 
i have in no way een here long enough to say anything substancial about the site, but when it comes to the neams in red and green having an "aura", i completely agree... you tend to think that this person has deserved their opinion much more than you, and that they have much better reasoning and validity in their opinions seeing as they are entrusted with responsibility on a site where you give your opinions.

i have not seen any trend of one sidedness, like i said because i ahve not been here long enough to see a change, si can't comment on that.

i do think this site is great, and when you filter through it, you get a very informative and entertaining experience.

- Patty

*NS Skateboarders* Vas y il l'a cassé!

P-
 
I don't know where to start...I'll just agree with skismadtrix for starters. If I find the time to word my feelings in a good statement I'll post that later.

 
If your gonna call me out on this then please explain

CMc - *NSFD*

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"Son
, when you participate in sporting events, its not whether you win or loose, its how drunk you get." - Homer
 
Actually, awhile back under a previous username, i attacked blue mountain for the amount of lifttickets they sell in comparison to how many people can actually fit on the ski hill. (this was a long while ago though, so perhaps things are changed).

I commented that your basically sacrificing the saftey of the masses by cramming the runs full of people for extra dollars- and if someone did that with a movie theatre, there would be an uproar.

I got called a socialist, amongst other things- and although i do admit that my side of the arguement was fundamentally wrong; in that people charge and do what they can get away with- and they can't exactly tell people who show up that they cannot ski.

-the consumer is the one who has control......

I agree- but that doesent warrent deleting my post.

Which is exactly what happend.

Thankfully though, i don't think blue mountain has NS as a sponser anymore- or at least there banner/ad isnt all over the website.

 
Some companies seem to have a get out of jail free pass on this site. Other companies don't.

Some examples I have noticed is H3O films for some odd reason or other has a free pass. I don't get it. I've made several posts about them that have been deleted. They don't deserve to be even in the ski scene yet some people back them up. The guy who runs them is a complete unreliable asshole.

Another one is Armada. When people would post pictures of their new skis they were taken down. Sure they wanted to keep it a secret but this is supposed to be an open forum where we can scam as many pictures as possible of the upcoming gear. That was totally lame to take the pictures off.

There are for sure other companies out there who have a free pass aswell, and some that have quite the opposite.

MSP for example doesn't have a pass (and I'm damn happy about that too haha) so we can do whatever the hell we want to them.

'Keep on rocking in the free world'
 
In responce to get out of jail free cards there are 2 issues. The first being that there is often a big difference between stating an opinion in a constructive conversation, and the blatant shit talking that is often used. If a negative opinion is posted in the form of a discussion topic or responce then it will generally be left no matter who the company is. But 3page threads with nothing but trash talk towards a caompany, its products or its people dont offer anything to the site and generally get removed with the rest of the trash.

In the case of removing the photos of the armada line up at their request, we would have done the same if it had been salomon or line or anyone else. NS does have a responsibilty to other parts of the ski industry, while it helps create hype for many companies, we must also work with them to ensure it fits with their intended marketing. Many companies go to huge lengths to insure their products are released on their schedules. We simply adhere to that as part of the media.

We try not to play favorites to anyone.

CMc - *NSFD*

-------------------------------------
--------------------------------

"Son
, when you participate in sporting events, its not whether you win or loose, its how drunk you get." - Homer
 
Yeah... and we can't afford the lawyers that some other companies can. :)

Increase the peace?

The only piece I'll increase is that which deletes your peeps.

 
Dfresh and JD May are on the money on this one. The bias comes right from the top. CKO had his mind made up that Predator will never be more than a mogul brand before he and I had issues. After he attacked me for constructively soliciting outerwear design discussion, I attempted to respond by working WITH NS instead of just posting my thoughts and questions as I had been. But he would not have it. He feels that he and NS have no business with Predator because he feels that he knows where skiing is headed and we are not part of that. Anyone who knows us knows that we are young, energetic, reasonable, adaptable, willing to accept criticism, and we love to ski and support the newschool movement. Even after I phoned him to discuss these concepts, and I mentioned that we would probably be friends if we lived in the same place or knew each other, he was not open to that idea. We, (I), do not have a get out of jail free card, and have not been treated respectfully in any way by CKO, the CEO, straight biased, straight from the top.

 
"wrongly opinionated" hey explain that one to me? haha

about the mods, they do not treat all threads equal. LIke if i was to voice my opinion about a certin member.. i know for a fact that it would be removed.. why? b/c everything single thread about that person has been removed.

`
 
sadly, i have to comment on this.

newschoolers is evidently run by people who assume we are all thirteen year olds. A website that originally was founded for a grass roots movement called "newschool" skiing, now doesnt even consider any kind of support for the movement. Honestly, IMO newschoolers comes off as lazy.......no return emails, no return phone calls, not even to potential advertisers. My interest in advertising on this site has just been redirected to a now official deal with freeskier, which sucks, because newschoolers is still THE place to go for info. Sad, but true. And not likely to change unless management has a complete change of attitude and realize that they need to support those who support them.

My .02

 
I have been on da intarnet for many years(to many), and this is the best out there, good activity and interesting posts/topics, I can get all the info on ski things I want to.. Anyway there will always be shit on a site, and this is a huge active site, and the gayness factor is still very low in my opinion. I think the crew is doin a great job on this site. I love you

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join the crochet cult! msg me
 
okay my post didnt realy answear the topic.. but hell I think we can talk much shit about companies before somethin happens, and I fully understand why some of it get deletes..if u think about gettin sued

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join the crochet cult! msg me
 
what I want to know is who the fuck keeps deleteing the CR Johnson ad when I post it?!

Its not my fault his ad looks like a giant penis when you turn it upside down. People want to see that shit!

 
I only take it seriously because it's my job to. :)

Theoneguy... http://www.snowcoupons.com - that's the site, for anyone who hasn't seen it.

You know what? I'll tell you the truth. If you want to contact me, do it over email. If you don't email, it can be really hard to track your correspondence. A phone message gets lost much easier than an email.

You're not mentioning that when we finally did talk I apologized and said that we should start over.

I asked you to email some ideas over, so I could get your address and send you out media kit and some site stats, and you just never contacted me.

Maybe you were over it. But I at least realised my wrongs and did something to change it.

Increase the peace?

The only piece I'll increase is that which deletes your peeps.

 
then why are you on now?

take your negative attitude elsewhere.

i agree with you on the 13 year old kids and what not, but newschoolers is really the only place for skiers to congragate (sp) all across the nation and discuss something with equal opinion. some people make take different peoples opinions more serious than others, but everyone has a say in something if they choose to participate.

rock on NS

and doug:

youre the shit

Poor Milk Productions
 
In response to your answer. While worded well and attempted to be thought out this just doesn't hold weight.

Most of the other manufacturers got pics of their gear posted from SIA this past winter, so much so that there was entire threads dedicated to pics of the gear. Armada's pics were pulled down while others were left up.

In addition, you claim that you won't allow threads that deteriorate in to shit bashing a company or person. How do you account for the allowance of the "Say I if you refuse to buy Ninthward" thread? This thread went on for pages with nothing but bashing of the company. When the same thing happens to H3O you guys pull the threads immediately. What's sad is that Ninthward is one of the sponsors of the site and you allow them to be bashed but H30 isn't. I'm not saying that either of these situations is right, but don't claim to be fair when things are obviously skewed.

 
Er... deleting that ninthward thread would've been far too obvious. But there are probably things to say on that issue as well.

 
I'd also like to say something on my own accord.

There's a real problem of people's definitions of "core" here.

With the magazines, if you work there you're guaranteed a $30,000+/year salary. Magazines get it because they sell really, really expensive ads to pay for all the staff. So yeah, Newschoolers takes some money and makes some allegiances, but I'll tell you I'm not coming CLOSE to making that much money here.

Yeah, I could go out (as the sales guy) and take a ton of money from online gambling, selling smileys, the US Army, anyone who was willing to give a buck so I could get paid.

Sure there are companies that have a "free pass" on newschoolers. Generally it is because they have treated us with respect, and not taken advantage of us. When a company's thread gets deleted, it is because the person at that company thought they could screw our system by just posting in the forums.

Sometimes companies contact us, and we reject their advertising. I always thought that would make us less sold out rather than more.

I'm sorry if our opinions on certain things grate on people. Hell I know I'm not always right, but I just want to have my voice on this site and be able to post what I feel just like anyone else. I enjoy the freedom to express my opinion on the world of skiing.

We care what you guys think about the site. People make mistakes, people do things wrong.

That's why we have threads like this so you guys can tell us what we're doing wrong, and we can work on it.

'cause change is good.

Increase the peace?

The only piece I'll increase is that which deletes your peeps.

 
go back to hell you you came from. I can say this becuase i've been here so long. and i'm negative right now becuae i just got on after 3 months being off and it has just gotten worse mainly in posting quality and NS sold out a LONG time ago. not saying i hate doug or the NS staff i just think NS could be more objective

.:Tyler:.

-----------------------------

Cos I know what I've gotta do

I couldn't stop now even if I wanted to

They told me give it up its impossible

Never bury my head in the sand like the ostrich do

And I'm young and I still got a lot to prove

I can't stop won't stop unstoppable

 
I somewhat agree on this, but I can see it from both sides. While I understand that the Admins and Mods have to remove some posts to legally protect their site, aka, can't be promoting illegal shit, I do feel that sometimes they tend to lean to one side or the other. Also, the site has declined even since I have been here, and like someone said before, many of the older people (age wise, not NS time wise) have left, and some of the old "key players" have departed also. Personally, I can see why, and now I have started avoiding ski gabber and non ski gabber all together. I still come on from time to time, by find myself only going into the cults (PPP), because people are just more chill in there. I can understand why the admins have to do this stuff, but there are a lot of young people on here, or so it seems. You guys are doing a great job running the site, and I understand how much work it is, but sometimes the opinions get a bit out of hand

~Ben

______________

www.freeheellife.com

Dude, joke's totally on them, you should make a t-shirt that says 'all you fools suck' and on the back it can say 'I rule coz T-dawg said so' and yeah, you'll be rockin it shibby, new steeze brah, wikkid! ~PhattTim

~Phunkin Phatt Phreerider~

 
Yea I agree with that. Although I talked to Ross (cruz) about it a while ago and apparantly its not as bad as I had thought it was. NS isnt as great as it used to be I'll admit. But it's less of a management issue than its growing which will get rid of the once present family atmosphere and introduce immature and ignorant people to offset the peace.

check out the new logic website:

www.logiclothing.com

only one C
 
I feel that NS has stayed really seperate from corporations and "the man" but I am concerned that in the future a big sponser will come in here and change things like lets say if a large ski company were to purchase NS and turned it into a big ass ad for them and stopped people from sharing their ideas and opinions.

But currently i'm a little afraid that NS is becoming "old" i've been seeing real adults on here with families and kids but i think as long as we keep such amazing posts at "names for vaginas" and why so and so sucks we will be ok

M~M~C

poach: To take or appropriate something unfairly or illegally (you know what I'm talking about)

 
I will always love newschoolers no matter what. Even if there is bias, which i dont think there is, where else can you get all of the info thats just on the front page of this site? I prefer newschoolers over any magazine out there.

Where did you get your clothes, the toilet store?

D-Railed Productions

skier8990 aim. talk to me if you like
 
On the flip side of my last post, I want to illustrate another point at what I view as corruption amongst the admins.

*The riders I'm alluding to have seemed to cool off a bit and I have no personal issues.

There was a period in time where the Ninthward team riders consistently did everything they could to piss people off. Racial slurs, shit talking, physical threats, anything goes. This pissed a lot of members off and created a few inconsistancies in the policies of this site.

First, other members have been permanently banned for posts identical to the ones that the mentioned riders posted. Specifically, I remember ATLANTASKI being banned for racial slurs. Others have been banned or warned for similar bullshit posts. In the case of the 9thward riders, nothing ever happened.

This type of stuff created lots of hate threads about 9thward and their riders. Whether right or wrong, it's understandable how it happened. Instead of sticking with the previously stated policy, and removing the threads they were allowed to remain instead. I have already stated that I feel that this was unfair to the company in a previous post, but I feel that the actions taken by the admins were even worse.

The admins got on these threads and backed the company no matter what. In every post that they backed the company, they indirectly supported the actions of the company's riders. What does this say to the members of the site. It's ok to talk shit and spit slurs as long as you are a pro skier and your comany sponsors the site?

I'm not spitting hate at you guys, but you asked for the criticism and I feel that you should hear it.

 
The only h3o threads/posts that were deleted by MacMahoooon were ones that took personal attacks at me. I asked Chris to delete those.

I've just come to one sad realization about our ns community in general. Someone dies in an avalanche or gets seriously hurt and that’s all we can talk about for weeks. A storm just devastated the south-east, killed a confirmed 57 so far (they may not even find all of the bodies), and is going to cause an immense distress on our economy (definitely US, probably Canadian too), but we sit here and bitch about this shit. There are only two threads totaling 47 posts about this on the first page in non ski gabber. Which matters more right now?

 
I don't believe that sitting and talking about the devastation is going to do much of anything. We are talking about issues with the site because our input was solicited.

Only comment about H30 threads is that there were more than just ones concerning you that have been deleted.

 
This site is great for info and happenings, but I think stuff gets out of hand sometimes. Everyone has an opinion, and can state that, but personal attacks on a person or company with nothing but heresay as the basis for their arguement. Threads that go into an all out bash fest with no real conversation going on, it should be deleted in my opinion. There needs to be consistancy to the deletings too. Companies who donate/advertise more than others should not have any special treatment over those that don't, that's just not fair. Granted, it may piss some companies off, but it's necessary.

I've been around for a while, I'm no OG, but a while. I just don't post because the respect level is just dropping and dropping, your opinion doesn't matter on some issues. This site is great, you guys are doing a great job, but no matter how great you are, there is always room for improvement.

You are the feces produced when shame eats stupidity

-Dale Gribble
 
the only mod i ever thought deleted shit for no reason was flanker

______________________________

Extra points if you're so bored of your cab 270 on bs switch up 450 out that you just collapse on the landing and start audibly snoring -skimack
 
Kendrick, I realize that you're upset but I don't think it's any reason to send me inflammatory messages with a link to this thread and say: "ahem. you're going to respond to this the same way you responded to my outerwear design ideas thread, right?". I thought we wanted to keep this as professional as possible?

However I will respond to your points as I still stand by my decision and think there is a very important issue behind it all.

To begin, the original post that was deleted was removed because we don't allow companies to post in the forums without asking us first. We don't make it at all necessary to become an advertiser (especially for the smaller companies) but we need to at least know that you see the potential of the site and the community and you want to figure out the preferred method of getting involved. This as opposed to simply posting something and hoping to get a little bit of free market research. In this case Kendrick I'm not at all singling you out, it happens on a fairly regular basis, but nevertheless that is how we dealt with it.

Next, you bring up when you tried to solicit advertising from us, and I subsequently refused. That's completely correct and it brings up the most important issue here: who should NS work with and who should we not? Bottom line is, NS won't exist unless it can take in some money to pay for it's hosting and it's staff. And since NS will never be a pay site, we've taken on advertisers around the site. Now the question becomes with whom can we work to ensure that we stay alive (and hopefully have a chance to grow) and yet not be considered "sold out" to the core audience that we're seeking to grow. It's an issue we face head-on every day but we have make the call. Some companies seem to fit with us and some don't and I don't think we should be hated on for making stand for what we're stoked on.

In the individual case of you Kendrick, I was more taken aback by your PMs at the time calling me things like a 'fucking box of shite'. I just didn't feel the need to work with some one that would do that. And as long as we're being honest I'll say that I don't much care for your brand and I still don't think that it's catering to the core newschool scene. But that's why you guys are branching out isn't it?

In general though, we do have a mission to make skiing as 'good' as we can - but that direction must come from somewhere. Sometimes that involves taking money from a 'big company' if it means we can put on a sick event or have a great contest, or do more event coverage, but sometimes it means taking that stand and supporting the people and the companies we believe in. We try to make these decisions based on what's good for the site, for the sport, and the community... but everyone is going to have their own opinion on where they want the sport to go.

Wow, there have been a lot of messages posted on the thread since I started writing this... I'm glad everyone's being honest (although it's not super pleasurable to be called out this hard we definitely need to hear it), I'll try my best to respond to the rest.

two miles an hour so everybody sees you.
 
There is one thing in particular I'd like to comment on here...

Many people have mentioned that the shit talking has been getting worse over time, but I don't think it's any worse than before. What I have noticed however, is the increase in legit discussion going on now.

There has always been plenty of shit-talking, but I personally find that the frequency of good conversations is increasing and that shit-talkers are being more often put down with intelligent arguments instead of just flame wars.

The shit talking will decreaes if it's not fueled by more shit talking.

My 0.02$

--

I'm too lazy to come up with a new signature so now it's this.
 
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