Brand new to touring -

[Rodigan]

Hey NS, hope you can help with a few new guy questions on touring. I am 44, strong all mountain skier, 5,9, 168 pounds. Spend my time in Chamonix, Zermatt, Scandinavia always freeride with a guide. Next season most of my friends are out touring so now my fitness is on point i thought its time to get involved. I have a couple of courses booked for December but want to have all my kit bought early on as so far i can see £££££($$$$$$) requirements....

One thing i know i don't want is to sacrifice a good ride down, if i gotta lug a bit more weight uphill thats fine with me.

Thinking of these two skis.

Icelantic Nomad 105 in a 181cm - reasons, i can get at a good price, had Icelantic Nomad mark2 and loved the ride and build back in the day. What it would be like for touring, no clue....

Faction Candide 3.0 in a 182cm - reasons, again super cheap right now, I have the 2.0 and it a laugh and a giggle, i hear its light and good for touring. Also hear durability not in same game as Icelantic.

Current quiver apart from CT2, Kartel 116 and 108, obviously love with all my heart but as a new guy spending over a G on skis/bindings is team overkill for this project.

Based on the above, would you recommend anything else????

Bindings, again i want something good but don't want to spend too much as i am just getting started. I can get Marker for a good price and the Baron is looking like the entry level, on the whole whats it like, would it be shit on these skis, do i need to spend the money and go with something else etc etc?

Boots, got a good boot fitter/sales place local so whatever suits

wrote this after a good night so hope it makes sense!!

thanks in advance

 

[JohnJonsz]

What kind of boots do you have? Are you trying to get touring specific boots or just use your alpine boots witha heavy binding?

 

[Rodigan]

What kind of boots do you have? Are you trying to get touring specific boots or just use your alpine boots witha heavy binding?

Hey mate, no touring boots as yet. Just gonna get whatever the shop recommend for my feet when i have the $$$$ for that piece of kit. For normal shredding i have FT first chair 10

cheers

 

[PacificRimJob]

Good news is you will have lots of forward range of motion with your FT's due to the tongue dislodging.. pull the forward lean shim out of the back of the cuff and you'll have a semi-comfy bodged touring boot.

As for a touring binding, you're limited to only frame options... The good news with that is they will feel and work exactly the same as alpine options.

You'll only have to be concerned with downhill performance when you get into the Low-Tech touring bindings such as Salomon/Atomic's MTN/Backland, Dynafit's Superlight, or any other minimalist tech binding.

...Otherwise, kingpins, Ion's, Tectons, Vipecs, and Radical 2.0's are awesome options if you want a tech binding you can rip on once you get in the game and get a touring boot.

[For all that say the aforementioned bindings don't rip hard enough... Hoji sends it harder than you on Radical 2.0's so you can get out of my face ]

 

[Rodigan]

Good news is you will have lots of forward range of motion with your FT's due to the tongue dislodging.. pull the forward lean shim out of the back of the cuff and you'll have a semi-comfy bodged touring boot.

As for a touring binding, you're limited to only frame options... The good news with that is they will feel and work exactly the same as alpine options.

You'll only have to be concerned with downhill performance when you get into the Low-Tech touring bindings such as Salomon/Atomic's MTN/Backland, Dynafit's Superlight, or any other minimalist tech binding.

...Otherwise, kingpins, Ion's, Tectons, Vipecs, and Radical 2.0's are awesome options if you want a tech binding you can rip on once you get in the game and get a touring boot.

[For all that say the aforementioned bindings don't rip hard enough... Hoji sends it harder than you on Radical 2.0's so you can get out of my face ]

DINGOSEAN ......thanks for the info bro, all really helpful. From what i have been reading it looks like spending the money on a good tech binding is the way to go, i am hearing a lot of aches and pains about Barons etc so for the extra £150 it looks like a no brainer.....

 

[-WZ-]

DINGOSEAN ......thanks for the info bro, all really helpful. From what i have been reading it looks like spending the money on a good tech binding is the way to go, i am hearing a lot of aches and pains about Barons etc so for the extra £150 it looks like a no brainer.....

If you're serious about getting into touring, almost everyone I know has started out on frame bindings, switched to pins after a couple of seasons and never looked back. The benefit alone of not lugging an extra kg on your foot with every step is worth it after one tour. Especially now with options like the shift coming out, I predict frame bindings are slowly going to die out. Basically just choose Tecton, Kingpin or Shift and your not going to be sacrificing much downhill performance at all - I use my Kingpins both in and out of resort interchangeably without even thinking about it now. As for boots just give your boot fitter your criteria, (ie weight range, price point , tech fittings, flex) and then try on what options they have and pick whichever fits best. Can't help you out with advice on skis as I haven't skied either of them, but I would argue for touring boots/bindings are going to impact your day more than the skis anyways. Hope this gives a little insight!

 

[PacificRimJob]

DINGOSEAN ......thanks for the info bro, all really helpful. From what i have been reading it looks like spending the money on a good tech binding is the way to go, i am hearing a lot of aches and pains about Barons etc so for the extra £150 it looks like a no brainer.....

Yeah. I mean i have a couple pairs of frame bindings mounted up still, but only on my really fat skis that i wouldn't want to go on a long tour with anyhow.. Those are just for proper sidecountry missions with lift or automobile assist.

I wouldn't go more than like 3k with frame bindings anymore... its just silly at this rate with how weighty they are.

its an expensive endeavor to get into tech binding scene, as you need to buy a boot AND a binding... but it's worth it.

 

[JoltyGauges]

You'll only have to be concerned with downhill performance when you get into the Low-Tech touring bindings such as Salomon/Atomic's MTN/Backland, Dynafit's Superlight, or any other minimalist tech binding.

...Otherwise, kingpins, Ion's, Tectons, Vipecs, and Radical 2.0's are awesome options if you want a tech binding you can rip on once you get in the game and get a touring boot.

[For all that say the aforementioned bindings don't rip hard enough... Hoji sends it harder than you on Radical 2.0's so you can get out of my face ]

Those low tech options you mentioned have the exact same performance issues as the higher spec tech bindings you mentioned such as ION's etc. Lateral release in tow is going to always be the problem with tech bindings (excluding shift) its nothing to do with dins etc Backland/MTN can be set to monster release values and lock toes if you want... If anything stuff like the Salomon MTN binding is a better choice then an ION/Vipec it goes up faster and down the same as any tech binding. The likes of Cody Townsend ski big Alaskan faces on them

 

[PacificRimJob]

Those low tech options you mentioned have the exact same performance issues as the higher spec tech bindings you mentioned such as ION's etc. Lateral release in tow is going to always be the problem with tech bindings (excluding shift) its nothing to do with dins etc Backland/MTN can be set to monster release values and lock toes if you want... If anything stuff like the Salomon MTN binding is a better choice then an ION/Vipec it goes up faster and down the same as any tech binding. The likes of Cody Townsend ski big Alaskan faces on them

The vipecs and tectons both have lateral release in the toe rather than the heel like other tech bindings. they have elasticity in that as well, being that the track the pins sit on can flex laterally. additionally, from dynafit the radical 2.0 has a toe that allows it to rotate with the heelpiece, resulting in less ski flex ejections, pre-releases, and offers an overall better ride. its not as elastic as the frischi diamir options, but it is quite good.

the salomon mtn, dynafit superlight, plum yak, hagans, etc all suffer from far worse issues - them being that the toepiece has zero elasticity and these can result in a pre-release on firmer more variable terrain. the aformentioned bindings all have built in countermeasures to attempt to combat that. hell, dynafit redesigned the radical simply because of these issues that these bindings all share.

i like the mtn/backland. i'll be getting a pair next season on a pair of ultra light peak bagging skis.. but i would not be using it like i would my vipecs or tectons inbounds. the vipecs have elasticity and release both in the heel and the toepiece. they feel like an alpine binding. the mtn does not, and without installing the exp pins in the heel, and locking the toe, they're likely to prerelease on you in a crash.

case and point, i was skiing today in andorra, jumping off of some sizeable cliffs with some spanish mates i had just met. one of whom had the backland 109's with some backland bindings. he was locking his toes because otherwise, the binding doesn't have enough elasticity to handle the ski's tortional twisting and flexing in such a situation.

 

[JoltyGauges]

The vipecs and tectons both have lateral release in the toe rather than the heel like other tech bindings. they have elasticity in that as well, being that the track the pins sit on can flex laterally. additionally, from dynafit the radical 2.0 has a toe that allows it to rotate with the heelpiece, resulting in less ski flex ejections, pre-releases, and offers an overall better ride. its not as elastic as the frischi diamir options, but it is quite good.

the salomon mtn, dynafit superlight, plum yak, hagans, etc all suffer from far worse issues - them being that the toepiece has zero elasticity and these can result in a pre-release on firmer more variable terrain. the aformentioned bindings all have built in countermeasures to attempt to combat that. hell, dynafit redesigned the radical simply because of these issues that these bindings all share.

i like the mtn/backland. i'll be getting a pair next season on a pair of ultra light peak bagging skis.. but i would not be using it like i would my vipecs or tectons inbounds. the vipecs have elasticity and release both in the heel and the toepiece. they feel like an alpine binding. the mtn does not, and without installing the exp pins in the heel, and locking the toe, they're likely to prerelease on you in a crash.

case and point, i was skiing today in andorra, jumping off of some sizeable cliffs with some spanish mates i had just met. one of whom had the backland 109's with some backland bindings. he was locking his toes because otherwise, the binding doesn't have enough elasticity to handle the ski's tortional twisting and flexing in such a situation.

All fair points, Which i would agree with. However the rotation within the toe pieces is a new thing and hasn't been proven to be safer yet. Regarding the skiing feeling, the floating heal and pins in the toe are definitely a different feeling in general to an alpine binding. I think it doesn't matter which binding you buy in the tech world they will all feel different to an alpine one (excluding hybrids tecton/kingpin which still feel different just not as much). However you can still ski hard on all of them, I wouldn't say they are limiting (Yes the pure race tech bindings obviously are). Your friend who is hucking off cliffs chooses to lock his toes which is dangerous and rather unforgiving but he probably doesn't have to ski less aggressive then he would on any other tech binding. If he was skiing on a Marker Kingpin he would lock his toes also for the same reasons he locks them on the Backland (and those bindings are marketed for skiing anywhere). That binding is commonly thought of as the best tech binding for the downhill and it feels very much the same as the MTN tech (I ski both). Even the toe piece with the extra pin is just for show it actually has almost identical release values as a two spring. Locking toes is not a requirement it just is something people do for added security of 90% no release in toe. You can watch Chris Rubens/ Cody Townsend skiing some sizeable lines on the Salomon MTN tech and they say they never lock there toes unless the terrain is super high consequence. In my opinion if guys with skiing ability like them can rip with the binding on then 99% of us here on NS cant even get it close to the point where its the factor holding us back. Just my two pence.

 

[clorox]

I fucking love my kingpins and have always felt really safe in them. I used some dukes once and can't say the extra weight uphill was worth the downhill, plus the stack height made turning feel awkward and the full frame messes with the flex of the ski, so if your marker discounts apply to tech bindings and you can get a good quiver killing boot with tech fittings, I'd absolutely say it's worth it (kingpins are way cheaper in Europe than North America). I use them with Dalbello Lupo AX's which are also my in resort/park boot, and has easily removable tongues. You got the bootfitter right but that's just my recommendation as far as basic function. I also have a pair of Black Diamond Helio 105's which are surprisingly solid downhill and extremely light, and a pair of Armada JJ Zero's which steal days from my BD's unless it's hardpack and then I'll probably just ski park or something.

Don't blow a ton on skis because skis have a pretty good ratio of weight:downhill performance generally.

Pro tip: get a shell, some wool and a down jacket for technical breaks and when at the top. Getting cold while touring sucks. If you stray far from a resort, bring more food than you think you'll need.

I'm in norway touring til the end of may and pm me if you have any questions.