Question for the park crew/managers out there. Obviously this depends on labor costs, size of the park and other factors, but a rough estimate for say, 3 decent sized jumps and 12-15 other features would be super useful for a school project I'm working on! What cat time costs per hour would be very useful to know too!
How much does it cost to build and maintain a terrain park?
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bzmn_ski_rat
Member
idk... but I'm going to guess probably around 10k to build a park
gravel
Active member
14379816:bzmn_ski_rat said:
i would guess way more.
depends where you’re starting from. if you need to fabricate rails it would be a lot of money for materials and labor hours.
snowblowing is very expensive depending on how much you need, so 3 decent jumps would take a good bit of money.
you also need to pay a park crew to take care of it and groomers to clean it up every night, so money for equipment, fuel, and labor.
i would not start guessing below 100k to open and maintain a medium park for a while season including building features. might be a lot more but i’m just spitballing.
Derangedkiller
New member
If you already own a ski resort where you can add a terrain park it would cost you far less than having to purchase land and/or an existing ski resort to create one. Insurance also is astronomical if you're a small resort who doesn't have buying power like the conglomerates do
a_burger
Active member
Depends when/how you make the snow, and how you organize handwork. Waiting till it’s single digit temps and using diesel compressors (fuel costs are slightly more stable then electricity which spikes at peak hours especially when it’s cold) you can make a lot in a short window. 3 jumps and a dozen rails is probably 48-72 hours of cat time depending where snow is made.
a lot of the cost depends on who’s running shit. A driven and resourceful person can pull a dozen features out of their ass if there’s enough metal lying around
a lot of the cost depends on who’s running shit. A driven and resourceful person can pull a dozen features out of their ass if there’s enough metal lying around
skiP.E.I.
Active member
Where I work now we don't have snow making, it's all natural so it takes more cat time to push up tables, but it still has to be cheaper than making enough snow for a park. The park features themselves have a high initial cost - Anywhere from about $900 CAD for a 10 foot flat bar to $3500 for a 16'x4' dance floor box.
Currently I have a mini park built with a jump and 3 jibs. I'd estimate that was $300 ish in labor and fuel costs to build and about $20 daily to maintain.
The main park right now has 4 rails and 4 rollers/knuckles of different sizes. Those rollers will eventually become jumps and jibs.
For that park I'd say there is about $600 in labour and $200 in fuel put in at this point. It's on average about $60/day to maintain that park, but it doesn't get machine groomed every day.
Currently I have a mini park built with a jump and 3 jibs. I'd estimate that was $300 ish in labor and fuel costs to build and about $20 daily to maintain.
The main park right now has 4 rails and 4 rollers/knuckles of different sizes. Those rollers will eventually become jumps and jibs.
For that park I'd say there is about $600 in labour and $200 in fuel put in at this point. It's on average about $60/day to maintain that park, but it doesn't get machine groomed every day.
bigwhite.steeze
Active member
cat time is the money, an 8 hour shift in a cat can be over 200 litres of fuel, + operator at 30$ an hour with burdens.
if your in the west dealing with pushing out parks with new snowfall, its alot of time. In the east maybe not as much snow clearing, but probably snow making. Jumps take alot of snow, ALOT.
A decent park in Western Canada would have a budget of $150,000 + a season easily totaling cat time and day labor.
if your in the west dealing with pushing out parks with new snowfall, its alot of time. In the east maybe not as much snow clearing, but probably snow making. Jumps take alot of snow, ALOT.
A decent park in Western Canada would have a budget of $150,000 + a season easily totaling cat time and day labor.
IlsPlauns64
New member
I only know that in Laax the superpipe costs about a million per season
galardogod
Active member
14380147:IlsPlauns64 said:
Super pipes are absolutely ignorant in cost.
Young_patty
Active member
14380147:IlsPlauns64 said:
14380162:galardogod said:
Yup what they said^
Here's a quote from the 2008 X games that throws it into perspective:
"it costs resorts anywhere from $100,000 to $300,000 to make snow for the super pipes (half-pipes) in Colorado."
That is just the snow itself too. Once you incorporate man hours/wages, snow cat fuel, specialized equipment like pipe shapers, electricity and insurance it can easily add up to about a million in costs for the resort.
Rails easy, jumps not so easy.
You can make a sick rail park with almost no money. Also steel is cheap comparatively. At Oak i got donations for steel, welded for free and we had some pretty sick setups. We had an XS jump that i basically shaped by hand.
Jumps require snow, cat maintenance, and honestly can be more difficult to build. If you know what a sick rail setup you can build it pretty much yourself woth 1 or 2 other people to move things around.
With a jump the guy at the local hill moght be a sick oprtator, but if he's never built a jump it can be tough. Pictures are your best friend. If he can envision what it needs to look like he moght be able to build it, or will at least be a lot close than without.
The knuckle is the biggest thing. You can hand shape a lip pretty easy, that's how we did em for years at mtns i worked way back.
If the knuckle is wonky, the lamding is too flat, there isn't a drive around the take off. It could be shit.
Snowmaking is expensive, depends on what your setup is and what kind of temps you have. But jumps require a decent amount of snow. If you're in an all man made area that will be $$$ also have to work that in to the snowmaking plan with the trails that need snow for racing, the bunny hill etc. Park may be low priority to on the lost depending how new it is and what the capacity.
I probably would have had better numbers for you when i was doing early season snowmaking a couple years but hard for me to remember.
But yeah, start with rails honestly. Best bang for your buck.
This is one of the reasons the trend went from a few rails and a ton of jumps to a few good jumps and a ton of rails. Rails are cheap and easy to move around and keep the park fresh. Building a few good jumps where they fit and maintaining them is the move and shuffling the rails.
Idk, been around parks a while and dabbled in some snowmaking.
Where's your hill located?
You can make a sick rail park with almost no money. Also steel is cheap comparatively. At Oak i got donations for steel, welded for free and we had some pretty sick setups. We had an XS jump that i basically shaped by hand.
Jumps require snow, cat maintenance, and honestly can be more difficult to build. If you know what a sick rail setup you can build it pretty much yourself woth 1 or 2 other people to move things around.
With a jump the guy at the local hill moght be a sick oprtator, but if he's never built a jump it can be tough. Pictures are your best friend. If he can envision what it needs to look like he moght be able to build it, or will at least be a lot close than without.
The knuckle is the biggest thing. You can hand shape a lip pretty easy, that's how we did em for years at mtns i worked way back.
If the knuckle is wonky, the lamding is too flat, there isn't a drive around the take off. It could be shit.
Snowmaking is expensive, depends on what your setup is and what kind of temps you have. But jumps require a decent amount of snow. If you're in an all man made area that will be $$$ also have to work that in to the snowmaking plan with the trails that need snow for racing, the bunny hill etc. Park may be low priority to on the lost depending how new it is and what the capacity.
I probably would have had better numbers for you when i was doing early season snowmaking a couple years but hard for me to remember.
But yeah, start with rails honestly. Best bang for your buck.
This is one of the reasons the trend went from a few rails and a ton of jumps to a few good jumps and a ton of rails. Rails are cheap and easy to move around and keep the park fresh. Building a few good jumps where they fit and maintaining them is the move and shuffling the rails.
Idk, been around parks a while and dabbled in some snowmaking.
Where's your hill located?
Corey_O132
Member
14380187:TOAST. said:
Out west a lot of park cat ops start at $25 so 30 is definitely not out of the question. Park cat ops are typically the highest-paid cat operators because it takes a lot more shaping skill than doing something like trail grooming or winching.
14380202:Corey_O132 said:
The fuck mountain you riding and how do I get a job?
Corey_O132
Member
14380219:a_burger said:
Lmao, yeah hate to say it but it's true.
Also, lining up and doing fleet sucks sometimes from what I've heard, depending on who is in charge.
I will say though, if you ever have a chance, listen to that radio channel at your resort. It's funnier than a lot of comedy sketches out there. Those guys typically don't give a fuck what they say over the radio.
Corey_O132
Member
14380207:theabortionator said:
You don't want to work for them lmao. Check out Beaver Creek though if you're actually interested. They pay their guys pretty well, but it doesn't matter bc the cost of living is so high out here.
Weirdo_Puppy
Member
$20 and half a redbull is my estimate.
bigwhite.steeze
Active member
14380187:TOAST. said:
pretty easy to be making 23$/hr+ cat driving in Western Canada, 30$ would be what the employer pays when you factor in CPP/EI and other burdens businesses pay to gov per hour
14380233:Corey_O132 said:
Actually have worked there in 14/15. Park day staff not in a cat. @TL was working there at the time.
Cool mtn parks were dying though and Ill never understand painting the cats gold.